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First set photos of Joaquin Phoenix as the Joker
- Thread starter Gravity Insanity
- Start date
Please tell me that the shake up involves this film being the permanent start of a proper DCCU. Joakim Phoenix as the Joker is such a great fit, and I want to see him in a proper atagonist role against a hopefully equal and great batman.
Gundam has a bunch of different incarnations and standalone stuff so I don't see your point.
Anyways, I'm very interested in this film and if it will have any connection to Matt Reeve's movie. Big fan of Phoenix.
I mean, I'm likely in the minority here, but I thought Leto's Joker was fine enough, and this is just all around a mistake. Having the older Joker for an origin film is likely going to end up just muddying the waters moving forward.
So is this an adaptation of the 'The Killing Joke'-Joker backstory then?
Also, Todd Philipps directing this gives me no hope but man I might watch it for my man Joaquin
Also, Todd Philipps directing this gives me no hope but man I might watch it for my man Joaquin
Gundam has a myriad of Alternate Universes that are more popular than the mainline in some regions and circles, so...
I'm not going to suggest that Phoenix is a bad actor, but this is largely just a bad idea for a film on every axiom possible.
I would flip the f out if they did that (in a good way). I predicted a while ago that it'd end with a voice over of him talking about the story then we'd cut to inside Arkham and that would be the first time we see him with the white face and green hair and he's laying on a couch talking to a doctor (not Harley).
Let me just quickly explain why this movie is fucking stupid from every angle. First of all, the premise misses the entire point of The Joker, we aren't supposed to know where he came from. The Joker works as Batman's villain and one that works best when he simply springs up out of nowhere. We aren't supposed to understand the Joker as he's a living embodiment of crazy. The minute we can sympathize with him on a human level is when he ceases to compelling. The Joker can't be saved no matter how much Batman wants to try to.
But besides all of that, this movie seems monumentally stupid from a business perspective. Do you know why Marvel films make billions of dollars? Because kids can watch them. A Joker standalone movie, especially one harping off of The Killing Joke, is not a movie aimed for kids. Even stupid, "gritty," Batman v. Superman could target kids because it was about Batman and fucking Superman, the embodiment of everything good (allegedly). However, the Joker is a maniacal serial killer. How the hell do you convince mommy and daddy to take little Timmy to go see the ultra-violent Joker movie?
DC/WB have lost their damn minds.
But besides all of that, this movie seems monumentally stupid from a business perspective. Do you know why Marvel films make billions of dollars? Because kids can watch them. A Joker standalone movie, especially one harping off of The Killing Joke, is not a movie aimed for kids. Even stupid, "gritty," Batman v. Superman could target kids because it was about Batman and fucking Superman, the embodiment of everything good (allegedly). However, the Joker is a maniacal serial killer. How the hell do you convince mommy and daddy to take little Timmy to go see the ultra-violent Joker movie?
DC/WB have lost their damn minds.
War Dogs was pretty good and Joaquin is the man so I'm hyped. Very curious how much if any time he spends as The Joker in this.
How is a joker origin story with a way older and different looking joker supposed to fit in with their other movies? Who needed a joker origin story or yet another interpretation of the character? Everything about the DCEU continues to be a trash fire.
I doubt this thing has a very big budget. It'll be fine, commercially. Especially if its half-Oscar bait.
"First photo of Venom revealed"
He looks like someone who always seems to find himself questioning something the government may not be looking at.
I think they could understand if it were obviously unrelated to anything else, something like Red Son that changes core elements of the chararacters, but this looks like it's still too close to the source material. It'll be no more an elseworld than other movies already are.
I don't think this is aiming for that kind of success or that audience
I mean, if the rumors are true of Thomas Wayne being alive and older and being a criminal (or at least shady) are true, that should immediately clue people in.
It's an origin story though. People likely will attempt to see it as a prequel, and Thomas has been barely a character in the movies.
Yeah, but this Joker looks like he's in his late 40s / early 50s. If Thomas Wayne is still alive, Joker would be in a retirement home by the time Bruce puts on the cape and cowl.
I mean, that's clearly not who it is aimed at. The fact that WB are seemingly taking a risk with their property rather than spectacularly failing to copy the Marvel Blueprint is A Good Thing.
But yeah, unless they pull something really clever, it fundamentally misses the point of the character.
It is worth pointing out that The Killing Joke does want readers' sympathy for the Joker (at points and in a very confused, possibly intentional way). That story is held up as a classic in the Joker canon.
For some reason.
This won't have a huge budget and i'm pretty Confident kids won't be the target demographic for this movie. Not every superhero movie needs to make over $500M.
I don't think that's how characterisation works. People have been saying this forever and I think it's bullshit. People act like Joker can only be unpredictable (read: scary) if we don't sympathise with him.
Why can't an audience sympathise with the man who loses his grip on his sanity and becomes the Joker?
Because the Joker isn't supposed to be a "man" in the film sense. He's essentially an elemental force of chaos and evil. That's why people like the character. As far as I'm concerned, Burton's Joker straddled the line as much as is possible. Ledger's Joker went fully in the right direction, and Leto's Joker tried to marry both of those incarnations together.
I'd compare the Joker to Michael Myers from the Halloween series. Yes, you can do an origin film for him, but it largely robs him of what makes him work.
Let's be honest. Michael Meyers isn't interesting outside of the opening act of Halloween.
From Todd's Instagram
"Don't put it in your pocket - it's your lucky Joker card. If you put it in your pocket it will just be another card".
I was just about to say Burton's Joker worked perfectly fine as pre-and post Joker, in my opinion, and was enhanced by Nicholson's performance. Going even further in depth, with an excellent actor like Joaquin could be quite compelling. I'll give it the benefit of the doubt for now.
Nicholson basically did a lot of heavy lifting to make that work, as I think Burton mostly got the character wrong. I feel a lot of this film's fate will come down to Phoenix selling us on the character.
The Joker is whatever the writer wants him to be and that's always been the case. There's been so many different variations of him throughout the years that I fail to see the issue with them trying something different on film. There will still be twenty other things with him in it at any given time anyway if this isn't your cup of tea.
