Dice

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,360
Canada
I might get flak for this, but I think that Anime created a very unrealistic standard on what a generation of men considers "attractive".
Kind of a deviation of the trope "reality is unrealistic" but for beauty standards.

Boss looks awesome, and we need more kick-ass mature women in gaming.

We're also literally in a generation of people using face tuning apps to look like constant models (or even cartoons going by some proportions).

Like, we sorta boomeranged out of natural and expanding beauty standards, in part thanks to influencer culture as well. :/
People thinking pinups are a standard are out of touch that most women look....normal and plain and aren't hardcore hourglass shapes.

 

Kordova

Member
Dec 10, 2023
415
Leyndell
I might get flak for this, but I think that Anime created a very unrealistic standard on what a generation of men considers "attractive".
Kind of a deviation of the trope "reality is unrealistic" but for beauty standards.

Boss looks awesome, and we need more kick-ass mature women in gaming.
I've considered the same. The same guys made those edits to characters faces stating that it's better that way and the original design is ugly. Those Aloy edits were egregiously overdone. The boss looks like the boss. She's still going to beat the breaks off everyone in the game.
 

coffeecat

Member
Jul 14, 2018
124
I would argue that while anime is a huge factor and component in causing the skewed perceptions of unrealistic beauty standards for women inside video games, there's also the core issue that this happened long before anime became mainstream to them. Anime is not the first place where we had stylized, buxom beauties, and plenty of Western cartoons like Looney Tunes, Roger Rabbit, etc had portrayals of exaggerated waistlines on women with large chests that jut out. And, we can see this same style in many older games as well such as Dragon's Lair & Space Ace with Princess Daphne. This all started long before they were exposed to mainstream anime and hentai. There's also that awful movie Cool World with the heavily sexualized Holli Would and Brad Pitt.

Society has indoctrinated men into only accepting women in media as these types for a long, long time, and accepting anything else goes against their programming. It was also helpful that this was all done during eras when women were stereotyped and stigmatized by media and enforced societal norms that we had no value or could be considered "attractive" unless we wore certain types and brands of clothing, we were expected to behave a certain way on and off cameras, and most of all to be submissive and provide for the home and children. That our main "job" and "goal" was to be the perfect housewife and that our "greatest joy" or "assets" came from our ability to use the newest *gasps* dishwasher while wearing heels. Thanks, 1950s.

If I had to clean the house in heels now, I'd die.
Yeah, at the end of the day this is an extension of the ingrained sexism and misogyny within our society. Certainly throughout much of North America and Europe, women are an oppressed class, often in ways that are fundamentally baked into society, going back far, far before the 1950s. Let's remember that in much of the Western world, women weren't even legally people for many hundreds of years and didn't have basic freedoms. We couldn't own property. We couldn't vote. We couldn't go outside without being accompanied by a man.

But obviously many less obvious forms of oppression remain. Whether that's being expected to be passive and subservient to men in their lives, being responsible for childcare for "free" in addition to other employment, assumed to know how to cook, clean, and do clerical work for others, expectations around taking on others' emotional labour and support, having qualities ascribed to their gender rather than them as individuals, and of course having their value tied to often unrealistic beauty standards... there are obligations and expectations for women that are often unfair and impose significant consequences on their lives. It's also one of those things where they are often invisible until they are pushed against a little too hard, at which point it becomes all too clear just how far society still has to go.

Many women have internalized these expectations, and of course so have men, often to degrees that they aren't even aware they're doing it. And unfortunately many men do not like being reminded that this is a thing. The best way to counter this is to have more and more women in positive roles and positions of power and control... and now that this has begun to happen in games, as well as other popular media like movies and comic books, we're seeing the worst people out there show their true colours and whine like children whose toys are being taken away.
 
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Kain-Nosgoth

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,056
Switzerland
We just went back in time 25 years with this one, god that's so fucking bad :

image.png



They publish a lot of comics and artbooks for capcom
 

Dice

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,360
Canada
Sometimes I feel like NSFW should be added to the thread's title 😅

I guess, but also why? Like....the thread title is descriptive already, what will you find here if anything but (wait for it!) sexualized women.
Why come to this thread if you're in a public place that might not respond well to it?😅

I'd also argue this only highlights the problem further if content in our games is literally stuff you wouldn't want to be seen in public with lol (obvious H-titles aside; which this thread doesn't actually deal with).
 
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Rhaknar

Member
Oct 26, 2017
43,739
on one hand, yeah...

on the other hand, its UDON, so kinda expected. It's like being surprised a vanillaware game looks the way it does, or Monster Hunter women armor looking the way it does.

I threw that one in there for free just for you MoonlitSeer lol
 

ImaPlayThis

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,413
We just went back in time 25 years with this one, god that's so fucking bad :

They publish a lot of comics and artbooks for capcom
Not to be that guy but this has been UDONs MO for literal years now, this is unfortunately nothing new, on a yearly basis they release a street fighter swimsuit edition book which is just pictures of the female characters in bikinis and such (I'm guessing like 10% of it might have male characters). I also feel like their artwork has gotten crazy horny lately too, recently they did artwork of the rival schools character Kyoko and it was completely ridiculous (I'm deffo not going to link to it but it's similar to what you posted)
 

Kain-Nosgoth

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,056
Switzerland
Not to be that guy but this has been UDONs MO for literal years now, this is unfortunately nothing new, on a yearly basis they release a street fighter swimsuit edition book which is just pictures of the female characters in bikinis and such (I'm guessing like 10% of it might have male characters). I also feel like their artwork has gotten crazy horny lately too, recently they did artwork of the rival schools character Kyoko and it was completely ridiculous (I'm deffo not going to link to it but it's similar to what you posted)

i don't mind having swimsuit arts, not a problem in itself, but this one just look so bad, the proportions, the single thread of fabric stuck on the hips, and so on

Also i'm not super familiar with UDON, only saw this one shared on discord... i bought some of their stuff but that was megaman artbooks and manga
 

Joe2187

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,554
i don't mind having swimsuit arts, not a problem in itself, but this one just look so bad, the proportions, the single thread of fabric stuck on the hips, and so on

Also i'm not super familiar with UDON, only saw this one shared on discord... i bought some of their stuff but that was megaman artbooks and manga

Udon comics is notorious for having alternate comic covers that are exclusive to certain sites and events.

I stopped doing business with them when one of their variants was exclusive to a notorious "Alt-right comicsgate" website tied with Ethan Van Sciver

You can look at their current catalog here, I love the homage covers the most...but they make their money off commissioning artists for exclusive comic cover variants with lots of skin and boobage. this is an Art compendium for street fighter but it looks like porn.

ArtofSFEXC-3d_1800x1800.jpg


which is sad is because they had such great gems previously like these...

Insta-DSPosters-Victor_1800x1800.jpg
FinalFight_1CoverE_1800x1800.jpg
 

Isilia

Member
Mar 11, 2019
6,060
US: PA
Always the convenient boob pockets. I'm sure those are well designed with the female anatomy in mind. Not weird at all.
 
Feb 24, 2018
5,634
So this is an observation I've noticed the past decade and while I'm talking from a wlw perspective, I know some men also find these type of women attractive as well.

I've noticed their is a trend to find women often read by autistic people as autistic as attractive despite not traditionally designed to be visually "sexy" attractive; I've noticed this especially with wlw women, especially shippers.

I was reminded of this with all the Dragon Age news given both ME and DA have characters read like this such as Liara, Peebee, Merrill, Sera, Dagna etc. FF's Yuna and Aerith are also classic examples and Sailor Mercury and Falin Touden in anime, often being the blue Oni in the relationship.

I don't object to this to be clear.
 
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Nimbat1003

Member
Nov 14, 2021
1,476
I've noticed their is a trend to find women often read by autistic people as attractive despite not traditionally designed to be visually "sexy" attractive; I've noticed this especially with wlw women, especially shippers.

I was reminded of this with all the Dragon Age news given both ME and DA have characters read like this such as Liara, Peebee, Merrill, Sera, Dagna etc. FF's Yuna and Aerith are also classic examples and Sailor Mercury and Falin Touden in anime, often being the blue Oni in the relationship.

sorry i'm a little confused do u mean autistic readers being attracted to "unsexy" characters?
 
Feb 24, 2018
5,634
sorry i'm a little confused do u mean autistic readers being attracted to "unsexy" characters?
My mistake, I meant women in fiction who are often read as autistic by autistic people seem to be considered attractive despite how their usually not the traditionally "sexy" characters (edit: I mean not usually the women heavily sexualised and objectified not that their ugly or unattractive), especially often with wlw women shippers I've noticed.
 
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NicoNicoRose

Member
Dec 9, 2020
193
Portland, OR
My mistake, I meant women in fiction who are often read as autistic by autistic people seem to be considered attractive despite how their usually not the traditionally "sexy" characters, especially often with wlw women shippers I've noticed.

I definitely relate to this as a wlw person and wlw shipper because I am constantly finding myself thinking these "unsexy" characters are hot as hell
 

Nimbat1003

Member
Nov 14, 2021
1,476
My mistake, I meant women in fiction who are often read as autistic by autistic people seem to be considered attractive despite how their usually not the traditionally "sexy" characters, especially often with wlw women shippers I've noticed.

i wonder if it's also just introverted/socially awkward people in general since i like a lot of those characters (and I've been tested for autism) so i'm not too surprised lol. edit: though that just might be a personal trait about liking more androgynous/ gender nonconforming which alot of these characters also are.

I definitely relate to this as a wlw person and wlw shipper because I am constantly finding myself thinking these "unsexy" characters are hot as hell

as a straight guy with an Aerith avatar i agree.
 
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Feb 24, 2018
5,634
I definitely relate to this as a wlw person and wlw shipper because I am constantly finding myself thinking these "unsexy" characters are hot as hell
Like I said, I don't object and like seeing autistic/autistic read characters being seen as cute and attractive rather than weird and gross, especially since it doesn't come across as fetishistiatic. Plus it helps that so much of it is truly adorable like all the Falin x Marcelle I've seen recently.
 
Mar 23, 2024
103
My mistake, I meant women in fiction who are often read as autistic by autistic people seem to be considered attractive despite how their usually not the traditionally "sexy" characters, especially often with wlw women shippers I've noticed.
What does "traditionally" sexy even mean? And how would the characters you listed be considered unsexy? Like most of them you listed are traditionally attractive.
 
Feb 24, 2018
5,634
What does "traditionally" sexy even mean? And how would the characters you listed be considered unsexy? Like most of them you listed are traditionally attractive.
I didn't mean the were ugly or unattractive, but there not normally the sex appeal characters, the characters that get the majority and blunt of the objectification and sexualisation in games. Aerith isn't nearly as objectified as Tifa is for example.

I've done a really poor job explaining this.
 

waterpuppy

Too green for a tag
Member
Jul 17, 2021
1,920
I didn't mean the were ugly or unattractive, but there not normally the sex appeal characters, the characters that get the majority and blunt of the objectification and sexualisation in games. Aerith isn't nearly as objectified as Tifa is for example.

I've done a really poor job explaining this.
I could kind of see your point if the first character you mentioned hadn't been Liara. The asari as a race are essentially "hot blue bisexual alien babes", clearly designed to be attractive to the average male gamer so claiming she isn't the sex appeal character is kind of crazy to me? Like especially in ME1 she is very much the exotic sexy alien romance.
 
Mar 7, 2020
3,188
USA
I could kind of see your point if the first character you mentioned hadn't been Liara. The asari as a race are essentially "hot blue bisexual alien babes", clearly designed to be attractive to the average male gamer so claiming she isn't the sex appeal character is kind of crazy to me? Like especially in ME1 she is very much the exotic sexy alien romance.
You mean Garrus?
 
Feb 24, 2018
5,634
I could kind of see your point if the first character you mentioned hadn't been Liara. The asari as a race are essentially "hot blue bisexual alien babes", clearly designed to be attractive to the average male gamer so claiming she isn't the sex appeal character is kind of crazy to me? Like especially in ME1 she is very much the exotic sexy alien romance.
While that's true with the Asari in general, I never read Liara like that, especially in ME1 where she was introverted dork. Like comparing to how she's treated compared to Sha'Ira in that game.
 

Kenai

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,693
I could kind of see your point if the first character you mentioned hadn't been Liara. The asari as a race are essentially "hot blue bisexual alien babes", clearly designed to be attractive to the average male gamer so claiming she isn't the sex appeal character is kind of crazy to me? Like especially in ME1 she is very much the exotic sexy alien romance.

Well Liara never had sweat memes going for her like Tali at least (if she actually did please do not tell me, let me live in ignorant bliss)
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
119,920
While that's true with the Asari in general, I never read Liara like that, especially in ME1 where she was introverted dork. Like comparing to how she's treated compared to Sha'Ira in that game.

I remember Liara propositioning my Shepard extremely early in ME1 and it made me so uncomfortable that I turned her down and it made me even more uncomfortable when she spent the entire rest of the trilogy obsessed with me. I basically called her Stalker Smurf for the rest of the series.

Liara is this weird confluence of "we want an ADORKABLE character" and "hot blue alien babe who wants to SEX UP the main character, as this is sci-fi and there must be a sexy alien babe, as mandated by Nerd Law(TM)" tropes and I don't think they ever clicked together super well. At least, it didn't work for me.
 
Feb 24, 2018
5,634
Okay I think I've I've poorly explained I was trying to say.

I'm autistic and grew up being heavily physically and mentally bullied because of it (along with being fat, a dork and people thinking I was gay) and made to feel unwanted, ugly and unattractive (especially when only discourse was usually "Autistic = Freak/Misogynist/unlikable prick/Man".

Characters like the ones I brought are the type of ones I grew up relating to (Sailor Mercury especially was a childhood idol) and read as autistic like I know many other autistic people do.

That's why seeing those characters being considered attractive by women, being shipped and appearing in adorable wlw art made me so happy. I wasn't calling Liara or Aerith ugly, they are attractive, just pointing out their not the characters usually sexualized or treated as the sex appeal characters. I like seeing this, especially since it's usually done in a non-objectifying or fetishy way. I love say quirky, shy introverts to love factoids and think Sea pigs are the best ever considered beautiful by women, I would have loved knowing that as a kid.

I wasn't upset, I wasn't frustrated, I was trying to be positive.
 
Feb 24, 2018
5,634
I stopped doing business with them when one of their variants was exclusive to a notorious "Alt-right comicsgate" website tied with Ethan Van Sciver
Holy shit, I did not know this, why does Capcom do so much business with them?! I stopped buy anything from them after the awful DarkStalkers comic which made Morrigan into an uncaring rapist.
 

ventuno

Member
Nov 11, 2019
2,512
Okay I think I've I've poorly explained I was trying to say.

I'm autistic and grew up being heavily physically and mentally bullied because of it (along with being fat, a dork and people thinking I was gay) and made to feel unwanted, ugly and unattractive (especially when only discourse was usually "Autistic = Freak/Misogynist/unlikable prick/Man".

Characters like the ones I brought are the type of ones I grew up relating to (Sailor Mercury especially was a childhood idol) and read as autistic like I know many other autistic people do.

That's why seeing those characters being considered attractive by women, being shipped and appearing in adorable wlw art made me so happy. I wasn't calling Liara or Aerith ugly, they are attractive, just pointing out their not the characters usually sexualized or treated as the sex appeal characters. I like seeing this, especially since it's usually done in a non-objectifying or fetishy way. I love say quirky, shy introverts to love factoids and think Sea pigs are the best ever considered beautiful by women, I would have loved knowing that as a kid.

I wasn't upset, I wasn't frustrated, I was trying to be positive.

I think I see where you were coming from, it sounds to me like you took it as characters you relate to being framed more positively than you're used to and it felt welcoming and reassuring to you, right? Like the narrative might finally have changed on things that are attacked.

EDIT: two words.
 

Common Knowledge

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,456

Capcom once again stunned that the hot character is thirsted over 🙄
Wasn't there an internal initiative at Capcom a few years back about how they needed to "even out" male and female eye candy in their games?

I really have yet to see any improvement. 🤷
 

crienne

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,474
People find this design attractive? With her blonde hair, blue eyes, thin waist, exposed midriff, and cleavage-baring top? I suppose I can understand how Capcom was caught off guard cause man, you just can't guess the tastes of gamers these days.

Does this even need the /s?

GO3KxQia4AUZ0z9
 

Love Machine

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,364
Tokyo, Japan
Man, that Gemma stuff... "we definitely see you guys" sounds so cringe.

Does anyone else find her...boring? Like, wow, you "designed" her to be appealing and that was what you came up with. She seems so cookie-cutter (like the post above describes) that it's like an instant turn-off. Also I'm pretty sure a smithy would want slightly less exposed skin what with all those sharp metal objects and sparks flying everywhere, but what do I know.

...God now that stupid pouting face is annoying me. I need to sign off lol
 
Jan 11, 2018
10,143
Is this the new meta for devs who don't wanna get horny jail bonked?

"Oops, we accidentally created a hot waifu. We had no idea people would thirst over her so much since she was barely in the trailer. I guess we have no choice but to embrace it and use her more heavily in the marketing from now on! You can't predict these things, after all!"
 

fifthblight

Member
Apr 8, 2024
223
People find this design attractive? With her blonde hair, blue eyes, thin waist, exposed midriff, and cleavage-baring top? I suppose I can understand how Capcom was caught off guard cause man, you just can't guess the tastes of gamers these days.

Does this even need the /s?

GO3KxQia4AUZ0z9

smithing in a crop top is the new frying bacon shirtless
 

Naiad

Member
Aug 27, 2020
1,278
the thinly veiled hate Horizon gets never ceases to amaze me

Them even mentioning FE is so laughable too because FE has never been about supporting their women cast in anything and in fact, makes sure to be as misogynistic as possible. It's pretty telling.

Of course, they'd prefer the series that lets you "touch them" in one on one interactions and date inside their games.
 

Chumunga64

Member
Jun 22, 2018
14,843
I like Aloy

I just wish she wasn't in game where she's basically a third person shooter with pretty slow weapons while every major enemy is a super fast hyper-agressive close quarters combatan so you need traps and bullet time to win fights

really wish horizon was monster hunter lite
 

NeoChaos

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,354
NorCal
Them even mentioning FE is so laughable too because FE has never been about supporting their women cast in anything and in fact, makes sure to be as misogynistic as possible. It's pretty telling.
Considering the "boring" part of the FE rep description, I think they're using that comparison negatively toward FE. Fire Emblem has a negative perception in Smash discussion because of how frequently the series gets reps in Smash games.
 

GreenMamba

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,612
There's nothing inherently wrong about disliking Horizon or Aloy or whatever. It just gets into weird territory when it constantly gets considered some small franchise that is getting unjustly pushed or that people don't *really* like Horizon or Aloy for whatever made up unfalsifiable reason. It's one of the only mega AAA franchises I've ever seen that gets so many idiots tripping over themselves to explain away its success, and you see this all the time outside of the typical idiot safe spaces. It really rubs some people the wrong way that people like it, and that's what suspect, not just people disliking the games or characters for whatever reason.
 
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Naiad

Member
Aug 27, 2020
1,278
Considering the "boring" part of the FE rep description, I think they're using that comparison negatively toward FE. Fire Emblem has a negative perception in Smash discussion because of how frequently the series gets reps in Smash games.

Even if Fire Emblem already has a negative connotation surrounding it, Aloy gets the "boring" criticism launched at her constantly. So, for someone to say that they prefer a "boring" FE character instead when that same problem arises as an issue or excuse with Aloy. It's just tone-deaf and hypocritical.
 
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