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Sony Made A 'Tragic Mistake' Taking Spider-Man Out Of The MCU, Joe Russo Says

Cheerilee

Cheerilee

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,969
Kinthey said:
Ok, so the deal expired but this still means that it was Disney who made new demands. To frame it as "Sony chose to take Spiderman out of the mcu" feels kind of wrong.
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Kevin Feige arranged a sweetheart deal which cost Disney hundreds of millions of dollars, because he wanted to demonstrate the value of cooperation to Sony (since such negotiations were previously unthinkable, and someone had to make the first move).

The deal expired and Feige proposed a new win-win deal at the renewal. Feige proposed an equal partnership.

Sony shot it down because they liked that sweetheart deal, and they want more of that free money. Even though that was never going to continue forever.

Sony walked away. Sony thinks they can make MCU-level movies without Disney (even though Far From Home was literally the biggest movie Sony has ever seen). Sony thinks they have learned Kevin Feige's secrets through their time working with him, and now they can be the new Kevin Feige. LOL no. That's not going to happen.
 

Michaelandavinci

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
764
Tetra-Grammaton-Cleric said:
Disney having control over an IP that was originally part of the Marvel franchise doesn't constitute a monopoly, nor does anything else in regards to what's going on over at Disney currently.

But by all means, if I'm wrong educate me and explain how any of this constitutes a monopoly on Disney's end.
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Your first sentence is already contradictory and is safe to says you know nothing about corporate management and strategic takeovers. This move by Disney is in effect to consolidate all their Marvel IPs into one place in the long run. If you can't even tell by looking at this then their is no point debating about it. Both Sony and Disney come to their eventual decision by looking at their bottom line, if it does not benefit their bottom line then there won't be a deal. So stop looking at the situation from a fanboy view but looks at it from a strategic corporate view. At the end of the day it's all about maximizing their respective company's bottom line.
 
Raonak

Raonak

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
2,170
Disney should've just offered a better deal.

imo; MCU needs spiderman more than spiderman needs MCU.
 
Callibretto

Callibretto

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,548
Indonesia
Salty Rice said:
The tragic mistake was Disneys greed.

Nobody in their right mind would agree to 50% if you have ownership.
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people keep bring up 50%, but isn't the rumor and leaks keep changing as time goes on and the last number I've heard is 30% cut for Disney, that seems a very reasonable number imo and people seems to forget, Disney is also paying some of the production cost too.

Disney previous take of 5% from week 1 gross is ridiculously low
 
TheIlliterati

TheIlliterati

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,782
Putting aside the companies themselves, Rothman ran XMen and FF into the dirt. The idea that they now "know" how to steal that Marvel magic(hyperbole) and put it into Spider-Man is bullshit. Where was it for Dark Phoenix? Maybe if they attach Lord and Miller to the 3rd S-M film, I would believe they could pull it off, but Rothman's guidance means jack shit. Marvel is the one who has consistently attached solid talent and pulled off at minimum solid films.
 
Sirhc

Sirhc

Hasn't made a thread yet. Shame me.
Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,078
Raonak said:
Disney should've just offered a better deal.

imo; MCU needs spiderman more than spiderman needs MCU.
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Wut? The MCU was fine pre Spider-Man, they were turning the freaking Guardians of the Galaxy into billion dollar household names before Spider-Man.

The deal falling apart sucks for fans but Marvel has so many characters to tap it doesn't matter much.
 
Arex

Arex

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,617
Indonesia
Tetra-Grammaton-Cleric said:
Yeah I keep forgetting Sony is out there fighting for the little guy.

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You don't have to be a little guy to get bullied.
 

AnotherDayAnotherDollar

The Fallen
Oct 31, 2017
5,632
Callibretto said:
people keep bring up 50%, but isn't the rumor and leaks keep changing as time goes on and the last number I've heard is 30% cut for Disney, that seems a very reasonable number imo and people seems to forget, Disney is also paying some of the production cost too.

Disney previous take of 5% from week 1 gross is ridiculously low
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5% from Day 1.

And yes deadline updated it to reflect the numbers, but people still quote the first report because it makes for a nicer story.
 
Raonak

Raonak

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
2,170
Sirhc said:
Wut? The MCU was fine pre Spider-Man, they were turning the freaking Guardians of the Galaxy into billion dollar household names before Spider-Man.

The deal falling apart sucks for fans but Marvel has so many characters to tap it doesn't matter much.
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Well, if that's the case, then maybe this breakup is actually good for both.

Marvel can continue highlighting lesser known heroes.
Spiderman can focus on just being a friendly neighbourhood spiderman and stay away from the high level threats that marvel is leaning towards.

Seems like this will be a blessing in disguise.
 
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Keyouta

Keyouta

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,217
Canada
I just don't buy how they're going to now continue the story of Holland's Spidey while at the same time ripping him from that universe. They can't make any callbacks or reference other heroes or going ons. Do they pretend like, May's boyfriend Happy doesn't exist? Or Stark was never there?

Sounds easier to reboot but Holland is on for like another two films. (Spidey 3 and Vs Venom if I had to guess.)
 
ryan299

ryan299

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,466
I don't think it's a big deal but we'll see how 3 turns out without marvel involved. Far from home isn't very good and both films have relied heavily on iron man which has helped them succeed.
 
CoolestSpot

CoolestSpot

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
17,325
I love people bringing up 50% like Disney wasnt planning to negotiate down to 30 or 20.

They just didnt know they were dealing with crazy people and feeling themselves too much.
 
Callibretto

Callibretto

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,548
Indonesia
Raonak said:
Disney should've just offered a better deal.

imo; MCU needs spiderman more than spiderman needs MCU.
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MCU need Spider-man during the lead up to Endgame. Peter Parker is a great emotional anchor for Tony Stark, it's what motivate Tony to do the whole time heist thing.

Russos and Feige got their money's worth with Spidey's role in MCU, but now that Endgame is finished and Tony's dead, MCU didn't need Spider-man man as much anymore.

Maybe if the deal continue, Spider-man could end up leading Young Avenger team or something. But the way things left now, they could handwave Spider-man missing as he went hiding after his identity is revealed. It's not ideal, but MCU has dropped character in MCU before like Sif, Betty Brant, The Leader that has no follow up at all
 
excelsiorlef

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
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Oct 25, 2017
73,439
Afrikan said:
what would be cheaper for Sony...

Giving into what Disney wanted, or throwing the bank at Kevin Feige and pouching him from Disney. Keeping offering much more than what Disney counters.

Did Kevin sign some type of lifetime contract?
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Feige ain't gonna go from the MCU with tons of control to just a Spider-Man universe under Rothman lol

Future Gazer said:
Feige on a pedestal
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Who wouldn't put Feige on a pedestal. Notice that no one else has succeeded at the Cinematic Universe thing? Everyone tries to be him, but he's the only one who has pulled it off
 

rusty chrome

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,640
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BadWolf

BadWolf

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Oct 25, 2017
12,148
If I were Sony it would be hard not to make the same choice, it makes business sense.

Eitherway, the best SM movie is Spider-Verse as many have already mentioned so yeah.
 
Captain of Outer Space

Captain of Outer Space

Come Sale Away With Me
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Oct 28, 2017
11,530
This stuff is weirdly so transparent as Disney or Sony send out their company men to make weird pleas to shame the other into agreeing to their deal and hoping they can rile up enough fanboys into a fervor to yell at the other on Twitter or whatever in the hopes that public opinion swings to their side. I don't really see a reason to get worked up over any of this when giant media companies try to use the media to their advantage for these sorts of deals when they'll get something done whenever Spider-Man is needed next for the MCU.
 
Pop-O-Matic

Pop-O-Matic

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
13,018
You know that thing where a fanbase is so fucking insufferable that it makes you hate a thing you once loved? Because that's where I am with Spider-Verse now. Like it was a great movie, sure, but c'mon...
 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,749
Pop-O-Matic said:
You know that thing where a fanbase is so fucking insufferable that it makes you hate a thing you once loved? Because that's where I am with Spider-Verse now. Like it was a great movie, sure, but c'mon...
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No, no. It's literally the greatest movie of all time. better than that shit like citizen kane, schindler's list, and your favorite film ever. It's so great, we have to loudly screech about it in every thread about spider man and the mcu, so people know just how great it is. Which is the most totally perfect film ever created by intelligent life in the history of the universe.
 
lmcfigs

lmcfigs

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,091
what is going on w/ you guys. like Does the Nolan Batman films not exist anymore because Warner Bros also produced Suicide Squad and justice league? like what is going on?

they can make good Spiderman movies outside the mcu. there were good Spiderman movies before it and they'll be good ones after.

And the spider verse movie was great. like the dude tried to claim it wasn't better than any MCU film. for real?! it wasn't better than Thor?
 

rusty chrome

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,640
Sandstar said:
No, no. It's literally the greatest movie of all time. better than that shit like citizen kane, schindler's list, and your favorite film ever. It's so great, we have to loudly screech about it in every thread about spider man and the mcu, so people know just how great it is. Which is the most totally perfect film ever created by intelligent life in the history of the universe.
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That's kinda extra.

Disney holding that L is their fault.
 
lmcfigs

lmcfigs

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,091
Sandstar said:
I think it's a mostly accurate rendition of stuff that's been said in this very thread. That last part might be a little over the top, but I got carried away. Apologies.
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it's just kind of a dick move. into the spider verse won a golden globe and an academy award for best animated movie. but because people have to make a point about their favorite corporation, it's now just an okay movie.
 
Ploid 6.0

Ploid 6.0

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,440
BringBackSonics said:
According to the Russo's, they stated from the very start that Sony was kind of a pain, that Feige had to jump through a ton of hoops to make this Happen. So in the end they weren't surprised to see the 'divorce'
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From the gaming side Marvel is a pain to work with too, very expensive license, and very slow because everything has to go through them. "Dr. Strange's fingers should look differently. This X-23 skin needs a few changes, we'll get back to you on the rest. Also We're mad at you for having a Fantastic 4 event and sale without asking." (R.I.P. Marvel Heroes, axed abruptly by Disney before your expensive contract was expired)
 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,749
lmcfigs said:
it's just kind of a dick move. into the spider verse won a golden globe and an academy award for best animated movie. but because people have to make a point about their favorite corporation, it's now just an okay movie.
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I mean, black panther won 3 oscars. Does that make it a better film that Spider-verse? That seems to be what people are saying when they mention that SV got an oscar. I mean, spiderverse is a really good film. It's fans don't have to come in to every spiderman thread screeching about how great it was. It just turns people off.
 
Tace

Tace

Avenger
Nov 1, 2017
35,804
The Rapscallion
lmcfigs said:
it's just kind of a dick move. into the spider verse won a golden globe and an academy award for best animated movie. but because people have to make a point about their favorite corporation, it's now just an okay movie.
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I think it's more people keep bringing that up as to why it's good Sony will keep the movie rights, while ignoring all the times they fucked it up...

Spider-Verse is a great movie, but I don't think that one film is indicative of how they will handle a live action universe. Not when shit like Venom exists
 
Toriko

Toriko

Banned
Dec 29, 2017
7,793
You would think the MCU was churning out some AFI top 100 masterpieces instead of by the numbers mediocre summer blockbusters by all the handwringing going on about this decision.

Who gives a shit.

Scullibundo said:
If Feige's Spider-Man magic was what we saw in the two standalone films with Holland, I'm not bothered.
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exactly this. Two dumbass movies. The world will survive without that mediocrity. Do not worry Disney.
 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,749
Toriko said:
You would think the MCU was churning out some AFI top 100 masterpieces instead of by the numbers mediocre summer blockbusters by all the handwringing going on about this decision.

Who gives a shit.



exactly this. Two dumbass movies. The world will survive without that mediocrity. Do not worry Disney.
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You'd think Sony was churning out some AFI top 100 masterpieces, the way people keep going on about Into the Spiderverse.
 
KingM

KingM

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,507
Tace said:
I think it's more people keep bringing that up as to why it's good Sony will keep the movie rights, while ignoring all the times they fucked it up...

Spider-Verse is a great movie, but I don't think that one film is indicative of how they will handle a live action universe. Not when shit like Venom exists
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They've only fucked up big with SM3 and ASM2. Venom is corny movie that did well so that worked out for them. SM1,2,ASM and Spiderverse were all liked well enough when they came out and got either tons of box office success, critical praise or both.
 
lmcfigs

lmcfigs

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,091
Sandstar said:
I mean, black panther won 3 oscars. Does that make it a better film that Spider-verse? That seems to be what people are saying when they mention that SV got an oscar. I mean, spiderverse is a really good film. It's fans don't have to come in to every spiderman thread screeching about how great it was. It just turns people off.
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of course awards aren't the only sign of quality of the movie, but posters in this thread seem to have some strange opinions about it (and I guess the Raimi films for that matter as well).

Im also concerned about what seems like an endorsement for anti-competitive practices in the film industry. I don't think it's a good thing that Disney owns all these properties and its a real shame that people seem to want Disney to just have complete control dominance in this space.
 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,749
lmcfigs said:
of course awards aren't the only sign of quality of the movie, but posters in this thread seem to have some strange opinions about it (and I guess the Raimi films for that matter as well).

Im also concerned about what seems like an endorsement for anti-competitive practices in the film industry. I don't think it's a good thing that Disney owns all these properties and its a real shame that people seem to want Disney to just have complete control dominance in this space.
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Being able to pay for 50% of the production costs for 50% of the profits of movies based on a character they own every other right to=having complete dominance in this space. Got it.
 
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