In hindsight, I don't think I liked Succession at all.

[Soapbox Killer]

It's strange. Going through the seasons, which I binged I thought the show was fine but it was not the typical show I would watch. I enjoyed the ride (I thought) but in the end, nothing seemed to matter and everyone is still the same rich, douche socks that started the show. No one grew. No one became "better." Everyone is a shitbag....and then the show ends with shitbags doing shitbag things and then credits. Maybe I just don't like this type of tv, I don't have the sophisticated pallet for this flavor. Don't get me wrong, it has its moments , Kendal's rap is an alltime tv moment for me and a few others but perhaps once you get a certain age in life new things just don't do it for you anymore.

 

[Rag]

I have no idea if this is a 'hot take' but I wonder if I would have liked the show better if they weren't so reliant on that theme song. I know the show isn't supposed to make you feel warm inside, but that plodding serious theme song rolling over most of the show gave it a feeling of dread that I didn't necessarily need.

 

[El_TigroX]

Eh... I don't think someone needs to change for the better for it to feel complete or meaningful.

There's something to be said that at the end of that, they were all filthy rich due to a sale, and yet they were all more or less miserable and had lost the game they were so certain they would win. I mean, it's Icarus with gilded ass wings. You could argue Roman was made whole and free from his bird cage to go be a wretch without limits, and that was the best outcome for anyone.

They're all trapped - Tom, even if he won, lost.

I think there's an element in modern media of a belief that it all needs to be a neat bow or have conclusion. These characters lived out their lives many moons later, and were still fucked up weirdos.

 

[IDontBeatGames]

in the end, nothing seemed to matter and everyone is still the same rich, douche socks that started the show. No one grew. No one became "better." Everyone is a shitbag....and then the show ends with shitbags doing shitbag things and then credits.

Click to shrink...

Isn't this the whole message of Succession, though? These spoiled kids are all fighting for something they don't really need or are qualified for, from a business perspective. Every single of them could fuck off, live their best life and launch various projects (like they one they should've focused on as siblings, I think it was called The 100 or some shit?) time and time again regardless if their previous projects fail because, well, they're rich. They were all fighting for something they never needed and throughout the entire journey, especially in the last season, the show highlights the fact that they're just fighting over it because other siblings are entertaining the idea of possibly succeeding their father. It never comes from a genuine place at all, it's just them all being jealous spoiled brats who aren't serious people.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

I haven't seen Succession yet, so I can't speak to the show specifically, but I can ABSOLUTELY agree with one part of your post, which is the fact that as I get older, the less patience I have for media about horrible pieces of shit doing horrible piece of shit things over and over again. I'm just so tired of being asked to emotionally invest myself in assholes I wouldn't want anything to do with if I met them in real life.

Video games, movies, TV shows, I need something to actually care about, and if all of the main characters are awful people, it's really hard for me to stick with it.

 

[NinjaScooter]

You definitely saw arcs even if people didn't become "better". Some people don't actually become "better" they are just actual assholes and horrible individuals until the day they die. Thats life.

Mad Men and Sopranos are maybe my favorite shows of all time and the main characters in those shows didn't really change from bad to good all that much but they definitely had arcs and development.

 

[Blader]

The characters did change. Many of them are just worse off.

 

[HStallion]

I found Succesion very well made and acted but it feels rather repetitive. If you love that kind of stuff then I can see why people love it because it's all very well crafted but beyond the humorous parts I was checking out.

 

[Khanimus]

No one grew. No one became "better." Everyone is a shitbag...

Click to shrink...

...that's like... the point of the show.

The series is constantly baiting these characters with opportunities to get better and do the right thing - if not for the broader good, atleast to being better towards their siblings. But both the damage and conditioning predominantly from their father hovers over them and is the biggest hurdle. Their inability to overcome it, and in many ways succumbing to it is revealing in and of itself.

Characters don't need to get better for a story like this to matter. There is a point in both that they can't get better, and that you as an audience member want to believe that they can. This show isn't just "rich people doing rich people things." If it were, it'd be some reality show about the Kardashians or whatever.

 

[GreenSocks]

Everyone changed in every aspect.

 

[SilverX]

The writers wanted to make sure every Roy ¨lost¨" in the end and there is just no way it could avoid retroactively worsening the whole show. You rooted for the characters and it shifted moment to moment across the entire cast, only to find their big moments would be more or less meaningless.

The whole ending message from the writers seemed to be ¨This is a bullshit show full of bullshit characters, thanks for supporting its brief run!¨

 

[NinjaScooter]

Roman, Shiv and especially Kendall are 1000% not the same people in the last episode as they are in the first. Like not even close.

 

[Dalek]

I feel the same way, OP. I never really connected with the show. I really hated everyone the entire time through and I didn't really care at all what happened to them. My wife loved the show so I watched it with her-but I don't have fond memories of it in any way. The production value was really insane and I liked seeing all the different filming locations-but from a character and story perspective I never cared in any way about any of it. And I think people saying "That's the point!" don't really get that it doesn't make it any better. Some people can connect with a story like that and others can't.

Whereas something like The Sopranos features a cast of morally repugnant characters but I was totally engrossed in every minute of it.

I found Succesion very well made and acted but it feels rather repetitive. If you love that kind of stuff then I can see why people love it because it's all very well crafted but beyond the humorous parts I was checking out.

Click to shrink...

It was INCREDIBLY repetitive. At a certain point, trying to get the upper hand over person_x over a merger or a deal just becomes nebulous. There's no real stakes involved because it's just "We want to win"-there's never any nuance to it. Their lives won't be any worse or better. It matters to their ego but not to their life in any substantial way and I don't really care about that.

 

[Jroc]

Felt the complete opposite. Loved watching these characters be their worst selves and enjoyed it from start to finish. It's rare for people to completely change themselves in real life, I certainly wasn't expecting it in this show.

 

[Soapbox Killer]

...that's like... the point of the show.

The series is constantly baiting these characters with opportunities to get better and do the right thing - if not for the broader good, atleast to being better towards their siblings. But both the damage and conditioning predominantly from their father hovers over them and is the biggest hurdle. Their inability to overcome it, and in many ways succumbing to it is revealing in and of itself.

Characters don't need to get better for a story like this to matter. There is a point in both that they can't get better, and that you as an audience member want to believe that they can. This show isn't just "rich people doing rich people things." If it were, it'd be some reality show about the Kardashians or whatever.

Click to shrink...

If the point of the show is that then I get it and I am solid in my feelings of not liking it.

 

[Messofanego]

I haven't seen Succession yet, so I can't speak to the show specifically, but I can ABSOLUTELY agree with one part of your post, which is the fact that as I get older, the less patience I have for media about horrible pieces of shit doing horrible piece of shit things over and over again. I'm just so tired of being asked to emotionally invest myself in assholes I wouldn't want anything to do with if I met them in real life.

Video games, movies, TV shows, I need something to actually care about, and if all of the main characters are awful people, it's really hard for me to stick with it.

Click to shrink...

That's a interesting take. Personally, I love it, get to explore weirdos who I'd never want to bump into in real life. If the film wants to help me understand why they're like that, that's a bonus. And Succession marvels in this. Like as a therapist, Succession is full of juicy psychodynamic fruit to eat through. Don't need them to have a redemptive arc. Arthouse films that don't follow the hero's journey tend to be all about this. Or villain protagonists. Some Scorsese films, Paul Thomas Anderson, It's Always Sunny In Philadephia, Gaspar Noe films, Michael Haneke films, Simon Killer, Nicolas Winding Refn, Aguirre The Wrath Of God, etc.

 

[KingK]

Haven't watched Succession, but I don't plan on it either. I have no interest in watching a show about rich assholes being rich assholes.

I watched the first 5 or so episodes of White Lotus due to the hype and fucking hated it. Thought it was a terrible show and very boring.

I don't think I can tolerate watching a show about spoiled rich fucks unless the twist is a worker uprising that kills them all and confiscates their wealth.

 

[julia crawford]

Gonna be full honest here. I watched the first episode. When i started the second episode it really dawned on me "this is going to be a show about terrible rich people being rich terrible" and dropped it. Maybe i'm wrong, but i just didn't want to watch a show like that.

 

[NinjaScooter]

Gonna be full honest here. I watched the first episode. When i started the second episode it really dawned on me "this is going to be a show about terrible rich people being rich terrible" and dropped it. Maybe i'm wrong, but i just didn't want to watch a show like that.

Click to shrink...

The show might still not be for you, but to be fair the show doesn't really glorify these people and makes it a point to highlight how miserable and empty they all actually are. The show runner has a clear contempt for these types of people and it shows. Nothing about Succession is about which of these miserable, rich fucks is going to "win".

 

[PlanetSmasher]

That's a interesting take. Personally, I love it, get to explore weirdos who I'd never want to bump into in real life. If the film wants to help me understand why they're like that, that's a bonus. And Succession marvels in this. Like as a therapist, Succession is full of juicy psychodynamic fruit to eat through. Don't need them to have a redemptive arc. Arthouse films that don't follow the hero's journey tend to be all about this. Or villain protagonists. Some Scorsese films, Paul Thomas Anderson, It's Always Sunny In Philadephia, Gaspar Noe films, Michael Haneke films, Simon Killer, Nicolas Winding Refn, Aguirre The Wrath Of God, etc.

Click to shrink...

I just find it emotionally taxing to watch dickheads repeatedly be dickheads over and over again. I watched Sunny for years, but eventually I was like "OK I've seen enough". And Sunny is a sitcom, so it's slightly different, but for a narrative show with a serialized story I kind of need something to build towards, and "watch this asshole destroy their entire life over four seasons of misery" is the kind of thing I just can't stick with until the end. I tend to hit capacity after a couple episodes and just drift off.

 

[julia crawford]

The show might still not be for you, but to be fair the show doesn't really glorify these people and makes it a point to highlight how miserable and empty they all actually are. The show runner has a clear contempt for these types of people and it shows. Nothing about Succession is about which of these miserable, rich fucks is going to "win".

Click to shrink...

I understand that, i wasn't trying to suggest that it was my feeling the show was celebratory. It still wasn't something i would enjoy.

 

[thecouncil]

I have no idea if this is a 'hot take' but I wonder if I would have liked the show better if they weren't so reliant on that theme song. I know the show isn't supposed to make you feel warm inside, but that plodding serious theme song rolling over most of the show gave it a feeling of dread that I didn't necessarily need.

Click to shrink...

there was a lot of that theme and its variations but damn britell was really knocking it out of the park with the score for this show:

A Piacere - Orchestra | Succession: Season 1 (HBO Original Series Soundtrack)

"A Piacere - Orchestra" from Succession: Season 1 (HBO Original Series Soundtrack)Music by Nicholas Britell ► Listen to the soundtrack here: https://soundtr...

youtu.be

Andantino for Brass and Orchestra in B Minor

Provided to YouTube by MilanAndantino for Brass and Orchestra in B Minor · Nicholas BritellSuccession: Season 1 (HBO Original Series Soundtrack)℗ 2019 HBO un...

youtu.be

Succession S2 Official Soundtrack | Rondo in F Minor - Nicholas Britell | WaterTower

Rondo in F Minor for String Orchestra | Nicholas Britell Avail now: https://lnk.to/successionID#Succession #HBO #SoundtrackSubscribe to WaterTower Music on Y...

youtu.be

Minuet in C Minor - Strings and Viola Solo

Provided to YouTube by BWSCD IncMinuet in C Minor - Strings and Viola Solo · Nicholas BritellSuccession: Season 4℗ 2023 Home Box Office, Inc, under exclusive...

youtu.be

 

[Dalek]

Gonna be full honest here. I watched the first episode. When i started the second episode it really dawned on me "this is going to be a show about terrible rich people being rich terrible" and dropped it. Maybe i'm wrong, but i just didn't want to watch a show like that.

Click to shrink...

It's exactly like that the entire time. There will be times when those people have setbacks in their lives when they are sad for their own predicament or worried that they might face some repercussions but every episode of the show is "terrible rich people being terrible and rich".

 

[808s & Villainy]

I enjoyed the ride (I thought) but in the end, nothing seemed to matter and everyone is still the same rich, douche socks that started the show. No one grew. No one became "better." Everyone is a shitbag....and then the show ends with shitbags doing shitbag things and then credits.

Click to shrink...

Welcome to the world of rich people and the world of satirical dark comedies
In storytelling there is such a thing as a "flat character arc" where it's less about how the character grows and more how the world around them changes

 

[ConradCervantes]

Gonna be full honest here. I watched the first episode. When i started the second episode it really dawned on me "this is going to be a show about terrible rich people being rich terrible" and dropped it. Maybe i'm wrong, but i just didn't want to watch a show like that.

Click to shrink...

That is precisely what it is, so it's understandable that people may not take to it. The writing and acting can do a terrific job of making you feel for some of these assholes despite all of their inherent selfishness.

Give Armstrong all the money, HBO. Letting him get away would be a tremendous error.

 

[JigglesBunny]

Bad and immoral characters don't need to grow or change for their story to be worth telling. It just sounds like it's not your type of show, which is fine.

 

[Soapbox Killer]

Welcome to the world of rich people and the world of satirical dark comedies
In storytelling there is such a thing as a "flat character arc" where it's less about how the character grows and more how the world around them changes

Click to shrink...

Not my bag I guess. I am proud of myself for even trying and finishing a show like this.

Bad and immoral characters don't need to grow or change for their story to be worth telling. It just sounds like it's not your type of show, which is fine.

Click to shrink...

Maybe it's my own fault for not believing the show when the showed me that it was full of scumbags and I thought that someone would rise above the tide of shit.



They didn't.

 

[Royalan]

I've been meaning to catch up on this show.

I started with it when it premiered, but peace'd out around episode 4 because I just found it so damn boring. I love me a good "Rich White Assholes" show every now and then, but I just couldn't give a single fuck about the hook.

But enough people whose tastes I value swear to me that the show takes off toward the end of the first season, so I might give it a go.

 

[Noisepurge]

Haven't watched Succession, but I don't plan on it either. I have no interest in watching a show about rich assholes being rich assholes.

I watched the first 5 or so episodes of White Lotus due to the hype and fucking hated it. Thought it was a terrible show and very boring.

Click to shrink...

as perspective i also didn't like White Lotus at all due to all characters being miserable. But in Succession they are so well written that i did like it a lot, so i'd say give it a chance! :D

 

[BLEEN]

That's what made the show so endearing and fresh. Pieces of you actually ended up caring for these pieces of shits way more than something like characters from The Sopranos or Walter White himself. They really pushed the meaning of 'liking the anti-hero'.

I also don't think it's a show you should necessarily binge. Works better week to week, imo.

 

[ann3nova.]

I'd be curious of your review of The Sopranos.

 

[BLEEN]

I've been meaning to catch up on this show.

I started with it when it premiered, but peace'd out around episode 4 because I just found it so damn boring. I love me a good "Rich White Assholes" show every now and then, but I just couldn't give a single fuck about the hook.

But enough people whose tastes I value swear to me that the show takes off toward the end of the first season, so I might give it a go.

Click to shrink...

Season 1 and 2 are pretty much perfect mainly due to the leadups to the ends.

 

[Squarehard]

The show is just terrible until you start finding the very least of aspects to like about the characters.

Basically, there's no clear antagonist for awhile, since they were all the antagonists.

Once some of them actually start going against the father, then it's more entertaining.

 

[Nere]

I disagree if we all knew what is going to be end up happening with every asshole on a medium then what's the point? Sometimes assholes win in real life and sometimes they lose it just wouldn't be fun if in every medium they were "punished" in the end, there would be no suspense, no mystery, no point.

 

[doops.]

I haven't seen the show and have a feeling I wouldn't like it either, going by the OP, but is it kind of like Always Sunny in the sense of morally bankrupt people constantly tripping over themselves to entertaining degrees? I love Always Sunny, and I'm seeing a lot of parallels that can be drawn between that show and Succession in what you guys are saying about it, so perhaps I would actually.

 

[345]

i don't mean to call out OP on this specifically, because it's something i see a lot of lately, but i just absolutely do not understand any kind of media criticism that hinges on "these people suck".

you shouldn't have to like fictional characters to find them compelling. the interpersonal drama in succession is incredibly well-observed and relevant to anyone with a stake in the current cultural and political moment. maybe you don't vibe with the show's sense of humour but dismissing it as being about "rich people doing shitbag things" is such an unserious take.

who did you root for in taxi driver? in the sopranos? in a clockwork orange? in american psycho?

no these are not good people. that is why the show is good

 

[krazen]

I think its why I and a few of my friends has issues watching particularly the first season; until they establish the plots and the players its terrible people being terrible.

Once they get those established along with their good comedic rhythm its good watch; entertaining and well acted with surprises. But it was always the first season, assholes being assholes.

Non Spoilery but I remember when a character died and my partner cried because she was dealing with someone close to her going through things and I was surprised since the show is relentless on showing how big of pieces of shit they were. Its a testimony to the direction/plot/acting it affected her so, but for me it was like if you heard a sexual assaulter, elder abuser, etc get hit by a bus. I mighta even giggled.

 

[Khanimus]

I just find it emotionally taxing to watch dickheads repeatedly be dickheads over and over again. I watched Sunny for years, but eventually I was like "OK I've seen enough". And Sunny is a sitcom, so it's slightly different, but for a narrative show with a serialized story I kind of need something to build towards, and "watch this asshole destroy their entire life over four seasons of misery" is the kind of thing I just can't stick with until the end. I tend to hit capacity after a couple episodes and just drift off.

Click to shrink...

I mean it's not like 4 seasons of these characters gritting through their teeth. Most of Succession is extremely fucking funny, even if it occasionally gets very real.

 

[red_shift_ltd]

Haven't watched Succession, but I don't plan on it either. I have no interest in watching a show about rich assholes being rich assholes.

I watched the first 5 or so episodes of White Lotus due to the hype and fucking hated it. Thought it was a terrible show and very boring.

I don't think I can tolerate watching a show about spoiled rich fucks unless the twist is a worker uprising that kills them all and confiscates their wealth.

Click to shrink...

Completely agree, I've been avoiding both shows for that reason. Life is too short for that.

 

[BLEEN]

I mean it's not like 4 seasons of these characters gritting through their teeth. Most of Succession is extremely fucking funny, even if it occasionally gets very real.

Click to shrink...

Just like the Sopranos, it should be watched thru a comedic lense; it's flawless in that respect. Heavy but flawless. I actually wish they leaned into it more in the last season.

 

[HeartlessNobody2134]

I can see why you would feel that way.

I avoided Succession because from the outside looking in I was like "damn are there any non white people on the show?"

I did end up mostly really liking it though.

Great score, writing and acting.

I have no problems with violence or sex in film/tv but when something doesn't have much or any of that, it does stand out and Succession is one of those shows.

It is repetitive but that's a big part of the theme of the show.

I will say what works in the show's favor is that it didn't overstay its welcome.

 

[Khanimus]

Just like the Sopranos, it should be watched thru a comedic lense; it's flawless in that respect. Heavy but flawless. I actually wish they leaned into it more in the last season.

Click to shrink...

My partner didn't vibe with the first episode of Succession precisely because she kinda hated them. It was after I told her "oh, the show thinks these people are complete idiots - like nearly every scene is making fun of them," she agreed to continue watching and it quickly became a thing we were rushing to get back to.

 

[kenjieno]

These people have no morals. Why would they go through some redemption arc? Spectacular show and I bet that it's an accurate take on the Murdochs. I would hate for the series to end up with any kind of moral lessons/they're now good people fireworks.

 

[Poppy]

i simply didn't get what they were going for, i watched all of season one for the record.

like yeah obviously i could get the humor of these assholes doing their asshole things and like i know the show isn't on their side, but it felt like they would constantly try to cut that through with like flashes of genuine or emotional stuff for a few minutes and i was like what is the point of this

i feel nothing for any of these people, not even enough to laugh at them, it just like...i dunno, it was almost so pointless and annoying that i didn't find it to contain any actual value. and for whatever reason that did not translate to entertainment

 

[BLEEN]

Roman, Shiv and especially Kendall are 1000% not the same people in the last episode as they are in the first. Like not even close.

Click to shrink...

Spinoff with just Kendall when



And Greg

 

[CHC]

From the outside the show never appealed to me. I'm not really interested in a show about a bunch of cloistered rich assholes, even if it is critical of them. I'm sure it's probably enjoyable while you're watching it, just didn't seem like I'd come away from it with any ideas or feelings I don't already have about those kinds of people.

I don't know, I'm just a bit worn out with media that skewers the rich, feels like kind of low-hanging fruit at this point. Obviously I agree with the sentiment but a lot of that stuff feels very tired and self-congratulatory lately.

 

[LetsEatSnacks]

I can see why you would feel that way.



I have no problems with violence or sex in film/tv but when something doesn't have much or any of that, it does stand out and Succession is one of those shows.

Click to shrink...

 

[Soapbox Killer]

I'd be curious of your review of The Sopranos.

Click to shrink...

Never watched it.

i don't mean to call out OP on this specifically, because it's something i see a lot of lately, but i just absolutely do not understand any kind of media criticism that hinges on "these people suck".

you shouldn't have to like fictional characters to find them compelling. the interpersonal drama in succession is incredibly well-observed and relevant to anyone with a stake in the current cultural and political moment. maybe you don't vibe with the show's sense of humour but dismissing it as being about "rich people doing shitbag things" is such an unserious take.

who did you root for in taxi driver? in the sopranos? in a clockwork orange? in american psycho?

no these are not good people. that is why the show is good

Click to shrink...

The show is actually about shitbag people and I don't think that is an unserious take. It's the focus of the show. Folks eating dinner with towels on their head to hide their shame? THIS SHOW!

I didn't root for anyone cause I never saw any of them. I tried to watch A Clockwork Orange but I found it ...not for me.

 

[HeartlessNobody2134]

Click to shrink...

 

[Poppy]

i dont think it's very close to the sopranos, on the sopranos everyone feels like a caricature most of the time and on succession they dial back everything to the point where it doesnt really read as comedic much of the time