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Why women criticise sexualised character designs | OT3 | "make her look more...corpulent, more stuffed where the eyes can't escape."
- Thread starter Persephone
- Start date
- OT
It was a women that raised the problem with racism in this thread, it's disingenuous to pretend this was a silencing women thing. You had a chance to learn and grow, and you choose to double down , that reflects badly on you and no one else
If someone feels something is racist and they tell us then we need to take it seriously and think about it. Generalization is racist and we were doing it in this thread. Having someone come here and explain to us what we are doing wrong is a good thing. I myself was guilty of generalization and their posts helped me realize that. You were banned because you dismissed that. Own up to it and learn.
You being a woman has nothing to do with this. It applies to everyone regardless of their gender.
I'm enjoying Monster Hunter Rise a lot but the armours are bumming me out so far.
It was so much worse when me and my partner crafted the same armour and mine had the thighs exposed and his didn't. It sucks that Capcom still haven't learned.
The only hair option I have as a Black woman is an afro as well. This was also an issue in the base MHW game. /sigh
It was so much worse when me and my partner crafted the same armour and mine had the thighs exposed and his didn't. It sucks that Capcom still haven't learned.
The only hair option I have as a Black woman is an afro as well. This was also an issue in the base MHW game. /sigh
It cool that they allow you to have different voices, facial hair, and pretty good character options but clothing continue to be a sore point. Let my lady have pants that aren't shorts.
Yeah. :/ Especially the Wroggi Armour, some cool Western Outfit for Male types, while the female one still doesnt have any pants. Shit sucks.
Wow, yeah that's egregious lol. Do Capcom think no women play these games or do they think this is what we think of as a power fantasy?Yeah. :/ Especially the Wroggi Armour, some cool Western Outfit for Male types, while the female one still doesnt have any pants. Shit sucks.
Yeah. :/ Especially the Wroggi Armour, some cool Western Outfit for Male types, while the female one still doesnt have any pants. Shit sucks.
wow this is bad even for Monster Hunter standards...
pretty sure some people really think showing you're sexy is a female power fantasy somehow. It's the archaic mindset about men having to look strong and women having to look pretty.
Yeah. :/ Especially the Wroggi Armour, some cool Western Outfit for Male types, while the female one still doesnt have any pants. Shit sucks.
They really couldn't be bothered to design an outfit for women so they just took the male one and took pieces off.
Why does the woman have to get Onechabara armor? That's just insulting.Yeah. :/ Especially the Wroggi Armour, some cool Western Outfit for Male types, while the female one still doesnt have any pants. Shit sucks.
Yeah. :/ Especially the Wroggi Armour, some cool Western Outfit for Male types, while the female one still doesnt have any pants. Shit sucks.
Why they think women love to walk around in underwear?
As a man posting in this thread, I just wanted to say thanks to the people highlighting these problems in this thread. I thought I was already aware of most of the ideas highlighted in here, but it seems I've been more unthinkingly unresponsive about it than I realised.
Question: Is it right to be more concerned about mainstream media than niche media (because of it's greater potential to normalise harmful implicit attitudes)?
Question: Is it right to be more concerned about mainstream media than niche media (because of it's greater potential to normalise harmful implicit attitudes)?
Yeah. :/ Especially the Wroggi Armour, some cool Western Outfit for Male types, while the female one still doesnt have any pants. Shit sucks.
I knew there were many differences in the past for MH armor, but this is especially dumb. This is worse than the first AF Dragoon armor in FFXIV.
Yeah. :/ Especially the Wroggi Armour, some cool Western Outfit for Male types, while the female one still doesnt have any pants. Shit sucks.
My god
Your character is out there fighting fucking monsters, is going to be thrown through mud, ice, rough dirt... And their idea of armor for a huntress is... A bikini with a cowboy hat.
I always choose a male hunter so this went over my radar.
Capcom, you had that internal memo about doing better with your women characters. When's that supposed to kick in because fuck that Wroggi Outfit. I was looking forward to getting to grind Wroggi for the cowboy duds. Not fucking now! I absolutely remember wearing Wroggi gear in 3U and it was more or less fine. What the hell did you do?
There's even a simple solution to this dumb shit that's always been there: the clothes you pick when you create your character. First time playing I assumed that was what your hunter wore under your armor and would affect how much skin was seen. Would solve a lot of these stupid problems if it did work that way but nope. Oh, you chose the long underwear? Have some thigh gaps! Absolute fucking clowns.
(edit: though I may be misremembering Wroggi in 3U too. I'm thinking I just wore the hat because of this very problem.)
There's even a simple solution to this dumb shit that's always been there: the clothes you pick when you create your character. First time playing I assumed that was what your hunter wore under your armor and would affect how much skin was seen. Would solve a lot of these stupid problems if it did work that way but nope. Oh, you chose the long underwear? Have some thigh gaps! Absolute fucking clowns.
(edit: though I may be misremembering Wroggi in 3U too. I'm thinking I just wore the hat because of this very problem.)
Fuck that monster hunter design. Hadn't world been a step forward in the right direction too? Like not that there weren't bad differences in the some of the women's armor sets, but it was better then some of the previous MH games at least wasn't it?
Its a shame to see them walk backwards.
Its a shame to see them walk backwards.
oh thanks. Weird coincidence, I was just going through your Valkyrie Profile buyer's guide thread after finally getting a working copy of the PS1 version 👍
That is weird lol. I've been meaning to play mine once I finish setting up a shelf for my PS1. Grats on the nice find.
Amazing the differences in posts of the couple that came back.
Yeah. :/ Especially the Wroggi Armour, some cool Western Outfit for Male types, while the female one still doesnt have any pants. Shit sucks.
From a quick bare minimum google search: https://horserookie.com/horseback-riding-what-to-wear/#Jeans
Fuck women and their thighs I guess 🤷♂️
Being a woman has absolutely nothing to do with your ban and you make all women look bad when you try to play that fuckin card. You could have taken the ban with some manner of decorum and grace, you're an adult and you know what you had said, but instead, you decide to try and play the gender card like you're just automatically owed a free pass because you're a woman in a topic meant for women to talk about the injustices of women portrayed inside the gaming industry.
Nah, gurl. You sink down on your ship alone, we're not coming with you.
Bye, Felicia.
Did a quick search of female outfits and if it not skirts , shorts or midriffs but dresses.
I call this the "We have to make sure everyone knows they're a girl!" collection.
Seeing these costume designs from Monster Hunter takes me back to vanilla Ragnarok Online and yea, at the time the in-game character sprites were very tiny and you could just barely make anything out on them besides hairstyles and hair color, even eye colors were barely noticeable.
But, looking way back on the concept art and thinking on it. Man....some of those designs were heavily skewed too. RO Online had a lot of hit-and-miss issues.
Just some examples: 1st pic - Magician Base Class, 2nd pic - Rune Knight Third Class, 3rd pic - Asura Third Job Class, 4th Pic - Assassin Cross Third Job Class, 5th Pic - Wizard Second Job Class, & 6th Archbishop - Third Job Class.
The trend is kind of obvious, but I will throw in ONE thing that they did right.
There's ONE WHOLE KNIGHT CLASS WHERE SHE'S GOT PANTS AND NOT A BIKINI. =___=
But, looking way back on the concept art and thinking on it. Man....some of those designs were heavily skewed too. RO Online had a lot of hit-and-miss issues.
Just some examples: 1st pic - Magician Base Class, 2nd pic - Rune Knight Third Class, 3rd pic - Asura Third Job Class, 4th Pic - Assassin Cross Third Job Class, 5th Pic - Wizard Second Job Class, & 6th Archbishop - Third Job Class.
The trend is kind of obvious, but I will throw in ONE thing that they did right.
There's ONE WHOLE KNIGHT CLASS WHERE SHE'S GOT PANTS AND NOT A BIKINI. =___=
I'm here just out of pure curiosity.
In which direction is the conversation going? Is there room for all sorts of (respectful) opionions? Are there guidelines?
In which direction is the conversation going? Is there room for all sorts of (respectful) opionions? Are there guidelines?
This is so vague that it can't really be answered. The people who post in this thread are not one amalgamated lump that agrees on everything, we disagree with each other sometimes, we have differing opinions.
Have you read the OP? If your respectful opinion is some variant of the men who have come into these threads before with "actually its good for developers to not give women clothing in games", I promise you whatever new unique take you think you have on this has been covered before.
Any particular conversation going on? I read the guidelines in the OP, so I have no problem with them.
I'd appreciate not being tagged even before starting speaking, you don't know me. Thank you.
The super vague "is any respectful opinion okay" is often a lead in to someone just posting some shit take. Sorry if I was wrong, but I also didn't accuse you, I just tried to head it off if that is where you were going. You are right that I don't know you, which is why I said "If your opinion is ____". The word If explicitly leaves open that that might not be the case.
No worries, I understand. No offense taken.
Let me ask something less generic then: are there are signs the sexualisation of characters has been diminishing in the past 10-20 years? Is the trend positive/negative?
There is one workaround, but I wouldn't call it a solution— the character creator doesn't restrict hair/make-up/voices to gender, so you could potentially make a woman using the male base body. It doesn't solve the shit designs being in the game though, and it would mean you're going to get a differently shaped body, so it's at best a "at least now my character doesn't have exposed thighs and boob plate".
Just gonna say that I'm a woman and I never opt for practical armor. I know that a lot of people WANT it and I would love for everyone to have practical/modest options, but if someone gives me the chance to battle in like a comfy sundress I will TAKE it. I do not care how silly it looks, I just feel so much happier when my characters are wearing cute clothes.
Which is not to say I love it when female characters are stuck with negligees and boob platters and I get really, really miffed about really bouncy boob physics but mostly because I get really monofocused on like, "Have these people ever seen a breast? Breasts obey the laws of gravity, argh."
But in general, if you offered me a choice between a bikini and full coverage plate armor, I'll take the bikini.
Which is not to say I love it when female characters are stuck with negligees and boob platters and I get really, really miffed about really bouncy boob physics but mostly because I get really monofocused on like, "Have these people ever seen a breast? Breasts obey the laws of gravity, argh."
But in general, if you offered me a choice between a bikini and full coverage plate armor, I'll take the bikini.
We usually just post examples of games doing bad/good designs and talk about them.
Ragnarok Online is directly based off of Lee Myung-Jin's manwha Ragnarok, which ended early so he could work on the game. Given the source material, not too surprising - more or less every named female character in said manwha is dressed like so.Seeing these costume designs from Monster Hunter takes me back to vanilla Ragnarok Online and yea, at the time the in-game character sprites were very tiny and you could just barely make anything out on them besides hairstyles and hair color, even eye colors were barely noticeable.
But, looking way back on the concept art and thinking on it. Man....some of those designs were heavily skewed too. RO Online had a lot of hit-and-miss issues.
Just some examples: 1st pic - Magician Base Class, 2nd pic - Rune Knight Third Class, 3rd pic - Asura Third Job Class, 4th Pic - Assassin Cross Third Job Class, 5th Pic - Wizard Second Job Class, & 6th Archbishop - Third Job Class.
The trend is kind of obvious, but I will throw in ONE thing that they did right.
There's ONE WHOLE KNIGHT CLASS WHERE SHE'S GOT PANTS AND NOT A BIKINI. =___=
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Ragnarok Online is directly based off of Lee Myung-Jin's manwha Ragnarok, which ended early so he could work on the game. Given the source material, not too surprising - more or less every named female character in said manwha is dressed like so.
I never knew about any of this, good to know, and yea I can definitely see the similarities for sure.
Thanks!
For me, I love looking cute irl and have a feminine aesthetic, but I hate this shit in video games where it's targeted just at women. It makes it obvious they think it's more important for women specifically to look attractive or sexy than actually be able to protect themselves. Men however need to look tough and wear something that actually offers them protection from enemies and the elements.
The early swordsman job lines in RO are probably the best character designs in the game. I really like them
Swordsman
Knight
Crusader
But after that, the designs strip away most of the utility
Lord Knight
Paladin
Then we get to the third jobs. Rune knight went through a redesign settling on the last one
Rune Knight
Overall not super egregious, if typical anime swordswoman fare. Now we come to the final job stage of the Crusader posted above
The Crusader line just strips away all the armor haha. I guess they thought the big shield was modest enough. I remember another player on a private server back in 2011 complaining about it and wishing she could change the sprite. Which eventually you could. They added alternate job sprites. These are the alt designs
Rune Knight v2
Royal Guard
Swordsman
Knight
Crusader
But after that, the designs strip away most of the utility
Lord Knight
Paladin
Then we get to the third jobs. Rune knight went through a redesign settling on the last one
Rune Knight
Overall not super egregious, if typical anime swordswoman fare. Now we come to the final job stage of the Crusader posted above
Royal Guard
The Crusader line just strips away all the armor haha. I guess they thought the big shield was modest enough. I remember another player on a private server back in 2011 complaining about it and wishing she could change the sprite. Which eventually you could. They added alternate job sprites. These are the alt designs
Rune Knight v2
Royal Guard
i found it enjoyable as a lad and there are some cool visuals in it, but yeah. those are the first two female characters introduced in the first chapter (fenris fenrir and sara irine) and the tone is pretty much set.
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I just want my characters to look cool, which definitely doesn't equal practical most of the time.
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it's kind of a tricky one wrt looking cute/sexy in games. if it's my choice then hell yeah go for it. if it's forced on me then No Thank You
At least some of the npcs of mhr are in a better place
I havent been to the argosy much yet, or the hub, but the few times I've been in there I've literally stopped what I'm doing to watch the hub quest twins extremely amusing animations.
The guild master or whoever sitting on top of the baby tetsacubra (it's actually a tadpole version) was just going nuts scribbling tons of paper work and flinging it towards the desk, and shes just reading a book or something while no look snatching them all out of the air.
Yeah. :/ Especially the Wroggi Armour, some cool Western Outfit for Male types, while the female one still doesnt have any pants. Shit sucks.
GF is trying to convince me to get Rise. Is there a visual list of all the armor sets?
It's sad that outside of white man, there isn't any consideration for armor and body choices. It's been like this for as long as I remember. Sure, you get lots of choices for (white) women as well, but it usually comes down to "how clotheless do you want to be?"
That cowgirl, underwear model up there shows it's still in full force.
That cowgirl, underwear model up there shows it's still in full force.
Damn you increasing graphical fidelity!
The remobra legs were one of a couple go to options for 'uniform trousers' for me, typically for making a sea captain/buccaneer transmog (more swashbuckling than pirate)
Now they are clearly too shiny and leathery lol.
Armor for women characters seems to range from basically same as the men but without pants, to stripper costumes.
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