PlayStation 5 Pre-Release Technical Discussion |OT|

Deleted member 23046 · Jul 12, 2020

anexanhume said:
I think we need to view the extent of Microsoft's BC support as mostly a vanity project. They go the extra mile and it seems more of a passion project than an initiative that seriously drives platform adoption. A Sony exec pointed out that the data shows that BC polls well but doesn't actually get used and got raked over the coals for it, but I suspect it's largely true and minor in its impact to the platform.

Microsoft has provided a great work on a "selected" emulation, and not an unlocked one where the Xbox/360 emulator would be freely accessible for any games. As a platform owner, you cannot offer the promise of emulation if games crash or are bugged (something common with software emulation) and you also need to be legally ok with publishers of games supported.

Also publishers already have the freedom to put any PS1/2 games on the PSN, it's not only on Sony side. But clearly MS did a great job, it would be nice to have a virtualized equivalent for the PS123SPVITA, with some basic improvements regarding scaling and filtering. If this were to happened I am not expecting anything regarding physical licensing, but more a global subscription to access the entire thing.

unapersson · Jul 12, 2020

The only way to have full emulation is to have hardware support for physical disks, running off the disk, as soon as there's a digital component you'll hit licensing and ownership issues.

Even then so many PS3 games have digital components and installations that the generation would be problematic no matter what.

gebler · Jul 12, 2020

褲蓋Calo said:
I wonder what's powering their PS3 PSNow service, it can't be a bunch of PS3s right?

MrKlaw said:
... it is

They are using a customized rack-based version of the PS3 hardware: https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-sony-creates-custom-ps3-for-playstation-now

褲蓋Calo · Jul 12, 2020

gebler said:
They are using a customized rack-based version of the PS3 hardware: https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-sony-creates-custom-ps3-for-playstation-now

MrKlaw said:
... it is

Oh....

anexanhume · Jul 12, 2020

褲蓋Calo said:
Oh....

Yup. This is why it's kinda insane they haven't gone down the emulation path. RPCS3 is the same license as PCSX ReARMed in the PS Classic, so it's not as if it would be out of character.

Bakura · Jul 13, 2020

I feel bad for people who got banned last week

EagleClaw · Jul 13, 2020

shocking....
If you buy a disc and want to play on a discless system it doesn't work...

That is the quality journalism i want to see /s

Tiago Rodrigues · Jul 13, 2020

Bakura said:
I feel bad for people who got banned last week

Sony really needs to sort this out. Come on.
I've always had Sony consoles but damn it, MS is so ahead in everything related to unifying their eco-system it's not even funny anymore.

Ghost Slayer · Jul 13, 2020

If I say Tom is MS ******, will I get banned? :v

Grayson · Jul 13, 2020

Tiago Rodrigues said:
Sony really needs to sort this out. Come on.
I've always had Sony consoles but damn it, MS is so ahead in everything related to unifying their eco-system it's not even funny anymore.

???

Lirion · Jul 13, 2020

Tiago Rodrigues said:
Sony really needs to sort this out. Come on.
I've always had Sony consoles but damn it, MS is so ahead in everything related to unifying their eco-system it's not even funny anymore.

What is there to sort out? Put in the PS4 disc in the PS5 (yes you need a PS5 with a blu-ray drive to play discs) and get the PS5 version.

Yaqza · Jul 13, 2020

Tiago Rodrigues said:
Sony really needs to sort this out. Come on.
I've always had Sony consoles but damn it, MS is so ahead in everything related to unifying their eco-system it's not even funny anymore.

Pssst, you forgot to put /s at the end of the sentence.

MrKlaw · Jul 13, 2020

Wouldn't smart delivery be the same? If I buy physical on xsx and try to play on a xb1SAD I wouldn't expect it to work - you need the disc as license key. Same if Lockhart is all digital

if they didn't do that then it'd be too easy to abuse

EagleClaw · Jul 13, 2020

MrKlaw said:
Wouldn't smart delivery be the same? If I buy physical on xsx and try to play on a xb1SAD I wouldn't expect it to work - you need the disc as license key. Same if Lockhart is all digital

if they didn't do that then it'd be too easy to abuse

Yes, it is the same for Xbox s digital and a disc game, but tom warren just covers all the sony news /s

BreakAtmo · Jul 13, 2020

Bakura said:
I feel bad for people who got banned last week

This... seems super obvious? If they didn't do this you could buy the PS4 version on disc, get the digital PS5 version and then return the disc. And yes, if you have a digital PS5 you can't do this... which is also super obvious. Who is this affecting?

MrKlaw said:
Wouldn't smart delivery be the same? If I buy physical on xsx and try to play on a xb1SAD I wouldn't expect it to work - you need the disc as license key. Same if Lockhart is all digital

if they didn't do that then it'd be too easy to abuse

Bingo. But technically there's no digital-only next-gen Xbox yet, so it's not technically a lie to point fingers solely at Sony. I'm sure Tom Warren will similarly point at Microsoft when they announce Lockhart and confirm Smart Delivery works the same way. After all, he would never be so disingenuous and partisan.

score01 · Jul 13, 2020

Yikes at that Tom Warren tweet. That is extremely embarrassing. I don't keep up with series x news but I'm sure that if you bought the one x version on disc you would also need to keep this in the drive on your series x.

Careful though guys, this thread could turn into a graveyard.

Gamer17 · Jul 13, 2020

Tiago Rodrigues said:
Sony really needs to sort this out. Come on.
I've always had Sony consoles but damn it, MS is so ahead in everything related to unifying their eco-system it's not even funny anymore.

Isn't it kind of a common sense ? If you buy ps4 disk u get the ps5 version for free but ur ps4 disk act as authentication code so u don't sell the disk and keep digital copy. If you get digital ps4 version you get ps5 digital edition for free.

If you buy ps5 DE ofcourse game disk won't work on it and u need to buy digital games.

What exactly do they need to clarify ?

Pabliter · Jul 13, 2020

I am sorry but you can't also play your bluray based games on the xbox ons digital edition. that's no news. I mean, it's not a big surprise if you can't use your wired headphones on a 3.5mm jackless mobile phone, isn't it?

come on.

19thCenturyFox · Jul 13, 2020

To be fair, people could be expecting to get the digital PS5 version when they install the physical PS4 version on their PS4. It doesn't make sense from a publishers point of view but people may be expecting it anyway and it makes sense to warn these people.

Chamon · Jul 13, 2020

But why are you buying discs if you want to go digital? I think some people are seeing a problem where there really isn't.

Gamer17 · Jul 13, 2020

19thCenturyFox said:
To be fair, people could be expecting to get the digital PS5 version when they install the physical PS4 version on their PS4. It doesn't make sense from a publishers point of view but people may be expecting it anyway and it makes sense to warn these people.

So they can sell their ps4 physical copy and keep the digital ps5 game for free ? So u r saying they r expecting free games ? Lol

hubertuss03 · Jul 13, 2020

Tiago Rodrigues said:
Sony really needs to sort this out. Come on.
I've always had Sony consoles but damn it, MS is so ahead in everything related to unifying their eco-system it's not even funny anymore.

What? 🤨

EagleClaw · Jul 13, 2020

19thCenturyFox said:
To be fair, people could be expecting to get the digital PS5 version when they install the physical PS4 version on their PS4. It doesn't make sense from a publishers point of view but people may be expecting it anyway and it makes sense to warn these people.

Yes, quality journalism.
I'm happy that there are journalists that warn people with clear words.
Would have been good to tell people also about the xbox one s digital, because that will be the same problem.
But i'm pretty sure he just missed that because he handles the sony topic in the news.

BreakAtmo · Jul 13, 2020

19thCenturyFox said:
To be fair, people could be expecting to get the digital PS5 version when they install the physical PS4 version on their PS4. It doesn't make sense from a publishers point of view but people may be expecting it anyway and it makes sense to warn these people.

Those people are stupid. And even then, Ubisoft is clarifying this months in advance for those very stupid people. So anyone trying to make controversy out of this is, "uhhhh..."

19thCenturyFox · Jul 13, 2020

Gamer17 said:
So they can sell their ps4 physical copy and keep the digital ps5 game for free ? So u r saying they r expecting free games ? Lol

That's pretty much what I'm saying. Most people don't realize that this would mean that they can share a physical disc with their entire department at work and use it as an infinite PS5 game code generator and that a publisher would never allow it.

random88 · Jul 13, 2020

Why would someone buy a physical PS4 game if they plan to go digital with PS5? I see no issues here, either buy digital on PS4 and play on PS5 DE, or buy physical and go with an ordinary PS5.

EagleClaw · Jul 13, 2020

I don't understand the problem, maybe it is a US thing...
there is written "HOT CONTENT" on coffee cups, there are "WET FLOOR" signs at swimming pools...
maybe on disc cases should be printed in big red letters "ONLY FOR DISC DRIVE".

/jk

19thCenturyFox · Jul 13, 2020

s_hyperion said:
Why would someone buy a physical PS4 game if they plan to go digital with PS5? I see no issues here, either buy digital on PS4 and play on PS5 DE, or buy physical and go with an ordinary PS5.

After years of doing customer support and tech support I don't ask myself why people would do X, Y or Z anymore. The question is how many people are likely to mess this up and can it be prevented through a label or warning. I talked to people who pushed DVDs into a discless Mac's large horizontal vent and wondered why they wouldn't play. These things happen and more frequently than we would be comfortable with.

BreakAtmo · Jul 13, 2020

s_hyperion said:
Why would someone buy a physical PS4 game if they plan to go digital with PS5? I see no issues here, either buy digital on PS4 and play on PS5 DE, or buy physical and go with an ordinary PS5.

I think the idea is that some people might think they can use the PS4 game disc to activate the free PS5 version digitally on their PS4, then trade up to a PS5 Digital Edition and play without the disc. It's really stupid if you think about it for more than 5 seconds.

19thCenturyFox said:
After years of doing customer support and tech support I don't ask myself why people would do X, Y or Z anymore. The question is how many people are likely to mess this up and can it be prevented through a label or warning. I talked to people who pushed DVDs into a discless Mac's large horizontal vent and wondered why they wouldn't play. These things happen and more frequently than we would be comfortable with.

Of course, some people can do maybe 1 second at most.

anexanhume · Jul 13, 2020

Bakura said:
I feel bad for people who got banned last week

Consumers be like

Tiago Rodrigues · Jul 13, 2020

Grayson said:
???

Lirion said:
What is there to sort out? Put in the PS4 disc in the PS5 (yes you need a PS5 with a blu-ray drive to play discs) and get the PS5 version.

Yaqza said:
Pssst, you forgot to put /s at the end of the sentence.

Gamer17 said:
Isn't it kind of a common sense ? If you buy ps4 disk u get the ps5 version for free but ur ps4 disk act as authentication code so u don't sell the disk and keep digital copy. If you get digital ps4 version you get ps5 digital edition for free.

If you buy ps5 DE ofcourse game disk won't work on it and u need to buy digital games.

What exactly do they need to clarify ?

hubertuss03 said:
What? 🤨

I thought MS allowed us to upgrade no matter if we got a physical this gen or not and then simply download a digital copy of the same game next gen (allowing us to upgrade no matter if we originally got a physical game or digital this gen).
If that's not it...what is Smart delivery and how does it differ from Sony?

Anyway...that Tom Warren probably realized his mistake since i can't find that tweet anymore.
He could never hide his bias anyway.

Magio · Jul 13, 2020

I'm not Tom Warren's biggest fan, but I don't think he's an idiot. He's just Microsoft-adjacent.

So, if he's trying to throw shade at Sony based on this, it makes me wonder if Xbox is getting ready to announce a revamp of physical/digital licenses that would allow one to get a digital license from a physical disc. They tried it once already and got burned because they fucked up the execution and the optics (basically, to avoid getting shat on: Make it optional (a checkmark at install) and easily reversible), but such a system could definitely be done in a way that wouldn't be outright shit, and Tom Warren could then come back to this tweet and point out that buying physical DOES get you Smart Delivery on your discless Series S.

Wouldn't bet money on it, but it just seems weird to me that Warren would tweet this otherwise.

Deleted member 5028 · Jul 13, 2020

Tiago Rodrigues said:
He could never hide his bias anyway.

Is it bias for someone to work a specific beat? Tom is not a video games journalist. He works the Microsoft beat. He previously coveted MS before the Verge and he was hired to continue that work. Some of y'all just want to bash anyone who doesnt cover your specific best

EagleClaw · Jul 13, 2020

Tiago Rodrigues said:
I thought MS allowed us to upgrade no matter if we got a physical this gen or not and then simply download a digital copy of the same game next gen (allowing us to upgrade no matter if we originally got a physical game or digital this gen).
If that's not it...what is Smart delivery and how does it differ from Sony?

Anyway...that Tom Warren probably realized his mistake since i can't find that tweet anymore.
He could never hide his bias anyway.

Magio said:
I'm not Tom Warren's biggest fan, but I don't think he's an idiot. He's just Microsoft-adjacent.

So, if he's trying to throw shade at Sony based on this, it makes me wonder if Xbox is getting ready to announce a revamp of physical/digital licenses that would allow one to get a digital license from a physical disc. They tried it once already and got burned because they fucked up the execution and the optics (basically, to avoid getting shat on: Make it optional (a checkmark at install) and easily reversible), but such a system could definitely be done in a way that wouldn't be outright shit, and Tom Warren could then come back to this tweet and point out that buying physical DOES get you Smart Delivery on your discless Series S.

Wouldn't bet money on it, but it just seems weird to me that Warren would tweet this otherwise.

How will MS do that? How can they give you a digital copy for your disc game?
Will they reactivate online check ins?

FF Seraphim · Jul 13, 2020

Bakura said:
I feel bad for people who got banned last week

Isn't this... isn't this the same damn thing with the MS? If Lockhart is actually discless wouldn't this be the same problem?

Tiago Rodrigues · Jul 13, 2020

EagleClaw said:
How will MS do it, presenting a digital copy for your disc game.
Will they reactivate online check ins?

Once you install and play a physical copy it's in your library no matter what right? I thought for some reason MS was allowing you to download a digital copy next gen even if you had previously bought a physical one. But again, i'm out of the loop in regards MS stuff. I actually thought Smart Delivery was that, lmao.

SlipperyFishes said:
Is it bias for someone to work a specific beat? Tom is not a video games journalist. He works the Microsoft beat. He previously coveted MS before the Verge and he was hired to continue that work. Some of y'all just want to bash anyone who doesnt cover your specific best

I mean...at least make sure you don't tweet stuff like that for no reason. It's okay to work for MS without dissing the competition. He always looks childish for no reason.

Mula · Jul 13, 2020

Can you play disc games on x box one sad? I mean the digital version if you have only the disc?

EagleClaw · Jul 13, 2020

Tiago Rodrigues said:
Once you install and play a physical copy it's in your library no matter what right? I thought for some reason MS was allowing you to download a digital copy next gen even if you had previously bought a physical one. But again, i'm out of the loop in regards MS stuff. I actually thought Smart Delivery was that, lmao.

I don't think that is how it works.
You could sell the disc after you got your smart delivery, and another person can use smart delivery again.
Would be pretty pro-consumer, but i'm not sure if the 3rd party developers would be happy with that.

smart delivery just means that there has something to be delivered in a smart way, and that will be the XSX game files, because on the disc will be the Xbox one files.
Smart= checking if it is a XSX
Delivery= sending the XSX files while installing.
You will still have to use the disc to play.

Pat002 · Jul 13, 2020

Tom Warren is literally paid by MS. Just stop following him or post his stuff when he needs to speak well for a company for a living.

Data Journalism | Microsoft Power BI

Engage your audience through data journalism. Learn how to use data storytelling in Power BI to turn data into insightful visuals that inform and persuade.

powerbi.microsoft.com

StraightToHell · Jul 13, 2020

s_hyperion said:
Why would someone buy a physical PS4 game if they plan to go digital with PS5? I see no issues here, either buy digital on PS4 and play on PS5 DE, or buy physical and go with an ordinary PS5.

The concern is mostly likely about a PS4 owner upgrading to a PS5 digital version of the game, then giving away or trading in their PS4 disc copy. It is likely to be seen as a lost sale.

Magio · Jul 13, 2020

EagleClaw said:
How will MS do that? How can they give you a digital copy for your disc game?
Will they reactivate online check ins?

That's how they'd have to do it, yes. But I don't think there'd be as much backlash if they made it optional. There'd still be some issues (what happens if you're internet-less the first time you put a disc in?), but I don't think the backlash would be as bad as what they got in 2013.

Again this is pure speculation based on the idea that Warren has inside info from Microsoft and that this tweet is a setup for when Microsoft announces their plans.

EagleClaw · Jul 13, 2020

Magio said:
That's how they'd have to do it, yes. But I don't think there'd be as much backlash if they made it optional. There'd still be some issues (what happens if you're internet-less the first time you put a disc in?), but I don't think the backlash would be as bad as what they got in 2013.

Again this is pure speculation based on the idea that Warren has inside info from Microsoft and that this tweet is a setup for when Microsoft announces their plans.

How can you do it optional?
I mean if i would buy used disc games i would opt out of that, simple as that.
And the person with the digital version of that game can be opted in.
It doesn't work...

Magio · Jul 13, 2020

EagleClaw said:
How can you do it optional?
I mean if i would buy used disc games i would opt out of that, simple as that.
And the person with the digital version of that game can be opted in.
It doesn't work...

You'd opt in or out on a per-game basis. So for example: I put my TLOU II disc in, at install there's a checkmark "Activate digital license", if you check it you can then play without the disc in or use your digital license on a discless console but if someone else uses the disc it automatically revokes your license, and when uninstalling a game you can revoke the digital license and sell your physical disc.

Only thing is that you'd have to be connected to the internet the first time you put a disc in, but everything else would be optional and reversible.

PS: I don't have all the answers, and I'm sure there are flaws with "my" system. I'm also not a Microsoft engineer. I'm just speculating.

Adookah · Jul 13, 2020

It's OK that he writes for Microsoft but he could stop shitting on Sony and PlayStation.

score01 · Jul 13, 2020

SlipperyFishes said:
Is it bias for someone to work a specific beat? Tom is not a video games journalist. He works the Microsoft beat. He previously coveted MS before the Verge and he was hired to continue that work. Some of y'all just want to bash anyone who doesnt cover your specific best

I don't think anyone has a problem with Tom Warren being a Microsoft focused reporter. By all means report as much MS info as you can. The issue most have is his erroneous/incorrect/fake concern reporting on Sony. I'm sure we could all agree that we could do without that. Really eats into his credibility.

I guess there is a reason why he deleted that tweet.

Pat002 · Jul 13, 2020

score01 said:
I don't think anyone has a problem with Tom Warren being a Microsoft focused reporter. By all means report as much MS info as you can. The issue most have is his erroneous/incorrect reporting on Sony. I'm sure we could all agree that we could do without that. Really eats into his credibility.

Fear, uncertainty, and doubt - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

EagleClaw · Jul 13, 2020

Magio said:
You'd opt in or out on a per-game basis. So for example: I put my TLOU II disc in, at install there's a checkmark "Activate digital license", if you check it you can then play without the disc in or use your digital license on a discless console but if someone else uses the disc it automatically revokes your license, and when uninstalling a game you can revoke the digital license and sell your physical disc.

Only thing is that you'd have to be connected to the internet the first time you put a disc in, but everything else would be optional and reversible.

How would you validate your disc if you have a discless PS5?

That is the idea the "original" Xbox one had, you need an online connection to install disc games, no chance otherwise.
If that would be optional then you could install the game from a disc used as digital version "key" without online check.

I wouldn't have a problem in todays time with that, because in my opinion physical is already just a "key" for a day one patch and following patches.

Deleted member 5028 · Jul 13, 2020

Pat002 said:
Tom Warren is literally paid by MS. Just stop following him or post his stuff when he needs to speak well for a company for a living.

Data Journalism | Microsoft Power BI

Engage your audience through data journalism. Learn how to use data storytelling in Power BI to turn data into insightful visuals that inform and persuade.

powerbi.microsoft.com

This bullshit needs to stop

Decarb · Jul 13, 2020

MS can do whatever they want with their first party stuff, but good luck convincing Ubisoft and other major 3rd party publishers to give away the digital version free with physical disks. I bet most of them are already at their "generosity" limit with smart delivery stuff as it is.

Magio · Jul 13, 2020

EagleClaw said:
How would you validate your disc if you have a discless PS5?

Obviously you'd have to validate your disc on a console that does have a disc-reader before making the switch to a discless console.

PlayStation 5 Pre-Release Technical Discussion |OT|

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