If we assume that both consoles will release in November 2020, when does mass production of these consoles has to start?
But I'm still curious though...so you're saying that exciting shareholders and potential shareholders before the end of the fiscal year, which probably drives up stock price, is not a thing?The end of the fiscal year has nothing to do with announcing product details to the public. They've already announced the PS5 and given a release window, which is what matters for their guidance. When they make their forward-looking statements for the next fiscal year (in late April, not in March) they would indicate whether they still expected to ship PS5 in that FY, but they wouldn't need to show off the box or tell people the specs or any of what we think of as being a "reveal." That's a completely different thing. They could easily reaffirm their commitment to shipping PS5 in the then-current FY in April, with no information beyond what's already been announced, and then reveal it in May or June.
Nintendo didn't have to reveal the NX details when their fiscal year started. Microsoft didn't have to reveal XO details in their guidance for the fiscal year. That's just not how it works.
I think chances are good we'll get the announcement of the PS5 reveal event before they do their FY report in April, but the event may well happen after.
You don't convince non technical people (the majority of console gamers) with technology.Sony are going to show the games, they won't gloss over the hardware but the wow will be the games being showed off I presume, not the specs, well maybe the SSD will get a nice talk among a few other things but not wow, TF numbers, more game thing numbers. Frankly that's more exciting than the Series X reveal. Show us the games.
Also, maybe they haven't finalised the PS5 design, thermals and what not so waiting a little longer to show it off. Microsoft went for a mini tower, I somehow doubt Sony would go that route.
But I'm still curious though...so you're saying that exciting shareholders and potential shareholders before the end of the fiscal year, which probably drives up stock price, is not a thing?
If we assume that both consoles will release in November 2020, when does mass production of these consoles has to start?
I mean, you were pretty confident in answering what you thought the reason wasn't.
What do you think the answer is? This is a speculation thread, after all.
I have a question, a lot of people assume that 4k requires 4x time the processing power of 1080p but in a lot of benchmarks i saw 4k produced about half of the fps of 4k, sometimes a bit lower. I know 4k is more bandwidth intensive but if bandwidth is not a problem shouldnt 4k be less of a challenge than many assume?
Here are some benchmark examples:
This is a tautology. Of course they're not showing it off because they don't want to. Why don't they want to show off the console? That's the question.
Most people who wants to play TLoU2 won't upgrade before at least one year. Early adopters will still buy it on PS4 AND buy the PS5.Didn't Nintendo also have like a 3 or 2 month window from announcement to release? Maybe you're right here.
I agree on the massive release focus that may be a priority going forward.
Even though prior consoles like the PS2/PS3 also had big games coming out around the time of the next console iteration, gaming is way bigger now as a whole that such titles themselves are their own events with major fanfare.
PS5 being revealed won't overshadow that or screw with the sales but Sony likely just doesn't want to be juggling more then one news piece at a time. They probably want to laser focus on key things at key moments, spread across and swapping between them so they maintain the mind share of not just their upcoming console but their brand itself and the games that back it.
Ghost I don't see being a problem but TLOU and FF7 will likely have Sony wanting to have the press, etc... focusing a lot of their time on.
Parts? Some of them maybe.If we assume that both consoles will release in November 2020, when does mass production of these consoles has to start?
I worked retail for 35 years at Toys "R" Us and was involved with every launch of consoles since the Nintendo NES. As I continued my career I was more heavily involved in meetings/CES/E3 visits with companies about new games/consoles. A console official reveal has NOTHING to do with retail and has in the past ZERO impact on retailers being prepared. Retailers don't give a shit about TF performance or anything like that. What we did care about is launch date, pricing and number of games/accessories and then working out with the vendors where to merchandise the product. On top of that the other MAJOR factor was product allocation/splits. We always tried to get as much of the pie as we could when it came to major titles/new consoles.Perhaps Sony's strategy has changed with their recent replacements of some well-known higher-ups, but I can't help but go back and recall Sean Layden's 2013 comment that June was way too late to reveal a console in a launch year. He was talking about preparing retailers earlier for the holiday push.
Cause it looks exactly like the XSX?
If we assume that both consoles will release in November 2020, when does mass production of these consoles has to start?
Why? Literal toys are also a multi-billion dollar market that people build their careers around. Some people build communities and make friends around toys, or use them to destress.
I have no problem thinking of video games as toys. They're literal playthings. That should be celebrated, not treated like a badge of shame.
People who get up in arms about games not being toys are the same sort of people who insist that the word "comics" is selling the field short, that they're really graphic novels. Meanwhile, all the people who make comics call them comics.
Hahahah that was one the nose easy to und......Apple's silence is deafening. I don't think Apple has anything to show on the next iPhone or they are scrambling after the reveal of the Samsung S20.
That was easy to write.
Owwwww lol....
Umm did everyone forget that Sony announced the PS4 in February 2013 and dropped TLOU in June 2013?
It is too late. Consoles sales (PS and Xbox) has decreased a lot in 2019 and accelerate quite a bit since Q4.I do think they don't want to get in the way of TLOU2 and signal the end too clearly yet, whether they have 8-9tf or 12-13tf. All the hype has got to be the PS4 is still trucking and give this potential huge seller the best chance and focus.
Or maybe they know they have to announce more and instead of doing it now they have a theory of just having them closer, bite the bullet and keep PlayStation in the news for the last big game and new console, take over the news cycle with both?
This time you will be able to play those games on next gen.And basically every other game Sony released for PS3 in 2013 underperformed. We can go round and round like this.
February never made sense for the PS5 reveal. It wasn't delayed.
This time you will be able to play those games on next gen.
This is not the same situation.
yeah.Games are rarely 100% shading limited hence why it's not 4X in practice.
I thoroughly enjoy it! :)Every time Richard pronounces, "Wolfenstein", I can't help take his intonation as a dig towards Alex- The man who pronounces the name as it was intended.
But Sony wants to sell those games now. They don't want people to wait to buy them because they'll look prettier on PS5.
I'm not saying that Sony delayed the reveal (I still think they weren't planning on saying anything until April anyway), but with the GDC and Pax East pullouts, it's clear things have changed with Sony's plans as of late.
That was a joke.
Parts? Some of them maybe.
The assembly chains? Not before summer. Not before we saw the box. You don't store millions of boxes for a lot of times, it is too costly.
It depends on how many they want to have for launch, full stop.
Consoles that have launched in the late-November timeframe have gone into production around midsummer in the past. That's about the latest I can envision before it starts to make more sense to delay to build up a bigger launch supply, though to be honest I think these consoles will be supply-constrained no matter what. Unlike with some electronics, it's not economically viable to put big console boxes on planes, so they have to go on boats.
When I say delay, I don't necessarily mean until 2021, although that's possible. A two or three week delay into early December could make a meaningful difference on available quantities at launch.
Umm did everyone forget that Sony announced the PS4 in February 2013 and dropped TLOU in June 2013? Games have nothing to do with why Sony is choosing to be quiet now. It's more than likely Sony had planned to start talking about it, but Coronavirus threw everything in flux.
Define faster. Because I feel like we have moved from "power" to "speed". Is it raw TF numbers or something else?
Parts? Some of them maybe.
The assembly chains? Not before summer. Not before we saw the box. You don't store millions of boxes for a lot of times, it is too costly.
We'll have to agree to disagree on this. I quite honestly don't agree with anything that I have quoted here..6-7 months ahead of launch is hardly last minute.
People keep on whatabouting this, but talking about the technical aspects of the PS5 in an article in a technology magazine actually seems to me like a deliberately low-profile way to get information about your console out to enthusiasts without necessarily having a big impact on public awareness.
Sony clearly seems concerned with protecting PS4 momentum more than Microsoft is with preserving XO momentum, which is why Microsoft had a big flashy trailer for their new console during the Game Awards and Sony didn't.
Sony wants their big Q2 games to sell PS4s.
Sony released the coronavirus obviously to cover up being caught flat footed by the 12 TF bombshell. Smart move, Sony.
Good perspective, thanks.I worked retail for 35 years at Toys "R" Us and was involved with every launch of consoles since the Nintendo NES. As I continued my career I was more heavily involved in meetings/CES/E3 visits with companies about new games/consoles. A console official reveal has NOTHING to do with retail and has in the past ZERO impact on retailers being prepared. Retailers don't give a shit about TF performance or anything like that. What we did care about is launch date, pricing and number of games/accessories and then working out with the vendors where to merchandise the product. On top of that the other MAJOR factor was product allocation/splits. We always tried to get as much of the pie as we could when it came to major titles/new consoles.
On the retail side of things, it was mainly phone calls and 1 on 1 meetings with the hardware manufactures. Back in the day CES/E3 was important to retail as that was a very easy way to have meetings with everyone in one location. That is what I enjoyed the most is being able to meet face to face with vendors and get information to better inform senior leadership on what is coming and what can we do to get maximum allocations from the vendors. Console reveals for retailers was a big nothing for us...it was more about getting us information about the size of the boxes, the number of games, accessories etc. so we can plan out the space to put this stuff and how we display them in-store.
they are going to sell out every unit they produce for some time most likely either way, so not quite sure what any of you think they are losing out on by waiting a while.
It just sounds funny to me the theory that Sony is not promoting the PS5 because they want to sell more current-gen games, which in turn promotes the selling of more PS4's. I know they want to sell games this year, but I think PS5 sales have priority this year over PS4 sales.Of course games sell consoles.
I don't think saying that Sony wants to sell copies of The Last of Us 2, and also hopes that TLOU2 will move PS4 consoles, is really going out on a limb, or evidence of anyone "morphing" their story or whatever.
But resetera, I guess. I never knew "Sony wants to sell their hardware and software products that are currently on the market" would be such a controversial take.
You just can't drop it lolOf course games sell consoles.
I don't think saying that Sony wants to sell copies of The Last of Us 2, and also hopes that TLOU2 will move PS4 consoles, is really going out on a limb, or evidence of anyone "morphing" their story or whatever.
But resetera, I guess. I never knew "Sony wants to sell their hardware and software products that are on the market in the first ten months of the year" would be such a controversial take.
Mikio Hirakawa -- Bank of America Merrill Lynch -- Analyst
The PS5 is to be launched in the selling season toward the end of the year. So what would be the guidance -- the future guidance for March '21? You have not disclosed the price for PS5. So what would happen to the guidance that you will be releasing in April for the next fiscal year*?*
Hiroki Totoki -- Senior Executive Vice President, Chief Financial Officer
It's very difficult to really discuss this timing-wise, but as of today, we will provide the guidance at a time period, which is comparable to the past. So we will not change the time schedule."
Thanks for this. So what do you make of this Shawn Layden quote then?I worked retail for 35 years at Toys "R" Us and was involved with every launch of consoles since the Nintendo NES. As I continued my career I was more heavily involved in meetings/CES/E3 visits with companies about new games/consoles. A console official reveal has NOTHING to do with retail and has in the past ZERO impact on retailers being prepared. Retailers don't give a shit about TF performance or anything like that. What we did care about is launch date, pricing and number of games/accessories and then working out with the vendors where to merchandise the product. On top of that the other MAJOR factor was product allocation/splits. We always tried to get as much of the pie as we could when it came to major titles/new consoles.
On the retail side of things, it was mainly phone calls and 1 on 1 meetings with the hardware manufactures. Back in the day CES/E3 was important to retail as that was a very easy way to have meetings with everyone in one location. That is what I enjoyed the most is being able to meet face to face with vendors and get information to better inform senior leadership on what is coming and what can we do to get maximum allocations from the vendors. Console reveals for retailers was a big nothing for us...it was more about getting us information about the size of the boxes, the number of games, accessories etc. so we can plan out the space to put this stuff and how we display them in-store.
"Now we have an event in February called Destination PlayStation, where we bring all retailers and third-party partners to come hear the story for the year," he said. "They're making purchasing discussions in February. June, now, is just too late to have a Christmas holiday discussion with retailers.
IIRC Lisa Su already stated console chip production starts in Q2 and will go full-on in Q3. This was before corona though.Mass production on the PS4 started in June, when they planned a staggered console release. They've already hinted at a universal release for the PS5. If their plans haven't changed on that, I'd think they'd have to begin production much earlier than summertime.
That event didn't take place this year unfortunately. At least, not run by SonyThanks for this. So what do you make of this 2013 Shawn Layden quote then?
We have had pages for the last couple of days saying that they don't want to mess with the marketing of their games, then you just turned it into "games selling consoles".
It just sounds funny to me the theory that Sony is not promoting the PS5 because they want to sell more current-gen games, which in turn promotes the selling of more PS4's.
I'd say Forza horizon 4So I am playing game pass Hellblade. Not so impressed with the enhanced visuals setting lol, but if next gen comes out anything like Project Mara or what we saw in Senua's new trailer that is going to be so insane. I take it I should be playing this game with headphones due to stereo audio. Still sounds pretty good on my 7.1 system with Neural X. To be fair I am seeing most console graphics as old and dated at this point. Next gen can't come soon enough. Is Gears supposed to be 1X's best "looker"?
Lol no worries..Making a final point and then announcing "we'll leave it at that" and leaving no room for any sort of rebuttal is just bad form.
How are those mutually exclusive? They want to sell games to existing console owners. They also want to sell consoles on the strength of those games. Why are you taking issue with this, or presenting it as some sort of spin or dodge? They're practically non-statements.
I swear I feel like I'm having a stroke here sometimes. Those are both not only perfectly compatible statements, they're both obviously true. Selling consoles to play games and then selling more games to owners of those consoles is basically the entire console business.
We can debate the impact of revealing the PS5 early on these game sales, sure. But I can't for the life of me understand why you're pulling out "Oh, so now you say Sony wants their big releases to sell systems?" as if it's some sort of gotcha or dunk.
Both can be true. I'm basically just saying "Sony wants to sell their current products." Which, like, yeah.
Do you think that Sony isn't going to have a special PS4 bundle for TLOU2? Okay, that's Sony using TLOU2 to move systems. For a very obvious example.