If the Democratic Party is really so frail it can't afford to take basic criticism without deflection, we are stuck.
Variations of "This is all their fault, fuck em" is not basic criticism
If the Democratic Party is really so frail it can't afford to take basic criticism without deflection, we are stuck.
Lol this really is the standard that people hold the dems to.Why are we re-litigating 2016 elections? In 2020 we gave them all pillars of government last year to fix this and they done nothing while saying they're our only salvation for these kinds of acts from the GOP. dems are liars and just as culpable for this. They still technically have the power to add more seats, cancel student debt, increase the wealth tax. Why're we always pointing the finger at everyone else hit our elected officials?
If you completely ignore the fact that we don't have the votes to do what you are suggesting but sure.Not relevant excel when the house and senate and president have the power to fix that ratio at this very moment
If you want to go back further, the die was cast as soon as the semi-direct election of presidential candidates via partisan electors was allowed (in something like 1812) as it allowed for party control. Many of the founders were leery of the Torries as a concept.This has all been in the (un)making for many decades. Probably started around 1867. You can't point to any one event (Hilary losing) and say it all happened because of this. The writing has been on the wall just as long as climate change has been known. The civil war "ended" and the confederate politicians got right back to their seats of power and reformed their plan. Instead of going to war, lets work within the system to destroy it. Sound familiar? (January 6)
I love how Republicans can do absolutely nothing and get no blame, yet the Democratic Party (which is really just a few who opposed measures) take all the blame. Like Republicans are accepted as just being obstructionists to the point them being half of the Senate and doing nothing is practically ignoredIf the Democratic Party is really so frail it can't afford to take basic criticism without deflection, we are stuck.
Can you share a potential whip count on that proposed vote?Not relevant excel when the house and senate and president have the power to fix that ratio at this very moment
I hope you find some because that's where it's most needed. Living in a comfortable blue county and state, my participation in these kinds of things feels less impactful.I keep looking at local Facebook pages for organizations that are around me but nothing so far.
Then again I live in Texas so I'm more likely to come across celebrations than I am protests.
I love how Republicans can do absolutely nothing and get no blame, yet the Democratic Party (which is really just a few who opposed measures) take all the blame. Like Republicans are accepted as just being obstructionists to the point them being half of the Senate and doing nothing is practically ignored
There is a big ass difference between basic criticism and trying to lay 100% of the blame at their feet. The dems deserve all kinds of criticism for the way that they've handled the last six or seven years, but this particular incident is not completely on them.If the Democratic Party is really so frail it can't afford to take basic criticism without deflection, we are stuck.
You literally said he should threaten Manchin with a criminal investigation of his daughter.
Hell yes, that's an impeachable offence.
Cripes, we just came through the Trump era where he was constantly demanding investigations of his enemies and at the time people here understood what a violation of constitutional bounds that was.
The Democrats have no leverage on Manchin. He's probably not going to be re-elected anyway and if he was it would require the support of massive numbers of Trump voters.
Forgetting that while Manchin deserves a lot of blame, he isn't wrong in that the Ds have been harmed by messing with the filibuster. McConnell is a master at baiting his opponents into changing the rules a little bit then nailing them with the rules.I love how Republicans can do absolutely nothing and get no blame, yet the Democratic Party (which is really just a few who opposed measures) take all the blame. Like Republicans are accepted as just being obstructionists to the point them being half of the Senate and doing nothing is practically ignored
I think this kind of shows proof that this method of protest isn't working. Not that I have any alternative ideas.
If she were to be believed for one second she cares
I hope you find some because that's where it's most needed. Living in a comfortable blue county and state, my participation in these kinds of things feels less impactful.
Once the ruling comes down, we should make a thread with actionable items, particularly for red states.
Political discussion on era when it comes to the Democrats in a nutshell.
Do I get to say fuck the Democrats?Everyone who was paying the fuck attention told you 2016 was an existential election
But people got super precious, and the media abandoned what little propriety they had left and went all in on fucking emails.
So here we are, but please do justify your future political antipathy by screaming fuck the Democrats or whatever to make yourself feel high horsey in the quicksand pits
Yes, he is.Forgetting that while Manchin deserves a lot of blame, he isn't wrong in that the Ds have been harmed by messing with the filibuster. McConnell is a master at baiting his opponents into changing the rules a little bit then nailing them with the rules.
The counter to that is to pass large scale voting rights laws at the same time as tweaking the filibuster, but you know. . . It took Kennedy's assassination and Johnson spending all of his political capital to get the 1963 VRA bill past.
This. We're dealing with a party that does not actually act in the best interests of the vulnerable of their own volition.Fuck the Democrats for being overall useless... And their leadership in particular...
Everyone who was paying the fuck attention told you 2016 was an existential election
But people got super precious, and the media abandoned what little propriety they had left and went all in on fucking emails.
So here we are, but please do justify your future political antipathy by screaming fuck the Democrats or whatever to make yourself feel high horsey in the quicksand pits
Do I get to say fuck the Democrats?
Because I canvassed for shitty Democratic centrist Harley Fucking Rouda in 2019 (better than Dana Rohrbacher ¯\_(ツ)_/¯) and knocked on doors for the Democrats and by extension Biden (better than Trump ¯\_(ツ)_/¯) last year and even this year knocked on doors for DSA candidates in local races.
Is that good enough to earn the right to criticize them?
Fuck the Democrats for being overall useless... And their leadership in particular...
Do I get to say fuck the Democrats?
Because I canvassed for shitty Democratic centrist Harley Fucking Rouda in 2019 (better than Dana Rohrbacher ¯\_(ツ)_/¯) and knocked on doors for the Democrats and by extension Biden (better than Trump ¯\_(ツ)_/¯) last year and even this year knocked on doors for DSA candidates in local races.
Is that good enough to earn the right to criticize them?
Fuck the Democrats for being overall useless... And their leadership in particular...
It would be awesome if Era users organized to raise money for these causes. We can do some good, if we commit to advocacy.How many posters are going to donate time or money to abortion funds? Even outside of current material conditions, how many posters are going to actually go out on the streets to protest and/or advocate? If it's a tangible priority to people, they need to put work in
Why are we re-litigating 2016 elections? In 2020 we gave them all pillars of government last year to fix this and they done nothing while saying they're our only salvation for these kinds of acts from the GOP. dems are liars and just as culpable for this. They still technically have the power to add more seats, cancel student debt, increase the wealth tax. Why're we always pointing the finger at everyone else hit our elected officials?
You seem really happy with calling people "online communist LARPers" when many of them are active members of local political groups and actually do work...It's more fun to LARP communist revolutions on the internet tho
Some people don't realize that the revolution isn't happening. Not now, not ever.
I'm not American but shouldn't the ire be reserved for the Republicans who have setting this up for decades? As well as obstructing, law breaking, inciting insurrection etc?
It would be awesome if Era users organized to raise money for these causes. We can do some good, if we commit to advocacy.
This year and next, I am focused on donations to Planned Parenthood and Abrams/Warnock.
You seem really happy with calling people "online communist LARPers" when many of them are active members of local political groups and actually do work...
I know people scoff at the idea, but a country wide walk out and protest of buying goods and working would bring these people to their knees as they watch their stocks falls. That's about the only thing we could do to get them to listen. Hit their wallets. I'd love to try something like this, but there are too many "I'm a Democrat.. wait hold on now let's not increase taxes *insert talking point about stifling innovation for job creators or whatever". Everything else has failed so far.
As red states sore up on Voter suppression i think your hypothesis falls flat. In most red states the GOP controls all branches of gouverment and is right now legislating to hold onto power even if a majority might be against them. Additionaly add their well oiled propaganda machines and i bet they won´t lose much voters.
Last why would anyone vote democrat? If abortion gets illegal under their watch, when voter suppression gets pushed more and more, under their watch and so on then all democrats are touting are just empty words.
At least the GOP goes seemingly through with what they say every time they get a chance, same can´t be said about Democrats. While the GOP also manages to stick every problem to democrats.
Except you didn't. Democrats hold the Senate with a weak majority and dipshits like Manchin and Sinema are constantly holding the rest of the party back, if there were 60 Dems in the Senate they would be in a better position to change things for the better and pass progressive policies.... In 2020 we gave them all pillars of government last year to fix this and ...
It should, but here we are. And because of this kind of attitude it's one of the bigger reasons why the Republicans constantly and repeatedly tend to get away with all of their bullshit.I'm not American but shouldn't the ire be reserved for the Republicans who have setting this up for decades? As well as obstructing, law breaking, inciting insurrection etc?
I disagree. People who didn't vote for Clinton need to take ownership and understand their personal culpability in what's happening right now. And then use that to make better choices going forward.All the talk about 2016 is a waste of time. It happened. There is no way to go back in time. Assigning blame will not change the outcome and our present day reality. We have been dealt a shitty hand and now have to dig out of it.
Yes, of course. But it's always fuck the Dems time here.I'm not American but shouldn't the ire be reserved for the Republicans who have setting this up for decades? As well as obstructing, law breaking, inciting insurrection etc?
Variations of "This is all their fault, fuck em" is not basic criticism
I love how Republicans can do absolutely nothing and get no blame, yet the Democratic Party (which is really just a few who opposed measures) take all the blame. Like Republicans are accepted as just being obstructionists to the point them being half of the Senate and doing nothing is practically ignored
There is a big ass difference between basic criticism and trying to weigh 100% of the blame at their feet. The demons deserve all kinds of criticism for the way that they've handled the last six or seven years, but this particular incident is not completely on them.
Pretending that it is all their fault and completely ignoring the fact that all of this comes about because of the way that the Republicans have handled the last six or seven years like some people already seem to be doing on here and on social media is not only ridiculous but plain dishonest.
Funny how your entire post misses the part where one of the biggest reasons there was a huge backlash against Obama was because of racism. The people who voted for Trump didn't do so because they thought Republicans would fight for the poor, I can tell you that much.
She lost because too many apathetic voters, uniformed and misinformed voters, didn't think Trump would win or didn't care if he did. Or were upset Clinton was too moderate and not progressive enough so they protested by abstaining.
Trump ran a campaign far more centered on identity politics than Hillary did.
I think the media is DEFINITELY downplaying the consequences of Roe being struck down by undercounting the number of women who'll be affected by these bans.Republicans and aspects of the media downplaying the stakes or misrepresenting things outright for ratings or appeasement.
I think the media is DEFINITELY downplaying the consequences of Roe being struck down.
I think the media is really undercounting the number of women who'll be affected by these bans.
By my count, there are about 68 million women living in states where abortion is legal and unlikely to change, 80 million where it will be gone immediately or within a few months of the end of Roe, and another 17 million where their rights will be subject to a Republican governor taking office or some small changes to control of the state house (PA, NC, WI, MN). That means a substantial majority of American women will no longer have access to abortion in their states, and only ~41% (!!!) will have solid abortion rights in theirs.
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Eh. "Fuck Republicans" is not useful in any way. Self-critique is more important than us just constantly saying "Republicans stink don't they?" "Yeah they totally do" on loop for eternity.
You know there's another option. Critiquing the role of those saying voting doesn't matter and voting third party in key races play in handing power to republicans. To me it's not a surprise that Sinema turned out the way she did. She behaves like she did because she was a green and ultimately they are directly tools of republicans or indirectly tools of republicans.Eh. "Fuck Republicans" is not useful in any way. Self-critique is more important than us just constantly saying "Republicans stink don't they?" "Yeah they totally do" on loop for eternity.
Well, if we're being honest, Jamaal Bowman has clearly already been influenced by Israel (DSA, which endorsed him, is currently figuring out what action to take since he voted to fund the Iron Dome and took trips to Israel) and Stacey Abrams is progressive in a lot of ways but has been cozy with the business world.Cori Bush? Jamaal Bowman? Ayanna Pressley? Stacey Abrams? Katie Porter?
When people paint all Dems with the same brush, all it does is help regressives push their narrative. People who should honestly know better keep lumping progressive Dems in with trash like Manchin, and it continues a feedback loop where progressives get punished at the ballot box.
It lays the majority of the blame where it belongs. Constantly shitting on the Democrats for the things that the Republicans are doing doesn't serve any purpose at all.Eh. "Fuck Republicans" is not useful in any way. Self-critique is more important than us just constantly saying "Republicans stink don't they?" "Yeah they totally do" on loop for eternity.
The idea that overturning Roe v Wade will suddenly energize Democratic turnout to course correct seems like bullshit. Like, Abortion rights are already a big deal to a lot of already heavily Blue states like California, New York, Illinois, and Massachusettes... but in a lot of more Conservative places this isn't going to suddenly energize some anti-GOP Revolution.
The voters in those states, especially the swing-y suburbs of Virginia, North Carolina, Georgia, Pennsylvania, etc. have made it abundantly clear that this isn't a priority for them compared to economic interests and a sense of normalcy that they crave.
It's not like Texas has really seen long lasting meaningful push back within the state on their law even if there have been some demonstrations.
America is a Right leaning country marching further and further right as of recently, and the fact of the matter is the Conservative voting blocks of older individuals that can swing states just blatantly don't care and are more likely to be pulled in by propaganda and religious beliefs. And worse yet, the Senate is designed in such a way to give Conservatives more power, and the Senate controls the Supreme Court, which several Democratic Senators aren't gonna be in favor of packing even when they overturn Roe v Wade. You'd need 50 votes to pack the court, of which we might have around 40-ish now if we assume the best case scenario, and it's considered a nuclear option that is risky for incumbents so the reality is probably even worse. You need to get what, a Democratic supermajority in the Senate to have a chance of making this work. Otherwise, you're then hoping Democrats hold on to the Senate long enough to replace Breyer and then stalling until Thomas or Roberts dies since they are now the oldest (Trump's appointees are all extremely young and will be on the court for 30+ years).
It's going to be almost structurally impossible to overturn anything the Supreme Court does for the next 10 years or so, and that's exactly why Conservatives have done everything they have for the past 5 years with regards to the courts.
I'm mainly saying that the election that solidified McConnel as Senate Leader during that period was also pivotal. The fact that we treat a single presidential election as a nexus point instead of a capstone to a long term strategy probably contributes to why people complain that a single Democrat win dosen't magically fix things.2016 was a pivotal point but yes elections always matter, and, until such a time that Republicans don't exist, choosing not to vote for Dems (whether not voting or voting third party) is empowering Republicans unless the seat is completely uncontested.