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Pikachu

Traded his Bone Marrow for Pizza
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,402
Some quotes from Twitter, Steam forums, PS4 Reddit AMA.

Inject Joy into my neck if old.

For context - the quote that Jim "misunderstood":

"Sure! We Happy Few is inspired by, among other things, prescription drug culture — the idea that no one should have to be sad if they can pop a pill and fix it. It's also about Happy Facebook culture: no one shares their bad news because it would bring everyone down. As a culture, we no longer value sadness."
https://web.archive.org/web/2016081...s-making-a-comeback-with-an-eerie-1960s-twist

On Jim Sterling and that "be sad rather than take drugs" interpretation:

I don't fault Jim for calling out bugs, and I am equally as frustrated as he is that he faced the issues he did. No one wants to ship a game that makes someone that mad. He does overstate the issues with the game a fair bit (and is wrong in terms of why those issues are happening), but hey, that's what his channel is about. He's a hyperbole guy, not a developer. There's a reason why his video is so angry when other reviews aren't.

/start rant

I am frustrated though that he misinterpreted a statement from our narrative director about the game's exploration of prescription drug culture. As a result, our ND and his wife have been receiving constant attacks from social justice advocates on twitter for the last few days... even though they have literally written a game about prescription drugs and dealt with these issues in a humane, kind and interesting way. They are kind, good people, and We Happy Few is an excellent, nuanced, story.

I contacted Jim, and he posted a statement being disappointed in people doing that. I appreciate him for doing that. However, it hasn't stopped - unfortunately, once people get started on this kind of thing they won't stop. Jim's video in August last year about Gearbox did the same thing, leading to review bombing and a ton of harrassment thrown our way for months. That bothers me.

I don't care why someone is an asshole online. Most think they're righteous, whether that's a social justice warrior or an alt-right instigator. I'm sick of people treating others badly, particularly on twitter - it's not a medium that deals well with complex topics.

The world would be a far better place if instead of getting angry we just asked "hey, what's up with that" and genuinely listened to the answer.

On pS4 (at least) bugs:

We're aiming for a hotfix to temporarily fix the save corruption issue. We're also working on a patch to improve framerate and a range of other bugs. The rendering issues you're talking about are caused by pretty intense load on the CPU and hard drive of the PS4 and Xbox - not issues that you guys would probably hear a lot about - which is causing the pop ins etc.

I am genuinely sorry for these issues - we had to back out some optimizations last minute because they were too unstable, and it caused a fairly significant drop in framerate for the day 1 version. Unfortunately we weren't able to delay release due to the retail builds being out in the wild.

I'm hoping to have a build today to fix the save issue and a few other bugs, and we'll then need to go through cert. That can take up to 5 days for the first patch. We're working on a bigger optimization and bug fixing patch too, which we'll push out as soon as we're comfortable it is stable.

On releasing a broken game:

I think you're overestimating independent teams' resources, and assuming that we're all the same.

In our case, I don't think this game is a "buggy broken product". The console versions are not at the framerate that we wanted, which causes a lot of the visible issues that you see... but that's not really a lot of bugs. Really just consequences of lower framerate. The game itself has almost no progression blockers, except for one issue that we had never seen before on release (the issue with keys randomly not spawning where they are supposed to).

We released because we had to. If we could have delayed the console versions we might have, but it wasn't an option. You can sum it up as "we thought we could optimize in the time we had and we got 95% of the way there". Unfortunately that 5% caused the issues that people are seeing on PS4.

On Gearbox:
We wrote about this in detail at the time about why we were doing what we were doing. We had a full scoped game on the way, with a significant amount of new content. We had reinvested, and believed that the increased game scope and quality was worth an increase in price - and importantly it needed to be the same price everywhere, and retail games are $60. Gearbox came on to publish the game - no development funding, just helping us getting it to retail and, importantly to PS4.

Yeah, most people don't want to hear that unfortunately. They'd rather stroke their Gearbox hate boner (pardon the appalling analogy but I feel like it's the best way I can describe it), than hear about how Gearbox are good people that did everything in their power to help us create the game we wanted to create. I've said it before, but Gearbox are not the enemies that the vocal minority think.


More:
https://www.reddit.com/r/PS4/comments/97izv4/we_are_compulsion_games_who_made_contrast_and_we/

https://steamcommunity.com/app/320240/discussions/0/1736588252369024447/

 
Last edited:

atomsk

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,492
User warned: Victim blaming.
Jim's video in August last year about Gearbox did the same thing, leading to review bombing and a ton of harrassment thrown our way for months. That bothers me.

Maybe don't take a publishing deal from Gearbox then?

Randy still says A:CM is a good game, know what you're getting into.

Increasing the price with other publishers and most people wouldn't have given it a second thought.
 
OP
OP
Pikachu

Pikachu

Traded his Bone Marrow for Pizza
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,402
They state that Gearbox didn't offer any funding. I wonder what they actually did offer then?

Gearbox came on to publish the game - no development funding, just helping us getting it to retail and, importantly to PS4.

(The game wasn't originally planned to have a physical release)
 

CloseTalker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,168
Gearbox are good people that did everything in their power to help us create the game we wanted to create. I've said it before, but Gearbox are not the enemies that the vocal minority think.

Maybe don't take a publishing deal from Gearbox then?

Randy still says A:CM is a good game, know what you're getting into.

Increasing the price with other publishers and most people wouldn't have given it a second thought.


I love how we know better than the people who worked on the game.
 

Zacmortar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,383
Okay, but it doesn't matter what you're game says about the drugs when the marketting and premise is anti-drug itself. Regardless of intent it's still damaging and shitty, and even with that good intent, I still haven't seen how it's nuanced besides "people take drug to forget and not be sad and thats bad apparently"
 

R dott B

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,142
As a result, our ND and his wife have been receiving constant attacks from social justice advocates on twitter for the last few days

Jim's video in August last year about Gearbox did the same thing, leading to review bombing and a ton of harrassment thrown our way for months.

Gamers are gross...

I've been enjoying my time with the game and I'm glad I backed it in 2015.
 

OrdinaryPrime

Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
11,042
1. People really need to stop harassing creators online. It's fucking pathetic honestly.
2. Using language like social justice warrior sincerely is stupid.
3. Pitchford sucks for documented reasons, I think people should just call him out and not the whole company. It's not really fair.
 

CloseTalker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,168

OrdinaryPrime

Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
11,042
I love how we know better than the people who worked on the game.

In general, this type of thinking is fallacious. For instance, the person that did DSFix (I'm not sure if they still post here) wouldn't have made the first Dark Souls port on PC such a success if he adopted this thinking.

For the people calling out Gearbox, Randy has consistently maintained his position on previous projects despite the ample evidence to the contrary. Call him out specifically, this generalization sucks.

Interesting choice of words.

You can just say shitty, that's what you mean and I totally agree.
 

CloseTalker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,168
In general, this type of thinking is fallacious. For instance, the person that did DSFix (I'm not sure if they still post here) wouldn't have made the first Dark Souls port on PC such a success if he adopted this thinking.
I'm not referencing the bugs, I'm referencing how people shit on Gearbox and how they must be to work with, despite the devs saying they were great partners. That the game is so buggy is probably due in large part to Gearbox being so hands-off and just helping out with publishing duties.
 

Liliana

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
3,375
NYC
I really soured on Jim, he became toxic.


I feel like he's the same as he's always been, it's just that the community around him has grown out of the kind of content he provides. Watching his videos now, it just makes your eyes roll.

He is absolutely toxic but wont catch any hell for it because hes "protecting the consumer"

Agreed with all of you. Jim really went downhill from his days at Destructiod.
 

JayWood2010

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,120
I like We Happy Few. Buggy sure, but excellent story. I think the gameplay is fine personally, but whatever I suppose.

People like Jim is toxic.
 

TheBeardedOne

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
22,189
Derry
I'm not a fan of Jim, and I didn't watch his video. It's too bad that his misinterpretations led to people spitefully attacking innocent people on Twitter, which has turned into a dump.

Jim's over-sensational and annoying, and way too full of himself for my taste. I've never liked his stuff.

As for We Happy Few: I really looked forward to it. I wish it came out later though, because I'm burned out on gaming. I did get it and have played two hours, but I just don't feel like playing more right now. What I have played was alright, but it's failed to really suck me in and I've gotten stuck because the nearby "hole in the fence" is nonexistent. But I don't think that's a bug. I think they just meant a gate, which requires a lock pick I can't find more materials to make because I unknowingly wasted all mine on filing cabinet lockpicking.

I don't think it's bad, and two hours are too early to judge a game on. There are things I like and don't like, but my excitement level has not been met.
 

replicantUK

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
838
United Kingdom
Jim Sterling needs to take responsibility for his words. Mentioned a few times, but I've stopped supporting him on Patreon and consuming his content. He fuels this type of hyperbole through misrepresentation and over exaggerations.

He also needs to get over his toxic obsession with Gearbox.
 

OrdinaryPrime

Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
11,042
I'm not referencing the bugs, I'm referencing how people shit on Gearbox and how they must be to work with, despite the devs saying they were great partners. That the game is so buggy is probably due in large part to Gearbox being so hands-off and just helping out with publishing duties.

People are lazy. Buggy game A and buggy game B published by the same company is all it takes for them to make uninformed comments.

From what I remember of playing Contrast back around the launch of PS4 and XB1, it seemed pretty buggy as well. Does anyone know how big Compulsion Games is in terms of resources?
 

skeezx

Member
Oct 27, 2017
20,337
i have sympathy as i'm not a fan of jim's output the last few years or so. i feel it's just calling out the obvious and making an 'episode' out of what we're already 'outraged' about. and of course harassment is ridiculous in this situation if that's what's really going on

but brass tacks you release a broken game published by Gearbox... buy the ticket, take the ride
 

Bubbavelli

Member
Oct 27, 2017
119
Agreed with all of you. Jim really went downhill from his days at Destructiod.

The interesting thing is that he was, from what i remember, *fine* at The Escapist. he only really became the gamerbaby when he started a patreon. Makes you think how easy it is to sell a product if youre a curated type of insufferable
 

CloseTalker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,168
People are lazy. Buggy game A and buggy game B published by the same company is all it takes for them to make uninformed comments.

From what I remember of playing Contrast back around the launch of PS4 and XB1, it seemed pretty buggy as well. Does anyone know how big Compulsion Games is in terms of resources?
I'm not sure. But I tend to get defensive when smaller devs get shit on for releasing less than perfect games, especially when they're pretty ambitious relative to the team size. You can think it's overpriced and buggy, but it's still people creating something new, which is more than 95% of the people here have done. Don't like it, or don't think it's worth the money? Don't buy it, and move on. No need to be shitheads about it, it's not like anyone here has personal stake in We Happy Few.
 

JINX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,483
People are lazy. Buggy game A and buggy game B published by the same company is all it takes for them to make uninformed comments.

From what I remember of playing Contrast back around the launch of PS4 and XB1, it seemed pretty buggy as well. Does anyone know how big Compulsion Games is in terms of resources?
Contrast was made by a very small team, while We Happy Few back in 2016 had around 16. When they decided to pivot the game to what people wanted, they slowly grew to now 35 and spent the last year adding story.
 

Painguy

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,024
California
Yeah, the way Jim over reacted on his video wasn't cool. The game obviously has its issues. It's okay to point it out, but don't be a dick about it. It really isn't that hard to be nice and professional. I think Jims attitude on video games stems from a lack of knowledge in the nitty gritty of game development. I don't mean any disrespect towards Jim, but I personally don't feel that he understands exactly how hard it is to make a video game. Oooorrrr I could just be an idiot and completely wrong....idk.
 
OP
OP
Pikachu

Pikachu

Traded his Bone Marrow for Pizza
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,402
I don't have an opinion on the part about drugs/depression because I didn't watch that video, but I did watch the 15 minute impressions one. He clearly can back up the bugs, and there's a point where he goes on a positivity rant about he loves the art design, writing, concept, etc so I can't say I think the video is a complete dumpster fire.

I generally don't like Jim because his videos always seem to be "you've already heard about this problem - here's my identical take to everyone else, but three days later!"
 

DarthWalden

Prophet of Truth
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
6,030
I actually really appreciate such candid responses from the developer here.

I agree with everything they had to say.

I personally cannot understand the over-reaction to videogames. I know its their shtick and people eat it up but I cannot stand guys like Jim, Total Biscuit, and Angry Joe, its okay to have a nuanced critical review without coming off like a screaming baby and taking every issue a game has and over blowing it to ridiculous proportions. But I guess this totally feeds into their audiences and it helps convey how angry they are about it to people who need everything spelt out for them.
 

Odesu

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,558
Let's organise a cagematch for Angry Joe and Jim Sterling only to then quietly leave while they spend their days shouting obscenities and the latest Reddit Headlines at each other.
 

Deleted member 46641

User requested account closure
Banned
Aug 12, 2018
3,494
"We have dealt with these issues in a humane, kind and interesting way"

I think having anti-depressant analogues result in a dystopian society is dehumanising people that use antidepressants, but go off.

And repeatedly mentioning "social justice"... hmmnm
 
OP
OP
Pikachu

Pikachu

Traded his Bone Marrow for Pizza
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,402
"We have dealt with these issues in a humane, kind and interesting way"

I think having anti-depressant analogues result in a dystopian society is dehumanising people that use antidepressants, but go off.

Is Brave New World problematic
 

OrdinaryPrime

Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
11,042
I'm not sure. But I tend to get defensive when smaller devs get shit on for releasing less than perfect games, especially when they're pretty ambitious relative to the team size. You can think it's overpriced and buggy, but it's still people creating something new, which is more than 95% of the people here have done. Don't like it, or don't think it's worth the money? Don't buy it, and move on. No need to be shitheads about it, it's not like anyone here has personal stake in We Happy Few.

Pretty sure I've never made a judgment on the game besides it's buggy. Which has been illustrated as such. Getting defensive for valid reasons, about unfair criticism makes sense. But your response was to me so I'm not really sure why you're assuming I don't like it (I haven't played the game) or I think it's overpriced (I don't own the game and haven't seen much footage about it besides the bugs).

Contrast was made by a very small team, while We Happy Few back in 2016 had around 16. When they decided to pivot the game to what people wanted, they slowly grew to now 35 and spent the last year adding story.

I appreciate the perspective.
 

IIFloodyII

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,228
The interesting thing is that he was, from what i remember, *fine* at The Escapist. he only really became the gamerbaby when he started a patreon. Makes you think how easy it is to sell a product if youre a curated type of insufferable
Nah, he was always like he is, people just didn't like him back then. He only really started building a fanbase towards the end of his time there if I remember right.
 

JINX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,483
"We have dealt with these issues in a humane, kind and interesting way"

I think having anti-depressant analogues result in a dystopian society is dehumanising people that use antidepressants, but go off.

And repeatedly mentioning "social justice"... hmmnm
Except Joy isn't an anti-depressant really at all, Jim never took issue with the games portrayal of drugs.
 

Delriach

Combat Designer
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
931
Chicago
Twitter harassment has escalated so much so quickly. It's really scary and it's only getting worse. I know people who have had very real threats made just because their name was listed in the credits for a game that had issues at launch. Bugs happen. Bugs suck. Nobody wants to ship a game with game breaking issues. Nobody spends years and years of their life working on something just so they can release a broken thing.

Alternatives to twitter become so much more appealing by the day. For me, it's a shame since I met so many people through twitter. I got my first job related to games through twitter. I want twitter to not suck.
 

Twinsen64

Banned
Mar 9, 2018
176
Am I the only one who is genuinely enJOYing myself with the game? Maybe because I'm not on console & can play at a consistent framerate