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Feb 14, 2018
3,083
EDIT 2: video from Spanish newspaper El Pais



Source

Thousands of people took to the streets at several locations in Cuba on Sunday to call for the end of the decades-old dictatorship and to demand food and vaccines. This was an unprecedented display of civil unrest as the island struggles under the worst economic crisis since the fall of the Soviet Union.

From San Antonio de Los Baños, a town about 40 kilometer south of Havana, to Palma Soriano, near the southern city of Santiago de Cuba, videos live-streamed on Facebook showed thousands of people walking and riding bikes and motorcycles along streets, gathering around squares and clapping while chanting "Freedom," "Down with Communism," and "Homeland and Life," which has become a battle cry among activists as it turns the revolutionary slogan "Homeland or Death" on its head.

COVID was kept pretty well under control for the past year, but cases have started to spike in the past month and it's getting worse. Half the cases in the country are in Matanzas, a province close to Havana. A month or two ago when the pandemic was getting bad there, the government was firing doctors whose COVID patients died, accusing them of medical malpractice. Now they are running out of doctors in Matanzas because the doctors themselves are dying of COVID -- even some who received the Abdala vaccine that is supposedly very effective. It may be, but there are understandably doubts about the honesty of the Cuban government on this matter.

Cuba is still restricting flights from the U.S. because of the pandemic, even though almost 50% of the U.S. population is fully vaccinated (70% of adults in Miami-Dade county are fully vaccinated). By contrast, flights from Russia to Cuba are commonplace even though less than 13% of the Russian population is vaccinated. This is important because Americans are allowed to bring medical supplies to Cuba. Among other things, the protestors are saying this policy of restricting flights from the U.S. is doing more harm than good because it would be easier for Cubans to receive medical supplies if more Americans were allowed to come. The country has a shortage of masks (doctors are using simple fabric masks, not N95s or medical masks), soap, and hand sanitizer.

Frustrations over COVID are exacerbated by the shortage of food and the way the regime represses speech critical of the government. As mentioned in the first article, the slogan of the regime is "Patria o Muerte" (literally 'homeland or death'). A collaborative protest song called "Patria y Vida" was released earlier this year by several notable Cuban artists. The government produced a counter-protest song in response, and has targeted artists and protestors using the slogan Patria y Vida. In the last few months, they vandalized an activist's house, stealing and destroying some of his art, then arrested him when he protested with a hunger strike. They took him to a hospital where a doctor alleged that he was badly mistreated. He has since been released and is joining the protests today. All this to say there is a lot going on in Cuba and this is a complex, developing situation.

EDIT: Update because the source news article was updated with new info.

Video streamed on Facebook by Antonio Miguel Cobas Jalowayski around 1 p.m. in Palma Soriano showed hundreds of protesters calling for freedom and shouting, "Down with the dictatorship" and "Down with Díaz-Canel," a reference to Cuban leader Miguel Diaz-Canel. The protesters also demanded medicine, COVID vaccines and "the end of hunger." A crowd is seen pushing a police car and shouting "the dictators just arrived," in reference to the police. Later, one protester is heard saying, "This is a peaceful demonstration."

The President encourages violence against protestors:
In an impromptu televised address later in the afternoon, Díaz-Canel blamed the protests on U.S. efforts to tighten the embargo, with the alleged intention to "provoke a social uprising" that would justify a military intervention.

Visibly upset and raising his voice, the Cuban leader warned that protesters would face a strong response and called "all revolutionaries" to confront them on the streets "with firmness and courage."

"We are not going to hand over the sovereignty or the independence of the people," he said. "There are many revolutionaries in this country who are willing to give our lives, we are willing to do anything, and we will be in the streets fighting."

Foreign minister blames paid protestors:
On Twitter, Cuban foreign minister Bruno Rodríguez suggested the protests were orchestrated by the US.

"President @DiazCanelB is in San Antonio de los Baños with the revolutionary people that are mobilized against the imperialist campaign and its salaried agents," he wrote. "We appreciate the international solidarity and support of Cubans living abroad #EliminatetheBlockade."

Background info:
Cuba is in the throes of its worst economic contraction in over three decades, as chronic inefficiencies and paralyzing bureaucracy have gradually eroded the country's production capacity, including the essential food and agriculture sectors. Trump-era sanctions have reduced access to vital economic lifelines like remittances, and foreign investment has plunged. Painful currency reforms this year have sent inflation soaring, and long lines for food have again become commonplace.

Now Cuba is struggling to control transmission of the coronavirus and has been setting record highs almost daily in the past few weeks. Cuba decided to make its own COVID-19 vaccine and didn't seek to buy shots from other countries. But plans to immunize the population with a homegrown vaccine has been plagued by delays.

... Although Cuban officials said this week the country is open for donations, historically, the government has refused or seized the humanitarian aid coming from Cuban exiles.

Police response -- people being beaten and arrested, internet being shut down:
A Facebook video posted by user AntenaCubana shows people in Palma Soriano throwing stones at the police while a person is heard saying the police had been beating the demonstrators. Another video showed several trucks carrying special-forces police officers reportedly arriving in San Antonio de los Baños, where Cuban president Díaz-Canel showed up to speak to residents, a gesture that mimics Fidel Castro's response to the uprising in Havana known as the Maleconazo in 1994.
...

But as news of the protests around the country spread on social media -- despite reports of the government shutting down internet access -- Cubans in the capital also took to the Malecon to demand the end of the regime.

Videos posted around 3 p.m. on Facebook showed a crowd chanting "Patria y vida." Cuban journalist Abraham Jiménez Enoa reported that the police were detaining protesters gathered around 23 and L streets, at the heart of the city of Havana.

There is also video at the Miami Herald. It seems to be hosted by the site so I don't know if I can embed it. I've seen tons of video on Facebook -- lots of people seem to be using Facebook Live to discourage the police from acting aggressively.
 
Last edited:

MonoStable

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,053
How has the Cuban government been handling covid? Would be good for some context I hope the people aren't suffering crackdowns like in colombia.
 

mbpm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,682
How has the Cuban government been handling covid? Would be good for some context I hope the people aren't suffering crackdowns like in colombia.
I think they made one of the best vaccines in the world despite the economic sanctions/blockade. No idea on availability though.
 
Aug 8, 2019
230
How has the Cuban government been handling covid? Would be good for some context I hope the people aren't suffering crackdowns like in colombia.
It was going very well, then cases started slowly rising from almost zero to four-digit cases per days. Then in the last month or so, cases starting rising to around 3k+ per day and the last two days there have been over 6k cases and more than 40 deaths a day. It's still doing better than the regional average with only around 1500 deaths since the beginning of the pandemic.
 
Aug 8, 2019
230
I think they made one of the best vaccines in the world despite the economic sanctions/blockade. No idea on availability though.
I think the issue is not availability of vaccines as much as a shortage of syringes. The other delay in vaccination rates is also the fact that the Cuban vaccines require three doses across (I believe) at least six weeks.
 

ChippyTurtle

Banned
Oct 13, 2018
4,773
You know how they can get all of that stuff? If the US ends the embargo.

Thats not going to happen, the chance to do it has passed. https://www.politico.com/states/flo...-cuban-american-voters-align-with-gop-1368365

But now 66 percent of those polled by Bendixen & Amandi International opposed reverting back to Obama policies toward Cuba. In a poll done by the same group in 2015, 51 percent backed the former president's effort. The new poll also showed a major shift in support for keeping the decades-old trade embargo against Cuba. Six years ago, only 36 percent favored retaining the embargo. Now 66 percent say they favor keeping it in place. The poll also found a majority — 56 percent — oppose easing travel restrictions.
 
Aug 8, 2019
230
You know how they can get all of that stuff? If the US ends the embargo.
The issue is that anti-government groups, whether on the island or the diaspora, want people to believe it doesn't exist. I've never understood people who really believe it doesn't exist and that everything is solely the fault of the government. If it doesn't exist, why not ask the United States to lift this imaginary blockade, since that is what the government blames for the underdevelopment of the country? Secondly, many Cubans in the States loooove Trump because of his harsh stance against Cuba, in which he turned back Obama-era normalization and then added 240 additional measures against Cuba in the span of four years. So why are they praising a politician that escalates the intensity of the blockade when, according to them, it doesn't exist?

Of course, there are many Cubans that are aware of the damage it causes, but they know that admitting so publicly would debilitate the unifying narrative of the regime change movement. That narrative promotes the notion that the blockade doesn't exist or is exaggerated and that the government is at fault because Communism imposes an internal blockade on the island.
 
Aug 8, 2019
230
Can't they get it from the rest of the world?
Yes, but sometimes it's not that easy. I saw this example in terms of Cuba trying to procure syringes:

At the same time, Cuba suffers from a shortage of syringes. Syringe manufacturers are entangled in one way or another with the U.S. pharmaceutical industry. Terumo (Japan) and Nipro (Japan) have operations in the United States, while B. Braun Melsungen AG (Germany) is in a partnership with Concordance Healthcare Solutions (US). An Indian syringe firm, Hindustan Syringes & Medical Devices Ltd., is linked to Envigo (US), which brings U.S. government scrutiny to the Indian firm. In an act of concrete solidarity, a campaign is underway to raise funds towards the purchase of syringes for Cuba.

Source
 

Daphne

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
3,699
Biden needs to show some courage and lift the damn embargo. There has never been any valid justification for a such an evil policy, and it continues to cost countless lives and cause misery.
 

Rodderick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,667
Oh look, a thread about the suffering of Cubans focusing pretty much exclusively on the embargo with seldom a peep about their tyrannical regime.
 

hyouko

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,232
news.fiu.edu

FIU Cuba Poll: Most Cuban Americans support President Trump and his policies, will vote to re-elect him

A majority of Cuban Americans support President Donald Trump and plan to vote for him in November, according to the latest FIU Cuba Poll.

Amazingly, even tho polls show Cuban Americans know the embargo has failed, support has risen since Obama for keeping it in place.
As ever, the cruelty is the point. The Republican party is the party of sadopopulism.
 

mbpm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,682
User Banned (2 Weeks): Dismissing concerns about dictatorships. Dissent is often suppressed in dictatorships, so the lack of popular movements is not evidence that the government is not tyrannical.
Oh look, a thread about the suffering of Cubans focusing pretty much exclusively on the embargo with seldom a peep about their tyrannical regime.
If the regime is so tyrannous, why are these movements a minority instead of a majority?
 
Aug 8, 2019
230
Oh look, a thread about the suffering of Cubans focusing pretty much exclusively on the embargo with seldom a peep about their tyrannical regime.

Yeah, because the anti-government narratives are always willing to admit that the embargo exists and that it also sows the material conditions for dissent. Notice how it wasn't mentioned once in the OP?
 

samoyed

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
15,191
User banned (1 month): Dismissing concerns and attempting to shut down criticism of dictatorships. Previous ban for advocating for violence.
Oh look, a thread about the suffering of Cubans focusing pretty much exclusively on the embargo with seldom a peep about their tyrannical regime.
You have two paths open to you as a US citizen, support boots on the ground or support lifting of sanctions/embargos. Griping about "tyrannical regimes" in your media or on social networks does literally nothing for anyone.

Make a material difference or shut it.

Anyway, I see this thing spreading all across twitter and the usual crowd is now advocating US military intervention. Excuse me if this does not strike me as extremely suspect.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,597
If the regime is so tyrannous, why are these movements a minority instead of a majority?

The embargo is obviously a factor to take into account, but how could anyone think of Cuba as a democracy? There's a strict ruling party that oppresses anyone that voices anything against the government. They're protesting now and cutting off the internet and the government is shutting down all signs of protests (protesting is a human right and should be everywhere). I wouldn't be surprised that this has been a problem because of retaliation. I.e. people are afraid to protest for those same reasons.
 

Trafalgar Law

Member
Nov 6, 2017
4,683
I don't know how to feel because while Cuba has its issues excarcebated by USA policy
I've seen enough Libya's Syria's and soft intervention being fucking distasters
Where in like 5 years we were like oh it's not all it seems and a terrible move
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
Updated the OP with this info:
Video streamed on Facebook by Antonio Miguel Cobas Jalowayski around 1 p.m. in Palma Soriano showed hundreds of protesters calling for freedom and shouting, "Down with the dictatorship" and "Down with Díaz-Canel," a reference to Cuban leader Miguel Diaz-Canel. The protesters also demanded medicine, COVID vaccines and "the end of hunger." A crowd is seen pushing a police car and shouting "the dictators just arrived," in reference to the police. Later, one protester is heard saying, "This is a peaceful demonstration."

The President encourages violence against protestors:
In an impromptu televised address later in the afternoon, Díaz-Canel blamed the protests on U.S. efforts to tighten the embargo, with the alleged intention to "provoke a social uprising" that would justify a military intervention.

Visibly upset and raising his voice, the Cuban leader warned that protesters would face a strong response and called "all revolutionaries" to confront them on the streets "with firmness and courage."

"We are not going to hand over the sovereignty or the independence of the people," he said. "There are many revolutionaries in this country who are willing to give our lives, we are willing to do anything, and we will be in the streets fighting."

Foreign minister blames paid protestors:
On Twitter, Cuban foreign minister Bruno Rodríguez suggested the protests were orchestrated by the US.

"President @DiazCanelB is in San Antonio de los Baños with the revolutionary people that are mobilized against the imperialist campaign and its salaried agents," he wrote. "We appreciate the international solidarity and support of Cubans living abroad #EliminatetheBlockade."

Background info:
Cuba is in the throes of its worst economic contraction in over three decades, as chronic inefficiencies and paralyzing bureaucracy have gradually eroded the country's production capacity, including the essential food and agriculture sectors. Trump-era sanctions have reduced access to vital economic lifelines like remittances, and foreign investment has plunged. Painful currency reforms this year have sent inflation soaring, and long lines for food have again become commonplace.

Now Cuba is struggling to control transmission of the coronavirus and has been setting record highs almost daily in the past few weeks. Cuba decided to make its own COVID-19 vaccine and didn't seek to buy shots from other countries. But plans to immunize the population with a homegrown vaccine has been plagued by delays.

... Although Cuban officials said this week the country is open for donations, historically, the government has refused or seized the humanitarian aid coming from Cuban exiles.

Police response -- people being beaten and arrested, internet being shut down:
A Facebook video posted by user AntenaCubana shows people in Palma Soriano throwing stones at the police while a person is heard saying the police had been beating the demonstrators. Another video showed several trucks carrying special-forces police officers reportedly arriving in San Antonio de los Baños, where Cuban president Díaz-Canel showed up to speak to residents, a gesture that mimics Fidel Castro's response to the uprising in Havana known as the Maleconazo in 1994.
...

But as news of the protests around the country spread on social media -- despite reports of the government shutting down internet access -- Cubans in the capital also took to the Malecon to demand the end of the regime.

Videos posted around 3 p.m. on Facebook showed a crowd chanting "Patria y vida." Cuban journalist Abraham Jiménez Enoa reported that the police were detaining protesters gathered around 23 and L streets, at the heart of the city of Havana.

There is also video at the Miami Herald. It seems to be hosted by the site so I don't know if I can embed it. I've seen tons of video on Facebook -- lots of people seem to be using Facebook Live to discourage the police from acting aggressively.

The embargo certainly causes problems in Cuba. These people aren't protesting the embargo; if they were, the government wouldn't be arresting them and shutting down the internet. The embargo doesn't force the government to fire its own doctors for allowing COVID patients to die, or to beat and arrest protestors. The supplies and food that the government does have are taken to hotels and tourist destinations where Cubans aren't allowed to access or buy them. They are reserved for tourists so that Cuba can give put on its best Disneyland impression to outsiders while people who live there are left to rot. As I mentioned, the government could increase supplies by reopening travel from the U.S.; protestors feel it has resisted doing so because it doesn't want the U.S. (and Cubans living there) to get credit for helping. The president is insisting that Cuba doesn't need help from any other countries.

So yes the embargo is harmful to Cubans. It is not the cause of all of their problems, and they are not protesting against the embargo today. A little bit of solidarity with the protestors' concerns is appreciated, even while it is on-topic and valid to say that the embargo is the cause of some of the problems.

It should be easy for posters here to show solidarity since one of their concerns is police brutality and one of their slogans is "la policia pinga," basically fuck the police but more vulgar.
 

samoyed

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
15,191
You can donate here.
ghpartners.org

Vaccination Syringes for Cuba - Global Health Partners

JOIN OUR CAMPAIGN TO SPUR CUBA’S FIGHT AGAINST COVID!
Thanks, I dropped a donation just now. Too lazy to vet.

wiZK3Oc.png
 

Nivash

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,464
I think they made one of the best vaccines in the world despite the economic sanctions/blockade. No idea on availability though.

The Cuban regime claims it's ~92 % effective but there's been no study published as a source for that claim. Supposedly, the number comes from the phase I/II trials. The current vaccination campaign in Cuba is actually the phase III trial.

apnews.com

The Latest: NKorea tells WHO it has detected no virus cases

North Korea has told the World Health Organization it tested more than 30,000 people for the coronavirus through June 10 but has yet to find a single infection.

The current approved western vaccines ended their phase III trials around last november. CureVac failed its phase III trial a few weeks ago after concluding it was ineffective.

www.clinicaltrialsarena.com

CureVac’s Covid-19 vaccine fails to meet Phase IIb/III efficacy criteria

CureVac has reported second interim analysis results from Phase IIb/III study where its Covid-19 vaccine failed to meet efficacy criteria.

Until Cuba actually publishes a study for Abdala everyone should take the claims with a huge grain of salt. I'm personally even more cautious than usual because Cuba has so much riding on it. They're propping it up as a nationalist victory and they're hoping to sell or exchange it for favors with for example Venezuela, much in the same way that healthcare in general is an important Cuban export.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,597
Updated the OP with this info:
The President encourages violence against protestors:


Foreign minister blames paid protestors:


Background info:


Police response -- people being beaten and arrested, internet being shut down:


There is also video at the Miami Herald. It seems to be hosted by the site so I don't know if I can embed it. I've seen tons of video on Facebook -- lots of people seem to be using Facebook Live to discourage the police from acting aggressively.

The embargo certainly causes problems in Cuba. These people aren't protesting the embargo; if they were, the government wouldn't be arresting them and shutting down the internet. The embargo doesn't force the government to fire its own doctors for allowing COVID patients to die, or to beat and arrest protestors. The supplies and food that the government does have are taken to hotels and tourist destinations where Cubans aren't allowed to access or buy them. They are reserved for tourists so that Cuba can give put on its best Disneyland impression to outsiders while people who live there are left to rot. As I mentioned, the government could increase supplies by reopening travel from the U.S.; protestors feel it has resisted doing so because it doesn't want the U.S. (and Cubans living there) to get credit for helping. The president is insisting that Cuba doesn't need help from any other countries.

So yes the embargo is harmful to Cubans. It is not the cause of all of their problems, and they are not protesting against the embargo today. A little bit of solidarity with the protestors' concerns is appreciated, even while it is on-topic and valid to say that the embargo is the cause of some of the problems.

It should be easy for posters here to show solidarity since one of their concerns is police brutality and one of their slogans is "la policia pinga," basically fuck the police but more vulgar.

I absolutely 100% agree. People should condone human rights violations everywhere (and yes, many HR organizations have accounted for human right violations, including attacking/suppressing the press, the right to protest, etc).
 

ryan299

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,432
I'm in Key West and there were people driving around the island waving Cuban flags and honking.
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
Yeah, because the anti-government narratives are always willing to admit that the embargo exists and that it also sows the material conditions for dissent. Notice how it wasn't mentioned once in the OP?
Hi. I didn't mention the embargo because the protestors aren't protesting against it today and it wasn't mentioned in the original version of the article I used as my source, the only English-language article I found about the events taking place in Cuba. The existence of the embargo is common knowledge and I didn't feel the need to go into that whole history lesson in an OP I was trying to keep brief and focused on the protests. If you want to control the narrative, you could have made your own thread about the topic. As it is, you're free to post about it here.
 
Aug 8, 2019
230
Updated the OP with this info:
The President encourages violence against protestors:


Foreign minister blames paid protestors:


Background info:


Police response -- people being beaten and arrested, internet being shut down:


There is also video at the Miami Herald. It seems to be hosted by the site so I don't know if I can embed it. I've seen tons of video on Facebook -- lots of people seem to be using Facebook Live to discourage the police from acting aggressively.

The embargo certainly causes problems in Cuba. These people aren't protesting the embargo; if they were, the government wouldn't be arresting them and shutting down the internet. The embargo doesn't force the government to fire its own doctors for allowing COVID patients to die, or to beat and arrest protestors. The supplies and food that the government does have are taken to hotels and tourist destinations where Cubans aren't allowed to access or buy them. They are reserved for tourists so that Cuba can give put on its best Disneyland impression to outsiders while people who live there are left to rot. As I mentioned, the government could increase supplies by reopening travel from the U.S.; protestors feel it has resisted doing so because it doesn't want the U.S. (and Cubans living there) to get credit for helping. The president is insisting that Cuba doesn't need help from any other countries.

Let's not forget that the embargo has made it harder for the state to access imports, which lowers the available supply, which is then snatched up by resellers that sell food and goods on the black market for jacked up prices, leaving people frustrated at the artificially created inflation compounding the inflation that came about after the ordenamiento monetario.

Again, if the embargo is not responsible for Cuba's underdevelopment, inefficiency and shortages, then there is no reason for it to exist. Those against the government should be the first to demand the end of the embargo because the government has been using that excuse for six whole decades.
 

Haze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,792
Detroit, MI
Wow some dictatorship. Letting people peacefully march the streets of the capital? You'd think someone would do an authoritarianism or something.


Let's not forget that the embargo has made it harder for the state to access imports, which lowers the available supply, which is then snatched up by resellers that sell food and goods on the black market for jacked up prices, leaving people frustrated at the artificially created inflation compounding the inflation that came about after the ordenamiento monetario.

Again, if the embargo is not responsible for Cuba's underdevelopment, inefficiency and shortages, then there is no reason for it to exist. Those against the government should be the first to demand the end of the embargo because the government has been using that excuse for six whole decades.

The world's largest food exporter is 90 miles away.
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
The Cuban regime claims it's ~92 % effective but there's been no study published as a source for that claim. Supposedly, the number comes from the phase I/II trials. The current vaccination campaign in Cuba is actually the phase III trial.

apnews.com

The Latest: NKorea tells WHO it has detected no virus cases

North Korea has told the World Health Organization it tested more than 30,000 people for the coronavirus through June 10 but has yet to find a single infection.

The current approved western vaccines ended their phase III trials around last november. CureVac failed its phase III trial a few weeks ago after concluding it was ineffective.

www.clinicaltrialsarena.com

CureVac’s Covid-19 vaccine fails to meet Phase IIb/III efficacy criteria

CureVac has reported second interim analysis results from Phase IIb/III study where its Covid-19 vaccine failed to meet efficacy criteria.

Until Cuba actually publishes a study for Abdala everyone should take the claims with a huge grain of salt. I'm personally even more cautious than usual because Cuba has so much riding on it. They're propping it up as a nationalist victory and they're hoping to sell or exchange it for favors with for example Venezuela, much in the same way that healthcare in general is an important Cuban export.
I personally know people who have gotten Abdala and they're hopeful that it's as effective as Cuba says. However they know people who have gotten the same vaccine who are still dying of COVID and they are reasonably skeptical about its effectiveness. I really hope it's as good as they say because lives are on the line -- including lives of people very close to my loved ones.
 
Aug 8, 2019
230
Hi. I didn't mention the embargo because the protestors aren't protesting against it today and it wasn't mentioned in the original version of the article I used as my source, the only English-language article I found about the events taking place in Cuba. The existence of the embargo is common knowledge and I didn't feel the need to go into that whole history lesson in an OP I was trying to keep brief and focused on the protests. If you want to control the narrative, you could have made your own thread about the topic. As it is, you're free to post about it here.
Sorry if it seemed as if I were attacking you for leaving it out. However, my point still stands based on the article you used. That text came from the only English-language article you could find and it just so happens to exclude any mention of the embargo? Odd.
 
Jul 3, 2019
963
User banned (2 weeks): Hostility against another member, accusations of astroturfing.
Smell the astroturf from a mile away.

The USA could just lift the sanctions on Cuba.
 
Aug 8, 2019
230
80% of syringe manufacturing is Chinese. You'd think there wouldn't be an issue there. It's possible this socialist magazine source is not being completely honest with us.
I believe the difference is between where it's manufactured and who is manufacturing them. The list mentions the largest syringe manufacturing companies in the world.
 

B-Dubs

That's some catch, that catch-22
General Manager
Oct 25, 2017
32,833
They literally are. There were a few arrests and violence where the protests got heated but for the most part people are just walking through the streets. This is a regular protest you would see in any country. The president himself is literally walking in the other without guards.
In an impromptu televised address later in the afternoon, Díaz-Canel blamed the protests on U.S. efforts to tighten the embargo, with the alleged intention to "provoke a social uprising" that would justify a military intervention.

Visibly upset and raising his voice, the Cuban leader warned that protesters would face a strong response and called "all revolutionaries" to confront them on the streets "with firmness and courage."

"We are not going to hand over the sovereignty or the independence of the people," he said. "There are many revolutionaries in this country who are willing to give our lives, we are willing to do anything, and we will be in the streets fighting."

Sounds like they're allowing peaceful protests to me.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,597
They literally are. There were a few arrests and violence where the protests got heated but for the most part people are just walking through the streets. This is a regular protest you would see in any country. The president himself is literally walking in the other without guards.

They're literally not??? They're getting arrested and not just where the "protests got heated" lmao. Look at what's happening with the press (AP) covering the protests.

Miguel Díaz Canel also literally said: "a los revolucionarios comunistas a que salgan a la calle donde se vayan a producir estas provocaciones y enfrentarlas con decisión". Are you serious?
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
Sorry if it seemed as if I were attacking you for leaving it out. However, my point still stands based on the article you used. That text came from the only English-language article you could find and it just so happens to exclude any mention of the embargo? Odd.
It was a developing story; it was really short. It mentions the embargo exactly once now, which is in my edit of the OP. You can post another article about the protests or about how the embargo has limited access to medical supplies if you want.
 

Haze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,792
Detroit, MI
They're literally not??? They're getting arrested and not just where the "protests got heated" lmao. Look at what's happening with the press (AP) covering the protests.

Miguel Díaz Canel also literally said: "a los revolucionarios comunistas a que salgan a la calle donde se vayan a producir estas provocaciones y enfrentarlas con decisión". Are you serious?

See above. As of present there is not an organized repression of the protests.

So far, this seems to be the response in the streets, with Diaz-Canel walking with a counter protest.
 
Last edited:

B-Dubs

That's some catch, that catch-22
General Manager
Oct 25, 2017
32,833
See above. As of present there is not an organized repression of the protests.
A Facebook video posted by user AntenaCubana shows people in Palma Soriano throwing stones at the police while a person is heard saying the police had been beating the demonstrators. Another video showed several trucks carrying special-forces police officers reportedly arriving in San Antonio de los Baños, where Cuban president Díaz-Canel showed up to speak to residents, a gesture that mimics Fidel Castro's response to the uprising in Havana known as the Maleconazo in 1994.
...

But as news of the protests around the country spread on social media -- despite reports of the government shutting down internet access -- Cubans in the capital also took to the Malecon to demand the end of the regime.

Videos posted around 3 p.m. on Facebook showed a crowd chanting "Patria y vida." Cuban journalist Abraham Jiménez Enoa reported that the police were detaining protesters gathered around 23 and L streets, at the heart of the city of Havana.
Uhh, according to the reporting you're wrong
 

Nivash

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,464
I personally know people who have gotten Abdala and they're hopeful that it's as effective as Cuba says. However they know people who have gotten the same vaccine who are still dying of COVID and they are reasonably skeptical about its effectiveness. I really hope it's as good as they say because lives are on the line -- including lives of people very close to my loved ones.

I'm equally hopeful, there's absolutely no downsides if it works. The main issue with the current vaccines are supply, especially for the mRNA's, and any new vaccine will help alleviate that. Especially less technologically intense versions that can be produced in middle income countries.

But I'm deeply wary of authoritarian regimes exploiting people with bad vaccines to gain favors or even just for good PR.

Especially with real world data from South America throwing increasingly large amounts of doubt on whether the effectiveness of the Chinese vaccines exported there is really as good as was claimed.

www.asianews.it

Doubts growing in Chile, Brazil, and Peru about the effectiveness of Chinese anti-COVID vaccines

About 45 per cent of Chileans have been vaccinated, especially with Sinovac, but infections are at their highest since the outbreak of the pandemic. Of the 70 million doses administered in Brazil, 55

thediplomat.com

Latin America Believed in Chinese Vaccines. Now It May Have Reason to Rethink.

China’s latest disclosure could reconfigure regional politics and promote domestic development across the Americas.