Status
Not open for further replies.
Jul 2, 2021
16,366
Yeah, especially when they absolutely ditched FromSoftware during the release of Demon's Souls outside of Japan and let Atlus and Bandai save them. Shuhei calling the game bad close to release. Sony crawling back to get Bloodborne when they saw that Souls games are taking off. Such a great relationship 😂 But hey, they probably pay a lot now so the financial relationship is pretty good I guess.
I mean Shu played an early version of Demon's Souls with huge framerate issues and a broken online mode. And after playing two hours and still being at the beginning of the game he gave up. It's not really a shocking story that Shu thought it sucks.
Sony still paid From Software to create a Sony game. They had a great relationship before and after Demon's Souls.
They are two companies with a long history together and not some teenagers with some kind of a love-hate relationship where one person "crawls back" to the other one after getting "ditched".
 

Tiago Rodrigues

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Nov 15, 2018
5,244
Yeah, especially when they absolutely ditched FromSoftware during the release of Demon's Souls outside of Japan and let Atlus and Bandai save them. Shuhei calling the game bad close to release. Sony crawling back to get Bloodborne when they saw that Souls games are taking off. Such a great relationship 😂 But hey, they probably pay a lot now so the financial relationship is pretty good I guess.

Sony did finance Demon's Souls with them and started a new genre with From Software. The other Souls games probably wouldn't exist without that first experience. Bloodborne is also many people's favourite game from that studio.
They have been doing one game per generation with them with a new coming so yes the relationship is great I'm sure.
 

modiz

Member
Oct 8, 2018
17,980
Yeah, especially when they absolutely ditched FromSoftware during the release of Demon's Souls outside of Japan and let Atlus and Bandai save them. Shuhei calling the game bad close to release. Sony crawling back to get Bloodborne when they saw that Souls games are taking off. Such a great relationship 😂 But hey, they probably pay a lot now so the financial relationship is pretty good I guess.
And this is how nonsense narratives are made.
You do know about shu calling Demon's Souls bad that it was from an early alpha build and that the game became one of his favorite games by launch right? Shu even announced the remake during the Future of Gaming due to his well known story on that game. Idk about that "crawling back to get Bloodborne" part either. But I guess you somehow made it to make sense in your head, despite not being the case.
 
Jul 2, 2021
16,366
Sony did finance Demon's Souls with them and started a new genre with From Software. The other Souls games probably wouldn't exist without that first experience. Bloodborne is also many people's favourite game from that studio.
They have been doing one game per generation with them with a new coming so yes the relationship is great I'm sure.
Two games on the PS4.
 

Dust

C H A O S
Member
Oct 25, 2017
32,936
Remember when GopherD and DemoNite used to tease Project Beast(Bloodborne) before announcement? Those were the days.
 

Kunjiru

Member
Apr 14, 2020
1,483

https://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2012/02/10/shuhei-yoshida-interview.aspx?PostPageIndex=1

"For my personal experience with Demon's Souls, when it was close to final I spent close to two hours playing it and after two hours I was still standing at the beginning at the game. I said, "This is crap. This is an unbelievably bad game." So I put it aside."

But sure, that's my anti-shill narrative that's showing here.

Also he loved the game so much that he and the rest of execs pulled all the marketing and publishing from NA and Europe, just to keep his favourite to himself I guess.

Sure, later he realized that they dropped the ball with the game and he probably even really likes the game now, but it doesn't change the things that happened. His annoucement of a remake was somewhat of a redemption, but still, don't try to give me that great relationships and "near and dear my heart" bullshit like nothing happened lmao.
 
Jan 20, 2019
10,681
https://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2012/02/10/shuhei-yoshida-interview.aspx?PostPageIndex=1

"For my personal experience with Demon's Souls, when it was close to final I spent close to two hours playing it and after two hours I was still standing at the beginning at the game. I said, "This is crap. This is an unbelievably bad game." So I put it aside."

But sure, that's my anti-shill narrative that's showing here.

Also he loved the game so much that he and the rest of execs pulled all the marketing and publishing from NA and Europe, just to keep his favourite to himself I guess.

Sure, later he realized that they dropped the ball with the game and he probably even really likes the game now, but it doesn't change the things that happened. His annoucement of a remake was somewhat of a redemption, but still, don't try to give me that great relationships and "near and dear my heart" bullshit like nothing happened lmao.

One thing doenst invalidate the other and he already admite his mistake, that doesnt change that it is a game dear to him, nobody here knows what the relashionship between him and from are.
 
Oct 25, 2017
13,246
https://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2012/02/10/shuhei-yoshida-interview.aspx?PostPageIndex=1

"For my personal experience with Demon's Souls, when it was close to final I spent close to two hours playing it and after two hours I was still standing at the beginning at the game. I said, "This is crap. This is an unbelievably bad game." So I put it aside."

But sure, that's my anti-shill narrative that's showing here.

Also he loved the game so much that he and the rest of execs pulled all the marketing and publishing from NA and Europe, just to keep his favourite to himself I guess.

Sure, later he realized that they dropped the ball with the game and he probably even really likes the game now, but it doesn't change the things that happened. His annoucement of a remake was somewhat of a redemption, but still, don't try to give me that great relationships and "near and dear my heart" bullshit like nothing happened lmao.

Shu: "We definitely dropped the ball from a publishing standpoint, including studio management side. We were not able to see the value of the product we were making."

He completely admits its Sony's fault but it's definitely not Sony's fault.
 

Angie

Best Avatar Thread Ever!
Member
Nov 20, 2017
40,270
Kingdom of Corona
giphy.gif


Akira is out tomorow.
 

Maxime

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,010
It is the newly released OT, but it is the DC of the last one.
It will have the same topics and arguments of the last OT, but also feature content that wasn't part of the last OT.

And do we have to pay for it? Because I already own the previous OT and the added features seem lackluster…
 

Akelisrain

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,420
Bel Air MD
I so behind on my gaming, still have not finished Returnal, need to cop me Tsushima, and Stranding. Have not played Miles yet, so behind and many games are coming soon. :'(
 

DeathyG

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,910
NW Indiana
I thought I'd be done with AC Valhalla before the Iki Island expansion hits, but nope. Not even close. Ridiculously bloated game and definitely not as good as Odyssey. Probably gonna drop it.
 

Bopp

Member
Aug 6, 2021
1,484
I so behind on my gaming, still have not finished Returnal, need to cop me Tsushima, and Stranding. Have not played Miles yet, so behind and many games are coming soon. :'(

I feel ya.
Most recent game I bought and finished was Returnal. After that...no time (and not a lot of disposable income :( ).
Been playing Slay The Spire and Splitgate occasionally, though, so there's that.
 

Brot

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,149
the edge
It really is ridiculous to me. Making video games isn't like pressing a button and suddenly shit works. There are so many moving parts, from so many different departments, and it's difficult enough managing those moving parts when you're all in the same building! Having to do it remotely is another beast entirely!

And yeah, the effect Covid has had on game development can't be stressed enough. Like I've mentioned before, it's amazing to me that we got brand new console hardware from Sony and Microsoft last holiday, let alone hundreds of new games releasing across multiple platforms.

And I don't think the various studios get nearly enough credit and appreciation for pulling that all off during a global pandemic in which millions of people have lost their lives.

Many of us have had to put in extra extra effort and work to make sure these games get out when they get out, and the physical, mental, and emotional cost of that isn't anything to scoff at or downplay.
Thank you for your posts. It really sucks that it needs to be repeated ad nauseum but way too many people still have this "how hard can it be" attitude because they were never curious enough to look a little behind the curtain to see how it all works and gets made. Otherwise it would be pretty clear how something like WFH can obliterate your entire workflow and it's not necessarily something that can be fixed over months, if at all. Not to mention things like the huge setbacks for the mocap studios and how these delays might conflict with the actor's schedules. There's just so much stuff to think about.

I hope we'll get to see a documentary from one of the bigger productions that covers the entire pandemic. Perhaps even a new doc on God of War 2, that would be cool.
 

FFNB

Associate Game Designer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
6,215
Los Angeles, CA
Honestly, I left the last thread too soon and wouldn't have even seen it if platocplx hadn't quoted it. We both have him to thank.



So game dev can be summarised as:

"Will this break someth-"
"Yes."
"But it's onl-"
"Yes."
"But what if w-"
"Yes."

One thing I did want to know - in your opinion, will the ability to work solely on SSDs do much to make game development easier? I was talking with another developer on Twitter a while back who said the trying to get the game art to fit through the narrow pipe of HDD bandwidth is a very labour-intensive, trial-and-error process that takes up a solid 50% off the art team's time and just makes everything harder. Has that been the case in your experience?

Lol, yeah, I saw that my post was, like, the last post in that thread, and was tempted to repost it here, but was too lazy to, so thank you, platocplx for bringing it over to the new thread for me 😂😂

As for your question, that's a bit out of my wheelhouse, to be honest! I'm not an engineer or technical systems designer, so I can't say for sure. While I'm fairly positive that the inclusion of SSDs as standard on these new consoles has made things easier in some way, I can't say for sure, because each studio and project is different, and the needs of that studio/project can vary significantly from project to project and studio to studio.

I imagine that the SSD has freed up a lot of resources compared to working with the limitations of an HDD, but I don't have any experience working with SSDs at the moment, and my specific job doesn't actually require me to work with memory allocation and bandwidth directly anyway lol
 

platocplx

2020 Member Elect
Member
Oct 30, 2017
36,085
Honestly, I left the last thread too soon and wouldn't have even seen it if @platocplx hadn't quoted it. We both have him to thank.

Lol, yeah, I saw that my post was, like, the last post in that thread, and was tempted to repost it here, but was too lazy to, so thank you, platocplx for bringing it over to the new thread for me 😂😂

As for your question, that's a bit out of my wheelhouse, to be honest! I'm not an engineer or technical systems designer, so I can't say for sure. While I'm fairly positive that the inclusion of SSDs as standard on these new consoles has made things easier in some way, I can't say for sure, because each studio and project is different, and the needs of that studio/project can vary significantly from project to project and studio to studio.

I imagine that the SSD has freed up a lot of resources compared to working with the limitations of an HDD, but I don't have any experience working with SSDs at the moment, and my specific job doesn't actually require me to work with memory allocation and bandwidth directly anyway lol
Too good a convo not to continue. Esp when we have some others who are dealing with large amounts of data at home and the issues.
Hell for a while my internet kept freaking going out come to find out my cable splitter was bad and when I replaced it it started working again just one of the fun issues lol.
 

BreakAtmo

Member
Nov 12, 2017
12,984
Australia
Lol, yeah, I saw that my post was, like, the last post in that thread, and was tempted to repost it here, but was too lazy to, so thank you, platocplx for bringing it over to the new thread for me 😂😂

You went down with the ship. Be proud.

As for your question, that's a bit out of my wheelhouse, to be honest! I'm not an engineer or technical systems designer, so I can't say for sure. While I'm fairly positive that the inclusion of SSDs as standard on these new consoles has made things easier in some way, I can't say for sure, because each studio and project is different, and the needs of that studio/project can vary significantly from project to project and studio to studio.

I imagine that the SSD has freed up a lot of resources compared to working with the limitations of an HDD, but I don't have any experience working with SSDs at the moment, and my specific job doesn't actually require me to work with memory allocation and bandwidth directly anyway lol

Ah, I see. Thank you for answering as best you could anyway.
 

IIFloodyII

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,314
Aye, with that I can at least agree, because years have passed and a lot could've changed. But it irritates me when someone tries to say otherwise and also dismisses signs of things not being that great in the past.
Demon's Souls entire development was not great, it's a fantastic story in hindsight, but a miracle it wasn't cancelled (like any other time in the PS3 life cycle it'd have for sure been cancelled miracle).I really doubt anyone on the team had hurt feeling over the high ups at Sony reactions, given it was already considered a failure in-house, it wasn't really what Sony even asked for and was coming in very hot due to the development being aimless before Miyazaki took the project over.
 

platocplx

2020 Member Elect
Member
Oct 30, 2017
36,085
Demon's Souls entire development was not great, it's a fantastic story in hindsight, but a miracle it wasn't cancelled (like any other time in the PS3 life cycle it'd have for sure been cancelled miracle).I really doubt anyone on the team had hurt feeling over the high ups at Sony reactions, given it was already considered a failure in-house, it wasn't really what Sony even asked for and was coming in very hot due to the development being aimless before Miyazaki took the project over.
Right things at the time probally we're very accurate and everything looks different in hindsight not much to draw from it at all other than of you truly believe in your creation do all that you can to see it through.
 
Oct 25, 2017
13,246
The very clear and apparent thing with Demon Souls is that From went on to make the same game with a different name because the IP was tied to Sony. And they did that without Sony's involvement.

We can't read into the relationship precisely of course, but one or both parties clearly weren't interested in continuing the style of games post-Demon's.
 

Androidsleeps

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,631
I NEED the new Sly game rumor to be true but the fact that none of the games got remastered or ported to PS4 makes me doubt it.
 

TheRealTalker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,765
Ah yes XDev Asia/Japan whose sole purpose is to partner with studio's to produce AAA first party titles won't partner with a studio to produce a AAA title.

Who knows if the From rumours are true or not but that new XDev take is pretty hilarious. It doesn't matter if producers of previous collabs left. That is like saying a studio or company could never make a new game or sequel because some people left said company.
 

stryke

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,347
I'm disappointed there is isn't a TLOU2 documentary yet. I liked the insight we got from docs like TLOU, GOW and Horizon.
Maybe something when Factions comes.
 

SolidSnakex

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,681
Ah yes XDev Asia/Japan whose sole purpose is to partner with studio's to produce AAA first party titles won't partner with a studio to produce a AAA title.

Who knows if the From rumours are true or not but that new XDev take is pretty hilarious. It doesn't matter if producers of previous collabs left. That is like saying a studio or company could never make a new game or sequel because some people left said company.

I think a lot of it is just people hoping it won't happen since then it'd be exclusive.
 

cooldawn

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,459
Speaking from experience, I can't agree more with this.

The pandemic has made our jobs soooooo much harder, and there is only so much you can adapt to. We aren't machines. We're human beings. We have lives and responsibilities outside of making video games, and the pandemic has affected a lot of us in many unforeseen and unexpected ways, both personally and professionally.

I've lost family to this pandemic. I know coworkers who have lost family and friends to this pandemic as well. That stress, on top of the practicalities of trying to make video games from home has had an effect on game development that you guys don't get to see.

And don't even get me started on the technical issues we often face. From VPN and network connection issues that make downloading and uploading large files a nightmare, to trying to accommodate different time zones because some of us are in either another state, and even another country, etc, etc.

Some of you say, "yeah, we know game development is hard, BUT…"

That just speaks to me that no, I'm sorry, you don't know how hard game development is. It's hard during the most ideal circumstances. Navigating that difficulty during a global pandemic has exacerbated it tenfold.

As a professional game designer, I feel other studio's pain in trying to do the best they can to produce fun games for us to play during a crisis.

As a gamer, I'm just grateful that we've even gotten the games we've gotten is year at all. I can't give enough kudos and congrats to the various studios in the industry that managed to ship their games this year so far.

Am I disappointed that some of my most anticipated titles of the year have been pushed back or delayed until next year? Yeah, a tiny little bit, but I can't say I'm upset or angry about it, because, well, I still have a shit ton of games and other things to occupy my time while I wait. I don't need an influx of new announcements to momentarily give me an endorphin and dopamine hit, or to keep my hype going.

Maybe I'm biased, but I just get irked when I see people brushing off the impact that this pandemic has had on the gaming industry. Like, I get it, people want to get hyped about shiny new shit 24/7, but we're only human, and we're all doing the best we can to get these games out the door in the best state they can be in for players to enjoy. It's just been significantly harder than normal, and processes that used to be taken for granted have had to be reevaluated and adapted to fit this new "normal." Tasks that would take, say, moments in the office, can take hours or more when performing them WFH, for example.
Great post.

The pandemic has hit the practicalities of development really hard. The simplest of tasks become much harder with the smallest of issues.

Overall Sony have done a great job throughout the pandemic with PS5's launch and continuing to support normal PS4 releases. Some great content during the last year and a half. In fact their performance has been really stand-out so far, all things considered.
 

~Millet~

Member
Jan 21, 2019
1,078
Has anyone else mentioned the FromSoft rumor apart from Nick and the other guy? Normally you get other insiders going yeah we totally heard it too on something like this.
Yes, but the source was anonymous. The rumor appeared on reddit and even mentioned the code name of the project: Velvet Veil. Also one person hinted it in the past thread.
 

Host Samurai

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,259
I just hope the new Sly game has high quality cel shaded graphics that make it look like a 2D cartoon. Only two games were very close to that look. Ni No Kuni and Windwaker.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.