Yep, if it boots straight into Windows, people are just gonna use steam or even epic. How does Microsoft get a cut from that?
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Windows Central: "Based on our sources", the next Xbox generation is a traditional console and a handheld
- Thread starter stopmrdomino
- Start date
Yep, if it boots straight into Windows, people are just gonna use steam or even epic. How does Microsoft get a cut from that?
Certainly up for their handheld..most probably.
The only thing that stops me exclusively only having a Steam Deck is the collection of games that use anti-cheat that is purposefully prevented from running on Linux/Deck, so I also have a windows handheld for those games (and the extra power helps for certain games and emulators too), but as there's talk of preventing kernel access anti cheat now, maybe Deck could play everything after that, so maybe I could just go Deck only in the future if they up the performance, which they likely will. I guess just game pass games would be the next reason to use a windows handheld, which I also wish would work on Deck natively.
I think their work on BC with their consoles have been great, but it seems they stopped investing in it unfortunately and I wonder if this would carry over to their next console. I wonder if they are going to open it up more to be closer to a PC, and "every PC" is essentially an Xbox to them too, think it would be an interesting move for them, may even spell the end for closed consoles at least, other than Nintendo who would probably still go that way. I can literally count the times I've used my Series X on one hand, everything I might have used it for I have it on PC anyway, I really see it as being nice as a way to play some exclusive 360 and X1 games at this point, so I do think they need to do something to keep their console more relevant and appealing next time, I think the handheld is one way they can for sure.
The only thing that stops me exclusively only having a Steam Deck is the collection of games that use anti-cheat that is purposefully prevented from running on Linux/Deck, so I also have a windows handheld for those games (and the extra power helps for certain games and emulators too), but as there's talk of preventing kernel access anti cheat now, maybe Deck could play everything after that, so maybe I could just go Deck only in the future if they up the performance, which they likely will. I guess just game pass games would be the next reason to use a windows handheld, which I also wish would work on Deck natively.
I think their work on BC with their consoles have been great, but it seems they stopped investing in it unfortunately and I wonder if this would carry over to their next console. I wonder if they are going to open it up more to be closer to a PC, and "every PC" is essentially an Xbox to them too, think it would be an interesting move for them, may even spell the end for closed consoles at least, other than Nintendo who would probably still go that way. I can literally count the times I've used my Series X on one hand, everything I might have used it for I have it on PC anyway, I really see it as being nice as a way to play some exclusive 360 and X1 games at this point, so I do think they need to do something to keep their console more relevant and appealing next time, I think the handheld is one way they can for sure.
I mean they can say it and ultimately end up doing it but I still question why and what success they hope to achieve
There must be C level execs in MS thinking if it's worth it when we've seen:
Expensive acquisitions
Talk of increased financial pressures and expectations for the division
Low hw sales
Stagnant game pass growth
Allegedly low sw sales
Seeming shrinking dev support
Seeming shrinking efforts to sell in certain regions
Increased moves to multiplatform releases on ps5 switch and expectedly switch 2
Genuinely why bother?
Personally The handheld I can see a place for, and even a PC like box
But a regular console? Good luck
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It's been like 5 years.
It won't and they don't but there are games that aren't available on Xbox or the windows store like playstation games. It being an Xbox first with its already deep ecosystem on display is how they'll make money. Valve also allows other stores but it doesn't matter. Yes Steam is the best but is it better than Xbox for controller based games? Hell naw and that's with Steam OS. Nobody will ever use the windows store but the Xbox OS and it's store work just fine.
The handheld is so very obviously going to be a windows device like the Lenovo Legion Go. Hopefully this forces them to clean up their Xbox/Gamepass apps
The article is pretty clear. There are two consoles. One is a successor to the Xbox Series X that will be much more powerful than the Xbox Series X and the other will be a handheld console that you play on the go that will be less powerful. No docking functionality is mentioned, it compares it to Steam Deck more than Switch. Sounds like the Xbox Series S is being killed off in terms of having a successor, and the handheld will be the second SKU for people who don't buy the more expensive "powerful" console.
MS has been saying fot nearly 10 years that Xbox is an ecosystem and not a console. Then when they keep making ecosystem plays gamers keep acting surprised. Just listen to them - they aren't being coy about their vision and their plans.
Example - You can play Xbox Cloud games on an Amazon Firestick literally right now, and on my fiber internet they look and play great,
Example - You can play Xbox Cloud games on an Amazon Firestick literally right now, and on my fiber internet they look and play great,
OP
OP
Developing for the handheld must be mandated otherwise the handheld will not have the same games as the more powerful console and it is supposed to be part of the same generation so games should be playable on both SKUs.
Additionally, if the handheld doesn't have the ability to run the entire Xbox backward compatibility library on it, it is DOA.
Wouldn't matter, games to take 6+ years to make anyways and they just ported jedi (one of the best looking games this gen) which was built for current gen consoles with ray tracing and ssd use to PS4. We are limited by time and budget not hardware.
Since the handheld will at most be series X level (and probably quite a bit weaker), at that point why not release a series X version also since you will have to scale for the handheld anyway. And at that point can you really call the more powerful console a new generation and wouldn't it be more like a series X pro if it will not really have any exclusive games?
What's the difference between this an a pc game having minimum specs? I figure Switch 2 will close the gap in what the handheld and docked mode will be so in 2 years I think we are looking at a minimal difference.
Sorry, bad wording. I meant that I fear the handheld won't be able to play Xbox console games, only those available for Xbox PC (plus, I guess, Steam, Epic, Gog, etc...) In my opinion, an Xbox handheld that is just a mere Deck alternative has little appeal, as I have little faith in MS delivering a better PC handheld experience than Valve.
None lol. The steam deck is a portable xbox one and runs ratchet end clank ps5 through a translation layer. I don't think people realize games are limited by time, budget and are designed to scale.
Devs don't have to optimize for low specs, and no expectations for good experience. Also, I expect some PC/console games to skip Switch 2.
The device is literally pointless and they would make virtually NO money if it didn't play xbox games. Not just because of the xbox app on PC being bad but the catalog is also bad. You aren't selling any games or subs with that.
The Switch 2 will likely cost more than a Series S at launch, and will still not quite reach Series S power. Which is perfectly fine for what Nintendo is doing.
But if MS is trying to launch a similarly priced handheld as a "Series S 2" along with their Series X 2... How the hell is this going to work? We have all witnessed the discussions and complaints about devs having to adapt any gane they want to release on Series X also for Series S. This will be an even bigger challenge if the same holds true for a handheld.
Really curious how they're going to tackle that.
But if MS is trying to launch a similarly priced handheld as a "Series S 2" along with their Series X 2... How the hell is this going to work? We have all witnessed the discussions and complaints about devs having to adapt any gane they want to release on Series X also for Series S. This will be an even bigger challenge if the same holds true for a handheld.
Really curious how they're going to tackle that.
They don't have to as in It's not mandated by steam but they literally always do it regardless. PC is becoming more important for everything but console exclusives, sports and call of duty. Games are built around the steam hardware survey.
The difference is you have a dedicated (likely very expensive) powerful home console whole entire 1st party library must be at its core designed to run on a handheld..that doesn't motivate me to spend $800 or whatever the thing is gonna cost. PC minimum specs are moving target that you're NOT handcuffed to, a handheld who must be catered to to what….2032? while tech continues to advance sounds awful. Again this is IF the development is mandatory, if it's optional fine but then that kinda defeats the purpose, just officially license some 3rd party hardware or whatever. The power gap for these SKUs is gonna be astronomical and this would unquestionably impact how hard the devs could push the home console hardware.
Oh and of course not every Xbox game will be on Switch 2.
The current switch costs as much or more than a series S despite being ancient so I don't really think that's a factor. The switch 2 hardware has also been done for YEARS.
Yup. This. Right now even with a pretty basic laptop you can stream GamePass games pretty impressively if you've got even partly decent internet. As mentioned above, a bunch of TVs are coming now with it an Xbox app preinstalled. In MS's dream world, if people are vaguely interested in a game (and people could be a wide audience); they just reach for a nearby remote and check it out through the app that's sitting right there. The biggest barrier to that is fucking controllers, not consoles or handhelds, etc.
EDIT: I'll add that personally this is not my ideal - streaming games is an absolute nightmare ecologically, although so are consoles and cards too - but from a pure business POV it makes a lot of sense for MS.
Value. The market has demonstrated that it isn't that interested in a traditional Xbox console. A multi-function device presents a much better value proposition.
I'm on fiber internet in Toronto, and everything else is blazing fast, but xcloud always shits the bed, even on my Series X. I haven't tried in six months or so, but it's unplayable, without exaggeration. (Visual artifacting, intense input lag, 50% of the time games don't even load). It's hard to buy their vision based on this. I like Game Pass though. But, for me, the PS Extra catalogue has more of my type of game.
I don't really care about handhelds or consoles, but I find the "console wars" fascinating. It'll be interesting to see what they come up with. If they debut their slimmed down Windows/Gaming OS with an Xbox native app and they allow you to install Steam, EGS, emulators, etc., then that sounds like something a lot of people would be interested in. Getting the specs right (OLED, battery, etc.) and the price could make it or break it, though.
As far as a new console is concerned, getting something out there two years earlier than Sony sounds like it may be their only shot at remaining relevant. Having the "best" version of games until the PS6 debuts and then maybe introducing a "Pro" device two years later to better compete may keep them viable.
Either way, the next few years will be crucial to them remaining relevant.
As far as a new console is concerned, getting something out there two years earlier than Sony sounds like it may be their only shot at remaining relevant. Having the "best" version of games until the PS6 debuts and then maybe introducing a "Pro" device two years later to better compete may keep them viable.
Either way, the next few years will be crucial to them remaining relevant.
it only makes sense really as a niche Portal-like device to avoid these problems and more. Every other option and this is a boondoggle: a less functional portable PC; a dedicated Switch-like device with no pipeline, etc.
Plenty of PC games don't work well on Steamdeck like Wukong and BG3.
Only if PC gamers see value in the console experience by itself, which it hasn't been demonstrated.
Could MS move away from the power race like Nintendo did? As in, just have the handheld and not have the series X 2?
Most games are still cross gen even now with the xbox one and PS4, so it's not like developers build to the potential of the consoles any more, and switch sales have shown gamers don't really care that much about power either
A handheld that just runs Steam and Xbox store isn't new. That exists today. There's lots of options and Xbox wouldn't be competing on price with an open handheld. And you won't ever get an Xbox handheld that runs Steam and Xbox console store. There is no way they have that licensing agreement for the current BC library of Xbox console store games. The actual new scenario would be an Xbox handheld that runs Xbox console store. It would have to be closed, and it would be differentiated by being the Xbox console store and cheaper when compared to similar spec'd handhelds like ROG, etc.
All that being said, I think the best way to position an Xbox handheld in 2026 is to say "here is a handheld that will play all your Series/One/360/OG games on the go." Don't position as a companion to the Nextbox - position it as a companion to the current Xbox library and experience. That way you don't force parity for the Nextbox and this handheld. You'd have to launch it separately, possibly in Spring 2026. Or, if Nextbox is 2027 you could launch the handheld in Fall 2026 to spur sales at the tale-end of the Series gen. To me, a handheld Series at the tale-end of the gen might be just as appealing as a Pro mid-gen refresh would have been, just to different people.
It's about the whole ecosystem. Xbox can position a handheld device that plays all Series Xbox games and the vast vast majority of Nextbox launch and after games will still get ports onto the handheld. It just wouldn't be mandatory. The handheld would be like a mid-gen refresh for Series in that way. We are moving away from hardline generations imo. With Switch 2 probably doing gangbusters and a Series-spec'd Xbox handheld, developers have choices. There will be games that push away from those lower-spec'd machines but I think they would be fewer and fewer just like we are seeing this gen until a tipping point far into the gen.
Forever games help with positioning an Xbox handheld as well imo but this post is already too long to go into that.
All that being said, I think the best way to position an Xbox handheld in 2026 is to say "here is a handheld that will play all your Series/One/360/OG games on the go." Don't position as a companion to the Nextbox - position it as a companion to the current Xbox library and experience. That way you don't force parity for the Nextbox and this handheld. You'd have to launch it separately, possibly in Spring 2026. Or, if Nextbox is 2027 you could launch the handheld in Fall 2026 to spur sales at the tale-end of the Series gen. To me, a handheld Series at the tale-end of the gen might be just as appealing as a Pro mid-gen refresh would have been, just to different people.
It's about the whole ecosystem. Xbox can position a handheld device that plays all Series Xbox games and the vast vast majority of Nextbox launch and after games will still get ports onto the handheld. It just wouldn't be mandatory. The handheld would be like a mid-gen refresh for Series in that way. We are moving away from hardline generations imo. With Switch 2 probably doing gangbusters and a Series-spec'd Xbox handheld, developers have choices. There will be games that push away from those lower-spec'd machines but I think they would be fewer and fewer just like we are seeing this gen until a tipping point far into the gen.
Forever games help with positioning an Xbox handheld as well imo but this post is already too long to go into that.
Honestly I am not sure if this work for Microsoft, considering their gaming business is not going that well this gen and how confusing their current strategy is for everyone. Sorry but I am very pesimistic with the future of the Xbox brand.
I hope to be wrong and that they have done some good research to conclude there is enough demand in the handheld market that we do not see...
I hope to be wrong and that they have done some good research to conclude there is enough demand in the handheld market that we do not see...
They don't, which is exactly why if this is what this console and handheld are—just a prebuilt PC and a Windows handheld that do indeed run Steam—they'll be on the market for 2 years tops before they pull the plug on hardware altogether.
I can think of several scenarios in which the console experience would be desirable. For couch PCs, for people who like small form factors, for people who buy prebuilt systems, for people who can't afford a proper PC, for playing games that have problematic PC ports etc.
In general I think the power path is facing insurmountable headwinds. That said, MS is more likely to pursue a lucrative middleman service provider path (we don't make the games or the hardware we run the nifty platform that connects the two) than turn its existing games division into something as dedicated as Nintendo's.
Microsoft will let third party stores in so they can point out to the governments that they allow it, as such Apple/PlayStation should allow Xbox stores. Their end goal is to force all the platforms open so they can expand their services to all of them and keep all the profit.
Worth the loss of sales to steam on Xbox to accomplish that.
Worth the loss of sales to steam on Xbox to accomplish that.
I think there is problems with all scenarios in this post but I'll just focus on one aspect for brevity's sake.
The affordability is gone the second you open it up. Xbox isn't going to take a loss or have a razor-thin margin on the hardware if you can skip their store. Meaning the big hubbub question of "can you build a PS5 Pro PC for the same price?" would actually be answered "yes, you could do that" for this device.
I don't know what you're trying to say, I think you might have misunderstood what I tried to convey.
A handheld that would be able to serve the same function to the nextgen "Series X 2" as the Series S did this gen, would have to be powerful enough to run EVERY next gen Xbox game. That has to be a damn powerful handheld and therefore also a very expensive one. What I was trying to say with the Switch 2 power+price expectations and comparison, was that even this brandnew handheld device that will launch at a mass market friendly price is not expected to be powerful enough to match the Series S in every CURRENT gen game. So what kind of device would MS have to launch to make that possible?
I personally just can't fathom how Microsoft would achieve that.
Their core strategy consists of being in every possible device, they won't give up on the console market just because they aren't first place. They may not face the competition headfirst but they still want to be there.
Not even gonna touch on them needing an Xbox SKU to keep up with their xcloud servers.