Where does the Democratic Party go from here? How do they legislate and how do they win?

[tgrfawcett]

I know a lot is still up in the air right now but looking ahead I had a few questions regarding the state of the Democratic Party.

• First: With the narrow margins on the House what can we expect for the next two years of legislating? An awful lot of Democrats narrow 2018 victories turning back around and flipping red. With new maps coming in two years, drawn in part by heavily Republican-controlled legislators, will the House flip in 2022? What then?
• Second: What is the play for the Senate actually both right now and in two years?
• 2a. Right now, NC seems out of reach for Cunningham given the margins on the remaining ballots. AK is likely completely out of reach for Gross. That leaves Georgia, can Democrats actually win two runoff races? It seems unlikely given how thoroughly trounced Democrats got in Maine, NC, Montana, Iowa, etc.
• 2b. I saw someone suggest Biden just appoint a Republican senator from a Dem governor state as an ambassador and see how it goes. Would he ever do that? Is that an actual strategy that would work?
• 2c. If they don't take the Senate this year by that narrow 50-50 margin do they actually have a shot in 2022? With government gridlock over the next two years, it seems that systemic problems maintain, Republicans blame Biden and the Democrats, and then voters show up in response to the messaging to win the house and hold the Senate. How do Democrats avoid this fate?
• Third: Despite a probable Biden win, it seems as though the Democratic Party's agenda is slipping away from them. Without the Senate, they can't get much work done on big issues like judicial or health care reform let alone climate action. If Democrats can't prove capable now then why in 2024 would voters want to elect, assuming he does not run another term, Biden's hand-picked successor?

I admit I am shook. This feels like we aren't ever going to actually recover from the damage Trump has done, that his party and all these motherfuckers who support him have done. The country will sooner fall flat on its face than vote in its best interests. I was hoping to feel confident going into the next two years we would be able to get work done before the pendulum swung back to the Republicans but that seems so far out of reach. How can we win if half the nation wants it to burn? Should we just let it burn, all suffer together so we might get back on track eventually? The doom spiral is real.

It was this close, it doesn't seem like it should have been. Given the imbalances in American democracy favoring rural states, especially in the Senate, the fight for Democrats is getting harder. Further, the Republicans seem unlikely to change tactics, they certainly didn't suffer in the House or the Senate for the last two years of gridlock. After four years of scandal Trump came out surprisingly well despite a probable loss, Trumpism and obstructionism seem likely to stick around. Republicans seem to have the advantage even when they are vocally proud of preventing progress on any major issue so it leaves one big question:

Where does the Democratic Party go from here? How do they legislate and how do they win?

 

[Sordid Plebeian]

Biden needs to lead with a steady hand if he wins so that we can have a return to "normalcy," but otherwise Dems really need to improve their outreach to minority groups and the working class. The country is immensely divided, and nothing will improve until Trumpism is defeated, which will be... a challenge.

 

[EdgeXL]

Even with a Biden win this election shows deep cracks within the Democratic party. Running against an impeached hairpiece should not be this close! Why does Trump have more votes than he did in 2016? Why does he have more votes from minorities? Why are the House and Senate this close? This should have been a landslide for the Democrats!

Time to clean house within the Democratic party. Demand better candidates from them. No more of this "vote the lesser evil" bullshit. Find good people in the Democratic party who can inspire voters and help them run for office.

 

[skillzilla81]

Stop trying to reach out to white voters. Focus on black and other people of color.

Stop with the lip service. Stop appealing to stupid ass racist moderates that think a statement like the one Biden gave the other day is just fine.

 

[hachikoma]

left, if it wants to survive (which it may not, idk)

 

[shnurgleton]

don't half ass healthcare. don't fucking sell out.

Time to clean house within the Democratic party. Demand better candidates from them. No more of this "vote the lesser evil" bullshit. Find good people in the Democratic party who can inspire voters and help them run for office.

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[Deleted member 46493]

Yeah unless things change, Dems are in big trouble for 2022 and beyond.

 

[Advance.Wars.Sgt.]

Stop trying to reach out to white voters. Focus on black and other people of color.

Stop with the lip service. Stop appealing to stupid ass racist moderates that think a statement like the one Biden gave the other day is just fine.

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I don't think they'll learn a goddamn thing. They'll continue to chase those ever elusive moderates and independents all the while throwing their base under the bus and further sow voter apathy.

 

[Chaos Legion]

Don't start infighting when clearly the Republicans won't have that problem in 2022/2024.

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

They really need to focus on regaining the working/blue collar class. Do that, and they'll win back a lot of the coalition they've lost. It's got to be the economy, the economy, the economy, by way of liberal goals.

 

[Sulik2]

Absolutely zero identity politics. As much as it sucks, half the voting base of this country will literally turn to fascism over voting blue if you mention social politics. Do that stuff in the background, but absolutely do not mention or run on it. The one and only focus of the democratic party needs to be focused on is how to help the middle class. The blue collar workers are the core of the GOP base. The democrats must actually offer them a way forward into a new green economy or they are going to continue to turn to the party that is at least giving them lip service for trying to help by bringing jobs back to America. Medicare for all and help the middle understand it will put more money in their pocket needs to be another goal. No fucking trade deal talk either. American jobs must be the #1 priority.

Run on cutting the military budget, giving everyone healthcare and a government job guarantee for blue collar worker as we transition the country's economy to handle climate change. Even the worst rascists will support you if you put money in their pockets. Money is the only way to get through to people who hate your entire party for literally just existing.

That will require ignoring racial issues most likely and focusing on class issues.

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Fixing class issues will help with racial issues at least.

 

[Damaniel]

left, if it wants to survive (which it may not, idk)

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In a country where people consider the most stereotypical centrist Democrat possible a socialist, going further left won't fix it. The only thing that fixes it is when all the people were adults during the Cold War die - then the stigma of 'socialism' becomes much less of a thing.

 

[Deleted member 4367]

They really need to focus on regaining the working/blue collar class. Do that, and they'll win back a lot of the coalition they've lost.

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That will require ignoring racial issues most likely and focusing on class issues.

 

[Deleted member 46493]

$15 minimum wage and drug legalization were more popular in red states than either candidate. Dems should double down on measures like these and others like it. Says something when DSA-endorsed candidates did better than moderate, centrist ones.

 

[OneEyedKing]

They can start by growing a spine and giving a shit about Black and poor people but that might be asking too much from them since it upsets the centrists, the right, and the corporate donors who they care more about.

They will learn all the wrong lessons from this election and get even worse.

Meanwhile DSA candidates crushed it, but of course that means nothing to the party at large.

 

[Deleted member 46493]

Meanwhile DSA candidates crushed it, but of course that means nothing to the party at large.

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And on a small budget, no need for $100m in donations like centrist Dems need just to lose.

 

[Deleted member 6230]

not confident that the Dems will learn the lessons they need to learn from this. They didn't learn it in 2016 and you already see them gearing up to blame POC for protesting not getting murdered in the streets by the cops.

 

[The Dread Pirate Westley]

Legislate the basics like money for pandemic relief and infrastructure. This will save/create jobs and the Republicans can't really say no (they will try anyways, of course).

Other than that, the Senate won't let anything real happen so focus on investigating the propaganda network (foreign and domestic) that's going to be the death of this country unless we do something about it. Root that shit out.

Focus on 2022 Senate and House races.

 

[OneEyedKing]

And on a small budget, no need for $100m in donations like centrist Dems need just to lose.

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I'm still in disbelief at the amount of money wasted on Amy McGrath. This shit has become a money laundering scheme at this point.

 

[RocketKiss]

Hopefully repealed and replaced.

 

[TrueSloth]

Don't start infighting when clearly the Republicans won't have that problem in 2022/2024.

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This kind of language seeks to dismiss actual issues people have. It's the equivalent of "shut up, because you don't have any other choice". So fuck off with this.

 

[TheMadTitan]

Don't even mention climate change. Sell the jobs program as an infrastructure program. Say the roads need fixing, say the train service sucks, say we're wasting money paying for electricity, slowly reduce subsidies on oil and gas and start giving subsidies for batteries and other green energy. Tell the south you have some great idea to save their properties from flooding every year and start building pumps and pipelines all over the place to suck up rain water. Do all of the obvious green energy shit, but don't overtly promote it as a green energy initiative.

Everyone on board is already on board, you need to get the dopes who aren't because all they hear is you trying to take their job instead of explicit plans to give you a higher paying one.

 

[sphagnum]

[*]2b. I saw someone suggest Biden just appoint a Republican senator from a Dem governor state as an ambassador and see how it goes. Would he ever do that? Is that an actual strategy that would work?

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What Republican senator is going to agree to this?

 

[Sixfortyfive]

Well if you're curious about what centrist Dems in congress think, the answer seems to be "we need to fight harder against socialism and rioters."

 

[hachikoma]

In a country where people consider the most stereotypical centrist Democrat possible a socialist, going further left won't fix it. The only thing that fixes it is when all the people were adults during the Cold War die - then the stigma of 'socialism' becomes much less of a thing.

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Biden is the most centrist ghoul imaginable and still got painted as a socialist. if your takeaway from the last 5 years is dems need to move even further right i don't know what to tell you. leftist policies that improve people's material conditions are the way forward. don't listen to us if you don't want to, though - i guess you're entitled to keep losing forever if that's what you want.

 

[Deleted member 7572]

I'm still in disbelief at the amount of money wasted on Amy McGrath. This shit has become a money laundering scheme at this point.

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My idiot boomer resistance neighbors contributed to her campaign.

$0 from them to Paula Jean. We live in West Virginia.

 

[StoveOven]

Focus on the material needs of your voters over the material "needs" of your donors.

 

[Deleted member 6230]

In a country where people consider the most stereotypical centrist Democrat possible a socialist, going further left won't fix it. The only thing that fixes it is when all the people were adults during the Cold War die - then the stigma of 'socialism' becomes much less of a thing.

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Yeah the Dems should totally do what has basically failed this time again. Maybe it'll work in 2022

 

[iksenpets]

Everything depends one winning both those Georgia runoffs. If you get a GOP majority, you're at minimum two years of zero legislation passing, other than maybe McConnell's preferred covid relief. That's not to say everything is lost: Biden will have free reign over the Justice department for prosecuting police violence, the EPA for regulating pollution, department of homeland security for reining in ICE, etc. but if it requires a bill, you're not getting it.

If you get that 50th Senator, you can probably get some stuff done, but it's going to be the absolute most popular stuff because you can't lose a single vote. And even that depends on getting everyone on board to end the filibuster, which is an open question.

If you fail to sell Joe Manchin on filibuster reform, you get a single reconciliation bill passed. This can only include spending bills, so you couldn't pass a new minimum wage, or voting rights, or DC/PR statehood. But you could get covid relief, an Obamacare patch in line with what's in Biden's plan (but nothing like the further-left plans that, say, Buttigieg ran on, let alone M4A; you're not getting close to those with these margins), some environmental spending (though it'll have to be tailored to not get defections from anyone with fossil fuels in their states) and maybe some miscellaneous spending. But it would all have to be paid for within 10 years, so you'd need to put in some big taxes in ten years, and those could only go so high before you start getting defections.

But if you do get rid of the filibuster, you can probably pass $15 minimum wage, voting rights act, PR/DC statehood, and the DREAM act. There's no situation anymore where you're adding court seats, or expanding unionization rights, passing larger immigration reform. These margins are just too small.

As for 2022, the map is alright for Senate expansion, but winning a midterm when you hold the presidency is super fucking rare. Backlash to the president is always a strong motivator.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

A major realignment of the party is essentially needed, and there needs to be a serious willingness to embrace progressive ideology as opposed to aggressively denying it. If Biden gets over the line, he owes it to Black voters rallying in PA, MI, and WI in addition to figures like Rashida Talaib effectively doing Biden's ground game for him to even begin with and the Justice Dems had an excellent showing this election. I think this election, more than others, shows that neoliberal political ideology and attempts to appeal to everyone is ultimately just weak against motivating your electorate to vote. Biden flopped with Republicans harder than Clinton did and a ton of moderate Dems who were afraid to get too committed got hit hard in House and Senate races.

Not only that, but Dems basically wasted money by the truckload on absolutely garbage candidates like Amy McGrath or people who donated to The Lincoln Project. Dems convinced themselves they were going into a Blue Wave year that they could leverage into all kinds of craziness, but they just didn't invest enough into things like State House races or even more winnable Senate races relative to the ones that got national attention because McConnell and Graham are universally hated outside of the Republican base. I expect a certain sect of Dems has no desire to actually abandon that, because that fund raising in of itself approaches a grift, but it's something people donating need to think more about. Also it would be helpful if Dems would avoid stupid mistakes like Cunningham's sex scandal that I think torpedoed what chance he had in NC this year.

It really just comes down to focusing on meaningful policy to change people's lives for the better and not being afraid to take a position in key issues. It feels like Dems bought very heavily into electability and browbeat people not on board with their candidates this time and did virtually nothing to address major issues different minority groups had with their approach. Dems leaned HARD into the ideas of bipartisan support, and proceeded to basically get nothing in return but a handful of white working class voters at the cost of many minority voters left utterly abandoned. Dems need to stop looking at successful movements as a bad thing and need to stop thinking about poisoning their chances of election by addressing sensitive and controversial topics. The problem is that makes them come off even more as part of the standard political apparatus, and people are fucking exhausted and pissed at that anyway.

Just, a fundamental realignment of priorities and ideas is required if this party is going to survive... And honestly, maybe it should just be wholly replaced at this point.

 

[SpaceCrystal]

First off: THEY NEED NEW LEADERSHIP. Chuck Schumer & Nancy Pelosi aren't it. They never had been. They have always tried to play nice with Republicans instead of playing hardball with them at every angle, such as during Trump's impeachment. Pelosi should've been hammering down on Trump about it day after day up until the election, but she had let it slide. Pelosi needs to step down, someone like AOC needs to primary Schumer, run against him in 2022 for his Senate seat, & progressives in the House needs to start pushing everyone further left. It's time for some things to change there.

Second, get better messaging. Relying on that same old "Trump is bad!" mantra isn't going to work. It didn't work with Hillary Clinton, & it's not working with Joe Biden, either. Like I said a lot of times, they should cater to everyone, including POC's & Latinos. Stop taking their votes for granted, & stop catering to just moderate whites. We all know how bad Trump is, but they should've been campaigning to people about healthcare, taxes, jobs, minimum wage increases, etc. Nobody wants to constantly hear about how bad a certain person is & beating a dead horse about it.

Third, stop nominating centrist/center-right politicians. They are never the right kind of people for the job. Start building up on progressives instead & get them more big in people's minds. Run someone who's exciting & charismatic as Trump & Obama.

 

[WereSalamander]

Progressive measures like minimum wage and legalization passed in multiple states. That and the fox exit poll of how respondents felt about the progressive issues point to the same conclusion: People like socialist measures, even if they might recoil at the term socialist like the Cubans in Florida did.

The answer seems easy to me then: Focus on campaigning those policies to the public while avoiding and rejecting the terms that bother these people like socialism. Coming up with a catchy term that's essentially an Americanized branding of socialism/progressivism might work.

 

[Pandaman]

What Republican senator is going to agree to this?

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Depends, do you think we can sneak someone into Romney's attic and have them pretend to be the voice of God?

 

[Toxi]

You are going to get the same answers from the usual camps that you always get.

 

[lupinko]

Even with a Biden win this election shows deep cracks within the Democratic party. Running against an impeached hairpiece should not be this close! Why does Trump have more votes than he did in 2016? Why does he have more votes from minorities? Why are the House and Senate this close? This should have been a landslide for the Democrats!

Time to clean house within the Democratic party. Demand better candidates from them. No more of this "vote the lesser evil" bullshit. Find good people in the Democratic party who can inspire voters and help them run for office.

Click to shrink...

Because Trump is the ultimate conman and showman. There hasn't been anyone like that from the right since Reagan. You should look at Carter vs Reagan and especially Mondale vs Reagan to answer your question. Trump's base just likes Trump for being Trump. It's not about policy since he has none.

 

[alexiswrite]

Ultimately the issue is that American politics is so broken that democrats have to win by like 3 points to win the presidency and like 7-8 plus to be able to govern effectively. While this is the case the task is just insanely difficult and I wished we recognised this more. The system is broken.

 

[samoyed]

I'm still in disbelief at the amount of money wasted on Amy McGrath. This shit has become a money laundering scheme at this point.

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I really don't know how people see Biden barely squeaking by as "we gotta go further right". You would need to run Bloomberg to get further right than Biden. Give it up. You'll never get the white reactionaries to vote for you and you don't even need them. Centrism failed in 2016 and barely succeeded in 2020, it has an awful track record. Obama ran as a progressive and governed like a centrist. Which makes the last decisive electoral centrist victory Bill Clinton, 28 years ago.

You guys are insane to think the future lies in going to the right. Minorities and progressives delivered this election to Biden.

 

[elLOaSTy]

I don't think they'll learn a goddamn thing. They'll continue to chase those ever elusive moderates and independents all the while throwing their base under the bus and further sow voter apathy.

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Yupp. We'll probably lose in 2022 after the senate can't pass a stimulus to help the economy and the GOP can frame it as the Dem leadership failing. Then it's back to a Trump child in 2024 or some other ghoul who's name we haven't considered just yet.

 

[louisacommie]

Accept America as an entity is going to die

 

[Rex Griswold]

Drop the intensely anti gun platform. Repeal or reform the NFA in exchange for a nationwide license requirements. Machine guns remain incredibly expensive, suppressors themselves remain expensive because they're suppressors, SBR laws out the window.

People will cry about a FOID style license, but even the most hard-core single issue gun voter will go blue for life if it means the NFA is repealed or heavily reworked.

Focus on real issues. Focus on wealth inequality, providing real opportunities to disadvantaged people, focus on accessible health care for all and removing the stigma from mental health issues.

And for fucks sake, no more old white people. I want new faces with new messages. Democrats are so incredibly unlikable because it's the same people over and over and over again. I want more of the squad and less of Pelosi and Schumer and Feinstein. We've been doing that for decades.

I'll eat the dog pile.

 

[Deleted member 46493]

Meanwhile no one's asking Cori Bush to get on the news 🙄

 

[Toxi]

Seriously, if you posted this thread a week ago, the responses would be the same.

 

[Deleted member 46493]

Obama ran as a progressive and governed like a centrist.

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For all the love this forum throws at Obama, they forget how he ran his campaign and won twice with a healthy margin while being called the Antichrist Socialist Muslim by the right.

 

[echoshifting]

Absolutely zero identity politics. As much as it sucks, half the voting base of this country will literally turn to fascism over voting blue if you mention social politics. Do that stuff in the background, but absolutely do not mention or run on it.

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lol if the party walks away from the issues of the lgbtq and poc voters in their base they can absolutely get fucked. I would never vote again

Seriously, to any Dem in the house or senate about to try to make Black Lives Matter or Trans Rights are Human Rights dirty words: get fucked and get out

 

[Deleted member 6230]

For all the love this forum throws at Obama, they forget how he ran his campaign and won twice with a healthy margin while being called the Antichrist Socialist Muslim by the right.

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And I said oop

 

[Anaron]

focus on class or fade away

 

[Azuran]

The Dems need to go extinct after this pathetic performance and quite frankly they deserve it. They always focus on courting white moderates who maybe, just maybe, might vote for them instead of focusing on the people that continue to support them. let alone the working class that's in dire needs of help. Medicare for all, raising the minimum wage, and marijuana legalization should be the bare minimum they should be running on. It's getting tiresome seeing things that could actually help Americans get ignored because some moderate in Wisconsin might not like his life getting better.

"But America is not ready for such a radical change!!!!" you say.

If that's the case then there's nothing that can save the Democrats if that's a popular opinion. Enjoy that unabashed capitalism baby! Viva the 1%!

 

[Chaos Legion]

This kind of language seeks to dismiss actual issues people have. It's the equivalent of "shut up, because you don't have any other choice". So fuck off with this.

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Far from it. I think we need to avoid digging into different factions and actually work together as we look towards how we're going to move forward as a party. I think there should be plenty of active dialogue between everyone in the party and we shouldn't ignore any issues when looking ahead at how to solve them.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

For all the love this forum throws at Obama, they forget how he ran his campaign and won twice with a healthy margin while being called the Antichrist Socialist Muslim by the right.

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Obama was the least "electable" presidential candidate of my lifetime. "Scary black muslim! Hussein! God daaaaaamn America!" And he's the one who won comfortably.

I do not understand why Democratic leadership is incapable of recognizing how important it is to actually inspire voters. They are afraid of their own shadow, always.

 

[Toxi]

Absolutely zero identity politics. As much as it sucks, half the voting base of this country will literally turn to fascism over voting blue if you mention social politics. Do that stuff in the background, but absolutely do not mention or run on it. The one and only focus of the democratic party needs to be focused on is how to help the middle class.

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Saying the quiet part out loud, huh.