Super Mario Sunshine is very average when it comes to gameplay, but it perfectly captures the summer atmosphere. I love the Delfino Plaza hub and the music. The game is only good because of the charm, which I think Odyssey misses anyway.
-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
-
We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.
Okay holy hell is Super Mario Sunshine as bad as it looks?
- Thread starter SolidChamp
- Start date
I loved Mario Sunshine. Didn't even know people didn't like it until the Giant Bomb videos on it.
It has the same blur vibe like SM64, which I loved. It feels like a direct sequel and IMO the gameplay is pretty great. I certainly prefer it over 3D land
It had issues, but I still had fun with it. It's not a horrible game by any realistic standards (other than that pachinko level). I don't think it's as good as most other Mario games, but I think it's better than the average game of the time by a wide margin.
Sunshine frusterates me, because I think it's mechanics such as the fludd, water sliding, and general controls are all excellent and the quality I would expect from a mainline Mario.
However, the level design has really serious issues. The game is full of pretty unfun padding like blue coin hunts, weird hidden shines (for example, anyone remember the shines where you have to spray the GOD DAMN SUN to spawn? How the fuck are you supposed to know that?!), and bizzare stupid ass missons like the Watermeleon one in Gelato Beach, a lot of the Hotel in general, the pachinko machine, that fucking Yoshi Boat Ride that takes way too long, Corona Mountain being one of the worst final levels in the series's history with a stupid lava boat mechanic, etc. The poor camera (especially when using the hover nozzle) is a big problem too!
While I do think Sunshine is a good game, I think its probably the most poorly designed mainline Mario (well except for Super Mario Brothers Special, but lmao only crazy weirdos like me count that game). It's a shame, I think now a days, Nintendo could make a brilliant Mario game based around the Fludd's mechanics, but Sunshine has such serious design issues that I doubt a remaster would solve enough, even if it could add a better camera and make blue coins less awful.
However, the level design has really serious issues. The game is full of pretty unfun padding like blue coin hunts, weird hidden shines (for example, anyone remember the shines where you have to spray the GOD DAMN SUN to spawn? How the fuck are you supposed to know that?!), and bizzare stupid ass missons like the Watermeleon one in Gelato Beach, a lot of the Hotel in general, the pachinko machine, that fucking Yoshi Boat Ride that takes way too long, Corona Mountain being one of the worst final levels in the series's history with a stupid lava boat mechanic, etc. The poor camera (especially when using the hover nozzle) is a big problem too!
While I do think Sunshine is a good game, I think its probably the most poorly designed mainline Mario (well except for Super Mario Brothers Special, but lmao only crazy weirdos like me count that game). It's a shame, I think now a days, Nintendo could make a brilliant Mario game based around the Fludd's mechanics, but Sunshine has such serious design issues that I doubt a remaster would solve enough, even if it could add a better camera and make blue coins less awful.
I didnt love the game but art wise it was pretty spectacular at the time, the water effects they made, considering the limitations of the Gamecube, were amazing and still look good today. We studied the graphics in this game a fair bit in college
Judging the art on an emulator, with forced widescreen on a non CRT monitor is .... not even close to fair.
Judging the art on an emulator, with forced widescreen on a non CRT monitor is .... not even close to fair.
.
Moving just feels great. I also like the atmosphere of the game, though I will admit some missions are whack.
It's probably the rumored remake/remaster I am looking forward to the most.
They did an amazing job with the graphics, blew me away when I first saw it in person and not all those shitty quality videos from the net before it was released.
It's probably nostalgia at this point, but I really enjoyed my time with Super Mario Sunshine. I think the Gamecube is one of my all-time favorite systems, and this probably plays a part in that. I thought the graphics at the time were excellent, and I don't really remember any issues with the moveset. I thought FLUDD was an interesting experiment, if a little gamebreaking at times. The levels it was taken away stood out as good to me, though.
I do remember having issues with level design. My girlfriend and I were playing it at the time (she's now my wife, so that probably has something to do with the rose-colored glasses), and her bragging rights for the past however many years has been "yeah, but I beat the watermelon level." That thing sucked.
I do remember having issues with level design. My girlfriend and I were playing it at the time (she's now my wife, so that probably has something to do with the rose-colored glasses), and her bragging rights for the past however many years has been "yeah, but I beat the watermelon level." That thing sucked.
This may apply to the whole GameCube-era Nintendo. And the console itself.
I mean the narrative it's framed around is silly and the cutscenes are definitely bad - even for the time - but there's like 5 of them in the game that take all of like 8 minutes total. The game is mostly hub and courses.
Definitely give it a try, OP - if you still enjoy 64 today, you'll enjoy this. The FLUDD mechanic is actually really cool once you get your brain around it and completely changes up the dynamics of mario platforming. There is some absolutely excellent course design as well.
I'm proud that the consensus seems to be that Sunshine isn't particularly great - sometimes you come through, Era.
Now if nostalgic Zoomers would just admit that Double Dash is a rushed, mediocre Mario Kart title, all would be good. And all the Sunshine stank in that game makes it even worse.
Now if nostalgic Zoomers would just admit that Double Dash is a rushed, mediocre Mario Kart title, all would be good. And all the Sunshine stank in that game makes it even worse.
Not sure what's worse your taste in games or your implication that zoomers are the ones propping up double dash. The game is near 20 years old.
It's fine? I remember some good times with it, but even after nearly crying because UPS delivered it late (I was young) it just never clicked for me. There wasn't enough variety in levels and, though this will sound ridiculous nowadays, it had VERY little returning favorites. I don't think goombas or koopa troopers were in it at all, and this was the old times when new mainline Mario games were so rare that not having the mainstays meant we might go ten years without seeing them.
Sunshine is a collection of actions that are textured and fun. Stuff like running on shingled rooftops, spinning off a tightrope, bouncing off umbrellas, jetting across the sea, creating slip 'n slides (just spray, jump and dive), hovering through the air and of course hosing down gunk -- all of these actions are individually satisfying and weave together into a tapestry of moment-to-moment goodness, all against the backdrop of one of the Mario universe's most immersive settings, drenched in light and color and a refreshing sea breeze, not to mention the gosh darn JOLLY Noki and Pianta. Sunshine even pulls the Dark Souls hat trick where you can see one region from another region for a sense of how the larger world fits together. So I can forgive some of its clumsier moments. If the rumors are true and it's being remade/remastered alongside SM64 and Galaxy, it will be a great middle episode between those two. We also owe the game for all of the wonderful iconography it has contributed to the series.
Odyssey is mostly a blitz of incoherent worlds (respective to each other), each one failing to justify itself existing in the universe. As a result, they all felt empty and soulless. I didn't care about the fork people is the jist of what I'm getting at. But yes, that level does look very cool and is probably the best one in the game just for that.
And also, my absolute greatest criticism is indeed the difficulty and that's the core reason I didn't have fun with it. If anything, the final challenge level left me feeling frustrated because I got a taste of what could have been with those platforming mechanics. All other things could be forgiven very easily if I just had fun things to jump on, but a platformer that fails to have fun things to jump on is a failed platformer, imo. Mario moves better than ever animation wise and the controls are so tight (though I went back to revisit sunshine and honestly, core movement and fludd aside that's probably my absolute favorite moveset for mario, the skill ceiling is absurd).
But yeah, it's not like I have some deep attachment to the lore of mario lol. Again, that's extremely secondary to my issues with it.
This game is 100% about the GameCube triggers. That was clearly the mechanic they were trying to highlight when they started designing the water systems and FLUDD is reasonably satisfying. Analog triggers were the only real controller gimmick that generation (unless gba link counts). Weird as a Mario game though. I liked it despite the clear issues
No other game matches its amazing gameplay mechanics except maybe Mario Odyssey and Celeste, and it was a frikkin' beautiful game back then on a CRT. Although some parts were frustrating, I've got patience and I love a good challenge.
I tend to judge games on their best aspects, rather than the lows, so it's one of my all-time favorites!
I tend to judge games on their best aspects, rather than the lows, so it's one of my all-time favorites!
I bought it on GameCube on day 1 and was really disappointed with it. I haven't bought a 3D Mario game since (unless you count Super Mario 64 DS). I kind of want to give Odyssey a try but I'm afraid I'll be disappointed again.
Odyssey's Capture is a lot more practical than FLUDD, and the main campaign is pretty fast paced. There're also lots of fun mini levels similar to the Secret Courses in Sunshine. I'd say you should try it out (but you probably won't like the postgame if you hated blue coins).
I have a ton of nostalgia for it (more than any Mario game) and tons of aspects of it I love, but it's absolutely the worst 3D Mario. It's far and away the least polished major title Nintendo has ever released, plain and simple. Probably the least polished internally game they've ever made period, at least past the NES era. It needed at least another year or so in the cooker, and definitely would have stood shoulder-to-shoulder with it's peers had it gotten it.
Which is exactly why it deserves a remaster. Or at least, one so extensive it's functionally a remake. There's a lot to love, but ultimately an unfinished game is an unfinished game.
Which is exactly why it deserves a remaster. Or at least, one so extensive it's functionally a remake. There's a lot to love, but ultimately an unfinished game is an unfinished game.
I don't understand why this game gets so much hate. It is an 18 year old game and one of the most pretentious games during its time. It was unique, and to my 6 year old eyes it was damn near perfect. Of course it might of not aged well to some people, but it definitely doesn't not deserve the hate it gets.
Haven't played the game in a while but I do remember it having a lot of frustrating segments and some questionable level design/gameplay mechanics I didn't like.
The voice acting was trash even back then and it only has gotten worse over the years.
If the remasters are real I don't know why went with Sunshine instead of Galaxy 2 but man, they sure do have a lot to fix to make it a decent experience compared to Galaxy and SM64.
The voice acting was trash even back then and it only has gotten worse over the years.
If the remasters are real I don't know why went with Sunshine instead of Galaxy 2 but man, they sure do have a lot to fix to make it a decent experience compared to Galaxy and SM64.
The last 3d mario that felt like an adventure. Odyssey brought back some of that feel, but was jarring as the jumping from world to world made it feel like a bunch of levels, much like the galaxy and 3d world games. In terms of overall enjoyment, i would say that it came second to super mario 64 and also had great music. Maybe the music in the future titles just wasn't as good?
The platforming with FLUDD and the use of water integrated into the gameplay is actually pretty masterful and should've been something Nintendo explored further in future games. It remains a novel and interesting set of game mechanics down to this day.
Unfortunately it's undermined by the awful, awful level design of its main stages and it's doubling- and tripling-down of weird out of the way gimmicks that all too frequently push the wonderful platforming mechanics to the background. And then there are the blue coins, a good idea that turned into a bad idea when someone had the bright idea of putting 240 of them in this tiny world and making them have no real purpose other than just giving you more shines.. Especially since this game also brings back the 100 coin collection challenges from SM64.
Despite all this the game manages to be quite fun and it never gets old just jumping around and performing acrobatics in Delfino Plaza, which despite being the hub world still manages to be the only level in the game besides maybe Bianco Hills that gives you room to breath and and interesting canvas to just jump around and have fun with. And of course the FLUDD-less levels tend to be quite enjoyable as well, though not having FLUDD with you in a game literally designed around it kind of defeats the purpose when you think about it.
Unfortunately it's undermined by the awful, awful level design of its main stages and it's doubling- and tripling-down of weird out of the way gimmicks that all too frequently push the wonderful platforming mechanics to the background. And then there are the blue coins, a good idea that turned into a bad idea when someone had the bright idea of putting 240 of them in this tiny world and making them have no real purpose other than just giving you more shines.. Especially since this game also brings back the 100 coin collection challenges from SM64.
Despite all this the game manages to be quite fun and it never gets old just jumping around and performing acrobatics in Delfino Plaza, which despite being the hub world still manages to be the only level in the game besides maybe Bianco Hills that gives you room to breath and and interesting canvas to just jump around and have fun with. And of course the FLUDD-less levels tend to be quite enjoyable as well, though not having FLUDD with you in a game literally designed around it kind of defeats the purpose when you think about it.
It's not really an age thing though. Sunshine's lack of polish is something that's readily apparent when comparing it to it's 6-year-older predecessor, Super Mario 64, which is still lauded today for how well it holds up. Sunshine just has too many clear cut issues stemming from its rushed development. At the end of the day it has a rock-solid foundation, which is why it's still quite beloved, but it is also still a game that you can immediately spot as unfinished. And that's why it's almost universally considered the worst in the series. A Mario game that's anything but polished to a mirror shine is going to stick out.
Yeah this is where I'm a too, it can be better and has some rough edges for sure but I still love it for what it is.
lolwut
the soundtrack in the galaxy and 3d world games blow sunshine and 64's out of the water
I agree with this. I like the idea of Super Mario Sunshine much more than I actually enjoy the game.
It's a pretty great premise and world they created, but then you start to play and ehhhhh.
I don't know if it's worth it for Nintendo, but a remake/heavily edited remaster that fixed a lot of flaws could do a lot to help its reputation.
Then again, Nintendo has shown with most of its remasters that they primarily focus on graphics and small gameplay tweaks. We didn't get a "fixed" Wind Waker, for example, with a bunch of new islands/dungeons added in. Still, I'd like to see what Nintendo could do.