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SmokeMaxX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,337
Hmmm

So what is the culpability of the Chinese government really?

They aren't responsible for the virus itself despite what conspiracy theorists will tell you

The charge appears to be that they mishandled initial response and withheld critical information or didnt take it seriously enough until it was too late

Is that fair though? How do you know just how bad it is until research comes in from medical professionals? Do they shoulder any blame?
I'm not sure how much blame to assign them. I know it'll be popular though because of hatrid for China + racism + the desire to shift blame. I know that the US had several months notice of COVID19 and has done an even poorer job containing it than they did, so I'm not sure how anyone expects China to have contained it.
 

Sheepinator

Member
Jul 25, 2018
28,073
Hmmm

So what is the culpability of the Chinese government really?

They aren't responsible for the virus itself despite what conspiracy theorists will tell you

The charge appears to be that they mishandled initial response and withheld critical information or didnt take it seriously enough until it was too late

Is that fair though? How do you know just how bad it is until research comes in from medical professionals? Do they shoulder any blame?
If you (not literally you) think Trump would have reacted any differently than China in the first month or two, i.e. trying to cover it up and making out it's no big deal, I have a bridge to sell you. That's what Trump did when he already knew it was a big deal.

The irony of course is that it's Trump's delayed response doing nothing in January and February except stopping some flights, which is killing Americans today. It spread here while he was saying it's just the flu and while he did nothing to prepare for the medical equipment shortages we're seeing already.

Trump had more advance notice than China did, and did even less in that time.
 

cameron

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
23,838




Leigh Ann Caldwell @LACaldwellDC

NEW: The latest Coronavirus stimulus (wh/ are changes from the original proposal):
- At least $100 billion for hospitals
- Unemployment insurance benefits expansion for 100% of salary for 4 months
- No phase-in of direct payments for lower income people. ($1200/person;$500/kid)​

9:58 AM - Mar 24, 2020


Lisa Desjardins @LisaDNews

NEW - UPDATE FROM CAPITOL: Manchin just told us there is good news, that GOP has made changes to oversight of the $500 b for corporations. And staff is now drafting language - that could take 2-3 hours. Also he said there is more $ for hospitals.

Thinks vote likely tonight.​

10:08 AM - Mar 24, 2020 · Washington, DC
 

Amibguous Cad

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,033
I'm not sure how much blame to assign them. I know it'll be popular though because of hatrid for China + racism + the desire to shift blame. I know that the US had several months notice of COVID19 and has done an even poorer job containing it than they did, so I'm not sure how anyone expects China to have contained it.

It was lax regulation of the markets in Wuhan that let the virus jump from pangolins to pigs to humans. People worried about conditions there aren't just being xenophobic assholes. The presence of both exotic and mundane animals in close proximity to each other in terrible conditions makes the transfer of viruses to humans much, much easier. It's a massive externality, and when this is all over there needs to be a regime of international inspections to make sure the conditions don't recur.
 

Selbran

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,571
Really need to see what the oversight for the finding is because unless the House has a say in how funds are dispersed there's nothing stopping the GOP from doing whatever they want with the funding.
 
Oct 27, 2017
7,885


twitter.com

Bobby Lewis on Twitter

“Fox's Stuart Varney says there's "two sides" to the coronavirus pandemic response, and "the investors, they're taking the president's side" instead of medical experts. https://t.co/bjljPcOlZo”

We're in hell


They should reconsider that then, Elysium doesn't exist and they're stuck on this rock with us, we aren't stuck in here with them.

EAT.THESE.GREASY.WEASELS
 

Kirblar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
30,744
It was lax regulation of the markets in Wuhan that let the virus jump from pangolins to pigs to humans. People worried about conditions there aren't just being xenophobic assholes. The presence of both exotic and mundane animals in close proximity to each other in terrible conditions makes the transfer of viruses to humans much, much easier. It's a massive externality, and when this is all over there needs to be a regime of international inspections to make sure the conditions don't recur.
This is why China's going full propagandist on the origins, because they know they fucked up huge not cracking down on this shit.
 

cameron

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
23,838
www.cbsnews.com

Americans see months-long pandemic fight ahead — CBS News poll

Scientists, doctors bridge partisan divide on whom to trust. Americans overwhelmingly approve of plan to send checks.

www.cbsnews.com

With Americans in lockdown, hope and calm beat nervousness — CBS News poll

Some report stress but most stay optimistic as life changes.

mLj9XAn.png


OWwNPAg.png






g1tCZ07.png


qF7hSqS.png
 

Sheepinator

Member
Jul 25, 2018
28,073
90% trust among Republicans for what Trump is saying about the virus!!! Holy crap. So they all believed there were millions of tests weeks ago, and that 15 cases would soon be zero (currently 46,485), and that those drugs he pimped are cures (which a couple took themselves and one died the other is in the ICU), wow.
 

DrROBschiz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,497
If you (not literally you) think Trump would have reacted any differently than China in the first month or two, i.e. trying to cover it up and making out it's no big deal, I have a bridge to sell you. That's what Trump did when he already knew it was a big deal.

The irony of course is that it's Trump's delayed response doing nothing in January and February except stopping some flights, which is killing Americans today. It spread here while he was saying it's just the flu and while he did nothing to prepare for the medical equipment shortages we're seeing already.

Trump had more advance notice than China did, and did even less in that time.

hey man I am with you 100%
 

Dierce

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,993
90% trust among Republicans for what Trump is saying about the virus!!! Holy crap. So they all believed there were millions of tests weeks ago, and that 15 cases would soon be zero (currently 46,485), and that those drugs he pimped are cures (which a couple took themselves and one died the other is in the ICU), wow.
What is even more astonishing is that they trust medical professionals to the same degree. The amount of cognitive dissonance is astounding.
 

Sheepinator

Member
Jul 25, 2018
28,073
What is even more astonishing is that they trust medical professionals to the same degree. The amount of cognitive dissonance is astounding.
13% trust in the media, yet it was the non-Fox media who warned them about this, which they called a Dem hoax! And here we are with the country mostly shut down weeks later, unemployment soaring, etc. smh
 

RolandGunner

Member
Oct 30, 2017
8,532
Really need to see what the oversight for the finding is because unless the House has a say in how funds are dispersed there's nothing stopping the GOP from doing whatever they want with the funding.

Treasury will be the ones dispersing the funds. That was never the question. It was always about tracking how the money goes out. Supposedly the verification is inspector general involvement and an oversight committee.
 

Selbran

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,571
There's literally no way you can trust Trump about the virus but also trust medical professionals. One of those two is acting against the other.
 

DrROBschiz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,497
I hate that this fucking village Idiot is still considered to be speaking gospel to s certain segment of our population
 

Mcfrank

Member
Oct 28, 2017
15,252
I hate that this fucking village Idiot is still considered to be speaking gospel to s certain segment of our population
My parents are life long republicans who dislike trump. Yesterday I got to hear a rant about how good of a job he is doing when I was on my phone call. If he says "churches are safe, go back to church" they will be the two happiest people on earth And probably vote for him =(
 

LegendofJoe

Member
Oct 28, 2017
12,099
Arkansas, USA
We won't be able to lovingly watch over our elderly if we're exposing ourselves at work. I might not be able to see my 90 year old grandfather ever again. Thanks Trump!
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,641
Aren't all of the business shut-downs instituted at the state level? How is he actually going to send anyone back to work?
Trump telling businesses to reopen will put pressure on governors to respond accordingly, and when they don't, he can try squeezing them on federal aid money. Or at the very least badger them in the press and online, to ensure some erosion of public support for those governors.

Of course he's not actually thinking it through like that, he probably assumes he'll flip the switch and everything will go back to normal, but that's how I can see it playing out.
 

AndyD

Mambo Number PS5
Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,602
Nashville
Aren't all of the business shut-downs instituted at the state level? How is he actually going to send anyone back to work?
Can't. He can force their hand by ending the emergency delclaration and condition emergency federal money, but he can't actively make people go back to work. People will continue to call in sick rather than go.
 

Casa

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,582
He knows he'll be getting his ass kicked in November if this continues much longer. He's desperately trying to get the market back up to the high 20k's because he knows that's his only chance. He'll let thousands of preventable deaths occur to help secure his re-election.
 
Jan 29, 2018
9,414
Red state governors are not going to defy trump publicly.
He won't, he'll just whine at Dem governors for doing their jobs while whipping up the cult
Trump telling businesses to reopen will put pressure on governors to respond accordingly, and when they don't, he can try squeezing them on federal aid money. Or at the very least badger them in the press and online, to ensure some erosion of public support for those governors.

Of course he's not actually thinking it through like that, he probably assumes he'll flip the switch and everything will go back to normal, but that's how I can see it playing out.

Here in Ohio DeWine has been pretty aggressive. I don't know what would happen if Trump pressured states to open back up.

It's infuriating that Trump might actually go out of his way to make things even worse at this point.
 
Oct 26, 2017
6,838
Rand Paul who is a Dr. is proof that the public can't be trusted to practice social distancing as the only defense against the CoVID-19.

The infections are accelerating like crazy and that's just a reflection of where we were 10 days ago. Considering only selected states and cities just started going on lockdown 2-4 days ago, can only imagine how bad the infections actually are right now. And Trump wants to send people back to work in that environment? Any supposed "safe area" will turn into a hotspot within the days because the virus is nowhere close to being contained. and we don't really know where it is right now aside from the mature hotspots. Here in California, the testing has been painfully slow. The actual infections is much worse than what the stats say.

Once those 45 minute tests come out, it's going to get real ugly fast.
 
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