I... is that a cleavage attack in the end? It looks like a heart but it comes from her chest and it has her skin color. What the actual fuck.
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Why women criticise sexualised character designs | OT3 | "make her look more...corpulent, more stuffed where the eyes can't escape."
- Thread starter Persephone
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...I don't know what I expected.
I nope'd out of that series hard after one game so didn't realize how deep it went.
Edit: oh fucking shit, I'd recomend not clicking on any recomended link for a character named Finnel from the same game. Time to clear browser history.
It might as well be, lol.
Yea....none of them are really "safe". Finnel makes me really uncomfortable.
I really don't like the vocabulary and imagery on display here. Purge the girls by taking off their clothes... it has a very misogynistic 16th-17th century real-life witch trial energy here. A bit disgusting to be honest.
And that video... I mean I have nothing against porn and porn games, but be honest and label your game accordingly! This is a softcore porn game. Take the same kind of thing with the same intensity and put it in a movie. This film definitely would be labelled as some kind of softcore porn movie like the ones they made in the 70s and 80s and used to play late at night on cable TV.
I agree with you on this a lot. The first and second game felt like fanservice to me, the usual pandering towards a straight, male crowd and that wasn't something that I was naive or oblivious to. It's sadly what I expected after playing the game for the first couple of hours, but the prior installments were not nearly as bad as the third. The third game felt straight-up like I was playing a softcore hentai game in the way that you're describing. I literally forced myself to finish it just for the sake of finishing it after spending $50-$60 on it when it was first released.
To feel that my money went....somewhere.
Sarapatra was a character that was meant to be overtly sexual, flirtatious, and thirsty.....other characters were just as bad or much worst without that kind of personality trope to match them. Tilia, Finnel, Filament....so bad.
I remember watching a lets play of Ar Tonelico 3 and remember it trying to bring up some dark subjects of body and beings but that not going to work out when it put it female characters in to bad situations.
Having a character chained up like a dog to get her to over come being selfish. Watching a clip of it it of her choice to be chained but then it shifts into melodrama as if it wants to be serious about character development.
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Same. I was sure he was a women.
Someone already answered, but yeah you'll find humorous moments in some of the side quests of that game.
Thank you so much for sharing this. Leaving stuff aside like your father leaving hentai lying around for his underage daughter to find (which has so many levels of fucked up that it's pretty much an hypercube), it's depressingly sobering to realize many families are still stuck up in that mentality even today (or a few years ago). My SO and myself don't want to have kids either, and we have received no shortage of weird and pity looks, condescending comments assuming they know better than us, that we'll change our minds with time, etc. Fortunately these are winding down these days, as both of us are 45. :D.
If I may ask you a question that may border on the "too personal" and you're free to ignore: do you find yourself second-guessing if you actually want to have a child? I find the societal pressure about it is so enormous that, if I wasn't confident that I don't, I'm not sure I would be able to tell apart if that desire was borne out of myself, or others.
Loop Hero is not a card game, or an idle game, or... well, anything I've heard it compared to, but I really wouldn't know how to describe it, exactly. A game where you grow your character by creating a world map? The one thing I can say is that it's a roguelite, which admittedly may be an even stronger of a turn-off for many people. Oh, and also, that it's more addicting than cocaine. :D
Same; in my headcanon they're a woman anyway. I wonder if it's left more ambiguous in the original Russian and it's only the English translation that necessitates making it explicit (I have absolutely no clue how Russian pronouns / gendered words work).
Hmm, to answer that question truthfully, it's really a yes and no sort of ordeal. Yes, I do want to have a child or children of my own, and occurring within the same thought process, no I do not because [reasons]. I think my indecisiveness that constantly flatlines on a neutral level has a lot to do with my own personal views and hierarchy that I use to self-prioritize life achievements or goals. To break it down simply:
Yes, I want to have a child because I sincerely want to have a little minion or monster of my own volition. I'm totally into the baby showers, the nurturing, the learning right from wrong, buying cute outfits and stuff, showering affection, and sharing my happiness with another little human being alongside my partner. I've kind of always wanted to give my parents a grandchild, more so my mother than my own father (and you obviously know why, lol). I was mostly raised into the person that I have become by my mother and grandfather actually. My grandfather was more of a father figure to me than my own father was as a little girl. I was sincerely hoping that my grandfather would live strongly enough to see me graduate from schooling, get married, and start raising a family....because I wanted to give my grandfather which I believed to be the greatest gift that I could ever give him in return for raising me, a great-grandchild whom he could spoil me just as much as he did to me. Sadly, he passed away when I was 16, but that still hasn't changed my wanting for a child of my own. I still want to give my mother a grandchild and I still want to have one because I believe that I honestly could become a good parent.
And now onto the "no" part, there are conflicting reasons regarding the "no" factor because they all primarily stem from fear basically and that is usually the main cause to constant self-doubt. When I find myself second-guessing becoming pregnant, a lot of that stems back to my childhood because of the environment that I was raised in. As a person coming from low to slightly middle income, I decided of my own volition that this wasn't the kind of financial stability that I would personally want to ever bring a child in and I kept telling myself over and over that the right thing to do is to wait until you feel that you're stable. This met blows with other people, family and non-family, where every one of them would use the time-old excuse of "well, you'll never be 100% ready for children" and while part of that is factually true because none of us have the clairvoyance for every little child-raising problem...there are still bits and pieces that I can prepare ahead of time to make situations that may ultimately seem chaotic into lesser than that. So, finances are the biggest role-player in the "no" factor. I know that I have a good, stable job...but, I also know that childcare is super costly and it doesn't get better until they leave the house, and even then there's such a thing as college. I know that I would be eligible for some social programs possibly, but I feel like things could still be ironed out. Debts could still be paid off and savings still need adjustments. I also would like to get married first and that's another finance depleter, however, a wedding is a one-time large ticket item and a child needs constant financial support for all of its life. So, if possible though I know the current situation with the pandemic puts a damper on things, I'd like to get married first before having a child. That's not so much as falling back on the traditional stigmas of marriage before children as it is with me just weighing that one situation will outpace the other in terms of costs.
And the other reasoning for no is space. We live in a house that is made comfortable for at least 4-5 people, however, the fifth room is in total disrepair and it would need to be remodeled quickly because while plenty of people have told me that the newborn can stay within our room for security....at some point, that kid is going to need and want their own privacy...and at some point, so will my SO, lol. I feel that the room needs to be prepped and readied into a nursery that can then be converted into a child's bedroom before we should really start getting too serious. Which...at the same time follows with the finances again actually. I'm not sure if it's right to start a high debt with a remodeling loan considering that there are also other parts of this house needing some TLC.
When I think about my wants, at the same time, these negative pressures are weighing on my mind and it's almost drowning. I want to have this one thing, but I'm convincing myself that I can't because of [reasons]. I'm pretty sure that my SO knows my indecisiveness about it and they're only a year older than myself. And then when I hear the pressures of people telling me that if I don't do this thing like right now, I then feel like I'm running out of time because as a society we've made women feel that it's unacceptable to have children the more you age. So, instead of wanting to be happy for having a child, I feel nothing but pressure and that I'm missing out on something that I earnestly want, but it's my fault that I can't when there are factors literally out of my control too since boatloads of money just don't magically appear out of thin air and if they do? They come with interest rates that want you to die in debt and that's no place for raising a child in my humble opinion. A child shouldn't start you in debt.
The game starring high school teenagers in which they pilot the mechs naked has a sexualized figure?
That can't be. Must be a mistake, yeah.
That can't be. Must be a mistake, yeah.
It's where her activation symbol is, they all have them somewhere on their body and they swipe them to call the sentinals.
Even if there was a VERY GOOD lore reason for them to be naked, would that wash away the sticky male gaze poured all over? Look in your heart... :p
"What if she like, had to breathe through her skin maaaaan. Words and deeeeeeeeds".
Just saw a Twitter account I follow (Wario64) post this figure from 13 Sentinels and... is there a good reason she's pulling her shirt up (I've never played it) or is it exactly the reason I think?
Well in short, each character summons their mech by swiping a specific part of their body. It's a different part for each character. To call her mech, she swipes...well you can guess.
Ah. So it's 100% a "she breathes through her skin" situation. I suppose I should be ashamed of my words and deeds.
There is a plot explanation. It's actually a significant plotline for this character in particular. It's a plot point that the devs could have easily kept while not featuring certain body parts. But if you would like to know:
To use the mech, each pilot has to be shot with a "magical gun" as the game describes. Where each character needs to swipe to summon the mech is where they got shot. So for this character, she was shot in the stomach. For the other female characters, it's the thigh and ankle of course. For the guys, it's things like the arm or the face.
Exactly. Same situation as the "breathes through her skin" bs. The devs wanted to leer at their female characters so they wrote the lore to let them do so.
"I really want to make a game about kids piloting mechs but I'd also like to have a slight boner."
Woke up to your reply. I'm speechless, that video is something alright...
First and second entry sound interesting at least, i think i'm going to try to hunt them down or, at least, play them somehow. I'm in the mood for some classic JRPG
1/2 aren't as bad. And the prequel/sequel ar nosurge is back to more like 1 and 2. However, if possible, try to read the prequel to ar nosurge first. An incredible journey. Not as much fanservice(outfits mainly but nothing like seen in 3) either (ciel nosurge that is)
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Uh was a vn/life sim that's only in japan. There used to be a full on video fan translation of it but uh, folks kept bullying the translator on the quality and he took it down. I posted about it a few weeks ago.(https://www.resetera.com/threads/ci...n-by-creator-due-to-internet-bullying.389897/) Now the only option is a read a summary, or find his website backed up (which I have)
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Ooof
Fuck trolls, seriously.
I'll try both. I plan on playing the games on summer, so i'll take my time to properly read the prequel in the meantime.
Thanks!
Having also played them as a teen who played every RPG I could get ahold of at the time, I would heavily caution anyone against playing even the earlier two Ar tonelico games. The music is nice, the worldbuilding and aesthetic is pretty neat, the gameplay is enjoyable and the treatment of women throughout the series is abhorrent. Ar tonelico 3 just put it on display in the open with its stripping mechanic, but every game in the series is riddled with anime harem fanservice writing.
Every female character is written to be a potential love interest to the male main character, (even the second game protagonist's own adoptive preteen sister) the games are riddled with a constant barrage of "teehee don't look up my skirt now" type comments from female characters. The first game has a mechanic where the girls' magic is upgraded through a wink wink nudge nudge mechanic where you push crystals into their "special spots" while they moan, the second game changed it so you upgrade their magic through watching them take a bath. Every game has a visual novel mechanic where you enter the psyches of the girls through a sex shop analogy so that you can fix their often severe psychological trauma through becoming their boyfriend. Not to mention the inherently othering way women are written just through the setting itself, with the magic half-android spellcasting race being comprised of solely women, leading to situations of weird fantasy racism-sexism and situations of EXTREMELY weird "women are the master race" writing alike.
There are elements of good in there, I begrudgingly have some fondness and nostalgia for a couple of characters due to having played them when I was so young. Luca, one of the female leads from the second game is still one of my favorite video game characters that I never reveal to anyone. But that same character was also endlessly shat on and had disgusting misogynistic comments and threats of violence written about her by the vast majority of the online fanbase at the time. All because she wasn't a perfect anime waifu since she dared to have a mental breakdown after she found out her lost sister, who she had been enduring poverty and underage fantasy-sex work for her whole life in an attempt to find her, had died years ago. It was one of my big eye-opening moments about video game views on women at the time as a kid lol.
In short, if you have a high tolerance for harem fanservice bullshit and you really want to enjoy some decent music and turn-based JRPG combat, Ar tonelico 1 and 2 can be an interesting case study in finding small bits of actually interesting writing in a pile of sludge. But don't go into them expecting them to be the slightest bit tasteful. (The English release of Ar tonelico 2 is also famously a broken mess, its translation being a nonsensical rush job by NISA and the US release in particular having a game crash bug on a mandatory boss.)
Every female character is written to be a potential love interest to the male main character, (even the second game protagonist's own adoptive preteen sister) the games are riddled with a constant barrage of "teehee don't look up my skirt now" type comments from female characters. The first game has a mechanic where the girls' magic is upgraded through a wink wink nudge nudge mechanic where you push crystals into their "special spots" while they moan, the second game changed it so you upgrade their magic through watching them take a bath. Every game has a visual novel mechanic where you enter the psyches of the girls through a sex shop analogy so that you can fix their often severe psychological trauma through becoming their boyfriend. Not to mention the inherently othering way women are written just through the setting itself, with the magic half-android spellcasting race being comprised of solely women, leading to situations of weird fantasy racism-sexism and situations of EXTREMELY weird "women are the master race" writing alike.
There are elements of good in there, I begrudgingly have some fondness and nostalgia for a couple of characters due to having played them when I was so young. Luca, one of the female leads from the second game is still one of my favorite video game characters that I never reveal to anyone. But that same character was also endlessly shat on and had disgusting misogynistic comments and threats of violence written about her by the vast majority of the online fanbase at the time. All because she wasn't a perfect anime waifu since she dared to have a mental breakdown after she found out her lost sister, who she had been enduring poverty and underage fantasy-sex work for her whole life in an attempt to find her, had died years ago. It was one of my big eye-opening moments about video game views on women at the time as a kid lol.
In short, if you have a high tolerance for harem fanservice bullshit and you really want to enjoy some decent music and turn-based JRPG combat, Ar tonelico 1 and 2 can be an interesting case study in finding small bits of actually interesting writing in a pile of sludge. But don't go into them expecting them to be the slightest bit tasteful. (The English release of Ar tonelico 2 is also famously a broken mess, its translation being a nonsensical rush job by NISA and the US release in particular having a game crash bug on a mandatory boss.)
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I was reading Steam discussions of Geneforge 1: Mutagen the other day. There was a discussion where one guy wanted to know if he can summon sexy female monsters like succubi in the game.
It's isometric 2D CRPG with low detail character sprites but his interest in the game was still influenced by whether or not it would have "sexy" women in it. (Spoiler: you can't summon sexy monsters in it.)
Oh my GOD lmao.
For y'all's reference this is what the summon/construct screen looks like:
Spiderweb Software's niche is retro-style CRPGs that have zero horniness and just play its stories straight. Pretty sharp writing too, from the ones I've played. No romances or "fanservice" or anything like that, which now that I think of it makes it pretty unique in the market these days.
Thank you so much for the detailed and heartfelt reply. It's clear you've given this topic a mountain of thought, so between that and your honest desire to simply love your kid, I think you would be an amazing mother. Especially as opposed to "our marriage is going badly so let's have a kid, they say it can fix it" (points at own parents; spoiler: didn't fix their marriage) or "we have no interest in kids but it's what people do, so..." (points at SO's parents).
Also, as a Spaniard, it's kind of heartbreaking to me that so many people in the US have to choose between not having kids, or passing on massive college loans to them. :(
You're welcome! It definitely is something to give a lot of thought to in my personal and humble opinion. After seeing so many bad cases of parenting in different places and then coupled with my own childhood experiences, it leaves a lot of scenarios to muddle through in order to find a more desirable situation and I've learned a lot of "what not to do" without even having my own yet. I think having a kid takes a serious commitment for both partners and firmly believe that even if childcare isn't a perfect world, you can still find ways to prepare for it even if 100% preparation for a kid is an idealistic, unachievable goal. I'm pretty sure that my parents had children just for the sake of having children, but on a split decision. I'm sure that my mother sincerely wanted kids and then we just became accessories for my father. I took the sexist brunt of that, but that's not to say that my older brother didn't get ignored by my father either on most occasions. A case of one parent leaving all of the responsibility to the other which is something I won't do myself.
I think that's the big dealbreaker usually for couples in the US where money is not nearly as fortunate to them as some other families. I have massive college debt myself that I won't so easily be able to escape from, and it's a shame. I wouldn't tell anyone or any kid for that matter not to pursue college, but I will tell them to try for scholarships as much as possible and don't solely rely on private and federal loan companies as I did. Also, to check those damn interest rates because those are literally the worst part. Naive 18-year-old to not realize that an interest rate of 9.75% is garbage. =__=;;
I always wanted to play these games because I played Ar nosurge on the Vita and loved it. That game had nice characters and of course amazing music. But I could never play the older ones because they're on PS2 and impossible to get basically. I guess that was a good thing in the end.
I mean if you enjoyed Ar nosurge, the Tonelico games are right along the same lines. They just take place after chronologically. Diving has existed since Tonelico 1.
That should be downright illegal. Man, fuck unbridled capitalism and the immoral assholes that profit this way. :(
This Ar Tonelico talk reminds me how I dropped the Ar Tonelico 3 a few hours into the game and never had any desire to try playing the game again. I had forgotten about all those dumb new gameplay mechanics added to that entry.
They are pretty rare now...around the time that I purchased AR1, it was 2008 or 2009 and at like...a $60 tag. You could probably still find original copies, but definitely not at $60 right away. What's also worst is trying to find a proper converter that would properly display those games on a 4k TV reasonably that doesn't turn the text into a bright, blurry mess.
I almost feel like I should have kept a standard television just for PS2 era games because they look like garbage on our TV after trying three different converters.
Have you tried Retrotink or OSSC? I have both and they are amazing for PS2 games.
The Tonelico games run decently on PS2 emulators too actually. A good way to go about playing the fan retranslation.
And that was back then so I'm sure they are even worse now! The main problem was that I don't have a PS2, and yes I bet it would be hard to use one on a never TV like that too. I think AR3 was really expensive too.
Oh there's a fan translation? Someone said they had a really bad localization so that would help alot I'm guessing.
I do not believe that we have. I'll have to relay that information to my SO who used to work in the IT field and get him to maybe check while I'm working or something. Thanks for the suggestions!
Oh, really? I never thought about looking at emulation either quite honestly. I figured that the titles were so obscure and not well-known that I didn't even bother to try looking. I'll keep an open mind about that, thanks!
After doing a quick Google check on the shopping tab, yea, some of the people selling copies have pretty cutthroat, expensive prices between places like Ebay and individual seller profiles just in general. The highest price tag is going for a cool $200, lol. The PS2 will definitely be the stopgap for you because I don't even want to imagine the price tag on an older gaming console in gently used or at least mint condition for running older games.
I'm a bit of a console hoarder. I've kept all of my older generation consoles in near-mint condition with constant cleanings and safe storage. I suppose that it also helps that I'm a bit of an OCD neat-freak too about my stuff, lol.
I still have a working Gamecube, two PS2's (the fat version and slim, the fat version was a 1st generation model that got the disc reading error for certain games or moves, just refuses to play certain things which prompted the purchase of a slim version), and even the original Xbox model, lol. Also, still have my N64, Gameboy Color, and Gameboy Advance too.
Honestly, those 2 I mentioned are really the only ones I would use nowadays since they don't mess with the picture like cheap converters would and they can even enhance them. Retrotink is cheaper and more plug n play as well.
Yeah I have one and it's excellent. At the 100 bucks range too but is usable for any retro console, even works with the NES!
Yeah, it's the best way to go about it today. Also considering you'd otherwise have to mod your PS2. Plus Ar Tonelico 2 was a hot mess with even a game breaking bug, which is patched out in the fan translation as well.