Wkd Box Office - 12•27-29•19 - Little Women Winter invades the box office, as Star Wars drops 59%.

Tace · Dec 30, 2019

Comic book fans are absolutely less picky than Star Wars fans. There are so many different variations of these characters already you at least have the benefit of knowing there's another adaptation or version coming

That said, comic fans are still picky but not SW level

ryutaro's mama · Dec 30, 2019

Tace said:
Comic book fans are absolutely less picky than Star Wars fans. There are so many different variations of these characters already you at least have the benefit of knowing there's another adaptation or version coming

That said, comic fans are still picky but not SW level

If the MCU turned in TROS at Movie #9, they wouldn't have made it to Movie #23.

UltraMagnus · Dec 30, 2019

ryutaro's mama said:
"wHy ArE yOu So WoUnD uP."

Yeah, it's a fucking predictable schtick.

Yeah dude, you're overly hostile for no reason, I'd appreciate it if you simply didn't respond, I was talking with other posters in the thread until you decided to explode for whatever reason.

ryutaro's mama · Dec 30, 2019

UltraMagnus said:
Yeah dude, you're overly hostile for no reason, I'd appreciate it if you simply didn't respond, I was talking with other posters in the thread until you decided to explode for whatever reason.

No one is hostile. I responded to your initial "point" and you decided to pivot into oblivion.

Also, this is a forum.

If you don't want to be called out on your antics by others, send a PM to the one person you want to talk to.

You are also free to stop responding at any time you like.

UltraMagnus · Dec 30, 2019

Tace said:
Comic book fans are absolutely less picky than Star Wars fans. There are so many different variations of these characters already you at least have the benefit of knowing there's another adaptation or version coming

That said, comic fans are still picky but not SW level

Yup agree 100%. Not only that comic book fans are conditioned to be OK with changes or variances in characters and creative interpretation applied, it's the bedrock of the comic book industry. There is no singular version of Spider-Man or The Hulk or Batman. But if you do that to Luke Skywalker ... get ready for death threats.

Tace · Dec 30, 2019

ryutaro's mama said:
If the MCU turned in TROS at Movie #9, they wouldn't have made it to Movie #23.

I doubt it, Thor the Dark World was their 8th MCU movie and they bounced back just fine. The MCU and Star Wars aren't directly comparable in that way anyway, there's so many stories happening at any one time in the MCU

I also don't really see how that has anything to do with comic book fans being less picky. We got shitty films for years, of course were less critical if a film is borderline competent. If it's good? Forget about it

Plus SW isn't even dead, TROS not doing as well as projected is not gonna end SW.

UltraMagnus · Dec 30, 2019

Tace said:
I doubt it, Thor the Dark World was their 8th MCU movie and they bounced back just fine. The MCU and Star Wars aren't directly comparable in that way anyway, there's so many stories happening at any one time in the MCU

I also don't really see how that has anything to do with comic book fans being less picky. We got shitty films for years, of course were less critical if a film is borderline competent. If it's good? Forget about it

Plus SW isn't even dead, TROS not doing as well as projected is not gonna end SW.

I remember in 2000 people were rejoicing big time that X-Men was half way decent. It was like a huge "victory" for comic book fans, especially after "costume gate" when photos leaked on the internet showing the characters were not going to wear their comic book suits people got up in arms assuming Hollywood was going to fuck it up.

But since it was half way decent movie, not spectacular per se but decent enough, that was fantastic for a lot of folkes.

ryutaro's mama · Dec 30, 2019

Tace said:
I doubt it, Thor the Dark World was their 8th MCU movie and they bounced back just fine.

They didn't have 3 PT tier films in that 9. That matters too. Even if you were to say, Incredible Hulk, Iron Mang 2 and Thor 2 were their worst 3, the others were all solid. Certainly from a review and reception standpoint.

The MCU and Star Wars aren't directly comparable in that way anyway, there's so many stories happening at any one time

I 100% agree with you which is why whenever this "arguments" are rolled out, it's rarely without an agenda.

I also don't really see how that has anything to do with comic book fans being less picky. We got shitty films for years, of course were less critical if a film is borderline competent. If it's good? Forget about it

When shit is peddled, comic fans chirp about it. See: Spider-Man 3, ASM2, X-Men3...hell, Blade Trinity ended that franchise with how bad it was. BvS had an AMAZING unveil at SDCC and that wasn't enough to save it. Cause it was bad.

Plus SW isn't even dead, TROS not doing as well as projected is not gonna end SW.

I would never suggest anything resembling that. Star Wars just needs a course correction (in the film division) and it will get it.

And it will be just fine.

Tace · Dec 30, 2019

UltraMagnus said:
I remember in 2000 people were rejoicing big time that X-Men was half way decent. It was like a huge "victory" for comic book fans, especially after "costume gate" when photos leaked on the internet showing the characters were not going to wear their comic book suits people got up in arms assuming Hollywood was going to fuck it up.

But since it was half way decent movie, not spectacular per se but decent enough, that was fantastic for a lot of folkes.

Yeah, I think it comes down to feeling like the "essence" of the characters or source material is translated well. I'll never forget seeing the trailer for the first Spider-Man as a kid. Had to have been 7 or so. I lost my shit. The movies have flaws but just seeing those characters adapted well was and still is a huge win

It's still insanely cool to me that comic book characters have come to life like this. Felt impossible not too long ago

ryutaro's mama said:
They didn't have 3 PT tier films in that 9. That matters too. Even if you were to say, Incredible Hulk, Iron Mang 2 and Thor 2 were their worst 3, the others were all solid. Certainly from a review and reception standpoint.

I don't really think it matters, point is Marvel have turned out stinkers and were fine. Early on, too

ryutaro's mama said:
When shit is peddled, comic fans chirp about it. See: Spider-Man 3, ASM2, X-Men3...hell, Blade Trinity ended that franchise with how bad it was. BvS had an AMAZING unveil at SDCC and that wasn't enough to save it. Cause it was bad.

I'm not saying those movies don't get trash, but it's not on the same level as SW fans. It's not. You'll find people who like SM3, BvS, ASM2 and we'll have a semi civil discussion.

You can't talk about SW movies without it going to shit in 3 pages.

ryutaro's mama said:
I would never suggest anything resembling that. Star Wars just needs a course correction (in the film division) and it will get it.

And it will be just fine.

You saying Marvel wouldn't have made it to movie #23 with a bad movie #9 to me implied you thought Star Wars was on the way out because it's movie #9 is considered to be bad...

It will be just fine, I know

ryutaro's mama · Dec 30, 2019

Tace said:
You saying Marvel wouldn't have made it to movie #23 with a bad movie #9 to me implied you thought Star Wars was on the way out because it's movie #9 is considered to be bad...

It will be just fine, I know

Oh, sorry if I wasn't clear. I was saying that to say, I don't think the MCU would have made it to movie #23 with such a spotty record of quality.

Meaning, the comic fans wouldn't be "less picky" for long. Hell, they got two movies in on the DCEU before the goodwill rug was pulled.

Mr. Pointy · Dec 30, 2019

DCEU is built off the structural foundation of 3 PT tier films (MoS, BvS and Justice League) and it's doing more than fine at the moment. Joker is its own thing, bur everything else is spawned from those three.

Tace · Dec 30, 2019

ryutaro's mama said:
Oh, sorry if I wasn't clear. I was saying that to say, I don't think the MCU would have made it to movie #23 with such a spotty record of quality.

Meaning, the comic fans wouldn't be "less picky" for long. Hell, they got two movies in on the DCEU before the goodwill rug was pulled.

Stinker after stinker, yeah, you're probably right. Don't underestimate comic book fans though. I would watch a lot of bad Spider-Man films to eventually watch one perfect one. Like an ungodly ratio

Comic book fans know pain lol

ryutaro's mama · Dec 30, 2019

Mr. Pointy said:
DCEU is built off the structural foundation of 3 PT tier films (MoS, BvS and Justice League) and it's doing more than fine at the moment. Joker is its own thing, bur everything else is spawned from those three.

No, it isn't. Everything is fragmented. There is a completely unrelated Joker film, a Wonder Woman film that is a sequel to WW but will likely not advance the DCEU. Same with Aquaman. And a complete Batman reboot.

And Suicide Squad that isn't a sequel to the first one.

Terraforce · Dec 30, 2019

TRUE ORDER said:
Yay!! I didn't know that there were places that the film hasn't debuted yet.
I really hope it manages to get 1.3B

Should accomplish that with ease. It's outpacing the original release and Frozen 1 was just barely under the 1.3 mark.

Deleted member 42055 · Dec 30, 2019

ryutaro's mama said:
No, there have been plenty of shitastic comics properties that fans have turned away from because it didn't do a good job telling stories. See: The first incarnations of the DCEU.

Your passive aggressive attempts at minimizing why the MCU is successful is a tired schtick.

The reality is that Marvel turns in well reviewed and profitable films that keep the fans coming for more. It doesn't rest on its laurels and keep making the same adventures with the same heroes. It expands. It introduces new parts, new onramps for a multitude of different fans while taking care of each subset. It doesn't assume that whatever shit they roll out, the fans will eat up (see: Solo and TROS) AND when a tone to a set of films doesn't resonate with the fans, they are flexible with changing direction, in a good way (see: Thor).

SW has told the same story, 3 times, in three trilogies (Chosen one archetype facing off against big bad, fate of the galaxy hangs in the balance) and they are surprised that people are now catching on and starting to tune out.

Imagine if for three different set of trilogies, Feige rolled out 3 different quests for the Infinity Gauntlet and then at the end, after dying at the end of the second trilogy, Thanos inexplicably returns to "tie everything together".

People would be tuning out of the MCU too.

All of this. I don't know why people don't refer to guardians of the galaxy more often. Look at the obscure everything about that set of characters but it was completely well done, by a director with a unique voice And now the property is huge. People want new, interesting stories people want to fall in love with new characters

ryutaro's mama · Dec 30, 2019

Agar25 said:
All of this. I don't know why people don't refer to guardians of the galaxy more often. Look at the obscure everything about that set of characters but it was completely well done, by a director with a unique voice And now the property is huge. People want new, interesting stories people want to fall in love with new characters

Correct. 🙂

I have maintained that GOTG is the best new SW movie that wasn't an actual SW film.

Also, Groot is what Jar Jar done right looks like.

Deleted member 16452 · Dec 30, 2019

Let's chill with the SW vs MCU nonsense, if you can't have a conversation without it devolving just put each other on ignore/move on.

And also lets try to chill in general, we've had a ton of great movies come out in the last 2 months, surely there are plenty of positive things to talk about.

ElBoxy · Dec 30, 2019

ryutaro's mama said:
Correct. 🙂

I have maintained that GOTG is the best new SW movie that wasn't an actual SW film.

Also, Groot is what Jar Jar done right looks like.

GOTG is a combination of many sci-fi fantasy space genres, just like Star Wars. And even then, both are still very different from one another. GOTG is very not-so-serious and self-aware with itself. It's a comedy first in the writing before anything else. What it has less in common is the actual comics it's based on, at least from what I heard from hardcore GOTG comic fans.

Akainu · Dec 30, 2019

hodayathink said:

Shut up Meg

ryutaro's mama · Dec 30, 2019

ElBoxyBrown said:
GOTG is a combination of many sci-fi fantasy space genres, just like Star Wars. And even then, both are still very different from one another. GOTG is very not-so-serious and self-aware with itself. It's a comedy first before anything else. What it has less in common is the actual comics it's based on, at least from what I heard from hardcore GOTG comic fans.

It works really well because we get a nice brood of space misfits, each with an endearing quality. And they form a neat little tribe.

ElBoxy · Dec 30, 2019

ryutaro's mama said:
It works really well because we get a nice brood of space misfits, each with an endearing quality. And they form a neat little tribe.

I agree. Every movie needs to take lessons from Fast & Furious.

ryutaro's mama · Dec 30, 2019

ElBoxyBrown said:
I agree. Every movie needs to take lessons from Fast & Furious.

Fast & Familia

Tricky I Shadow · Dec 30, 2019

Terraforce said:
Should accomplish that with ease. It's outpacing the original release and Frozen 1 was just barely under the 1.3 mark.

Deleted member 3093 · Dec 30, 2019

UltraMagnus said:
Dude, having an opinion you don't like isn't a "schtick". For whatever reason you get way too wound up over this stuff.

Did anyone care that Iron Man 3 or Thor 2 or Captain America: First Avenger, Age of Ultron, are kinda bland and/or silly films? No. No one really cares.

When that happens in Star Wars though for some people the world is ending.

To be fair, Star Wars movies are event films. We got Star Warses in the 70s, special editions in the 90s, prequels in the 2000s, and sequels in the 2010s. Marvel's been pretty consistent, so a middling entry feels less of an issue, whereas a failed Star War is like, that's gonna linger

Mekanos · Dec 30, 2019

Just came out of Skywalker...

11 PM Sunday showing, had to be the emptiest IMAX experience I've ever had lol.

I didn't hate it? I knew what I was in for going in, it wasn't a BVS level disaster but it was rooooough, especially the second half. And the editing! So many times where I'm totally lost on what the characters are attempting to do. And of course uncreative, safe and toothless that stripped away almost everything I loved about TLJ.

but it was entertaining as an action/adventure blockbuster on its own merits. The trio was a lot of fun. Shame Palpatine was wasted.

I feel like casual moviegoers would embrace this more than they are but maybe they're sick of Star Wars lmao.

PshycoNinja · Dec 30, 2019

Day 10 of TLJ release in Theaters: 368M Domestic
Day 10 of TROS release in Theaters: 361M Domstic

Talk about bombing. /s

Pop-O-Matic · Dec 30, 2019

PshycoNinja said:
Day 10 of TLJ release in Theaters: 368M Domestic
Day 10 of TROS release in Theaters: 361M Domstic

Talk about bombing. /s

How many times do we need to explain that the situations between these movies aren't comparable?

PshycoNinja · Dec 30, 2019

Yes, I've heard the Christmas Eve excuse. TRoS also suffered a 9M dip on the Eve, same as...well will you look at that? TLJ.

Pop-O-Matic · Dec 30, 2019

PshycoNinja said:
Yes, I've heard the Christmas Eve excuse. TRoS also suffered a 9M dip on the Eve, same as...well will you look at that? TLJ.

Christmas Eve didn't fall during the fucking weekend for TROS though.

PshycoNinja · Dec 30, 2019

Pop-O-Matic said:
Christmas Eve didn't fall during the fucking weekend for TROS though.

What does that have to do with the first ten days? Was I talking about the drop from weekend to weekend? I was not.

Reyes · Dec 30, 2019

Pop-O-Matic said:
How many times do we need to explain that the situations between these movies aren't comparable?

Nah rather reject reality and create my own narrative against a movie I don't like

PshycoNinja · Dec 30, 2019

Reyes said:
Nah rather reject reality and create my own narrative against a movie I don't like

Please elaborate how I am doing this? If anything, I'm giving numbers as to why TLJ and TROS are not bombs.

BDS · Dec 30, 2019

You guys have got to stop responding to PsychoNinja lol

People suffering from TLJ Derangement Syndrome can't be reasoned with.

PshycoNinja · Dec 30, 2019

BDS said:
You guys have got to stop responding to PsychoNinja lol

People suffering from TLJ Derangement Syndrome can't be reasoned with.

Hmmm. Interesting. Didn't realize we were just going to fling insults at one another when unable to discuss relevant numbers like adults.

Deleted member 60295 · Dec 30, 2019

CrichtonKicks said:
The ending of Rogue One is a master class in film editing and scoring. The whole transition from the final blast to Vader's assault to the handoff to Leia is just wonderfully done and leaves you on a high despite the body count.

It's honestly the only part of the film worth rewatching, apart from youtube montages of the god tier action in the third act.

Also, it convinced me that Michael Giacchino should probably have scored the new trilogy, too. John Williams gave us a couple decent leitmotifs for Rey and The FIrst Order, but apart from that, I was very disappointed in his work for The Force Awakens and The Last Jedi.. He is clearly past his prime, and should have retired from Star Wars after Revenge of the Sith.

PhoncipleBone · Dec 30, 2019

PshycoNinja said:
What does that have to do with the first ten days? Was I talking about the drop from weekend to weekend? I was not.

No, but since calendars seem to be tough for you we need to keep pointing out that TROS had 5 holiday days (which all usually perform like a Friday) compared to the zero TLJ had. In fact, TLJs holiday grosses didn't start until the 11th day.
This week is when you will see the gap between TLJ and TROS widen considerably.

Also, from all the posts overnight by others, i learned that Spidey FFH was bad and disliked.

KingSnake · Dec 30, 2019

PshycoNinja said:
Hmmm. Interesting. Didn't realize we were just going to fling insults at one another when unable to discuss relevant numbers like adults.

I wonder what Hamlet has to say about these numbers.

PshycoNinja · Dec 30, 2019

PhoncipleBone said:
No, but since calendars seem to be tough for you we need to keep pointing out that TROS had 5 holiday days (which all usually perform like a Friday) compared to the zero TLJ had. In fact, TLJs holiday grosses didn't start until the 11th day.
This week is when you will see the gap between TLJ and TROS widen considerably.

Also, from all the posts overnight by others, i learned that Spidey FFH was bad and disliked.

Again, no need for the nastiness.

That out of the way, this is moving the goal posts of the discussion. The poster I responded to was upset about Christmas Eve for TLJ being on a weekend, when that isn't the discussion.

As for your new point, sure, that could very well be the case, but that hardly changes my point in which the two movies took in nearly identical amount in the first ten days, despite a lower than expected OW for TRoS.

I'll be more than happy to discuss TRoS third week and the gap that happens if and when it happens.

KingSnake said:
I wonder what Hamlet has to say about these numbers.

Fun.

Are people who hate TRoS only allowed to joke around or is that allowed to everyone.

And while I enjoy Hamlet, I thought the line was appropriate given that it was about how people cannot have "objective opinions" and not about Box Office numbers. Believe it or not, nuance is allowed when discussing two completely different topics, even if the subject of the conversation is the same.

PhoncipleBone · Dec 30, 2019

KingSnake · Dec 30, 2019

PshycoNinja said:
Fun.

Are people who hate TRoS only allowed to joke around or is that allowed to everyone.

And while I enjoy Hamlet, I thought the line was appropriate given that it was about how people cannot have "objective opinions" and not about Box Office numbers. Believe it or not, nuance is allowed when discussing two completely different topics, even if the subject of the conversation is the same.

I don't see why Hamlet quotes can be used to counter movie reviews and reception but not to describe movie box office performance especially since it's about the same movie. It has the same level of relevance and talks a lot about addressing the topics at hand as adults.

Ignatz Mouse · Dec 30, 2019

Sweeney Swift said:
I'm frankly sick of having to defend what I like and how I like it in bulletpoint or essay form numerous times anytime I express liking something you don't (whether the "you" is directed to you specifically or JB or viper or anybody). I get it if you don't, "oh hey it looks weird, easier target than Star Wars", but meanwhile my posts about hating Star Wars are limited to hating the experience of TROS, how much I think the film sucks in basically every way (good job on bringing

the porgs for a scene

back tho), and I don't @ anyone about it surprised that they dug it enough to watch it more than once, even though I personally can't imagine ever doing that, because that's Not my experience with it

Meanwhile with Cats: I don't think I've had a more fun experience with a musical film in theaters! Maybe I haven't seen the right ones, but I loved the surrealism of the looks and environments, I laughed at a lot of the cheesiness and jokes, I appreciated a surprising amount of the choreography (the Skimbleshanks scene was an immediate highlight that comes to mind) and I dug the music (especially the original song Taylor Swift contributed to the soundtrack which gets its own great unique scene with a different character onscreen) and those two things are basically The reasons to watch musicals in that if they work, so does the film.

A lot of Cats worked wonders for me. If it doesn't or if you can't get past the weirdness (or even weirdness is actively a bad thing for you), that's fine. It's not at all actively a bad thing for me. It actively made this a delight to watch, once and over and over again. There's been something new I've noticed, or a scene that finally clicked, or a song I liked more, each time. There were films I loved even more than this this year, and I think I even mentioned earlier that right now if it's in my top 10 it's just barely rounding out the list, but I don't think I've ever had an experience quite like this in a theater and it's one film I keep coming back to and the feeling doesn't really go away (or at least it hasn't yet) since. Maybe that positive experience all goes away for me when I watch it on a smaller screen, but I really doubt that. This was a lot of fun, and it hasn't really stopped being fun. That's my experience with Cats

More power to you.

PshycoNinja · Dec 30, 2019

KingSnake said:
I don't see why Hamlet quotes can be used to counter movie reviews and reception but not to describe movie box office performance especially since it's about the same movie. It has the same level of relevance and talks a lot about addressing the topics at hand as adults.

It wasn't countering movie reviews. I was countering the idea you viewed your opinion as objective fact. Which it is not, and I used a line from Hamlet because i thought you were joking around with the "objective opinion" angle, so i thought to have some fun with it too.

KingSnake · Dec 30, 2019

PshycoNinja said:
It wasn't countering movie reviews. I was countering the idea you viewed your opinion as objective fact. Which it is not, and I used a line from Hamlet because i thought you were joking around with the "objective opinion" angle, so i thought to have some fun with it too.

So, like here, you weren't paying attention there either. But that's a discussion for another thread.

Ithil · Dec 30, 2019

UltraMagnus said:
Everyone can have their opinion on this, I would bet if you gave Star Wars fans a Star Wars movie equivalent to lets say Spider-Man FFH or Iron Man 2 ... there would be a lot of Star Wars fans that would pick apart 2000 different things that weren't good enough for them.

Too many jokes, not the Spider-Man I grew up with, he's wearing a black suit but it's not the symboite suit what the fuck is that shit, why's the character do X/Y instead of Z, too brain less, no deeper theme, why would the hero be dumb enough to just hand over control to the villain, it's not believable the entire school class gets being taken to all these different cities and no one questions it seriously, no teacher would behave that way, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.

I like how he throws out FFH as though it was some universally disliked film for no reason, even though it was hugely well received. Like going "lets say X-Men Apocalypse or Logan".

PanzerKraken · Dec 30, 2019

Tace said:
Comic book fans are absolutely less picky than Star Wars fans. There are so many different variations of these characters already you at least have the benefit of knowing there's another adaptation or version coming

That said, comic fans are still picky but not SW level

Comic fans are also used to bullshit stupid story lines, retcons, and ridiculous twists. It's what we've been dealing with forever when new writers change, drop, and retcon storylines multiple times a year. Comic fans also don't get stuck in nitpicking the ridiculous details of how things work.

Ignatz Mouse · Dec 30, 2019

Pop-O-Matic said:
Honestly, I feel like killing them off was the cowardly option. Basically cut off all those characters from future stories, of exploring what happened to them during and after the events of OT, if they ever interacted with the main cast, etc. Felt the same way about Solo killing off everyone who wasn't in the OT, except it hurt more there because Solo's secondary cast had more actual character than anyone in R1 besides Donnie Yen and maybe the robot.

Also, tbh, everyone and their mom called "they're all going to die at the end" the second they announced Rogue One, so it's not like it was really subverting expectations *winkwinknudgenudge*.

I didn't know that they'd all die until the Droid died and they didn't make a big deal out of it. It was quite the moment.

Schlorgan · Dec 30, 2019

How much less would people like Rogue One if it didn't have the Darth Vader scene at the end?

KingSnake · Dec 30, 2019

I liked Rogue One despite the Vader scene which I found pointless pandering.

PshycoNinja · Dec 30, 2019

While the Vader scene was cool, it seemed out of place in the movie. I really like story up until that point. The Vader scene was clear pandering, though.

dancingphlower · Dec 30, 2019

Schlorgan said:
How much less would people like Rogue One if it didn't have the Darth Vader scene at the end?

The Vader scene was cool but I still would have enjoyed the movie without it.

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