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KingK

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,860
Lol I'm 27 and I don't think I have even $1,000 in retirement/401K. Saving for retirement is a luxury most millennials cannot afford. Up until the last 2 years I don't think I'd ever had a job that even offered any retirement plans.

Meanwhile I've got about $40k in student loan debt.
 

Wilsongt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,511
Retirement as a concept won't exist for the people who are saddled with student debts in a few years, anyway. We are rapidly moving to work until you die territory.
 

pooptest

Member
Oct 27, 2017
629
Lol I'm 27 and I don't think I have even $1,000 in retirement/401K. Saving for retirement is a luxury most millennials cannot afford. Up until the last 2 years I don't think I'd ever had a job that even offered any retirement plans.

Meanwhile I've got about $40k in student loan debt.

I think that's about what age I was when I started my 401K. My only benefit is I got in right at the end of the recession in 2008/somewhere in 2009. I didn't make a lot of money back then, but always did 6% (employer matched 3%) and it's been pretty good. I've changed jobs since and make quite a bit more than the last one and was able to roll it over to this job's 401K plan.

Glad you're getting in now, albeit the sticks are already pretty high to begin with. Anyway, there's no too late to start, but I sometimes kick myself for not starting earlier. No biggie, though.
 

Wraith

Member
Jun 28, 2018
8,892
Biden might be an old idiot but people seem to like him for whatever reason. Nominating him would probably do a lot to cement our gains in the suburbs where someone like Bernie could cause a backlash. A Biden/Harris ticket for example could be extremely potent for bringing a lot of elements of the Democratic Party together!
Can someone explain Biden's support beyond the "Hey, I remember that name" factor? Are there people out there legit excited about his platform who actually think Biden, today, would be a great President? (Not just "better than Trump"-good, which is every candidate.)

It just seems like so much "I think he can win because all the polls say he can win, so that's why I'll pick him."
 

KingK

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,860
Retirement as a concept won't exist for the people who are saddled with student debts in a few years, anyway. We are rapidly moving to work until you die territory.
Yeah, I've already accepted that I'll either work until I die, or some actual political/policy solution will have occurred by then.

The way things are right now though, I don't think I or anyone I know around my age will be able to retire when we get old.

I think that's about what age I was when I started my 401K. My only benefit is I got in right at the end of the recession in 2008/somewhere in 2009. I didn't make a lot of money back then, but always did 6% (employer matched 3%) and it's been pretty good. I've changed jobs since and make quite a bit more than the last one and was able to roll it over to this job's 401K plan.

Glad you're getting in now, albeit the sticks are already pretty high to begin with. Anyway, there's no too late to start, but I sometimes kick myself for not starting earlier. No biggie, though.
Yeah, earlier this year I got a job in the public sector/local government that actually has a not terrible plan, as far as I can tell. I don't contribute much (budget is already really tight with with credit card and student loan payments, rent, car+insurance, etc.) but eh, the employer contribution isn't bad.
 
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Sheepinator

Member
Jul 25, 2018
28,066

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,636


Different angle on Pelosi. You can see that she upgraded her finger wagging by a notch on this.
 

lmcfigs

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,091
We really can't keep running on cutting taxes for the middle class every election either. Eventually you do need to raise taxes for everyone. Especially if you want to expand the welfare state.
 

cameron

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
23,835


Also James Rosen:
The network cited no reason for Rosen's exit and did not announce it on the air. According to Rosen's former colleagues, however, he had an established pattern of flirting aggressively with many peers and had made sexual advances toward three female Fox News journalists, including two reporters and a producer. And his departure followed increased scrutiny of his behavior at the network, according to colleagues.
 

Diablos

has a title.
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,610
this is the stupidest thing ive ever seen.
It's quite irresponsible, especially coming from a Republican whose party has long held the belief that you need to be 110% responsible in saving your own money for your future.

There are tons of people with outrageous student loan debt (or who are in a financial bind in general) who would love to take everything from their 401k without being penalized. Not that it's financially responsible of course since you're just buying yourself a few months' time at the expense of your retirement savings...

Early withdrawal is no joke, you're taxed 20% right off the bat and then when taxes are due you owe an additional 10%. I get that it's to prevent people from abusing early withdrawal, but for people with a lot of student loan debt among other things, they'd probably take advantage of an option that would not penalize you if it were available... not that it's the responsible thing to do, but if it's between that and bankruptcy or at least severe debt, lots of people would probably opt for that, misguided as it may be. Paul is obviously trying to capitalize on that.
 

JesseEwiak

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
3,781
Can someone explain Biden's support beyond the "Hey, I remember that name" factor? Are there people out there legit excited about his platform who actually think Biden, today, would be a great President? (Not just "better than Trump"-good, which is every candidate.)

It just seems like so much "I think he can win because all the polls say he can win, so that's why I'll pick him."

To explain his support from older black people, it's basically, along with them not believing in revolutionary change in the first place, Biden's also an old white man who was comfortable playing second fiddle to the first black President.
 

Aaron

I’m seeing double here!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,077
Minneapolis
We really can't keep running on cutting taxes for the middle class every election either. Eventually you do need to raise taxes for everyone. Especially if you want to expand the welfare state.
Yeah it's interesting this is never really touched on by deficit hawks, for example. If Obama and Congress had let the Clinton tax rates go back into effect in 2010 for everyone, that would have nearly wiped out the deficit by the time Obama left office:

1280px-ATRA_Deficit_Scenarios_-_v1.png
 

Sheepinator

Member
Jul 25, 2018
28,066
Jilted Trump Announces Formation Of Cooler, Way More Powerful NATO With His New Best Friends Oman, Macedonia, And Suriname

LONDON—In response to the covertly recorded footage of European leaders mocking the U.S. president, a jilted Donald Trump announced Wednesday the official formation of a cooler, way more powerful NATO with his new best friends Oman, Macedonia, and Suriname. "We are going to have so much fun without you losers," said the U.S. commander in chief of the impromptu new intergovernmental alliance he formed after proclaiming that "the old NATO is stupid," explaining that he had already poured billions of dollars of funding into the collective to ensure they have the "best summit ever."

 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,636
Yeah it's interesting this is never really touched on by deficit hawks, for example. If Obama and Congress had let the Clinton tax rates go back into effect in 2010 for everyone, that would have nearly wiped out the entire deficit.
Deficit only matters when the opposition is in power. Watch your Rand Pauls start crying about the deficit again when Dems take control.
 

shiba5

I shed
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
15,825
This is painfully dumb.

Student: I can't find a job with solid or any benefits and debt is crippling my ability to invest in myself or my life
Rand Paul: Just pay off your dept with your 401k!
Student: I hardly have any money in there. Using what little I have will further hurt my ability to retire, wont it?
Rand Paul: B O O T S T R A P S

Just get a better job that pays a lot. Duh

/s
 

Aaron

I’m seeing double here!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,077
Minneapolis
Deficit only matters when the opposition is in power. Watch your Rand Pauls start crying about the deficit again when Dems take control.
They should be called deficit bears, not deficit hawks. They love to hibernate for 8 years at a time.
Oh of course, I know how the game is played.

I can't wait until the Trump tax cuts get repealed to pay for something and the concern trolls will simultaneously be arguing that we can't afford it, but also we should leave the tax cuts in place.

Interestingly I remember hearing from a few people in 2012 they wanted to go over the cliff just to deal with the deficit, and wouldn't you know it, they were all Never Trumpers in 2016.

Wouldn't these nummbers mean only Warren and Bernie would receive delegates from California? This would be a disaster for Biden, delegates-wise.
15% is the threshold, yes (though I believe it's also evaluated by county or district or something, so it's not quite as simple as "if you get under 15% statewide you get nothing").

If those numbers held up Warren and Sanders would almost go evenly on the delegates.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,636
Wouldn't these nummbers mean only Warren and Bernie would receive delegates from California? This would be a disaster for Biden, delegates-wise.
Assuming these are the final results then Biden would receive no delegates.

There's a strong possibility of Biden not getting any delegates from Iowa as well.

Imagine the Democratic frontrunner getting 0 delegates from California, the biggest Democratic state...
 
Oct 27, 2017
17,973
Also James Rosen:
The network cited no reason for Rosen's exit and did not announce it on the air. According to Rosen's former colleagues, however, he had an established pattern of flirting aggressively with many peers and had made sexual advances toward three female Fox News journalists, including two reporters and a producer. And his departure followed increased scrutiny of his behavior at the network, according to colleagues.

The full answer from Pelosi, well worth a listen, actually shut him up.
 

Wraith

Member
Jun 28, 2018
8,892
Yeah it's interesting this is never really touched on by deficit hawks, for example. If Obama and Congress had let the Clinton tax rates go back into effect in 2010 for everyone, that would have nearly wiped out the deficit by the time Obama left office:
The GOP cycle. Pass irresponsible, time-limited tax cuts paid for by deficit spending, then campaign against Democrats by saying they're going to "raise taxes" when said irresponsible tax cuts expire. And claim the deficit's so high because social program exist, and since only lazy leeches would ever use social benefits, they should be slashed to the bone. And any Democrat who disagrees is only concerned about giving free stuff to lazy people...

And since Democrats are always running against this same platform, they say "middle class tax cuts" every time to appear reasonable to people who don't see the larger picture.
 

Steel

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
18,220
Assuming these are the final results then Biden would receive no delegates.

There's a strong possibility of Biden not getting any delegates from Iowa as well.

Imagine the Democratic frontrunner getting 0 delegates from California, the biggest Democratic state...
Like most state polls it has a 4% margin of error, and there are polls from just a couple of weeks earlier that show Biden in the lead (He got 28 and 24 in the last two polls in november), then a few weeks before that for Warren. State polls outside of Iowa and NH aren't showing much atm since there are so few with such a huge MOE.
 

ValiantChaos

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,112
Assuming these are the final results then Biden would receive no delegates.

There's a strong possibility of Biden not getting any delegates from Iowa as well.

Imagine the Democratic frontrunner getting 0 delegates from California, the biggest Democratic state...
You have to consider that delegates are awarded by statewide and by congressional districts so if he met the threashold in some of them he would still get delegates from CA
 

Deleted member 40853

User requested account closure
Banned
Mar 9, 2018
873
Can someone explain Biden's support beyond the "Hey, I remember that name" factor? Are there people out there legit excited about his platform who actually think Biden, today, would be a great President? (Not just "better than Trump"-good, which is every candidate.)

It just seems like so much "I think he can win because all the polls say he can win, so that's why I'll pick him."

I mean, people clearly just like the guy. It wasn't that long ago that everyone loved Uncle Joe until he got in the way of Warren and Sanders. He might stumble over his words but he's an affable, kind man who people seem to connect with. More than just name recognition he is a known quantity with experience in the executive branch. Compared to Warren or Sanders you know you are getting a pretty standard Democratic administration with Biden. He has been able to position himself well as a less 'extreme' option. This country is a lot more conservative than we'd like to acknowledge, and most people are simply uninterested in upending the system or following up Trump with an extremely progressive candidate. Unfortunately. Biden lets people feel like our norms haven't been entirely eroded and we can still have a "normal" President.

I wouldn't consider myself a Biden supporter but its not a mystery why people like him and this kind of rhetoric about all his supporters being low information voters who jumped when they heard a name they recognized is unhelpful and ignorant. Biden has been leading the polls the whole time and has rock solid support from black folks. Throw a VP like Harris and that sounds to me like a pretty solid coalition. Acting like it's all just name recognition and no one "actually" supports him is why the online left has been predicting his imminent demise since the race started. This country is not full of people who are secretly massive supporters of progressive ideas and only support Biden because of name recognition - people just like what he has to offer. Something that very few people "actually" support and only polls well because of name recognition is more like M4A, not Joe Biden.
 

Aaron

I’m seeing double here!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,077
Minneapolis
The GOP cycle. Pass irresponsible, time-limited tax cuts paid for by deficit spending, then campaign against Democrats by saying they're going to "raise taxes" when said irresponsible tax cuts expire. And claim the deficit's so high because social program exist, and since only lazy leeches would ever use social benefits, they should be slashed to the bone. And any Democrat who disagrees is only concerned about giving free stuff to lazy people...

And since Democrats are always running against this same platform, they say "middle class tax cuts" every time to appear reasonable to people who don't see the larger picture.
fwiw Biden isn't running on middle class tax cuts, although his tax policy (which coincidentally was just released today!) doesn't raise taxes on the middle class either.

Which seems appropriate - his plans are less ambitious than Warren or Sanders'.
 

Diablos

has a title.
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,610
This is painfully dumb.

Student: I can't find a job with solid or any benefits and debt is crippling my ability to invest in myself or my life
Rand Paul: Just pay off your dept with your 401k!
Student: I hardly have any money in there. Using what little I have will further hurt my ability to retire, wont it?
Rand Paul: B O O T S T R A P S
Honestly, though? More than dumb, it actually exposes how full of shit the GOP is when it comes to the economy/job market and what that means in regard to the bleak outlook for people who uh, basically aren't making a lot of money, and who aren't baby boomers, trying to build a future.

I really do sympathize with anyone who would need to tap into if not deplete their 401k to help them get through a hard time. It's not smart financially, but given the challenges most people face financially today, I understand why some people may need to do that. It's a reflection of the times we are living in. Case in point, this initiative exposes a lot of bullshit. First of all, the economy being oh-so-strong because there are so many jobs, jobs, JAAAHHHBBSS. Well, yes, there are a lot of jobs. But the amount of jobs that provide a decent wage/salary for people to build a future with is a whole other fucking story. If the economy was so great for the American worker, there wouldn't even need to be the discussion of reforming the 401k plan to permit for people to have another option for paying down student loan debt, but here we are!

Secondly, when a Republican is touting this as a potential new way to pay down student debt, it shows that they have absolutely no plans for helping Americans invest in their future and is putting that squarely on them when it's not really even their fault. This is completely contradictory to what they've been preaching for 3+ decades about how they want to be the party of fiscal responsibility and having tools in place to help Americans help themselves invest in their future.

That people would even need to consider tapping into their retirement savings to pay off debt isn't on them, it's on the financial and economic conditions (even with a "strong" economy) that make that seem like all the more of a necessity in the first place. It's basically the Republicans admitting that you're going to have to jeopardize your future to pay for the past and present because this country (mostly thanks to Republicans) has done hardly anything to actually put things in place that invests in our future. It's perverse and sad and just another indicator that this country is in serious trouble over the next few decades.
 
Oct 26, 2017
6,828
Warren went through a fairly natural cycle of challenging the front runner and not quite breaking through. Doesn't mean it's over or anything but I also don't think there was some specific derailment.

As soon as she released her healthcare plan, I knew she just pulled the blue wire on the ticking time bomb on her campaign. Kamala got a lot of shit for waffling on her healthcare plan early on, but it was actually the smart thing to do because she was thinking ahead to deeper in the primary race and the GE. I was a short-term hit, meant to keep her viable in the long run. The problem was Kamala's campaign never fully fired on all 4 cylinders, so she couldn't go the distance and see the benefit from the early pivot.

Whereas Warren played hard for the fervent progressive vote and won a lot of hearts from the Left in the summer, but she played the game not like someone who expected to actually win the nominee and be viable in the GE. She mistook Twitter as the Democratic base when it's actually just a vocal minority. The base of the Democratic party is definitely trending left, but it's still much closer to the center than the socialist/revolutionaries.

Also when you have an absolutely crazy opposition party in the GOP, not everyone wants to go hard in the opposite direction creating more uncertainty. There are a lot of people that just want a "stabilizing" force in the White House after the insanity of Trump. They want someone who is actually competent to pass a sensible healthcare plan. I don't think the majority of the public thinks the ACA is inadequate to the point of overhauling the system again. They basically just want Trump and co. to stop shitting on the ACA and actually just fix it. I think once it's fixed and it appears there are still problems, then people may be open to more drastic change. But not yet.

Healthcare is probably the most important issue to the vast majority of Americans and Warren completely misread the room by pandering to Bernie's crowd when electability in the GE was always one of the nagging issues hanging over her head. Allowing herself to be painted as "extreme" on healthcare was a campaign-ending blunder that many of us saw a mile away.

It's not too late, but she now has to rely on some external factors to break her way to get back in it.
 

adam387

Member
Nov 27, 2017
5,215
I mean, people clearly just like the guy. It wasn't that long ago that everyone loved Uncle Joe until he got in the way of Warren and Sanders. He might stumble over his words but he's an affable, kind man who people seem to connect with. More than just name recognition he is a known quantity with experience in the executive branch. Compared to Warren or Sanders you know you are getting a pretty standard Democratic administration with Biden. He has been able to position himself well as a less 'extreme' option. This country is a lot more conservative than we'd like to acknowledge, and most people are simply uninterested in upending the system or following up Trump with an extremely progressive candidate. Unfortunately. Biden lets people feel like our norms haven't been entirely eroded and we can still have a "normal" President.

I wouldn't consider myself a Biden supporter but its not a mystery why people like him and this kind of rhetoric about all his supporters being low information voters who jumped when they heard a name they recognized is unhelpful and ignorant. Biden has been leading the polls the whole time and has rock solid support from black folks. Throw a VP like Harris and that sounds to me like a pretty solid coalition. Acting like it's all just name recognition and no one "actually" supports him is why the online left has been predicting his imminent demise since the race started. This country is not full of people who are secretly massive supporters of progressive ideas and only support Biden because of name recognition - people just like what he has to offer. Something that very few people "actually" support and only polls well because of name recognition is more like M4A, not Joe Biden.

This is tea.
 

Avinash117

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,602
I know that Republicans don't want to solve issues, but I still don't get why they keep proposing ideas that literally doesn't solve anything.

Also its crazy that they either propose policies that either kill off the majority of their voters or that doesn't do anything that helps the majority of them.
 

Diablos

has a title.
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,610
I know that Republicans don't want to solve issues, but I still don't get why they keep proposing ideas that literally doesn't solve anything.

Also its crazy that they either propose policies that either kill off the majority of their voters or that doesn't do anything that helps the majority of them.
They want to keep people poor and desperate, that's why. They have basically ushered in an Aristocracy and want to make sure it stays that way.
After all, being poor and desperate can make one confused and angry and plays right into how the GOP attracts voters to help them stay in power.
 

Allard

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,933
I know that Republicans don't want to solve issues, but I still don't get why they keep proposing ideas that literally doesn't solve anything.

Also its crazy that they either propose policies that either kill off the majority of their voters or that doesn't do anything that helps the majority of them.

Its actually not that hard to understand, modern day conservatives (social and economic in respective fashion) do not want government to function, they literally want to put it in a place where you can drown it in a tub at a moments notice and not notice anything wrong. They don't want it involved in regulation, they don't want it involved in their lives unless it means to subjugate things they don't like. They want people to think government is broken and then run on that message, not as fixers but as people trying to get government out of peoples lives (again unless it means hurting things they don't like). They are saboteurs who don't want things to work, but they also acknowledge that despite what they wish goverment is involved in money regulation so they know if they push too hard one way they could see a collapse which is why despite their blustering McConnell and company at least know a market or financial collapse would not go well for them.
 
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