This is why PvP is in such a crappy spot atm and it's not easy to figure out.
Destiny is a game that can be enjoyed by multiple different types of players and multiple different level of skilled players. Right now, the needle is pushing more to cater to the hardcore crowd and streamers. If they keep it this way when Shadowkeep drops, it's going to continue being an uninviting mess for those jumping into the game as F2P players.
The idea of pinnacle weapons is fine, but they should make progress accessible to everyone (all skills) in competitive without being penalized for losses.
QP needs a SBMM/CBMM choice. RN, being "farmed" in QP is not fun and the matches aren't even worth engaging in. They need to try and split it at a certain skill level
I think it's 100% okay if weapon quests incentivize people to get good at a part of the game. I don't feel entitled to 1k Voices without learning Last Wish. Those pinnacle quests have the side effect of making you really learn how to use the weapon type, giving you a ton of practice, then proving you can do it. They're awesome that way, they absolutely make you a better player.
If you or anyone here is getting farmed in quick play, it's 99.9% because you haven't really learned how to play it yet. I say this as a guy who is in no way amazing, but nobody's farming me (well okay, I was one of the lowest level guys in every Iron Banner lobby this time around, that got ugly). But since you're clearing raids on practically a nightly basis you absolutely have the skill to do just fine in QP, you just need to spend more time in it.
When I started back in September I was 100% potato. I thought headseeker was an awesome perk because hitting headshots was some kind of elite streamer ability. I crutched Nova Warp like I was Tiny Tim because it was the only thing that stopped me from going 9-17 every match. My aim was like drunk 12 year old-tier.
But I watched multiple PvP Youtubers religiously, like every day. Got a couple of hundred matches under my belt, and by late October I was looking okay - not great, but okay. Then a few thousand matches under my belt. Picked up a sniper in November and swore I wouldn't put it down until I got good with it. That part didn't quite happen but I did stick with it, even in PvE where it's rarely optimal.
Once I got up to about 3500 kills with various snipers across various modes, weird things started happening. Because Destiny's first person, all of those drag snipes I'd watched Geekermon do day in day out kind of became ingrained in me as if I'd been the one doing it. My thumb muscles were finally starting to catch up and I was able to pull it off every once in a while because I knew exactly what the timing was supposed to look like. Then it started getting more frequent.
Then I hit jump snipes. Quick scopes. No scopes. I sniped a youtuber out of his super.
That stuff I can't do regularly, but it all happened, and I kept the footage. I'm consistent enough that I logged ~200 snipes on the Revoker quest in 2 evenings. If you told me I'd be pulling any of that off last fall I'd have called you nuts, I'm not that coordinated. But I can do it, and that's after 7-8 months. Where will I be at in another 6 months? A year?
And that's when it hits me, most of these good players dropping 29 every match have been at this for years, since the Halo days. It's actually surprising how quickly you can get above water without a ton of practice.
So yeah, long speech but the TL;DR is that most of Crucible is learned skills and strategies that can be ingrained if players make it a real part of their Destiny time rather than letting it be this intimidating thing.
Monster energy drinks do help a lot though.
No,
Decarb is right. The dad builds are weapons that are effective and relatively easy to obtain. Before Jotunn, Trust would've been considered a dad build gun. Same with Izanagi. I'd lump Arbalest, Thunderlord, Truth, and maybe even Last Word in there. I would definitely include any shotgun that can be obtained from regular drops, such as Dust Rock Blues.
Really, the only weapons that are never in a dad build are the Crucible pinnacle weapons. New weapons in any given season are initially tryhard guns, but they eventually become dad guns, as indicated by Hammerhead, Blast Furnace, Jotunn, and Kindled Orchid.
Precision weapons are excluded from dad-dom by definition. It's why Bygones is the dad meme gun. Trust is an easy-mode hand cannon, but it still requires consistent precision aim to be of any use. Kindled Orchid is absolutely a high skill weapon, at least on console. Any 140rpm hand cannon has an uphill climb there.
