Dec 4, 2017
11,483
Brazil
Gears 5 was an extremely refined experience that ultimately felt like just more gears. It would not bring new people that want something new. I signed Gamepass just to play this game and never finished. Not because it was bad, it wasn't, it just didn't get my attention.

Coalition is a talented studio, capable of doing good games, much better than 343i in my opinion, but as a Gears of War factory they will never shine.
 
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Pyroblazer

Member
Oct 30, 2017
547
The game was ignored because it's only decent, not because it's a Gears game. It's just not that good nor unique for most people, even if it's your GOTY.
That said yeah I would love to see Coalition and also the Halo team do something new. But they could have done much more interesting things with Gears too. Before the release I had the feeling they wanted to reinvent the franchise like God of War did, but they simply didn't. It started promising and then fell off a cliff. It was more interesting than the super boring Gears 4, but overall pretty stale too.
 
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More Butter

Banned
Jun 12, 2018
1,890
Gears 5 campaign was awesome. New gridiron mode is great too. Horde is great like always and escape is ok. Lots of good mp modes and good maps. Gears 5 is the whole package it's just not the kind of package people are too keen on these days. I love it though. I support the coalition doing what they want. I suspect they are probably working on gears 6 on XSX on unreal Engine 5 and will release in 2022 and then they will have a new IP after. That's my guess.
 

More Butter

Banned
Jun 12, 2018
1,890
The game was ignored because it's only decent, not because it's a Gears game. It's just not that good nor unique for most people, even if it's your GOTY.
That said yeah I would love to see Coalition and also the Halo team do something new. But they could have done much more interesting with Gears too. Before the release I had the feeling they wanted to reinvent the franchise like God of War did, but they simply didn't. It started promising and then fell off a cliff. It was more interesting than the super boring Gears 4, but overall pretty stale too.
Gears is more than decent. I think the biggest criticism you can bring gears 5 is that it's gears and you may not care for it. The open sections were a tad repetitive but they weren't there too long, the final chapter/boss was a bit overwhelming but if I give gears 5 a fair assessment against other shooters this gen its a great game. The presentation is as good as any game, the control is fantastic and refined, shooting feedback was great and fun, the enhancements to Jack were a great addition, game opens up like no other gears game, storytelling was fantastic, the final chapters of act 2 are gears at its absolute best, and there is a full and varied multiplayer suite and not many games can say that. It's a great game.
 

Bosch

Banned
May 15, 2019
3,680
Gears tactics is really good. It deserves a sequence. For me top3 Xbox fp this gen.

Gears 5 is great, maybe or for sure the best Gears game. I think they should at least make 6 to finish the story and move on.

But Gears Tactics needs to continue.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,694
As people have said, I think a big part of the problem is that Microsoft has studios explicitly devoted to only one franchise. There's something grim about knowing in advance that this is what you're going to be getting from these studios, and when you reach the end of one game, instead of having a grand self-contained ending, it's going to be something that leads into the next game coming out in two or three years. Which I guess might work if you're super-invested in the Gears/Halo story and lore, but I'm not sure many people are so many years later.
 

Pyroblazer

Member
Oct 30, 2017
547
Gears is more than decent. I think the biggest criticism you can bring gears 5 is that it's gears and you may not care for it. The open sections were a tad repetitive but they weren't there too long, the final chapter/boss was a bit overwhelming but if I give gears 5 a fair assessment against other shooters this gen its a great game. The presentation is as good as any game, the control is fantastic and refined, shooting feedback was great and fun, the enhancements to Jack were a great addition, game opens up like no other gears game, storytelling was fantastic, the final chapters of act 2 are gears at its absolute best, and there is a full and varied multiplayer suite and not many games can say that. It's a great game.

For me it was only decent though. I don't think the storytelling of any Gears is really great. The shooting is pretty good, but gameplay-wise we really need new ideas for the franchise. I like the idea of adding a bit of Vanquish or Binary Domain to it. Or go a bit into the horror direction, doesn't need to be a whole game, but give me a scary survival horror level with some crazy scary enemies. There are possibilities.
The open environments got repetitive for me pretty quick.
That said Gears is a good game, no doubt about it. Just disagree with OP that it's an ignored GOTY-tier level game.
We had a similiar thread a few weeks ago where someone said Gears 5 is unfairly treated and ignored and on par with Sony's first party stuff like Bloodborne, God of War and Uncharted 4 and made a poll with those games and unsurprisingly Gears 5 came dead last in that poll. It's a good game and fine, just not more for most people, it doesn't have anything to do with it beeing a Gears game. If Gears 6 reinvents the franchise in the same way and quality like Breath Of The Wild, God Of War or Resident Evil 4 did, it will be praised everywhere and will get amazing scores. But Gears 5 was far away from that.
 

HeWhoWalks

Member
Jan 17, 2018
2,522
I mean people argued that God of War was tired, but they reinvigorated the franchise. I think there is still space in the Gears franchise do something new and fresh. I am just about to beat Gears Tacics which felt very fresh to me but still had that Gears feel.

God of War also got a 5 year break. Gears got the Ultimate Edition AND 4 within that timeframe. As much as I love the franchise, I agree that it needs a break + re-imagining.
 

EvilBoris

Prophet of Truth - HDTVtest
Verified
Oct 29, 2017
16,751
Gears 5 was a great game, so much better than 4.
If anything it proves they've got the franchise back on track.
Not that it's gonna change the mind of people who don't like Gears of War:
 

Mr.Deadshot

Member
Oct 27, 2017
20,285
It should have stayed in the last generation. Gears 4 and 5 aren't as good as 1-3. 5 isn't even a good game. It doesn't help that the developer changed. It's the same problem with Halo. You just can't replace someone like Epic Games or Bungie with your own internal studio. There will always be a lot of fans that will compare the new games with the "good old times". Expectations are just too high. And it becomes even more of a problem when the new games aren't as good as the old ones and also don't feel fresh. Or add stuff nobody asks for like a new main character in Halo 5 and open areas in Gears.

It's time for fresh Microsoft IPs. Leave everything behind and give us some interesting/unique worlds ... but yeah, we will get the next Halo, Gears, Forza (Horizon) and probably even a new Fable no one asked for anyway. That's just how Microsoft works and that's because they can't hold a candle to Nintendo and Sony when it comes down to First-Party-Games.
 

ThreepQuest64

Avenger
Oct 29, 2017
5,735
Germany
Double the studio size, make a new IP AND Gears 6, ha!

As someone who didn't play 360 era Gears games, I really liked Gears 5 and it made me play Gears 4 afterwards. I really looking forward to Kait's storyarc in a Gears 6. But I also want them to do something else and new because I want to see their take on other settings and stories.
 

lost7

Member
Feb 20, 2018
2,750
I enjoyed Gears 5, so I have no problem with the series continuing. I do think there would be a lot more excitement for a new IP from Coalition, though. They're clearly a super talented studio so I would love if they created something completely new
 

EinBear

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,688
I really enjoyed Gears 5, and whilst I would say there's definitely room for improvement (the open world sections felt very undercooked), I do think the 'this IP needs a rest' comments are a bit harsh. There was a five year gap between Gears 3 and 4, and then another three years between 4 and 5. It's not like they're cranking these things out annually. I'm well up for playing Gears 6 in 2022, even if it is just a similarly solid third person shooter.
 

TCG276

Member
Dec 17, 2017
520
I didn't play Gears 5, and the only Gears I've played is Gears 4, which was very mediocre imo. That being said, I agree that Gears should take a break and The Coalition should try a new IP. Gears is an old IP at this point, and it doesn't have the fanfare it once had. The studio has too much talent to be wasting it on old IP when MS desperately needs some first party hits.
 

KernelC

alt account
Banned
Aug 28, 2019
3,561
yeah, it is obvious Gears is holding them back. Although I would argue campaign was kinda mediocre with some really strong high moments. Horde and Survive modes suck though, and they suck badly
 

N.Domixis

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
9,208
Yes, that sounds good. My other personal wish is a dead space sort of survival horror, where hiding behind cover is about surviving by staying unseen and the big payoff at the end is finally getting a lancer and just chainsawing the shit out of the enemies who'd tormented you all game.



Picking on your comment out of many like it, so sorry for that, but why is it sad for Coalition to make 2 Gears games but just awesome for Sony to force Naughty Dog to crunch out 5 Uncharted games in a row? Or buy Insomniac to make them do Ratchet 11 and Spider Man God Only Knows How Many At This Point?

Yes, they did let Guerilla make Horizon after Killzone 4 proved that series was even deader than Gears is now. Hurray? Meanwhile SSM is still stuck on God of War 15 years later with no end in sight.

Feels like a huge double standard to me, especially when Rod Ferguson has said on the record that Coalition might do other things in the future.
Wrong. ND made 3 uncharteds, TLOU, Uncharted, TLOU, and who knows what comes next.

that's much better than uncharted,uncharted,uncharted,uncharted,uncharted. Even I would get bored of that many uncharteds back to back. TLOUS gives us some breathing room.
 

ghostcrew

The Shrouded Ghost
Administrator
Oct 27, 2017
30,503
As people have said, I think a big part of the problem is that Microsoft has studios explicitly devoted to only one franchise. There's something grim about knowing in advance that this is what you're going to be getting from these studios, and when you reach the end of one game, instead of having a grand self-contained ending, it's going to be something that leads into the next game coming out in two or three years. Which I guess might work if you're super-invested in the Gears/Halo story and lore, but I'm not sure many people are so many years later.

To be fair to them, that's not that unusual and it's certainly not limited to Xbox studios. What about Polyphony? What have SSM made since the original God of War in 2005? Hint: it's exclusively more God of War games.

Some studios specialise in making the same franchise because they do really well and people like them. That's not inherently a bad thing. They're not free from criticism and those studios have all definitely received their fair shake of criticism for not trying other things too. But...

vB5tZ1JHoiZQ.gif
 

N.Domixis

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
9,208
To be fair to them, that's not that unusual and it's certainly not limited to Xbox studios. What about Polyphony? What have SSM made since the original God of War in 2005? Hint: it's exclusively more God of War games.

Some studios specialise in making the same franchise because they do really well and people like them. That's not inherently a bad thing. They're not free from criticism and those studios have all definitely received their fair shake of criticism for not trying other things too. But...

vB5tZ1JHoiZQ.gif
Yeah, but atleast SMS revamped God of war and made it completely new. Before it I never cared for God of War. God of War Ps4 was the first one I liked.
 

Oneself

#TeamThierry
Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,839
Montréal, Québec, Canada
I hope they will do something else or at least reinvent the series next.
Gears 5 definitely is better than 4 and the different environments look really good etc but it's not GOTY tier sadly IMO. It wasn't ignored because of its name, it's just the most OK 3rd person shooter ever. It doesn't try anything really new, it feels dated in many areas especially gameplay, level & character design, plot / story and, well, that doesn't leave much other things.
 

ghostcrew

The Shrouded Ghost
Administrator
Oct 27, 2017
30,503
Yeah, but atleast SMS revamped God of war and made it completely new. Before it I never cared for God of War. God of War Ps4 was the first one I liked.

So what if, after God of War: Ascension we said 'if there's one thing God of War Ascension proved, is that SSM needs to do a new IP'?
 

dunkzilla

alt account
Banned
Dec 13, 2018
4,762
I agree OP, but came to the conclusion a different way. I loved Gears 1-3, but found myself really disliking 4. I got caught up in the hype for 5 and watched replays of all 4 games to get me back in the mood. I was so excited for 5 to drop, and then it did, and I played it for a couple of hours and uninstalled it. The gameplay just felt stale.
 

NippleViking

Member
May 2, 2018
4,511
To be fair to them, that's not that unusual and it's certainly not limited to Xbox studios. What about Polyphony? What have SSM made since the original God of War in 2005? Hint: it's exclusively more God of War games.

Some studios specialise in making the same franchise because they do really well and people like them. That's not inherently a bad thing. They're not free from criticism and those studios have all definitely received their fair shake of criticism for not trying other things too. But...

vB5tZ1JHoiZQ.gif
I agree with what you're saying, though I think part of the argument here is do enough people still like Gears to justify its existence going forward? And in its current form, on its current trajectory, I think there's a decent case to be made that - no, the audience simply is no longer there. Gears now subsists on relatively small albeit hardcore community, and whilst the series hasn't fallen from grace (the series is great, and continues to do well critically), its certainly fallen out of public conscience.

I definitely don't envy The Coalition for the tight spot they're in. Giving up and moving on the Gears IP forever almost assuredly isn't the right idea, especially given how much MS has invested in the IP these last few years, but I do think they need to firmly assess what parts of the series continue to alienate players - which is perhaps gameplay, stylistic, or both - and what features they can bring to the table to attract new players.
 
Nov 28, 2017
1,444
You want MSFT, who's invested millions (maybe more than a billion, but it's still undisclosed) for just the acquisition of this IP (let alone fully or partially funding the original quadrilogy's development), sold (except maybe Judgment, still don't have final Judgment figures) consistently above 5M copies (the original trilogy sold more than 7M copies, EACH) upon every release, and has been one of the 4 flagships of the Xbox brand, for almost 14 years, to be suddenly abandoned indefinitely, because you feel a studio's talent has potential to make different IP's?

Good luck with that.

Gears 6 is coming in 2022, whether you like it, or you don't.

Also, please look at the studio that you're quoting in your OP's name again. Read it out loud, but slowly...
 

ghostcrew

The Shrouded Ghost
Administrator
Oct 27, 2017
30,503
I agree with what you're saying, though I think part of the argument here is do enough people still like Gears to justify its existence going forward? And in its current form, on its current trajectory, I think there's a decent case to be made that - no, the audience simply is no longer there. Gears now subsists on relatively small albeit hardcore community, and whilst the series hasn't fallen from grace (the series is great, and continues to do well critically), its certainly fallen out of public conscience.

I definitely don't envy The Coalition for the tight spot they're in. Giving up and moving on the Gears IP forever almost assuredly isn't the right idea, especially given how much MS has invested in the IP these last few years, but I do think they need to firmly assess what parts of the series continue to alienate players - which is perhaps gameplay, stylistic, or both - and what features they can bring to the table to attract new players.

I think there's an argument that even if nobody else in the world is playing it (which isn't true), South America warrants Microsoft keeping Gears alive. It's a monster game there and probably keeps Xbox a hell of a lot more relevant than it otherwise would be.

You can look at the hours played stats of Xbox games in different countries and see that, right now in Mexico, Gears 5 is being played more than Monecraft, more than Destiny 2, more than Siege, more than Overwatch, more than Roblox etc. It's adored there. It's bizarre how it's so big there compared to the rest of the world. And, even if it doesn't pull the same kinda numbers as it used to (there's no denying that Gears isn't as mainstream as it used to be), it does well enough elsewhere to not just drop. It's still doing numbers in the UK that place it around Borderlands 3/Battlefield/The Division 2 type of numbers. It's not Battleborn. It still absolutely has a presence. I wouldn't drop that if I was MS. They've got enough other studios to be making new IP.
 

Thera

Banned
Feb 28, 2019
12,876
France
Picking on your comment out of many like it, so sorry for that, but why is it sad for Coalition to make 2 Gears games but just awesome for Sony to force Naughty Dog to crunch out 5 Uncharted games in a row? Or buy Insomniac to make them do Ratchet 11 and Spider Man God Only Knows How Many At This Point?

Yes, they did let Guerilla make Horizon after Killzone 4 proved that series was even deader than Gears is now. Hurray? Meanwhile SSM is still stuck on God of War 15 years later with no end in sight.

Feels like a huge double standard to me, especially when Rod Ferguson has said on the record that Coalition might do other things in the future.
All statement are valid. For Insomniac, let's see. The action / platformer genre is dead, so there is room for R&C.

Otherwise, yes. I my own experience, over 3 versions of the same game is not a good idea (RPG and Racing game aside).
I won't say UC 4 was a bad game, it was a good exepreience for me. It was litteraly more of the same. I am done with this type of gameplay.

GoW Ascension (4) => Bad idea
Then => Reboot.

Killzone SF (4) => Bad idea
Then => HZD

Infamous SS (3) => Serviceable
Then => GoT

TLoU didn't ask for a sequel but it happened. They said they are done with Nathan Drake. What will they do next? Reboot Uncharted gameplay with an other character or new IP. Let's see, I hope for the latter.
 

MrGiraffe

Member
Feb 27, 2020
478
The series is a moldy husk, and Gears 5 did little to revive it, despite expectations and some - at the end of the day - minor changes.

I don't think it needs to be a new IP. As several people have alluded to, God of War did it successfully and it was looking like Gears 5 could have done it. It just didn't dare enough and it ended up being just another Gears for me. I dropped it about 60-70% through the campaign.
 

Raide

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
16,596
As much as I enjoyed Gears 5, I do agree that it needs a rest. The Coalition is such a talented team and now the focus is on UE5, they are in a great position to make some of the best games using the new tech.

Personally I think they should make a MP focused standalone game. Drop the SP. F2P it and make it have classic MP, a Battlefield style mode and a BR mode. Gears is missing a really interesting MP hook, since they just seem to be pumping out the same old MP feel over and over. No wonder people are bored. Imagine a Gears MP game based upon the Pendulum Wars, which is where everyone wants to play anyway. Massive battles, vehicles, destruction but using a similar cover system as classic.
 

ghostcrew

The Shrouded Ghost
Administrator
Oct 27, 2017
30,503
Personally I think they should make a MP focused standalone game. Drop the SP. F2P it and make it have classic MP, a Battlefield style mode and a BR mode. Gears is missing a really interesting MP hook, since they just seem to be pumping out the same old MP feel over and over. No wonder people are bored. Imagine a Gears MP game based upon the Pendulum Wars, which is where everyone wants to play anyway. Massive battles, vehicles, destruction but using a similar cover system as classic.

This is exactly where I'm at. These conversations almost always revolve around how people didn't like the campaign and that they dropped it or whatever. Meanwhile, the hardcore that still stick with Gears are all about the multiplayer. I've played Gears 5 for hundreds of hours and I haven't even beaten Act 1 of the campaign. I don't care about it at all.

They should drop the campaign and transition Gears into a solely multiplayer franchise. Apex Legends it up. Give us traditional Versus, Horde, Escape and something new.

Gears camapign is stuck in being a traditional feeling game because they're restrained by a multiplayer crowd that won't accept any changes to the formula. So just lob it off.
 

Kill3r7

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,905
Id was able to revitalize Doom. So it is possible for Gears to find its footing again as long as they are able to reinvent the franchise while staying true to its roots.

Edit: Agreed with other posters who say they need a better MP hook. I have beaten every single Gears game but only spend hundreds of hours on Gears 1&2 because of MP.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,694
To be fair to them, that's not that unusual and it's certainly not limited to Xbox studios. What about Polyphony? What have SSM made since the original God of War in 2005? Hint: it's exclusively more God of War games.

Some studios specialise in making the same franchise because they do really well and people like them. That's not inherently a bad thing. They're not free from criticism and those studios have all definitely received their fair shake of criticism for not trying other things too. But...

vB5tZ1JHoiZQ.gif

I get that. But it feels a bit different to react to the success of a game by making more, than it does to set up a studio that only makes games in a certain franchise. Sony Santa Monica might have only made God of War games (and I guess it seems likely that they'll be making God of War games for the foreseeable future too), but it seems more organic than it would have if they'd publicly stated their intention to only make God of War games and changed their name to 'Team Kratos' a decade ago.

Racing sims are a bit different, and all the specialised tech involved means that any studio that commits to that is in it for a long haul of iteration -- their expertise can't easily be transferred to any other type of game, and a new studio would have a hard time catching up with them.
 

NippleViking

Member
May 2, 2018
4,511
I think there's an argument that even if nobody else in the world is playing it (which isn't true), South America warrants Microsoft keeping Gears alive. It's a monster game there and probably keeps Xbox a hell of a lot more relevant than it otherwise would be.
Yes, this is a very good point. Mexico as well.

Totally agree with your recommendation as well. I've long wondered how these two audiences would react if MS forked the multiplayer of Gears into its own entry, enabling the Coalition to either work on a dedicated singleplayer Gears game or a new IP. My understanding is that it's the multiplayer which they care for, and not necessarily Gear's singleplayer narrative.

Separating Gears multiplayer could also be extremely beneficial to its community.
 

Bioshocker

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,208
Sweden
I liked Gears 5 and I also liked Gears of War 4. Think they're pretty even tbh, Gears 5 is a little better overall. But despite that I agree that The Coalition should take a break from Gears now and develop a completely new IP.
 

Ricky_R

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
3,997
Wasn't Death Stranding GOTY 2019?

Anyway, I've never clicked with Gears tbh, but I was hopeful Gears 5 would change that as it looked quite good before release, but once I played it I just couldn't muster interest to keep going. The franchise is just boring and unexciting for me.

I would definitely like for them to make a new IP, but I know there are a lot of Gears fans out there that may want more Gears and if the franchise is still successful for Xbox then I wouldn't blame them if they keep making them.
 

KernelC

alt account
Banned
Aug 28, 2019
3,561
Yes, this is a very good point. Mexico as well.

Totally agree with your recommendation as well. I've long wondered how these two audiences would react if MS forked the multiplayer of Gears into its own entry, enabling the Coalition to either work on a dedicated singleplayer Gears game or a new IP. My understanding is that it's the multiplayer which they care for, and not necessarily Gear's singleplayer narrative.

Separating Gears multiplayer could also be extremely beneficial to its community.
But even Gears 5 fell flat on Mexico, it had a great launch and then everyone went back to Fortnite
 

Raide

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
16,596
This is exactly where I'm at. These conversations almost always revolve around how people didn't like the campaign and that they dropped it or whatever. Meanwhile, the hardcore that still stick with Gears are all about the multiplayer. I've played Gears 5 for hundreds of hours and I haven't even beaten Act 1 of the campaign. I don't care about it at all.

They should drop the campaign and transition Gears into a solely multiplayer franchise. Apex Legends it up. Give us traditional Versus, Horde, Escape and something new.

Gears camapign is stuck in being a traditional feeling game because they're restrained by a multiplayer crowd that won't accept any changes to the formula. So just lob it off.
I fully agree. I think The Coalition are hamstrung by Gears and having to make this MP focused game and continue this crazy big SP thing they have going on. Tbh, nobody really cares anymore. Refocus the MP and expand on it to draw more people in. The SP, drop it and move onto a fresh new IP and push the SP like mad. They have the tech chops for sure.

I cannot be the only one that dreams about Battlefield Gears.
 

ShinUltramanJ

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,951
Gears V was braindead boring to me. Walk around and shoot. Walk around and shoot. Ride the skiff to get to shooting section. Walk around and shoot. Zzzzzzzzz

Gears V's shooting isn't good enough to carry the game. I'd much rather see a new ip.
 

Stooge

Member
Oct 29, 2017
11,532
Part of the problem with both Gears and Halo is the core story of the franchise was finished back on the 360. Like, we saved the world in both games and there was no threat to humanity left.

Both series are still good quality games but my give-a-shit about both franchises went way down this gen.
 

ebs

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
443
The improvement from Gears 4 to 5 is so big that I'm very keen to see what happens Gears 6.

That said. Given the incredibly talented team they clearly have, I'd be even more excited for a new IP. Microsoft has nothing fresh.
 

MasterLeePhD

Member
Oct 28, 2017
69
Loved Gears 5 campaign but preferred Gears 4 Multiplayer. The loot box system kept me coming back to 4... Didn't even buy any with real money, but I'd play until I earned enough in game coins to purchase them. Gears 5 mp model is rubbish and I fell off quick.

Anyway I'd love for the coalition to take a stab at something new.
 

cgcg

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
430
The game is boring a fuck and it's my first Gear game too. Got it on PC gamepass and can't be bothered to finish it. Its like they've taken the most boring aspects of shooters (crazy bullet sponges, awkward cover system) and added in the most boring aspects of open world (pointless traversal over the most bland environments). I mean how much that is on the dev and not the franchise? I've no idea since this was my first gears game but will doing something new is going to help?
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,343
new jersey
The game is boring a fuck and it's my first Gear game too. Got it on PC gamepass and can't be bothered to finish it. Its like they've taken the most boring aspects of shooters (crazy bullet sponges, awkward cover system) and added in the most boring aspects of open world (pointless traversal over the most bland environments). I mean how much that is on the dev and not the franchise? I've no idea since this was my first gears game but will doing something new is going to help?
Why did you decide to play the 5th entry of a game series as your first game? Isn't the original Gears UE on gamepass?