Trump didn't get impeached because of TLJ."Episode IX only did well cause JJ retconed TLJ!"
or
"Episode IX underperformed cause of TLJ!"
Trump didn't get impeached because of TLJ."Episode IX only did well cause JJ retconed TLJ!"
or
"Episode IX underperformed cause of TLJ!"
I don't know you think the prequels feel more like SW compared to the new trilogy. I feel the exact opposite. If you put all 3 trilogies together it's pretty obvious which one is not like the others. And I like the prequels as crap as they are.
Nah, male version would be "Kirito" or "Kvothe"
Your pathetic attempt to make it seem like we think only female characters can have such writing flaws is not going to work
This is the problem when your sequel trilogy and spin offs rely too much on nostalgia factor from 30-40 years ago.
Yes, of course it is stupid, as are most of these conversations.
Here's a fact for you, you seem to love those: No matter what Episode 9 does at the BO, in 2020 Black Widow and something called The Eternals is releasing. SW is not.
In 2021, something called Shang Chi is releasing, along with Dr. Strange and Thor. SW is not.
Disney is cool with SW missing box office for 2 years. Marvel, not so much.
SW is currently the Wizards version of Jordan. Still Jordan but not quite the Bulls version we all loved. 🙂
Star Wars is the only one that's purely a cinematic franchise that's been doing it for 40 years.
But 40 YEARS MAN.
Explain to me how Ant-man made more money at the box office than beloved 40 year old franchise stalwart Han Solo.
I'll listen.
Were the prequels Michael Jordan playing minor league baseball?SW is currently the Wizards version of Jordan. Still Jordan but not quite the Bulls version we all loved. 🙂
Excuses.It wasn't a very good movie, but most of all HARRISON FORD (you know this guy) is kind of a big fucking deal. He IS Han Solo. You can't make a Han Solo movie without Harrison Ford as Han Solo.
It's like making a Rocky movie without Sylvester Stallone playing Rocky.
It's not going to work.
Excuses.
Who the fack was Ant-man tho? How did that movie beat Chewie and Han, franchise icons of 40 years gone by?
Paul Rudd is very charming and funny actually, but where was Ant-Man played by Harrison Ford previously? Yeah, never? Thought so. So that comparison doesn't work.
Ant-Man is a blank slate, you can cast anyone and the audience will go with it. You can't cast anyone as Han Solo, it is one of most iconic Hollywood roles in modern fucking cinema. OK? Little difference there.
Oh man. That spin is epic. I will admit though, TLJ and R1 both made money on par with Black Panther. That's not bad. Not Avengers money, but not bad at all.
Honorable.
*giggles*
Were the prequels Michael Jordan playing minor league baseball?
Yeah only takes an Avengers movie to make as much as the horrible Last Jedi
No, just Black Panther.
TLJ didn't hit close to Avengers IW/EG money.
And Disney is completely cool with missing out on all that TLJ money for 2 year in favor of proven commodities like Eternals and Shang Chi.I dunno how come 85% of MCU movies can't make as much as the horrible (not really) Last Jedi tho? OMG! Fiege fail. Rite?
And Disney is completely cool with missing out on all that TLJ money for 2 year in favor of proven commodities like Eternals and Shang Chi.
And there's an ... oh 85% chance those two will fail to make as much as TLJ. How can that be if TLJ is so terrible and MCU gets everything right?
And YET Disney is cool with taking that chance. Disney decided to roll the dice on those films and shelve 40 year behemoth SW for 2 years.
That's a fact.
Solo was a bad idea, plain and simple. Recasting him with someone people aren't familiar with and failing to properly market the film/releasing outside of the established December timeframe was a bad idea too.Explain to me how Ant-man made more money at the box office than beloved 40 year old franchise stalwart Han Solo.
I'll listen.
Solo was a bad idea, plain and simple. Recasting him with someone people aren't familiar with and failing to properly market the film/releasing outside of the established December timeframe was a bad idea too.
It also was an expensive production disaster.
Just mismanaged from top to bottom.
However, the other 3 SW movies all pulled over a billion WW.
SW is still a domestic powerhouse. Even with a 200M bomb included, Disney SW is averaging 576M domestic.
SW is just not nearly as popular as other franchisees WW, especially not on Marvel's level, yet still managed to do 3 one billion films.
Imo, I don't think there is any SW fatigue. I just think they royally fucked up Solo across the board.
Even WITH Solo, Disney SW is averaging 1.1B WW.
I think this is more of figuring out what people want to see from SW movies instead of actual fatigue. The numbers just don't reflect it. It's easy to jump to conclusions off of one bomb though.
Oh, I'm not arguing that SW is on Marvel's level WW, at all. I would bet on marvel for their established success and stability across the board.You know I love ya, Surf. 🙂
If SW and Marvel were independent stocks and you were looking at futures, where would you invest?
Nobody will read this but here goes:
The Force Awakens was fine and, as a film, I think The Last Jedi was fantastic, probably the third best in the series. But the former banked heavily on nostalgia and I think the latter resonated more with critics and cinephiles and (despite its high sales and critical reception) fractured the fan base. Both are character-centric and none of the new characters (barring Kylo maybe) are as interesting as the old guard. They're fine, but just not as fun or memorable.
The main draw of Star Wars for kids though is the fantastical universe, and the sequels are greatly lacking in world building. The prequels were laughable, but kids loved the vibrant worlds that each had their own unique geography and ecosystem. I didn't care about the trade federation or any of that stuff but that scene in episode 1 where they're dodging all those giant sea creatures on the way to an intricately designed bubble city? That was amazing. The closest you get to that in the sequels is Crait, and there's not much focus because it's just the site of the final battle.
But in the end I don't think that's the biggest issue. Like the sales of physical toys such as action figures is down in general nowadays, and there's a bigger variety of marvel characters. In fact, variety is the biggest difference between Marvel and Star Wars. There are so many different characters and settings in Marvel that just about anyone can find a favorite. Maybe a kid likes the galactic setting of GotG, or only cares about Spider-Man, or wants to see cool wizard shenanigans with Doctor Strange. They're all looking for different things and they can find all of them under the same umbrella: Marvel.
Star Wars on the other hand is fairly one note. You can tell a variety of different stories but there's nowhere near as many possibilities. You can't change the science fantasy setting or set it in a relatable place like modern earth without it just not being Star Wars anymore.
TLDR: Disney could have handled SW better but ultimately the result wouldn't be much different. We live in 2019.
Oh, I'm not arguing that SW is on Marvel's level WW, at all. I would bet on marvel for their established success and stability across the board.
I am just pointing out that SW still puts out excellent numbers and easily rivals Marvel domestically.
So a lot of the doom and gloom in regard to Disney SW is just unfounded, financially.
They had one bomb. Meanwhile the WW total for 4 films stands at 4.5B. I think people forget just how good that is.
Now imagine if solo wasn't a fucking disaster. There would be no discussion here and Disney wouldn't have over corrected.
Good news is people still like the trilogy format. Bad news is that Lucasfilm has been pretty clueless with what else they should do, if you examine some of the turmoil behind the scenes.I don't think it's an bad thing though. You and I have spoken about this. We love SW bit you are Martin and I am more Malcolm. You more Xavier and I more Erik. You get the point.
I think the old format of making trilogies is played and SW needs further reaching stories and more time for viewers to invest.
I like Rey but have no investment in her. Same with Finn and Poe. Kylo is interesting but he could have used a few more films to truly develop. 7+ hours across a trilogy isn't nearly enough time to get a satisfying investment and payoff for the audience, imo.
Times have changed. I truly hope the time off does the franchise good.
Star Wars is fine, it's doing numbers that every other IP but one would kill to do and it's harder to write than most popular fantasy.
And that is the problem, imo. Let that shit go, man.Still genuinely shocked that an obi wan spinoff doesn't exist. That's gotta be easy money.
Still genuinely shocked that an obi wan spinoff doesn't exist. That's gotta be easy money.
Stop. I am not gonna let that get run out here as an excuse for circular storytelling that LFL has been rolling out in its film division as of late.
SW, while not having been around as long as Marvel, has 40 years of excellent source material that Disney owns, in the EU. Planets, characters, weapons, ships...stories through comics, novels and such. They don't have to adapt 1:1 (hell, Marvel doesn't even do that; MCU is very different than the comics) but they can mine what they like and run with it. They own it all! The most interesting SW thing coming out for me is The Mandalorian and that is, to my knowledge, 100% original.
Please don't roll this argument out as a crutch.
It's not at all a problem, financially.Stop. I am not gonna let that get run out here as an excuse for circular storytelling that LFL has been rolling out in its film division as of late.
SW, while not having been around as long as Marvel, has 40 years of excellent source material that Disney owns, in the EU. Planets, characters, weapons, ships...stories through comics, novels and such. They don't have to adapt 1:1 (hell, Marvel doesn't even do that; MCU is very different than the comics) but they can mine what they like and run with it. They own it all! The most interesting SW thing coming out for me is The Mandalorian and that is, to my knowledge, 100% original.
Please don't roll this argument out as a crutch.
And that is the problem, imo. Let that shit go, man.
Tell new stories about new people.
Marvel is double the age of Star Wars, Star Wars was never really intended to be something with so many side characters. It's designed to be the story of one family primarily from inception to even today.
There's nothing "wrong" or "bad" about that, OK? That is just a different style of storytelling, and quite frankly Empire Strikes Back still takes a giant shit on any modern so-called action adventure blockbuster, and at the end of the day that's what matters most, not box office receipts.
You keep saying what SW was "intended to be" but there are all these stories and lore that make cross sections through the mythos, introducing new an interesting characters and locales.
There is meat to mine from. SW isn't absent of great source material. LFL has chosen to play things incredibly safe and not take chances.
I said it earlier, GOTG imo was better science fantasy than SW. With more memorable characters...from a shit tier comic that no one read when it was released.
Apparently Lucas wanted a solo movie, and Kasdan got it as a reward for doing TFA.The goodwill it would generate, the new generation PT audience it would grab and and OT audience who praised Ewan even if having problems overall, and Ewan who has said repeatedly he's game
And they opted to do Solo instead. Crazy
You're living in the past, bro. The article talks about the NOW. And Han Solo has recently proven that he isn't bankable in the here and now so why even evoke his name?Yeah call me when GOTG has more memorable characters than Yoda, Darth Vader, Han Solo, Palpatine, etc. let alone a story arc that has any real stakes to it.
It's this, plus the new films are just lacking in a number of ways. Because the nostalgia bit has me tired and burned out, feeling like I'm being swindled into seeing something I've seen before, but better.I feel that this problem solely lies with how Lucasfilm (and Disney) have handled Star Wars. In theory, Star Wars would have plenty of potential to be just as fruitful as the MCU. I mean, you can literally do anything because very little was established, especially since they destroyed the entire old EU.
But they decided for some absurd reason to not do that and to instead completely rely on nostalgia. Modern kids aren't going apeshit over a movie teasing Luke Skywalker or basing an entire movie on the past of Han Solo. Even The Last Jedi with its subversive approach to Star Wars very much relies on nostalgia to push its narrative with Luke, Yoda, overreliance on familiar beats and visuals (though, granted, less so than Force Awakens).
This potentially works for people like me or my parents who grew up with these characters and movies, but doesn't do shit for winning over new audiences.
Apparently Lucas wanted a solo movie, and Kasdan got it as a reward for doing TFA.
I don't know why anybody would think it's a good idea though, especially without Ford.