Honestly? I wouldn't even be mad.
It's hard to improve upon perfection.
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Xbox Game Studios |OT7| Discover Your Next Favorite OT
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Honestly? I wouldn't even be mad.
It's hard to improve upon perfection.
It also could be they take a small hit on Lockhart but keep it in the black for Anaconda hoping that the fact the all digital nature of Lockhart will help make up for some of the costs. Like a doorbuster sale.
They take a small hit / no hit on Lockhart and take a massive hit for Anaconda. Anaconda is the dick waving loss leading SKU that isn't expected to outsell PS5 / Lockhart.
What a heartless publisher to pair Remedy with company they loath so. I wouldn't be surprised if Sam filed a suit to get them of the agreement unless changes are made immediately.
They had separate divisions before. Recently merged in 2016 or 2017... Maybe later
Okay, I changed my mind.
Lockhart is 7tf
Scarlett is overclocked lockhart
Both launch 2020.
Phil thinks the customers are ready for it.
edit: current Scarlett dev kit is baseline hardware at 10tf.
final version had two options to develop for: lockhart and Scarlett
Dev kits are now out there folks.
edit2 so once Scarlett is in fulL production they can add that to xcloud. And scale up power in prep for next gen.
wtf?
Lockhart is 7tf
Scarlett is overclocked lockhart
Both launch 2020.
Phil thinks the customers are ready for it.
edit: current Scarlett dev kit is baseline hardware at 10tf.
final version had two options to develop for: lockhart and Scarlett
Dev kits are now out there folks.
edit2 so once Scarlett is in fulL production they can add that to xcloud. And scale up power in prep for next gen.
wtf?
Last edited:
If there is any company with money to burn, it's Microsoft.
Scorpio was targeted towards people that wanted higher performance. These are the people that often do not have a problem justifying the price. A weaker console is something that is geared towards people that are price conscious; these are the people that companies always want to sacrifice for.
why should they???
they will made Money and the Game is only first on Xbox beside they're making the Campaign only they don't own the IP or Publishing rights So they already get paid
Because who wants to be put in a position to work with someone they hate?
You wouldn't understand. It's deeply personal between the two.
it's not about hate they just didn't find working with MS good for them pr maybe both feel that way
yes they never did Good with the Price
Nice. Definitely means we are getting a sleek new piece of hardware... a quiet one too.
I think going forward if they are to continue with everything being compatible, from games to controllers, we may see instead of like this gen (7 years with a half step in the middle) something like in 5 years there'll be a new premium and new entry-point system
That next gen thread tho... XD
I think we jumped in the hot phase now with Phil starting to hype Scarlett.
Does anyone remember what happend and especially when, when he did it with Scorpio. I mean how was the info flow afterwards ?
I think we jumped in the hot phase now with Phil starting to hype Scarlett.
Does anyone remember what happend and especially when, when he did it with Scorpio. I mean how was the info flow afterwards ?
No way. Console price must appeal to mass market. 499$ tops for Scarlett.
You are probably right but as FairyEmpire I would go for the expensive version if there is an option to choose from.
I would think they aren't going to hit 600 either, that one hurt the PS3 immensely. At the same time, if they have a regular version at 250-350 that runs the same games and has a hardware comparable to PS5, why not give enthusiasts an extra option?
I don't think they will go for the destiny style live service, which failed multiple times
Those things are not advanced in the star citizen /flight simulator era
Shitty art style to please the halo fandom, the assets and the animations are good
What is a campaign world technical art lead?
Maybe it's just the support for the next year, but something like mario kat 8 deluxe and battlefront could works very well
I hope that it's Japan because I'm tired of this obsession for japan, the world it's full of beautiful places, I'm sure that the PGG artists knows their job. Plus in japan recording assets with photogrammetry would be way more difficult than england and it was hard in their homecountry
That is the question I could answer with more confidence about JD, everything about the game is not set in stone
Xbox 360 Core launched at $299.99, and it was a great launch price for a new console IMHO, being $200 cheaper than PS3. It was an important part of the console's success, despite the RROD debacle.
Just thought about the 2 SKU approach. What if one SKU (cheap version) has a Disc drive but only a small SSD to have just enough space for 2 or 3 games and the other SKU (expensive) comes without a disc drive but has a 2 or more TB SSD ?
Most people think specs are different but does it need to be this way to have a 2 SKU approach ?
Most people think specs are different but does it need to be this way to have a 2 SKU approach ?
I'd imagine the cheaper SKU without a disk drive, with a smaller SSD and a weaker GPU. Just to hit that sweet 299$ price point.
Hrmm that is true. An upgraded CPU would certainly help it have a longer shelf life.
If they do go the Lockhart route, that 299 mark surely has to be something they hit. Less if possible. Personally, I would rather they not have them both at launch. Maybe a year or so down the line.
If you have a SKU without a disc drive you automatically need bigger SSD as those people obviously will be digital only hence they will need alot of storage.
Remember Xbox 360 launched with 2 SKUs and the only hardware differences was the HDD, Controller (wireless/wired) and a connection cable (Iirc) and the price differerence was 100 Euros/Dollars.
Since every controller nowdays is wireless you can exchange connection cable with disc drive and we have a very similar situation next year. 2 SKUs one for 399 and one for 499.
There seems to be a certain misconception going around on what Lockhart will actually be. I see people acting like as if Lockhart is meant to be a toaster playing videogames - and this couldn't be any more wrong.
Lockhart will be a true next generation console with next generational components. Both devices - if this is really what they'll go with in less than a year from now (and yes, despite the Kotaku article, this is still an *if*) - Anaconda and Lockhart, will share the same solutions for CPU, memory and SSD. Especially the CPU area will be incredibly important for next generation consoles. Zen 2 will allow not only higher framerates here, but also better physics, worlds that are filled with more life, more characters on screen, better AI, more precise simulation. Simply said: it will allow *more*. In combination with incredibly fast SSD and memory solutions, this will allow devs to build next generation experiences without holding back.
When looking at scalability, doing so via GPU and resolution seems like the easiest and most obvious solution. Rendering games at 4K requires a lot of resources. Offering a console *option* that scales back on resolution but stays true on every other aspects of a game is a no-brainer in an age of dynamic resolution methods, ML upscaling, intelligent sharpening filters etc. It allows to bring down the price on that console, which might also be releant for xCloud in future, as resources mean everything in the datacenters just as much. You don't need to only have Anaconda's sitting there in a few years when many people only stream to max. 1080p devices anyway (mobile).
I keep reading goal post arguments that Lockhart might "hold next generation" back. This lacks any rationale and doesn't mirror the situation of gaming ... At all. First and foremost: why do we simply ignore that every single Xbox first-party game will still come to PC? Yesterday, today and in future? Minimum requirements to play certain games on PC will be lower than Lockhart will ever be for many, many years to come. Xbox Game Studios are used to allow great scaling of their gams for so many years already, with their PC versions even being some of the best on the PC market these days. Scalability is important. I keep refering to my personal prime example here being Sea of Thieves. The game basically runs on a toaster, yet it looks absolutely incredible at 4K/60fps on a high-end rig. I would go even one step further and say that giving your developers the task to make your games scale great *profits* a "high-end" version as performance optimizations are happening for every kind of scale level.
Scalability on Lockhart is primarily meant to be done via GPU scaling. How does a GTX 980 hold back Remedy's Control on a RTX 2080 Ti and its next generation raytracing rendering? How does the original Xbox One GPU hold back one of the best-looking games available with Forza Horizon 4 played on a PC at 4K/60 Ultra? How does a Surface Laptop 3 GPU hold back Gears 5 on being the most-impressive looking HDR/60fps game on consoles this generation? I could go on and on. The answer will always be the same: it doesn't hold it back. Lockhart will not hold back anything as the components that will allow "next generation" experiences will be there. Just at lower resolutions and/or some graphical effect sliders set to a lower value.
Price matters so, so much. Some countries are more price sensitive than others, this is absolutely a fair comment to make. Thinking about Jimmy's mom here, who just wants to get her son the newest "FIFA for a new generation" or the "Fortnite next gen update", going into a Walmart and seeing a $399 console allowing this as well as a $499 one standing next to each other (the prices are just exemplary), Jimmy's mom doesn't have many reasons to not pick the cheaper one here. Both play the same games.
I think it's ironic we are on a "hardcore-gaming" forum here but all we focus on right now is Lockhart. An optional console that is not even aimed towards "us". The actual news should be: if Lockhart on the one end exists, so does Anaconda on the other end. And this is where this situation gets interesting. It would mean MS sticked with their original plan on not only offering the lowest price console on the one end, but more importantly on the other end also the best-performing device going into next-gen. Lockhart allows Anaconda to do ... More. After all, both are just two more options to get into the Xbox / Game Pass ecosystem.
The last point I want to add something to is the "confusion for the customer" argument. I don't know where this is suddenly coming from, but it's yet another example of something that completely ignores the industry itself, other industries, PC gaming or even ... This console generation. We are not talking about MS offering 20 different kind of SKUs here. We are talking about 2. *Two*. Something console gaming customers are used to since the release of PS4 Pro already - and something customers in pretty much *every other tech area* are used to for many, many years already, with many more options that just two. There are Pro/Plus/S/Super/Light/Basic/Core versions everywhere. The tech industry has learned that you need to offer *options* to reach a broader pool of customers. And if the differentiation is as easy as it is supposed to be here - offering TWO options on both price/performance ends - I simply think talking about "confusion" here seems very much disconnected from reality. I'll totally admit one thing on this one though: Xbox *needs* to get the naming right. They shouldn't do any experiments here. Naming needs to be easy and on-point. No doubt about that.
If you followed my comments on this whole topic a bit in the past, you'll know that I'm a proponent for the Xbox two SKU strategy. Because the truth is: both Nintendo and Playstation have a much more dominant mind-share and more promiment brands than Xbox. That's simply part of the truth and that is totally fine. You just need to have a plan on how to deal with that. And going into next-gen with one device that only equals PS5 in both price and performance will not do much for your brand. It's as easy as that. You need to do things differently. And offering options left and right is something the Xbox brand is doing industry-leading moves in since Phil became the Head of Xbox. Xbox needs and wants to become a brand that stands for diversity and options in games, hardware and services.
Please keep in mind this post is built on the foundation that the Lockhart/Anaconda roadmap is happenig in 2020. I can't guarantee that - and I won't. But not doing it this way would be a wasted opportunity for Xbox, its community and more importantly its future.
Lockhart will be a true next generation console with next generational components. Both devices - if this is really what they'll go with in less than a year from now (and yes, despite the Kotaku article, this is still an *if*) - Anaconda and Lockhart, will share the same solutions for CPU, memory and SSD. Especially the CPU area will be incredibly important for next generation consoles. Zen 2 will allow not only higher framerates here, but also better physics, worlds that are filled with more life, more characters on screen, better AI, more precise simulation. Simply said: it will allow *more*. In combination with incredibly fast SSD and memory solutions, this will allow devs to build next generation experiences without holding back.
When looking at scalability, doing so via GPU and resolution seems like the easiest and most obvious solution. Rendering games at 4K requires a lot of resources. Offering a console *option* that scales back on resolution but stays true on every other aspects of a game is a no-brainer in an age of dynamic resolution methods, ML upscaling, intelligent sharpening filters etc. It allows to bring down the price on that console, which might also be releant for xCloud in future, as resources mean everything in the datacenters just as much. You don't need to only have Anaconda's sitting there in a few years when many people only stream to max. 1080p devices anyway (mobile).
I keep reading goal post arguments that Lockhart might "hold next generation" back. This lacks any rationale and doesn't mirror the situation of gaming ... At all. First and foremost: why do we simply ignore that every single Xbox first-party game will still come to PC? Yesterday, today and in future? Minimum requirements to play certain games on PC will be lower than Lockhart will ever be for many, many years to come. Xbox Game Studios are used to allow great scaling of their gams for so many years already, with their PC versions even being some of the best on the PC market these days. Scalability is important. I keep refering to my personal prime example here being Sea of Thieves. The game basically runs on a toaster, yet it looks absolutely incredible at 4K/60fps on a high-end rig. I would go even one step further and say that giving your developers the task to make your games scale great *profits* a "high-end" version as performance optimizations are happening for every kind of scale level.
Scalability on Lockhart is primarily meant to be done via GPU scaling. How does a GTX 980 hold back Remedy's Control on a RTX 2080 Ti and its next generation raytracing rendering? How does the original Xbox One GPU hold back one of the best-looking games available with Forza Horizon 4 played on a PC at 4K/60 Ultra? How does a Surface Laptop 3 GPU hold back Gears 5 on being the most-impressive looking HDR/60fps game on consoles this generation? I could go on and on. The answer will always be the same: it doesn't hold it back. Lockhart will not hold back anything as the components that will allow "next generation" experiences will be there. Just at lower resolutions and/or some graphical effect sliders set to a lower value.
Price matters so, so much. Some countries are more price sensitive than others, this is absolutely a fair comment to make. Thinking about Jimmy's mom here, who just wants to get her son the newest "FIFA for a new generation" or the "Fortnite next gen update", going into a Walmart and seeing a $399 console allowing this as well as a $499 one standing next to each other (the prices are just exemplary), Jimmy's mom doesn't have many reasons to not pick the cheaper one here. Both play the same games.
I think it's ironic we are on a "hardcore-gaming" forum here but all we focus on right now is Lockhart. An optional console that is not even aimed towards "us". The actual news should be: if Lockhart on the one end exists, so does Anaconda on the other end. And this is where this situation gets interesting. It would mean MS sticked with their original plan on not only offering the lowest price console on the one end, but more importantly on the other end also the best-performing device going into next-gen. Lockhart allows Anaconda to do ... More. After all, both are just two more options to get into the Xbox / Game Pass ecosystem.
The last point I want to add something to is the "confusion for the customer" argument. I don't know where this is suddenly coming from, but it's yet another example of something that completely ignores the industry itself, other industries, PC gaming or even ... This console generation. We are not talking about MS offering 20 different kind of SKUs here. We are talking about 2. *Two*. Something console gaming customers are used to since the release of PS4 Pro already - and something customers in pretty much *every other tech area* are used to for many, many years already, with many more options that just two. There are Pro/Plus/S/Super/Light/Basic/Core versions everywhere. The tech industry has learned that you need to offer *options* to reach a broader pool of customers. And if the differentiation is as easy as it is supposed to be here - offering TWO options on both price/performance ends - I simply think talking about "confusion" here seems very much disconnected from reality. I'll totally admit one thing on this one though: Xbox *needs* to get the naming right. They shouldn't do any experiments here. Naming needs to be easy and on-point. No doubt about that.
If you followed my comments on this whole topic a bit in the past, you'll know that I'm a proponent for the Xbox two SKU strategy. Because the truth is: both Nintendo and Playstation have a much more dominant mind-share and more promiment brands than Xbox. That's simply part of the truth and that is totally fine. You just need to have a plan on how to deal with that. And going into next-gen with one device that only equals PS5 in both price and performance will not do much for your brand. It's as easy as that. You need to do things differently. And offering options left and right is something the Xbox brand is doing industry-leading moves in since Phil became the Head of Xbox. Xbox needs and wants to become a brand that stands for diversity and options in games, hardware and services.
Please keep in mind this post is built on the foundation that the Lockhart/Anaconda roadmap is happenig in 2020. I can't guarantee that - and I won't. But not doing it this way would be a wasted opportunity for Xbox, its community and more importantly its future.
https://www.resetera.com/threads/xbox-game-studios-ot6-im-back-to-rise.132019/page-314#post-26196202
Since that person in weibo ended up right about X019, gonna post his another rumor:
1. Just find out he posted about Lockhart again at Dec 3.
2. He ask people "what if Anaconda have 24GB GDDR6?"
Lol. That's an odd statement. Its interesting to watch the Halo Infinite trailer and then watch a cutscene of Halo 5. The difference is incredible really. MC and Mjolnir haven't ever looked this good.
Who is Jimmy ???
Seriously, I thank you for this post. It says it all and I couldn't agree more. All those complaints and arguments getting more and more ridiculous every day here...
Great post!
You think there is a possibility they'll launch a slightly cheaper all digital version of the high end console (Anaconda)
One point that's lost on people is that xCloud necessitates the existence and support of the Lockhart APU. There would be too much hardware power wasted using Anaconda SoC to stream sub 4k experience.
Yeah. Its quite necessary for that. Also, fantastic post from Klobrille. Couldn't have said it better myself. Its really much ado over nothing.
The word "might" is key here as it implies game developers still don't know how next Xbox is working developmentwise. I hope we will get some information very soon.
Just to play devil's advocate, what are your thoughts on this post from a verified dev:
Yes I'm pretty sure power efficiency has been one of the pillars of Lockhart's SoC design, because that's very important when you consider they'll have thousands put together
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