Nana is still playable and has the same amount of color pallettes. You can have Popo fill the role so I'm not sure how that is remotely similar to Banjo-Kazooie's moveset which doesn't have two characters that can be KO'd separately.
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The utter lack of female alts for Hero in Super Smash Bros. is downright appalling.
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Nana is still playable and has the same amount of color pallettes. You can have Popo fill the role so I'm not sure how that is remotely similar to Banjo-Kazooie's moveset which doesn't have two characters that can be KO'd separately.
If someone is arguing alt. costumes are of less importance, why are they simultaneously arguing that Hero should have female alt. costumes?
Myself, I count the alt. costumes as just as important as the default costumes. Ike with his Hero costume is my main, rather than Ike with his default Ranger costume. I always use Pikachu Libre instead of the other costume options. I always use Little Mac's wireframe alt -- my daughter 90% of the time picks Little Mac's default. I usually pick female Robin; meanwhile, I usually use male Wii Fit Fighter.
I have choices, and that is good.
I definitely see the point of arguing the case that Hero should have had female alt. costumes. It just seems odd to me that those same people are at the same time saying alt. costumes don't count with Smash's female representation.
And if that is your case, then why are you simultaneously making the case that Hero should have female alt costumes?
Tracer revealed as LAST DLC fighter along with OW and/or OW2 for Switch at the game awards 2019 could be a reasonable time frame.
I gotta admit, one of my first reactions to the Hero reveal was "Wow, the female versions of the heroes were completely snubbed." At the very least they should have used the female version of either Erdrick or the Zenithian hero, and used the pink-haired default female version of the DQIX angel for the Smash attack. Those female versions have always existed, so why not use at least one or two?
I feel like people have a different definition of "appalling" than I do.
I guess it would be nice if they had a female char, but I'm gonna act like Nintendo is "apalling" because of something like this. I probably would be more annoyed if they didnt add female characters like Robin or Lucina previously.
I'm just happy we even got more than one hero to begin with.
I guess it would be nice if they had a female char, but I'm gonna act like Nintendo is "apalling" because of something like this. I probably would be more annoyed if they didnt add female characters like Robin or Lucina previously.
I'm just happy we even got more than one hero to begin with.
But you had to add the secondary part of partner duos (Kazooie & Nana) as well as a character whose gender is unspecified (Jigglypuff) to get that number for the defaults. To better illustrate the problem, here's A.By's post from a thread we worked on.
In my opinion, I throw more of a bone towards gender-choice characters who are female by default, but I agree with the rest of A.By's argument. For a better illustration of the problem, here's the thread on the subject that I (as well as a number of others) worked on back in March.
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This is why I'm hoping for echoes of the DLC fighters. I wouldn't mind if they made up DQVIII and DQXI heroines. They can add them to future revisions of those games: DLC for DQXI and a rerelease of DQVIII because it deserves another one (with orchestrated music for all regions).
Alt costumes don't get merchandising, appear in cutscenes or trailers(with a few rare exceptions), don't get to be on the cover, and with the exception of female Corrin don't get amiibo.
I have no idea how you can think there equal representation in any form.
The reason I'm mad at least,can't speak for others, is that it's insulting the female characters aren't even given that much.
Such a port would be revealed at BlizzCon, not The Game Awards. Likewise, based on what was described of "Overwatch 2", it sounds more like a PvE expansion for the original game rather than a direct sequel set to replace OG Overwatch.
If you are referring to me, Zero Suit Samus is wearing shorts in her alts and not something that looks like underwear or panties. This is Sakurai's own words if you want more proof.
I don't think the costume is the problem.
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Smash reps always rely heavily on nostalgia, and unfortunately, none of the DQ female heroines are as iconic as their male counterparts.
Now, if they add new characters from the franchise in the future, I fully expect them to have Jessica, Jade, Alena or someone else in the game.
Now, if they add new characters from the franchise in the future, I fully expect them to have Jessica, Jade, Alena or someone else in the game.
It's the fact that characters like Robin had the female alts that akes the exclusion of a female hero appalling, we're at a point in smash bros where it's a standard feature for characters in which multiple genders apply.
If they want, they could dedicate the next season to be only female characters if they don't plan on adding one or two in this season pass as long as they're unique. That is if they plan to do second season pass.
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oh i know it's not gonna be an actual "sequel" but "OW2" it's what people universally are calling it as a place holder name since it's hinted that it might be a stand alone game, which actually a PVE only OW game would hypothetically be easier to port into the switch.
I can't think of any 3rd party female reps to put in as the last 2 dlc slots beside...Lara Croft and 2B tbh ._.
What other MAjor female 3rd party characters are there that could be in smash
Hell even Nintendo what other game from them has a female main protagonist ? Xenoblade 2? But she's like your weapon <.<. Already have too many FE characters too. They need to create more ips with a female lead .
Maybe the Astral Chain chick
Man I'd love this but not a chance it happens.
Hoping the next two give us some female reps though.
They even went back and added the option for Pokemon Trainer and Pikachu, despite having to cut some previously established color alts in the process.
People aren't arguing this. They are completely dismissing her as part of a duo. Anyone who played those games know how important she was so please stop with the foolishness. Kazooie is great and hilarious.
So... take out Yoshi, Pikachu, and R.O.B. (which are non-gendered in their default states) and 30/80 slots (including Hero) are the only ones that would be allowed to be 'representative' of males?
I think it's silly to be applying filters and throwing out what is present as representations because it doesn't apply to marketing (e.g., I have a female Corrin amiibo and a male Inkling amiibo, that was negated by the default pick on a screen not matching those genders?). In game, it takes 1 button click to switch to the costume of my choice, don't claim the choice doesn't exist or belittle it because it's not the 'default' choice.
And yeah, I have always thought of Jigglypuff as female. In my mind that is the default gender that I have applied to that Pokémon.
The female Hero versions aren't the same size and have different proportions. You would need to adjust all the work done for the Luminary for those and then balance things differently. They wouldn't just be an alternate appearence like the other Heroes chosen as alts are.
Huh, I didnt know people expected this to be a mandatory feature for smash fighters for now on, I guess I'm just out of touch
She's an animal, literally attached to a male character, and has second billing to the dude.
You'll forgive me for not giving her as much weight as a fully playable female character.
I have amiibo based on alt. costumes for Corrin, Cloud, Bayoneta, and Inkling. I can PICK the characters alts in-game very easily and do so when I play. So, yeah, they exist. The marketing btw CONSTANTLY displays alt costumes for all characters. Cutscenes for the character reveals actually revel in showing off the alt costumes.
I can't find the paper or the exact number but with those numbers I'm flashing back to the research showing that somewhere around 25-30% of a group being women winds up being seen as balanced gender representation.
EDIT: Had to skim some articles but this might be what I was thinking of: https://seejane.org/wp-content/uploads/gender-bias-without-borders-full-report.pdf
The male character is also an animal and is literally attached to the female character, and both share billing. Geeze.
So where are the amiibo for female villager, pokemon trainer, Robin, Pikachu LIbre, Spike eared Pichu, Wendy, etc?
There not as important as the default character. That is an objective fact.
Yeah I'm lost on this. Does male Wii Fit Trainer cancel out the existence of the female default one?
The thread literally begins with someone complainingly about the lack of female alts with Hero then proceeds to diminish every attempt or step the game makes at female inclusion by any or every means.
It can be better for sure. But it's weird to see a game such as this be criticized for giving you options such as this. I want more stand alone female characters but still enjoy the options to swap between male and female.
Also, Kazooie is a badass so let's stop diminishing her and their wildly cartoony moveset. Thank you.
I'd love for more alt. based amiibo to be released. That there are more amiibo still being released and not all characters have had amiibo's released yet does make it possible more alt ones could also release.
That I can PICK the alt costumes while playing and that cutscenes, trailers, and marketing DOES showcase alt costumes are also objective facts.
Let's ask for more inclusion. Let's not dismiss and filter inclusion that DOES take place.
The fact that we have to count Spiky Pichu to get a supposed balanced roster is really all that needs to be said IMO.
Is Sophia the one with the big poofy green hair? She's like the most iconic Dragon Quest design I can even think of because she doesn't just look like Goku, Trunks or Gohan with armor on. They should've put her in.
I agree with you here, at the very least I wish they had included her over the male DQ IV hero. Her design is so good.
Eight and Luminary don't have female equivalents and they didn't want to make gender alts for only some of Hero variants. Is it unfortunate? Yes, but appalling seems like a bit of an overly strong word.
They absolutely could've put Sofia in instead of Solo, but that's on Square Enix for only ever promoting the male DQ heroes, not Nintendo.
They absolutely could've put Sofia in instead of Solo, but that's on Square Enix for only ever promoting the male DQ heroes, not Nintendo.
It's more complicated than that, i personally would NOT say Kazooie is "enough" representation, but as a long time BK fans, we do find the idea of dismissing Kazooie as "a sidekick accesory to her male character" annoying and disrespectful to the character, Banjo and Kazooie have ALWAYS been inseparable and equally important to each other in the franchise, it doesn't matter that Banjo is the main body or that Kazooie literally does everything, to hardcore Banjo-Kazooie fans, they're equal parts of a single unit.
We shouldn't be at a point where a partner character is enough.
Banjo and Kazooie are a team but nobody would be bringing them up were there uniquely female characters in the game.
They are a duo.
Idk what to tell you. I'm not saying she is equal to Bayonetta but they are a 50/50 team with their own distinct personality and traits.
See it how you want and I'll see it how I want, I guess. In their own games they were portrayed this way and in the second game you can play with them both separately. So if you want to diminish her role for the betterment of your argument feel free. All I know is without each other they aren't as strong and I don't see how that's a negative or untrue to the characters--or how this makes Kazooie less.
I feel you OP. As much I like Eldrick and VIII Hero, I would love to see Aurora, Teresa, and Bianca playable.
Why wouldn't we? Until hero, Every character that has come since Smash 4 to which the choice applies has had this feature as well as retroactively adding it to other characters like the pokemon characters who got them.
Multiple female DQ Heroes have been posted in this very thread, come on.
Yeah, she looks like Bulma with a one piece on!
Er, seriously, though, it's kind of a shame there's not at least a visible female character there. We could get surprised and an alt color has them there, but it's doubtful.
I think it would be great to have gaming as a whole be equally representative of people. 50-50% would be actually balanced representation. That said, Smash Bros as a game celebrates the history of gaming. From that viewpoint, it's done pretty well no?
I talked about this in the previous page, and the problem with her is her design, as the Cero board is more strict towards designs that look like they are wearing underwear, for the A rating at least. That, and also because of her height differencing as she doesn't ine up perfectly with the male main character.
I don't think that's true.
Smash was never going to be a 50/50 split between male and female characters, we all know this and are only in the position of wanting them to do better. The fighting games out of Japan that do this often do so with heavily sexualized female characters and to me that's not as great.
I can be in the position of wanting them to do better, enjoying the current female selection, enjoying the alt swaps, and also enjoying Banjo-Kazooie. I don't have to take this absolutist stance that some here subscribe to.
Why do people keep bringing this up as if Smash bros didn't change the fuck out of the scale of two thirds of its cast in order to serve gameplay?
I don't think any of us expect Smash Ultimate to have a 50/50 split. But the fact that Smash Ultimate is in MvCI (a game marred by corporate meddling & poor decision making from top to bottom) territory when it comes to the percentage of female fighters on the roster (Smash Ultimate's 18.75% compared to MvCI's 16.667%) is legitimately concerning.
Consequently there are those in the position of hey, they're woefully underrepresented, and obvious points like a Dragon Quest heroine were missed because women get passed up all the time.
There's always room for improvement, and more to the point, why not have there be a 50/50 split? Why does gaming have to be so male centric, and when are we going to be more inclusive?