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My company started implementing cameras for people working from home

Lakeside

Lakeside

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,277
Sorry, my family enjoys privacy. There aren't many things that would get me to quit on the spot but I'd have to do so. I'd talk to a lawyer first to see if it's cool, and also entertain making them eliminate me.

Hell, I wouldn't be ok working my current job in the office with a camera staring at my face all day. Fuck that too.
 
Joni

Joni

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,508
Put a piece of furniture before the camera, or a piece of paper or whatever.
 
Hero_of_the_Day

Hero_of_the_Day

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
17,482
Qikz said:
Middle management should be forced to work a week as a member of normal staff and not management to help with this. Management are so detached from what's happening it's ridiculous.
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I had forgotten until now that back when I worked at McDonald's in highschool, this was totally a thing. All the managers, including the store manager, had to spend a week every year working the grill area.

Wonder if they still do that.
 
grumpybat

grumpybat

Member
Apr 12, 2021
556
USA
Absolutely shocked if this is legal. Wouldn't accept a job like that for any price (okay, maybe millions, but still).
 

Deleted member 4614

Oct 25, 2017
6,345
CatAssTrophy said:
Same. Being able to see into the private residence of an employee, one that you as a hypothetical employer doesn't pay the rent of, seems easily dismissible as a privacy violation. Full stop. Even with tech that can auto-blur backgrounds etc.
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What law are they violating?
 
jroc74

jroc74

Member
Oct 27, 2017
29,365
This sounds wild.

famicorpse said:
Time to move on OP. This is gross and a massive invasion of policy.
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This too. I used to live in a house with 6 other ppl, big house. I couldnt imagine having the camera on all the time.

My job doesnt even require cameras for meetings. If its needed they let us know before hand in an email.
 
jroc74

jroc74

Member
Oct 27, 2017
29,365
How my job handles production:

We have quotas, which come with perks. One of those perks is less check ins about your work. One of the perks was a flex schedule but thats now for everyone no matter what your performance is.

...that could be because everyone was meeting their quotas...dont really know.

Not meeting quotas? More frequent check ins, with questions about your work. It basically turns into a 'need help after school?' type of situation.

I dont know what happens if you constantly dont meet your quota.

Rosebud said:
That's worse than working on the office.
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Exactly, because sometimes I never saw my managers all day. At damn near every job I had over the years.

Again, this is wild.
 
tokkun

tokkun

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,454
en.wikipedia.org

Theory X and Theory Y - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

Theory X is based on assumptions regarding the typical worker. This management style assumes that the typical worker has little ambition, avoids responsibility, and is individual-goal oriented. In general, Theory X style managers believe their employees are less intelligent, lazier, and work solely for a sustainable income. Management believes employees' work is based on their own self-interest. Managers who believe employees operate in this manner are more likely to use rewards or punishments as motivation. Due to these assumptions, Theory X concludes the typical workforce operates more efficiently under a hands-on approach to management. Theory X managers believe all actions should be traceable to the individual responsible. This allows the individual to receive either a direct reward or a reprimand, depending on the outcome's positive or negative nature. This managerial style is more effective when used in a workforce that is not essentially motivated to perform.
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ErrorJustin

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,476
I used to manage a team of ~10 people with some fully remote and some in office. Now they're all fully remote for the time being, obviously.

The thing that I can't fathom is.... how can you not know what your team is up to, as a boss?!?

I don't micro-manage them but like... tasks are assigned, tasks get completed. New tasks get assigned. People have to be reachable in a reasonable period of time on Slack during business hours.

There are a few team members I would characterize as under-performing. Their output is lower. They take longer to do things. Are they only working 4-5 hours a day and not 8? Maybe... I don't know for sure. But like... I would never want a camera in their home work space to find out. They'll either just stall their career out or if their performance dips enough they'll be put onto a formal performance improvement plan....

Point is, supervisors should know what their team is working on, even when they're working remote, and it weirds me out how someone could not.
 
bananab

bananab

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,889
You could send this into askamanager, you'll undoubtedly get pretty much the exact response you're getting here, possibly with advice on how to handle it (which will almost certainly include finding new work).
 

Deleted member 4461

User Requested Account Deletion
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,010
Quit. Now is the time

HeySeuss said:
WFH is here to stay and there are going to be new ways to ensure people are doing their jobs instead of fucking off. It's the reality of having coworkers that ruin it for everyone. If it's a camera or specific software to track productivity, places are going to start implementing some sort of measures to effectively supervise people.
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The easiest way to track this is by the results of the work.
 
jroc74

jroc74

Member
Oct 27, 2017
29,365
ErrorJustin said:
I used to manage a team of ~10 people with some fully remote and some in office. Now they're all fully remote for the time being, obviously.

The thing that I can't fathom is.... how can you not know what your team is up to, as a boss?!?

I don't micro-manage them but like... tasks are assigned, tasks get completed. New tasks get assigned. People have to be reachable in a reasonable period of time on Slack during business hours.

There are a few team members I would characterize as under-performing. Their output is lower. They take longer to do things. Are they only working 4-5 hours a day and not 8? Maybe... I don't know for sure. But like... I would never want a camera in their home work space to find out. They'll either just stall their career out or if their performance dips enough they'll be put onto a formal performance improvement plan....

Point is, supervisors should know what their team is working on, even when they're working remote, and it weirds me out how someone could not.
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Exactly. This sounds like my current and previous job.

My current and previous job, the only time I hear from managers or supervisors is if:

I have a question.
They wanna let the team know about work changes, feedback from the client.
Monthly teem meetings.
If they have feedback about my work.

Some weeks, sometimes several weeks..... I dont talk to anyone. But...they know what I was assigned and at the end of the week we turn in a work report. I used to have to do this daily at my last job....so glad I dont work there anymore, this is much better, lol.
 
StereoVSN

StereoVSN

Member
Nov 1, 2017
13,620
Eastern US
It's a sign that OP needs to look for another job. Unfortunately this shit is spreading, estimate is 70% of companies are implementing this sort of shit by 2023 or so.
 
jroc74

jroc74

Member
Oct 27, 2017
29,365
HeySeuss said:
WFH is here to stay and there are going to be new ways to ensure people are doing their jobs instead of fucking off. It's the reality of having coworkers that ruin it for everyone. If it's a camera or specific software to track productivity, places are going to start implementing some sort of measures to effectively supervise people.
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This reminds me....they can kinda track it now: we are supposed to start Teams after we log on. This was required at my last job too but with Skype. For one if they send me an IM I should know without them having to email or call me.

But....if I hit my quota by 11 am, 12pm, which I have lately, I just have to hit the mouse every so often so my status isnt Away. There are ways around this in Settings but I dont even have to do that with this job. They may have tracked this at my last job, not sure...thats when I tweaked some things in Settings.

Even with that the only time I heard anything from managers is when I didnt start Teams or Skype at all.
 
NCR Ranger

NCR Ranger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,924
Sounds like something my current supervisor would do. I am convinced she thought I just sat on my ass during WFH because she was always bugging me for something. Now that we are back in the office we barely talk.

As others have said if that comes your way it is time to find a new job. Anyone that thinks being able to drop in on employees at random to see what they are doing is a good idea sends up a gaint red flag. Clearly they don't understand the work well enough to track the important stuff and that always leads to shiity management decisions that makes the jobs shit for everyone.
 
loco

loco

Member
Jan 6, 2021
5,586
If you have a medical note from your doctor you should be able to turn it off. My friend is an Amazon driver and was able to get all of that camera and GPS tracking removed from his delivery van due to his clinical anxiety diagnosis.
 
PinkSpider

PinkSpider

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,019
ErrorJustin said:
I used to manage a team of ~10 people with some fully remote and some in office. Now they're all fully remote for the time being, obviously.

The thing that I can't fathom is.... how can you not know what your team is up to, as a boss?!?

I don't micro-manage them but like... tasks are assigned, tasks get completed. New tasks get assigned. People have to be reachable in a reasonable period of time on Slack during business hours.

There are a few team members I would characterize as under-performing. Their output is lower. They take longer to do things. Are they only working 4-5 hours a day and not 8? Maybe... I don't know for sure. But like... I would never want a camera in their home work space to find out. They'll either just stall their career out or if their performance dips enough they'll be put onto a formal performance improvement plan....

Point is, supervisors should know what their team is working on, even when they're working remote, and it weirds me out how someone could not.
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Isn't this what agile working is for, you have maybe 2-3 weekly calls with a project board and deadlines. With deadlines being suggested by the worker and the manager free to challenge on it and any extensions?

If in a non deadline based world you have a X number of things to complete.
 
MIMIC

MIMIC

Member
Dec 18, 2017
8,387
Lol that sounds terrible. At my job, productivity was at a 5-year high while working from home (at least in my section).

They can't determine who the weak links are?
 
lorddarkflare

lorddarkflare

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,329
This is the lazy/traditional way to solve productivity issues. This sort of approach happens with in-office jobs too.

The correct approach takes a lot more effort in terms of organization structure and proper manager training/interest.

With a sane organization, if you set measurable milestones you should know instantly when people are slacking off.
 
hikarutilmitt

hikarutilmitt

"This guy are sick"
Member
Dec 16, 2017
11,531
Productivity should be measured by you doing your job. If you're not doing the job asked of you... you get written up, then fired if need be. There's no need to do this.

Legality is, sadly, more than a little grey because being allowed to work remotely is, itself, a now normal and expected term of employment, but you can see how requiring vaccination is working out, too.

Yes, I made that comparison for reasons. Don't @ me, feel free to @ me, whatever.
 

Deleted member 9305

Oct 26, 2017
4,064
Another thing, why would you trust them, if they don't trust you? Who knows, who is watching or what gets recorded.

Maybe you should ask them for a cam feed from your boss or someone from HR.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,390
Vermillion said:
Quit. Now is the time



The easiest way to track this is by the results of the work.
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Right. If you have some metrics, and someone is falling behind, discuss with the worker and find out what's going on and if the productivity as you measure it can be improved. You know, actually managing. Or just assume they're all lazy and watch them all the time. You were in the restroom for 15 minutes! That's unacceptable!
 
Lucreto

Lucreto

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,686
Get a new job.

Or ask if it works both ways. The manager watches you and you watch the manager. It won't last long if the manager is being stared at by 20 people.

My job is eager to get people back to the office. Calling it the normalisation of work. People have asked what are the working from home plans. Management are silent but I pay invoices and ordering a large amount of PC units instead of laptops is not a good indicator. We probably have to hand in our current laptops.

My job some can work from home but other have been in the office everyday for the last nearly two years. Management say they like to treat everyone equally so its not fair for some to have the option to WFH and others dont so the only option is to eliminate WFH
 

Deleted member 4461

User Requested Account Deletion
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,010
RedMercury said:
Unfortunately this won't be enough because you can go in a positive direction but then the people at the top will wonder "but did we go as high as we could have"
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Set different goals, have lower performers learn from higher performers, encourage rest, make sure people actually enjoy the work they're doing, check-in regularly...

Tons of things that don't require cameras. Incidentally you don't see the absolute productivity machines that are major tech companies implementing anything like this.
 

Deleted member 4614

Oct 25, 2017
6,345
RedMercury said:
That's the job of lawyers to argue
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Lawyers don't get to make up laws though. I am unaware of any laws that are being broken here.

Still horrible to do, but I think the people claiming it's illegal because it violates their sense of privacy are wrong.
 
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