Forbes Contributor: Disney’s ‘Star Wars’ Has Been Swallowed Whole By Nostalgia (The Mandalorian S2 spoilers)
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I never watched the cartoons, they seemed dumb to me and not worth my time.
None of the stuff in Mandalorian appeals to my nostalgia of the cartoons, since I don't have nostalgia for something I never knew, yet it's still been pretty damn good in my opinion
Fair enough, thanks for the head's up. I just finished Mando S2 a little bit ago, so I wasn't looking in too deep for fear of spoilers (which was starting to become an issue, so I picked up the pace on my viewing).
But it is worth pondering in a topic about Star Wars and Fanservice that Boba Fett and Ahsoka are getting shows out of this and not some of the more original characters.
Honestly, really looking forward to Acolyte. Figure a new setting like the High Republic has a good chance of getting something intriguing going on, given it's not established yet.
Also no one hates Star Wars fans more than Star Wars fans.
It is fan service, but I'm personally ok with it lol. Though, I think a lot of people don't know who Ahsoka is. I've never watched the cartoons before and I'm sure a lot of others haven't either. Can be new and unique to a lot of people.
People liked the Luke arrival in Mandalorian because Disney originally promised an entire trilogy that included the return of Luke, Leia, and Han, just to take a giant dump on all three of them and leave hopefuls bitter. For Luke to show up and even moderately resemble the Luke we remember was unexpected and appreciated.
That might change with Disney Plus. Honestly considering finally watching it myself. Figured, why not? Not the biggest fan of the era due to the Prequel Films, but hey, if good material got made with it, I might as well watch.
First, I couldn't get over the animation of the computer generated ones. Looked awful to me. Beyond that, I caught a couple episodes of one of them (the first one - Clone Wars?) and didn't have any interest in the time period or stories told or the presentation or really much of anything about it. 2-3 episodes of a six season show isn't giving it a chance, sure, but it didn't appeal to me.
I loved the Thrawn Trilogy and the first XWing books, that immediate post RotJ period was more my speed.
I did watch the Tartakovsky Clone Wars cartoon last year after much prodding, and I thought that was good -- so there was one cartoon I liked.
oh I'm with you. I've been thinking about it too. Only reason I haven't yet is because there is a lot lol.
Fair. Honestly, the issue with watching TV back in the day pre-DVR was once you fell behind, it just got hard to get the will to catch up.
But streaming makes watching from the beginning more viable. I like it being on my schedule vs the whims of whatever channel decides to shove the show you like on the 3AM slot.
And manages to do so while not making every main character an unlikable fuckup. Best Star Wars media since the OT.
Edit: also, I've never seen either Clone Wars or Rebels and had no problem understanding everything in Mando. No need to have watched them at all.
Yeah, I mean the sequel trilogy only ever told us Luke lost everything. It never showed us what he lost, so the impact of that loss obviously isn't as big as it should be. That seems to be what Favreau and Filoni are fixing and it may make watching Luke lose everything resonate much more.
Rangers of the New Republic is a show about all new or recently introduced characters
Whatever, Mando for the most part is good comfort food fun, sometimes I just hate being reminded that everything ends up with the sequel trilogy events.
Though I never liked post ROTJ stories, even in Legends. I don't need to see anymore cray cray bullshit with Sith, superweapons, and invading aliens after the picture perfect fairy tale ending of ROTJ. SWs just can't help but stay away from galaxy ending conflicts so no matter what path you choose it ends up fucking over ROTJ in some way and whatever new "ending" you try will never come close to being as good. Tolkien had it right when he scrapped the sequel to LOTR, sometimes you just got to let things be instead of being all "realistic" with everything inevitably going to back being to depressing shit.
Though I never liked post ROTJ stories, even in Legends. I don't need to see anymore cray cray bullshit with Sith, superweapons, and invading aliens after the picture perfect fairy tale ending of ROTJ. SWs just can't help but stay away from galaxy ending conflicts so no matter what path you choose it ends up fucking over ROTJ in some way and whatever new "ending" you try will never come close to being as good. Tolkien had it right when he scrapped the sequel to LOTR, sometimes you just got to let things be instead of being all "realistic" with everything inevitably going to back being to depressing shit.
Ah. I was ok with that. He inevitably showed up "on your left?". Hearing him was more than enough for me to understand the significance.
I enjoy the Mandalorian just fine, but I agree the ending of season two did nothing for me since I'm not a super fan of the series/universe. The only thing going through my head during the final episode climax was "I wonder what old character is going to be dragged out now", like they could have brought back Mace windu and I would have felt the exact same.
I can enjoy it while also wanting so so badly for the series to go into the future and to stop with the, " Hey fans do you remember this?? You like that Childhood nostalgia into your veins ??? who cares how thin the story iss ;)))"
What is wrong with holding on to pieces of nostalgia. I don't ever want to move past the best SW. Luke's appearance was the greatest thing ever!!
I popped.
I popped.
This is one aspect of pop culture that just drives me up the fucking wall...as soon as some big, cool zeitgeist moment happens that almost everyone loves and enjoys there always has to be some asshole real quick to say "hey this suck, I'm smarter than you, and lemme tell ya why"....
For fucking crying out loud...just let people enjoy stuff, esp. with what's going on in the world.
For fucking crying out loud...just let people enjoy stuff, esp. with what's going on in the world.
My god people want action in a Star WARS movie? What the hell is wrong with those people!?
Also they want to see the space wizards use laser swords which is probably the only unique thing about Star Wars.
I agree with this article.
I want Star Wars stories that are as far away as possible from the stories we already know. Let's have the next set of movies take place at least a century after TROS. Heck, let's go further. The next set of movies should take place a 1,000 years after the current era of stories we keep getting. Give me a galaxy that is far removed from the same old empire/first order vs rebel/ resistance set up. Give me new Star Wars iconography. Give me something new. The galaxy of Star Wars is vast and so full of possibilities. Exploring that possibility is the only thing that would get me excited about this franchise again.
I want Star Wars stories that are as far away as possible from the stories we already know. Let's have the next set of movies take place at least a century after TROS. Heck, let's go further. The next set of movies should take place a 1,000 years after the current era of stories we keep getting. Give me a galaxy that is far removed from the same old empire/first order vs rebel/ resistance set up. Give me new Star Wars iconography. Give me something new. The galaxy of Star Wars is vast and so full of possibilities. Exploring that possibility is the only thing that would get me excited about this franchise again.
I thought I'd hate if it was Luke. I didn't. I loved season 2. I loved the front half feeling like action adventure Tremors type of stuff. I wasn't super interested in the idea of Book of Boba Fett, then I heard that Robert Rodriguez was going to be show runner and now I am.
Honestly this is how I feel about the series too after Rise of Skywalker. I still haven't seen The Mandalorian because of it.
I'm not sure I would go so far as to say that nostalgia has "swallowed" the franchise, but it's definitely dragging it down. The Luke scene itself was fine (CGI aside). I'd be a little warmer to it, I suppose, if it hadn't immediately followed Boba Fett's reintroduction.
Lol, fuck off with this childish nonsense.
Lol, fuck off with this childish nonsense.
why do people think wiping the slate clean was a good thing, it wasn't and by doing so put issue that this star wars turned into nostalgia and retreads when when it didn't have to, they could have kept the EU and adapted to something new and interesting, the EU has years of doing new things and expanding the story of star wars, it wouldn't have been a retread of the OT, to simply adapt one of those stories,
When disney wiped the slate clean all expansion and potential was killed for empire vs rebellion again, a new hope again, esb and rotj again.
and My opinion of mandalorion what happened wasn't simple fanservice for the sake of fanservice, it's narrative fanservice so you don't have to re-explain a character or back story and you can just relay that these characters have a history but you can be invested in them.
lets take the marshals introduction and ashoka's, when cobb is introduced we are given a good portion of the episode having and exposition flash explaining his backstory taking away from grogu and din, when ashoka was introduced everything in that character moment is focused on grogu ashoka doesn't explain who she is but you can feel the wait in her words, you can tell she has a backstory and it causes her pain( for good reason) but ashoka isnt the main character, she doesn't need to explain everything about her
and about the luke thing yes its fanservice but it's also not without purpose, that group in that moment needed help, we are shown just how strong dark troopers are and gideons words are true they could barely handle one now they are up against a platoon. You are a viewer are left with questions how are they going to get out of this, how his din going to get grogu to the jedi he contacted, who is that jedi? we get the answer to all of those questions with the only logical choice luke and we all knew luke was the only choice of the 4 still active jedi that we know
Ashoka already said no, Cal at the end of fallen order he had chosen not to rebuild the order and to not interfere with the futures of force sensitive children he basically quit being a jedi, Ezra still missing according to filoni, luke is the only choice
so we got a scene, a scene many of us waited a really long time to see the hero at the hieght of his power, at the height of his legend wrecking shop.
does that moment take away from the emotional moment that follows no, it still heartbreaking to see din give up his son, but we were told from the beginning he had chosen from the beginning he would give grogu up to a jedi who would train him, what people didn't expect was it to be so soon.
Hard disagree. The greater connections to Star Wars lore is the icing that keeps the show fun, and feeling like Star Wars.
"Star Wars" as a thing is a pulp drama. Filled with coincidences, near misses, and narrow escapes. It's supposed to make you feel like there's magic in the world, and the connections/cameos do just that.
That said, focusing on that ignores what The Mandalorian is really about. Yes, a story of personal growth, and empathy as we see the Mando develop into a father that would do anything for his little guy (even forsake his own beliefs).
But ALSO a return to Star Wars being overtly political. One of my favorite through lines on S2 is the X-Wing pilots. The New Republic is fucking up their shot. Instead of the glorious return to freedom you'd assume came after Jedi, they're returning to being the bureaucratic pedants that we saw in the prequels, and potentially breeding pro-empire sentiment. ("One day, They'll miss us." says one true believing Imperial officer.) Those around the fringes actively preferring fascism that turns a blind eye to their dealings, as opposed to a bunch of well meaning "nannys". It's got a light dread to it, that is pretty topical.
Pretending like it's a giant nostalgia hole undervalues what's actually going on on screen.
"Star Wars" as a thing is a pulp drama. Filled with coincidences, near misses, and narrow escapes. It's supposed to make you feel like there's magic in the world, and the connections/cameos do just that.
That said, focusing on that ignores what The Mandalorian is really about. Yes, a story of personal growth, and empathy as we see the Mando develop into a father that would do anything for his little guy (even forsake his own beliefs).
But ALSO a return to Star Wars being overtly political. One of my favorite through lines on S2 is the X-Wing pilots. The New Republic is fucking up their shot. Instead of the glorious return to freedom you'd assume came after Jedi, they're returning to being the bureaucratic pedants that we saw in the prequels, and potentially breeding pro-empire sentiment. ("One day, They'll miss us." says one true believing Imperial officer.) Those around the fringes actively preferring fascism that turns a blind eye to their dealings, as opposed to a bunch of well meaning "nannys". It's got a light dread to it, that is pretty topical.
Pretending like it's a giant nostalgia hole undervalues what's actually going on on screen.
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Luke at his peak is the end of TLJ where he uses the Force to singlehandedly save the Resistance, secure the future of the Jedi, and set the First Order on the path to defeat -- all while embodying the ideals of the Jedi Order in their purest form. No flashy choppy choppy or Starkiller hijinks needed.
i never got this complaint, star wars has always been about the skywalkers, they are the protagonists and antagonists of the story, it's like saying why is batman is always bruce wayne or superman is always clark kent, star wars outside of the Eu old republic has never really escaped them vader. luke their kids or grandkids were always involved
to me the sticking to the skywalker complaint to use your example "man i like harry potter but i wish we could get away from this harry kid so it could be more interesting" that's how it feels to me
Awesome, bring even more !
Clone Wars live action flashbacks let's go !
She smiles at Luke actually.
The others have helmets haha. I think they're all intimidated to be in the presence of "the legend".
Which is entirely undermined by the fact that he
- Couldn't sense dark side users plotting the whole time
- He let snoke pervert Kylo (he mentions Snoke himself so he knew all about him)
- He ran away like a coward and abandoned his friends and family to get murdered one by one, as well as literally half the galaxy
- Allowed the first order to raise to power with two dark side users of incredible strength while the Alliance was still having the edge
- Was so certain Jedi should end but changed his mind after 4 hours of meeting Rey, making the lack of proper context of his exile unbearable and nonsensical
Clone Wars live action flashbacks let's go !
She smiles at Luke actually.
The others have helmets haha. I think they're all intimidated to be in the presence of "the legend".
Which is entirely undermined by the fact that he
- Couldn't sense dark side users plotting the whole time
- He let snoke pervert Kylo (he mentions Snoke himself so he knew all about him)
- He ran away like a coward and abandoned his friends and family to get murdered one by one, as well as literally half the galaxy
- Allowed the first order to raise to power with two dark side users of incredible strength while the Alliance was still having the edge
- Was so certain Jedi should end but changed his mind after 4 hours of meeting Rey, making the lack of proper context of his exile unbearable and nonsensical
Giving people what they want is not inherently a bad thing.
If we have more Mandalorian type Star Wars content on the way, then great. It's the best thing Disney has done with Star Wars and its not even close
Mandalorian is basically written the same as clone wars so I don't know why you would feel that way.
I'm of two minds of the mandalorian finale -
On one hand the finale was quite fantastic, exciting, possibly even beautiful in its usage of the star wars legacy, and it was fully enjoyable to me
On the other hand, I do not think this show in any way should be mistaken for any sort of high art or "best show of the year" or anything like that, it exists purely on a basic popcorn action flick logic that serves itself to the lowest common denominator without really any depth whatsoever, and if star wars were to transcend itself past being this it would definitely be a higher quality franchise, but honestly I'm not sure if it even needs to do this. People are perfectly fine with this franchise just being a series of action figures mashing together basically and I roughly am too as long as its acknowledged as being such
I do think some of the other announced star wars properties like The Acolyte sound like they could actually be higher quality, with that show in particular taking place at a completely different time and with a high quality creator attached
On one hand the finale was quite fantastic, exciting, possibly even beautiful in its usage of the star wars legacy, and it was fully enjoyable to me
On the other hand, I do not think this show in any way should be mistaken for any sort of high art or "best show of the year" or anything like that, it exists purely on a basic popcorn action flick logic that serves itself to the lowest common denominator without really any depth whatsoever, and if star wars were to transcend itself past being this it would definitely be a higher quality franchise, but honestly I'm not sure if it even needs to do this. People are perfectly fine with this franchise just being a series of action figures mashing together basically and I roughly am too as long as its acknowledged as being such
I do think some of the other announced star wars properties like The Acolyte sound like they could actually be higher quality, with that show in particular taking place at a completely different time and with a high quality creator attached
While true, the bar is incredibly low in that regard.
RoTS was high budget fan fiction so Mandalorian had nowhere to go but up.
....it literally became nonsensical at the end
The dude didn't even gave his name to Mando after he Deux Ex Fanserviced
It will be impossible to find baby yoda without this person's name.
I think they knew who he was.
Also how is it Deus Ex? There was an entire episode of Grogu calling to him.
That FFVIIR reference makes him sound like a pseudo intellectual dumbass.
I liked the first season, wasn't anything more then a interesting story in the Star Wars universe centered on slightly interesting, new character(s) and their dynamics but season 2; nothing groundbreaking and definitely didn't do much for as a casual viewer of Star Wars based media.
But season 2 felt like mostly winks and nods. It was made for SWs fans. Not to say it's a bad thing. But at same time, it was definitely doing so in way that was a detriment to itself. Nothing about it felt genuine.
The lackluster finale was the icing on the mediocre cake for me personally. Felt incredibly anticlimactic and rushed along with no sense of real stakes to be lost... just going through the motions to build towards a fan servicing reveal.
Like all the crap they unloaded suddenly didn't matter once he showed up.
But season 2 felt like mostly winks and nods. It was made for SWs fans. Not to say it's a bad thing. But at same time, it was definitely doing so in way that was a detriment to itself. Nothing about it felt genuine.
The lackluster finale was the icing on the mediocre cake for me personally. Felt incredibly anticlimactic and rushed along with no sense of real stakes to be lost... just going through the motions to build towards a fan servicing reveal.
Like all the crap they unloaded suddenly didn't matter once he showed up.
They who? Because mando barely heard fairy tales of the Jedi
The only person who knew him for sure was Boba Fett and he never came back.. And if he was there he would HATE luke
Baby Yoda called any jedi. To the seeing stone. To fiND him there, in the moment they most needed a help from a jedi is pure Deus ex machina
So much that if Mando and his crew had waited in the cantina Baby Yoda would be safe by the end