I think they both are. Kahn is another stereotype, but the program never reached that particular height. I'm sure there are a people that have had a few insults tossed their way in similar fashion.
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"The Simpsons" hits back at Hari Kondabolu's "The Problem With Apu"
- Thread starter Richiek
- Start date
I think they both are. Kahn is another stereotype, but the program never reached that particular height. I'm sure there are a people that have had a few insults tossed their way in similar fashion.
Being upset at family guy is letting Seth Mcfarlane win, that's what they want, family guy was always and will always be about shock humor and being as offensive as possible, the simpsons are supposed to be above that.
As an Indian American, I feel like an easy way to fix this from my perspective is to add another Indian character (maybe like Apu's nephew or someone) with no accent at all and turn him into a semi regular character. The issue really is that there isn't a lot of Indian representation in American media and having Apu essentially be the biggest thing we have is...sad to me. We have Master of None now, I suppose, which is great.
I don't get thank you come again jokes nowadays, but I sure as hell did growing up.
The show runners thinking this is some unfixable thing is really weak. Add a character that more accurately represents the life of a daily Indian American, and the complaints will go away. It's not that hard.
I don't get thank you come again jokes nowadays, but I sure as hell did growing up.
The show runners thinking this is some unfixable thing is really weak. Add a character that more accurately represents the life of a daily Indian American, and the complaints will go away. It's not that hard.
I think I've said explicitly what they thought was racist about Apu, so perhaps you should read it again. I'm not claiming to have the last word on what offends people, that's up to the individual. What I'm saying is that Apu is objectively a derogatory caricature of a minority and that that caricature was harmful. People can argue that there are derogatory caricatures of Scotsmen, Australians, Germans and other white nationalities in the show and that's true but that that's not the same thing for the same reason that there are no derogatory stereotypes of black people in show. Do you have to take offence? No. Is it offensive, hell yes.
lmao, no way. simpsons has always been humor for the lowest common denominator. it's the same stuff.
Well, you are being offended on behalf of other people. Apu is an Indian born character and, therefore, an Indian accent. Would it be better if they cast an Indian person to do the voice?
Family guy has always been about being more edgy and offensive than the simpsons, and for all the edginess of the simpsons, they're are traditionally viewed as something you can watch as a family, it's not weird for the simpsons to still be something that can be watched by kids, and no joke in the simpson goes as far as how offensive family guy can get, despite everything simpsons still have character arcs, heartwarming moments, just think about the "Moaning Lisa" thread we had a few days ago.
Family guy just wants to offend, it's a parade of racist, homophobic, transphobic and shock jokes.
I was pretty surprised to see Alison Brie playing a second generation Vietnamese American in BoJack Horseman didn't seem to generate much fuss.
There's the whiting wongs podcast where they started with a discussion of one of the Chinese writers of Rick & Morty not being happy that a Chinese character she wrote ended up being played by Susan Sarandon. They go into quite a lot of detail about it, I'd recommend the podcast for anyone wanting to hear more discussions about these kinds of subjects.
Well obviously. I'm upset about it and I'm a person. Clearly I mean more people should be upset about it. I think most people don't care at all.
I think the reason why people don't have a problem with this is because they aren't doing joke voices, I wouldn't have known Linda was voiced by a man if i hadn't been told, they're not making "lol, you sound like a man" jokes, they don't actually sound like dudes, Tina is supposed to have a weird voice, but she doesn't come as a man pretending to be a girl, she comes off as an awkward teen girl with a monotone voice. If the show made jokes about them sounding like men or any sort of transphobic joke, people would have a problem.
Think about how in the venture brothers absolutely no one ever even acknowledges Dr. Mrs. The Monarch has a male voice and after a bunch of episode you, the viewer, stop even thinking about it. Bob's Burger is like that but much better because the characters sound like women.
I am describing to you the reaction of brown people to the character back in the 90s when everything was supposedly so different, I have told you why that character was difficult for them and hinted at the problems Apu caused for them. I get that means nothing to you. It doesn't matter. It would be better if they had an Indian actor doing the voice but it would still be derogatory.
Maybe I should rephrase the point I made earlier - having an actor play a character that isn't their ethnicity is always bad, but what makes Apu so egregious is not only is it committing the Indian equivalent of blackface, Apu himself is also a played-up stereotype, even if he's a positive one. Imagine if you had a Chinese character played by a white dude putting on a fake Chinese accent and the show constantly made jokes about how he was good at math. That's a similar situation to what's going on with Apu.
Bob's Burgers is a tricky issue. I think the answer lies somewhere in the issue of drag, or how you can be transgender but not transracial. Someone probably has a better answer than me.
As for South Park, that entire worthless show belongs in the fucking garbage.
Bob's Burgers is a tricky issue. I think the answer lies somewhere in the issue of drag, or how you can be transgender but not transracial. Someone probably has a better answer than me.
As for South Park, that entire worthless show belongs in the fucking garbage.
Not staking a claim here, Linda is voiced by a man who is literally imitating a woman. He is imitating what he knows to be how a woman from staten island sounds. The difference is, nobody is debating whether or not the imitation of a woman from staten island is offensive, likely because it's not.
The key is, they're not doing the characters in a demeaning way, it's like why nobody criticizes Phil Lamarr for voicing Samurai Jack
Man there are so many good episodes. There is another one that depicts EXACTLY the difference with being a man and woman walking home its so funny but also shows just how different it is, also other just crazy shit that happens to women. overall pretty great show.
What an explicitly shithead comment: "someone convince me that my unfounded assumptions aren't true, I'm too weak minded to actually watch the short documentary and form my opinion on it but here is my opinion anyway!"
Honestly, is it that hard to understand why a white guy who is Scottish isn't a visible minority can just assimilate into just being a white guy much more easily than most south East Asian? Do you really know so little about America's history of racial exclusion that didn't include Irish and Italians as whites but now do?
Literally no one said you're should be offended if you're Indian. Lots of Indian people did explain in the short documentary what their problems with the character are. You can just listen to what they have to say, if you actually care to listen to those Indians people
Watching the problem with Apu, now. This is a really great exposure to how bad this character has been for many people. The response from the Simpsons isn't surprising.
I'm glad that I never waswa big fan of the Simpsons growing up. Had many discussions with my childhood friends on my position of the Simpsons but I couldn't articulate why I didn't like the show. This is certainly one big reason.
I'm glad that I never waswa big fan of the Simpsons growing up. Had many discussions with my childhood friends on my position of the Simpsons but I couldn't articulate why I didn't like the show. This is certainly one big reason.
I feel like the whole VA actors being played by a minority or not is less important to me when I'm watching the show in a dub version and the original VA is lost anyway.
The stereotypes though it's fucking bad and really disappointing of them that it is their answer.
The stereotypes though it's fucking bad and really disappointing of them that it is their answer.
Haha that's awesome. I haven't kept up to date with the show in the last decade at all. Also I don't complain about shows I don't watch, which is honestly what the majority of people do.
So PoC air their grievances about a shitty racial stereotype which they have been saddled with most of their lives and your best argument is a shrug and "nah it's fine."
If you're going to defend this garbage, atleast give the illusion that you're trying to form an argument.
Thanks for the replies. It's nice to see how other people view these things. I was reading through this thread, and the prior one on the topic, and saw some of the comparisons of a white man voicing Apu as similar to white people wearing blackface. It's honestly something I never thought of and it made think about other animated shows I watch. It's a good point about how Bob's Burgers doesn't use the character to negatively represent stereotypes the Apu does.
I said that I personally don't see him in the way that the doc portrayed, as some other people of colour have even said in this thread. Get off your high horse.
So I figured I'd peek back in here, I finally sat down and watched the whole thing with my Fiance, and... wow. It was bad, like really fucking bad. Going into it I thought he would have more legitimate arguments, but when you use hyperbole phrases like "Apu ruined my life. This is a grudge I've had for 28 years," then videotape yourself throwing a tantrum because Hank Azaria didn't acknowledge your e-mail, and then do a little slideshow of you punching his characters... yeah, we both think this guy is a little bitch. His other guests were more informed and professional I wish we saw more of them. My Fiance was so mad at this she personally tweeted to him about it. Some of Hot takes from our viewing I found funny,
"The reason Indian people aren't complaining about this is because we're too busy going to school, becoming Doctors, and doing something with our lives to worry about a Cartoon Character."
"Even his own parents think Apu is funny and he's being a little bitch."
"Our Pastor used to do the Apu voice during church (all Indian Church) and everyone always laughed. We loved it."
and my personal fav.
"The only reason this guy hates Apu is because he will never be as funny or as popular as Apu."
So you expected your reply of "OMG U guys SO MAD, y U care OLOL Cartoons destroyed ur life omg lol" would get legit replies, and when everyone ignored it, you decided to come back and repost the exact same garbage... are you expecting different replies?
I just gave a more informed Opinion, which is actually more negative that my ignorant opinion. Bizarre!
Isn't it funny how your more informed opinion is exactly the same as the opinion you had before it was informed?
Also, "a little bitch" is some real high brow language, dude.
I love how someone complaining about Hari being "a little bitch" because he can't take a joke managed to miss such obvious jokes.
Your "more informed opinion" is to repeatedly call Kondabolu a "little bitch," admit that your fiancé harassed him on Twitter about it, and then repeat a bunch of quotes from your personal anecdote like anyone particularly cares. Your argument fucking sucks.
Did two separate people use this account? I was not expecting this "little bitch" stuff yesterday.
Shame you didn't think it was funny but your girl getting mad at him on twitter? Calling him a bitch?
Sad stuff
Was that a joke? It wasn't funny.
It's not an argument, it's an opinion. Which you're entitled to think "fucking sucks." I don't care. I can't convince any of you to agree with me, much less than you can convince me this Documentary is nothing more than someone trying to blame problems he can't overcome himself on a cartoon character.
I cleaned up her language. She grew up in the streets, she tell's it like it is an has no filter.
Nobody cares to convince you of anything, if you haven't noticed people have stopped seriously engaging you since your position became "OMG JUST GET OVER IT OLOL" pages ago. Your opinion is as shallow as a kiddy pool.
I wouldn't dignify that "informed opinion" as an opinion.
I don't even get the point of defending zombi Simpsons, it's not even funny or insightful it's just bad.
And how can anyone get from a movie with plenty of minorities saying that their lives were noticeably worse off thanks to Apu's portrayal that the film maker is just jealous of Apu's popularity?
e: and the poster even used the "I asked my black friends" defense, why are we humoring this guy?
I don't even get the point of defending zombi Simpsons, it's not even funny or insightful it's just bad.
And how can anyone get from a movie with plenty of minorities saying that their lives were noticeably worse off thanks to Apu's portrayal that the film maker is just jealous of Apu's popularity?
e: and the poster even used the "I asked my black friends" defense, why are we humoring this guy?
lol @ you blaming Hari for being unable to overcome a problem himself when that problem is an entire system of racism.
So you already admit that you can't be convinced and aren't looking to convince anyone else. Why are you even posting?
Not to mention that the idea of being jealous of a fictional character's popularity is clown shoes
Real talk, that sounds like some real low brow conversations between that dude and his fiance. They sound like miserable people with no empathy.
User Warned: Trolling
Because seeing your responses to my dissenting opinion is humorous. And seeing you guys categorize me as Apathetic, Ignorant, etc is also pretty humorous.
Why should we give a shit about his fiancé's PoV when she's not even there to talk about this herself?
For all we know he can't take a hint and his inlaws just humored him because they know he's a huge Simpsons fanboy and don't want to hurt his feelings because they're decent people.
And that is if she even exists!
This is absolutely the reason not the fact that he found the character to be an insulting caritcature of his father.
Nah, he just jealous of a character whose name is literally Bullshit.
The biggest problem with Apu is that he is (or was) one of the only (and most prominent) depictions of an Indian character on American television. The character itself is actually pretty likeable IMO, but he is the only exposure a lot of people have to an "Indian person" so he naturally becomes a stereotype.
This is why it's important to fight for representation. Simpsons has plenty of other stereotypes that it pokes fun at, but they're almost all of people/ethnicities that have a huge presence in American media already (Scottish, Italians, "Rednecks", etc)
This is why it's important to fight for representation. Simpsons has plenty of other stereotypes that it pokes fun at, but they're almost all of people/ethnicities that have a huge presence in American media already (Scottish, Italians, "Rednecks", etc)
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This is the 3rd time someone has asked "what is your goal" and you've given a non-answer. Which is ironic because you went on a hissy fit about asking what people wanted -- if they wanted apu to disappear or whatever. So seriously -- what do you want? Is your goal honestly to try and shut people up? Because it objectively is not working.
My goal is to post on an internet forum and see how people respond while Dinner is cooking... Thank you for making that entertaining?
troll2
trōl/
verb
gerund or present participle: trolling
1.
informal
make a deliberately offensive or provocative online post with the aim of upsetting someone or eliciting an angry response from them.
If you're not interested in this discussion, it's not complicated to just not post here instead of throwing BS at the wall to see how people react to having shit thrown their way.
Worst Episode Ever is a very fun, irreverent Simpson show where they watch terrible episodes to determine which episode is the actual worst episode of the show. The bottom 5 (so far):