Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,752
If you want to compare the upcoming HDR release, do it *with* the HDR release and compare it to the 1999 DVD since none of us have access to original theatrical 35mm prints.
The original DVD was noticeably different from how it looked in theaters, so that's not necessarily a good reference point.
But that is how I remember the film looking since it's the one I've seen the most, and I can say that the green-tinted release was not how it looked in theaters.
 

SArcher

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Oct 26, 2017
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Can someone throw up some comparisons between the 1999 DVD and the UHD Blu-Ray?
 

Deleted member 4222

Oct 25, 2017
1,712
XbtWp6Qc.jpg

That's just ridiculous.
 

Laserdisk

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May 11, 2018
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The dvd and LD were never correct, they fixed the black crush of the release prints but the timing was pushed warmer.
They were miles closer to the original timing tho.
I suspect warner have rolled off the grain as usual, in a not bad way.
As a super 35 show and seeing a relese print recently I expected a little more grain.
 
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Glassboy

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Oct 27, 2017
3,736
I wish I could have seen this in theaters. I was too young at the time. Blew me away on vhs though.
 

SArcher

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I think I still prefer the 1999 DVD to the re-release DVD/Blu-Ray and to the UHD.
 

doof_warrior

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Oct 25, 2017
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NJ
In this thread we discuss a mythical 'original film master', which nobody has ever seen or can clearly remember.
this thread is getting into the weeds with all these arguments over how the original looked EXACTLY
but the point remains, the movie didnt have the insanely overbearing green tint that the bluray did
it was a little green, but it looked nothing like that garbage they put out on bluray
 

BocoDragon

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
5,207
I guess I never minded the green in theory. I like that they made it consistent with the other movies (kind of a "Episode IV ANH added to title crawl" style change). It is consistent with the 2/3/Enter the Matrix that the world of The Matrix is tinted green.

But then again I never got around to buying the Blu-rays....
 

rashbeep

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,747
I guess I never minded the green in theory. I like that they made it consistent with the other movies (kind of a "Episode IV ANH added to title crawl" style change). It is consistent with the 2/3/Enter the Matrix that the world of The Matrix is tinted green.

But then again I never got around to buying the Blu-rays....

The green tint is a problem when it destroys every other colour in the scene (like flesh tones). The shot I posted literally has neo and Morpheus looking like the hulk
 

Dommo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,720
Australia
Okay, just bought a copy of the UHD. Some thoughts after having a browse through some scenes, then directly comparing the UHD to the original Blu-Ray, then afterwards the restored Blu-Ray (on an OLED and an Xbox One S, so no Dolby Vision):

- The UHD looks really, really good. I don't think anyone should be worried about raised blacks or blown highlights here. The blacks are, for the most part, inky as can be with a few exceptions where it works fine. In fact, at first I thought I was getting crushed blacks, but comparing it to the other versions, I'm almost certain this is a creative choice in the photography, with silhouettes and deep shadows utilized quite often.
- It's a very different grade, and on the whole, less green, but I have to say, I'm kind of surprised at how understated the green in the original BD often is. It's not the vomit fest I remember it as, and there are some scenes where the UHD is a little greener (The interrogation scene for example, is darker and richer, with the back walls a deeper green now. It's also, now that I've seen it at 4k resolution, one of the grainiest fucking scenes I've ever seen. I wonder what iso stock they filmed this scene in...). On the whole it feels like the original BD is often more saturated, and the skin tones warmer, not greener. The UHD is a little more relaxed with its colours, overall less saturated I'd say, and yes, a little less uniform in its colour scheme, allowing more granular colours to pop. Probably more accurate to the original master. Looks really nice, and yes, The Matrix logo at the start is fucking white.
- It's actually a little dim/flat looking sometimes. Some of the scenes in the real world especially, and especially in comparison to both the original BD and the restored BD. This may just be because, in the original BD's case, it's a colour grade for the DVD, where its contrast levels needed to be more defined to make up for a lack of resolution, and in the restored BD's case, it's generally brighter than the UHD on the whole (more below). Which is fine, but sometimes the UHD looks a little murky to its detriment I think. It almost looks like a metadata problem where some of the rolloff on light sources looks off. Wondering if Dolby Vision would improve things. I'm experimenting with bumping dynamic contrast ratio to high which certainly helps, but I think that's not recommended, right? I'll continue to play around.
- The restored BD is a little bit fucked for the reasons discussed here. Generally, blacks are raised (but not all the time), and whites are often blown out to a really ugly degree. Neo and Morpheus in the construct is way too bright and the clearest example I think. As discussed here, another good example is the woman in the red dress scene - also somewhat blown out, and the colour scheme too cool (While the UHD leans into the blues in this scene, it looks perfectly natural). It's a lot sharper than the original BD - compression has come a long way, but I think I might watch the original BD before the restored for these reasons.
 
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Dommo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,720
Australia
Like, here's a really crude but solid example of the grade at play. Please do not use this as any kind of clear example of what the final UHD looks like. These were taken on a phone and obviously aren't handling the contrasts/luminance very well. But you can see the colour changes relative to the previous version. The UHD retains the green ambiance, but Neo's skin tones are a lot more natural and don't disappear so much into the background. You can also see some magentas and browns pop up in the back there too. It's not just a green haze. There's also generally more contrast. The UHD is happy to keep a lot of its information in those really dark shadow areas.

NyIHZYI.jpg
(UHD)

fvO00ui.jpg
(2004 DVD... I know... this was what I just chucked in now to compare out of curiosity but it should be the same grade as the original BD)
 

borghe

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,112
Watch these first

- The Revenant
- Blade Runner 2049
- Mad Max : Fury Road

They're insane.
here's my HDR short list (along with yours):
Pacific Rim
Guardians of the Galaxy 2
Lost in Space (Netflix)
Wonder Woman

For "classics done right" so far:
Blade Runner
Fifth Element
Terminator 2
Starship Troopers
Bram Stoker's Dracula

Some classics (Ghost busters, Jurassic Park and Princess Bride) I wasn't a fan of the HDR post-process. It took away the "classic look" of the movies without adding anything substantial IMHO.

Really hoping to see this hit iTunes this week being that I grabbed the movie years ago for $5 :D
 

borghe

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,112
Hmm did this one also get a new transfer. I hated capollas changes to the blu ray(I hated the changes he made to godfather too, the guy shouldnt be restoring his own movies).
possibly? It's an actual 4K transfer with a really wonderful HDR post-process.. so I am guessing(?) it's new.

edit - it appears this is using the transfer from the Supreme Cinema Series blu-ray. So the film version should be identical to that (albeit in 4K). Also it seems the HDR is varying. The disc comes only with HDR10. Vudu only has HDX. iTunes comes with Dolby Vision.
 
OP
OP
jett

jett

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
45,017
I thought the new Dracula transfer looked great.

12522_7_1080p.jpg

12520_7_1080p.jpg


The slight re-framing is the only problem I have it, a couple of scenes are affected negatively by it, it almost looks like a mistake.

Not a lot (if any) added detail in the 4K disc though.

c_image.php

c_image.php
 

Dan-o

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,205
Okay, just bought a copy of the UHD. Some thoughts after having a browse through some scenes, then directly comparing the UHD to the original Blu-Ray, then afterwards the restored Blu-Ray (on an OLED and an Xbox One S, so no Dolby Vision):
Thanks for these impressions! Sounds like a solid purchase for me.

It's also, now that I've seen it at 4k resolution, one of the grainiest fucking scenes I've ever seen.
This answers another one of my concerns, too. Glad to see they kept the grain (there and in other scenes I'm sure) instead of trying to hide it with DNR.
 

Deleted member 2171

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Oct 25, 2017
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Yeah, always prefer they leave the grain where it's at over the DNR because I don't think I've seen a DNR that doesn't turn everyone into plastic action figures.
 

elektrixx

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Oct 26, 2017
1,923
This will be my second UHD after Terminator 2.

Actually, I'm probably gonna pick up Pineapple Express while I'm at it!
 

FLEABttn

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,043

I wouldn't say there's a consensus about T2 being a classic "done right" for the UHD release. If anything, the opposite. It's been de-grained (not predator waxy but still), color timing is cold, and HDR seemingly virtually non-existent (I saw data suggesting that the nits don't go past 120).
 

Laserdisk

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May 11, 2018
8,942
UK
Yeah it varies in intensity throughout the film but there's always a prevalent lather of grain. No detail lost.
It's the usual warner roll off, it's managed but really well.
A super 35 show of its day had more grain, and more in its release prints (and insane black crush)
It's good with this and Die Hard that action is being treated well on UHD, predator will be the real test tho.
 

Kevers

The Fallen
Oct 29, 2017
14,911
Syracuse, NY
Just from the shots in the OP the original blu-ray release honestly doesn't look that bad. I assumed there would be a completely overbearing piss filter like RE5 or something.
 

rashbeep

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,747
I wouldn't say there's a consensus about T2 being a classic "done right" for the UHD release. If anything, the opposite. It's been de-grained (not predator waxy but still), color timing is cold, and HDR seemingly virtually non-existent (I saw data suggesting that the nits don't go past 120).

agreed, i think it looks kinda bad actually
 

Diego Renault

Member
Nov 1, 2017
1,339
I find the green filter beneficial for the film. makes it easier to distinguish the matrix from the real world and evoke a feeling of "oh shit, they are in there..."
 

Medalion

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,203
I dunno man... I am just waiting for Reloaded to come out in 4K... buy em as a pack

Reloaded is such a guilty pleasure for me