Russian Navy opens fire on Ukrainian Ships in the Black Sea
- Thread starter Kodama4
- Start date
When was the last time the US annexed part of a sovereign nation?
Trying to label me as alt right is fucking low.
Secondly calling it a regional conflict between two nations with centuries of bad blood between them is not incorrect. Nor is it stating that one is right and one is wrong, or that both are wrong.
Stop making shit up and telling me it's what I meant when I posted nothing of the sort.
I'm with you. The US is bad, but they definitely aren't Russia bad.
Well they did invade to sovereign nations, one under complete lies which resulted in massive deaths.
Dropped more bombs on Cambodia than all WW2. Use of agent orange to destroy forests in Vietnam is still causing birth defects to this day.
Use of depleted uranium in urban areas is causing massive spikes of birth defects and cancers in Iraq.
And the gem of foreign policy, supporting the Murderous Israeli occupation and slow genocide of Palestine and it's people.
Over throwing democratic governments all over the globe. List goes on.
Hell the oonly recorded use of Nuclear weapons was against civilians in Japan by the USA.
Both countries are piles of shit, don't kid yourself that one is worse than the other.
This.
And the thing is that the US more often than not corrects its mistakes. Bush got 8 years while the country was duped into that war but the aftermath saw George Bush and his legacy thrown into the trash. He was, even in 2016 a punching bag for both parties.
Russia has maybe the most corrupt elections in the world but even still, Putin the greatest threat to democracy world wide gets broad support in Russia.
Its just not comparable. Russia is ran by a fucking mafia.
Check here : https://www.google.es/amp/s/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSBREA1601G20140207
Just an example. This made big news and both Americans and Europeans were embarrassed. Could you imagine a US Assistant Secretary discussing who should be in the Ukraine government ? I think it speaks volume on what the Americans do behind the scenes...
NBC News @NBCNews
Russian Foreign Ministry says it issues "a warning" to Ukraine that naval conflict in the Sea of Azov and the Black Sea "is fraught with serious consequences" and Russia "will firmly curb any attempts to encroach on its sovereignty and security."
Russian Foreign Ministry says it issues "a warning" to Ukraine that naval conflict in the Sea of Azov and the Black Sea "is fraught with serious consequences" and Russia "will firmly curb any attempts to encroach on its sovereignty and security."
what does Martial law exactly mean for the internal affairs of Ukraine and also what it means for escalation of this whole thing?
Sorry if that's a loaded question, I'm not too familiar with the Russia and Ukraine situation and I haven't really followed it since the annexation of Crimea
Sorry if that's a loaded question, I'm not too familiar with the Russia and Ukraine situation and I haven't really followed it since the annexation of Crimea
Its quite telling that you basically have to look back to fucking WW1 and Vietnam to make the USA seem even close to shit that Russia is literally doing today.
Russia's mafia regime today is dozens of times worse than the US at its worse. Period.
All your points are valid but the list is even longer for Russia.
I can't think of the losses of civilian life attributed to the Iraq invasion or that in Afghanistan that compares to an action of Russia.
The first and second wars.in Chechnya are about as close as that gets.
What about the targeting of males of 13 and above under the Obama administration, labelling them combatants to hide the fact they murdered innocent people with a terrorist weapon class.
Israel is current day, Afghanistan and Iraq are still ongoing.
What trump's killing over 100,000 people in an instant with nuclear weapons?
List it then, let's see who has killed more innocent people and reamed more devastation between them both?
Both as bad as each other,.and I think the US wins in sheer amount of killing and wars started.
I actually listened to the call: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WV9J6sxCs5k
A diplomat having private disagreement? Wow, diabolical.
You've got to be kidding me. What were the actions they discussed? Having meetings with the people involved! As diplomats do! They weren't talking about hacking into political opponents or waging social media psyops campaigns, or clandestine military ops. They were talking about doing their jobs as diplomats -- diplomacy.
Last edited:
If you really want to break it down. Look at the body count of Russia's own citizens that Stalin put in to the meat grinder in order to hurry to gain control of all of Eastern Europe for himself. To say nothing of all the ethnic cleansing he did in Eastern Europe in places like Bulgaria, Romania, and Armenia. Without considering anything else that is more than the US has done.
Well, the US still has an annexed part of Cuba that it has claimed for itself.
It also continues to bomb brown people in at least 7 different sovereign nations.
Certainly not in the last 50 years.
Not to be pedantic, but what Stalin did to his own people is not foreign policy.
Everyone knows he was sick lunatic that killed as many of not more than what the war did to the Russians.
I mean if you want to talk about ethnic cleansing, let's talk about the first nation tribes, he'll let's talk about the slave trade and the ongoing racial regime in America.
Friend, they are both two big bullies that have killed millions and start wars.
Trash.
Again you are right, they have both done many horrible things. I disagree that they are on equal footing but we can leave it at that.
excuse me? Do you realize that de jure each state of USSR was independent. "Own people", yeah, sure.
Jesus wept. Have you not heard of the Russian invasion of Afghanistan? Up to 2,000,000 civilians were thought to have been killed.
You'd be surprised how many people in this country have no idea that happened.
Stalin was also Georgian, so each Russian death that he signed off on (all of them) is very much a foreign policy matter, if we're going to deploy pedantry to defend beastly Russian chauvinism.
Threads like this really do sort the book readers from the Facebookers.
another "beautiful" fact from the history
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German–Soviet_military_parade_in_Brest-Litovsk
German–Soviet military parade in Brest-Litovsk on September 22, 1939
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German–Soviet_military_parade_in_Brest-Litovsk
German–Soviet military parade in Brest-Litovsk on September 22, 1939
Maybe the people so concerned about America's past atrocities could be kind enough to address the OT instead of derailing the conversation with events that have no relation to the situation at hand.
FUCK WHATABOUTISM!!!! You literally have no clue what the fuck you are talking about when you are comparing Russia and the US when it comes to Ukraine.
Sure US gets involved in Ukraine politics, I wouldn't even be surprised if they do some shady shit like Russia does to the US when it comes to elections BUT RUSSIA LITERALLY INVADED THEIR NEIGHBOR! How is that even close?!!! Imagine if US invaded and annexed Ontario killing thousands of Canadians. This is what we are talking about here! It's not comparable in any way shape of form.
There's nothing "proxy" about Ukraine. Russia thinks that it's theirs and they will keep doing whatever they please regardless what US and EU do or don't do. Literally the only thing that would impact Russia are crippling sanctions. One think that is their weakness now that didn't exist during Soviet Union time is the fact that capitalism is very much a part of Russian economy.
Sure US gets involved in Ukraine politics, I wouldn't even be surprised if they do some shady shit like Russia does to the US when it comes to elections BUT RUSSIA LITERALLY INVADED THEIR NEIGHBOR! How is that even close?!!! Imagine if US invaded and annexed Ontario killing thousands of Canadians. This is what we are talking about here! It's not comparable in any way shape of form.
There's nothing "proxy" about Ukraine. Russia thinks that it's theirs and they will keep doing whatever they please regardless what US and EU do or don't do. Literally the only thing that would impact Russia are crippling sanctions. One think that is their weakness now that didn't exist during Soviet Union time is the fact that capitalism is very much a part of Russian economy.
Twitter Video:
NBC News @NBCNews
BREAKING: In first response from US government leadership, UN Amb. Haley says in UN Security Council mtg. that Russia's shooting at, and seizure of, Ukrainian vessels marks "yet another reckless Russian escalation."
Mark Knoller @markknoller
At UN Security Council, @nikkihaley denounces Russian attack on Ukrainian vessels as an "outrageous violation of sovereign Ukrainian territory." Calls it "yet another reckless Russian escalation." Says "this is no way for a law-abiding civilized nation to act."
BREAKING: In first response from US government leadership, UN Amb. Haley says in UN Security Council mtg. that Russia's shooting at, and seizure of, Ukrainian vessels marks "yet another reckless Russian escalation."
Mark Knoller @markknoller
At UN Security Council, @nikkihaley denounces Russian attack on Ukrainian vessels as an "outrageous violation of sovereign Ukrainian territory." Calls it "yet another reckless Russian escalation." Says "this is no way for a law-abiding civilized nation to act."
Mods really need to start cracking down on it.
Russia does something bad. - > Yeah, but what about USA.
It fully derails threads every single time on purpose.
Haley, your words are as worthless as it gets.
I'm talking about the deaths in Russia alone, not the Soviet Union.
Of course I have.
I will no longer engage any further with regards to USA / Russia past transgressions to avoid further derailment.
Apologies.
We can mention the war and I can again bring back the fact that the Iraq/Afghan war was met with a complete shift in power in our government and a full disavowal of that set of policy. We make mistakes but we also admit to and correct them. And the people who commit those mistakes are basically thrown to the wolves.
Russia doesn't make mistakes, doesn't acknowledge their crimes are wrong and continue to support and re-elect those that commit crimes.
Its worlds apart.
What would happen if the EU/America made a stand, like shifted some tanks and stuff into Ukraine. I know there is fear of escalation but it goes both ways, Russia isn't responding to anything else. I imagine Russia would probably use it as propaganda that US and Europe are expanding and threatening towards Russia so plays into their hands. Damned if you do, damned if you don't isn't it?
Immigrants on the ship with Hillary's snail mails, along with the children they kidnapped for her child sex ring.
Poroshenko is playing cards? He is at like 8% approval when Putin is at 99%. What the fuck are you talking about? Speaking of being clueless...
She already quit, she never had any sway in anything just bluster that would immediately be contradicted by Trump on twitter or it would be the other way around where Trump would have an embarrassing fit on twitter that then Haley would have to stomp out. Haley is among the most useless people in the administration up there with the former Secretary of State.
Is Crimea ever going back to Ukraine? I mean Russia is a bully and santions are at risk with the US being soft at it, Salvini calling to stop santions and half of Europe falling in love with Putin...
Now that China is buying soybeans from Russia at a record pace, they are probably offsetting some of their loses.
What a weird time we are leaving.
Now that China is buying soybeans from Russia at a record pace, they are probably offsetting some of their loses.
What a weird time we are leaving.
Putin's current approval is pretty low at this point. People are getting fed up and the retirement age mess is doing a number.
I would say that most of Ukrainians gave up on Crimea long time ago. I mean no one really felt strongly about it to begin with. The issue there is that Ukraine needs to pretend like it gives a shit because everyone will literally forget how fucking scary Russia is. (Some would argue that everyone forgot anyway)
According to this independent polling firm, 67.
https://www.foreignaffairs.com/arti...putins-approval-ratings-are-declining-sharply
While a US president would salivate for those numbers, considering Putin had a high of fucking 98, that's pretty bad.
Just took a peek at some pro-Russian twitter accounts, and they all seem to be retweeting posts by Russian media and even official Russian embassy accounts. They are basically pushing the narrative that Ukraine "preplanned the aggression" and Poroshenko is "sowing a frenzy to take control of the government" and then comparisons to Nazi Germany follow.
It's kind of hilarious. Now, I get the concern about martial law. But if you follow what's happening, if they were to enact it, it would only happen for 30-60 days. These accounts keep screaming about attacks on democracy, fascism, yada yada. There is one check-marked account that was listing all the potentially bad things the gov't could do under martial law, and then said "but in Russia you can talk freely about Putin all you want." This shit seriously made me laugh.
People really get stuck in their bubbles. I'm not saying they are completely wrong, though I think they give the Ukrainian military too much credit, basically saying they pulled off successfully what basically is making Russia look like the big bad guy to the whole world, with three little navy ships.
Anyway, I've been keeping an eye on this stuff. I'm already getting tired of the talking heads and people jumping to conclusions. I don't think martial law is necessary, but in the worst case scenario here, if it was enacted, it would be over in 60 days, and life would continue like normal afterward.
I'm also skeptical if anything is going to happen after this. There's panic on all sides about potential problems. I'm going to wait until things calm down before I start getting too worried (To be clear, I am currently living in Ukraine).
It's kind of hilarious. Now, I get the concern about martial law. But if you follow what's happening, if they were to enact it, it would only happen for 30-60 days. These accounts keep screaming about attacks on democracy, fascism, yada yada. There is one check-marked account that was listing all the potentially bad things the gov't could do under martial law, and then said "but in Russia you can talk freely about Putin all you want." This shit seriously made me laugh.
People really get stuck in their bubbles. I'm not saying they are completely wrong, though I think they give the Ukrainian military too much credit, basically saying they pulled off successfully what basically is making Russia look like the big bad guy to the whole world, with three little navy ships.
Anyway, I've been keeping an eye on this stuff. I'm already getting tired of the talking heads and people jumping to conclusions. I don't think martial law is necessary, but in the worst case scenario here, if it was enacted, it would be over in 60 days, and life would continue like normal afterward.
I'm also skeptical if anything is going to happen after this. There's panic on all sides about potential problems. I'm going to wait until things calm down before I start getting too worried (To be clear, I am currently living in Ukraine).
I should really stop watching these bullshit UNSC meetings, every time I do my hatred for this puppet show only increases.