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StoveOven

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,234
I don't think it serves American financial interests to be locked out of Cuba's economy. It's not like the embargo generates some sort of economic activity like a arms race would somewhat cause in the military industrial sector.

And while history has shown the imperialist structures fought to control Cuba economically, I don't think anyone actually sees the embargo as something that would eventually restore it these days.

If the embargo was lifted, realistically aside from Cuba benefiting, the economic activity it would generate for American financial interests absolutely outweighs this very faint scenario where the U.S puppets Cuba again.
I generally agree with this, and it's probably why the strategy with Cuba changed under Obama. The idea of the sanctions leading to a revolution has had decades to discredit itself.

Although I do think the possibility of a successful socialist state is still seen as a threat to American capital, especially with increased levels of dissent in America and the growing acceptance of socialism among young people.

But I wasn't talking about the embargo with that post. I was saying that if the US were to in any way involve themselves with some sort of Cuban opposition, they would do so in the way that best benefited American financial interests with little regard for the well being of Cubans.
 
Nov 2, 2017
2,253

Yes. There's definitely a bunch of liberals in this thread, and most all of them are the ones handwringing trying to distract from the long record of what US intervention looks like and who it benefits and thinking that screaming "COMMUNISM" constitutes an argument.

The people you're upset about are very clearly not liberals.
 

Deleted member 19813

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
3,928
I've said this before and I'll say it again, but for many on the left, politics is a team sport. To them, any socialist regime must be defended regardless of how odious the regime actually is - and similarly, the US is irredeemably evil and any opponent of the US must also be defended regardless of their actions.

This is what this thread has become.

While many Cubans were fleeing communism on styrofoam cooler lids in shark infested waters to get here, those blaming the USA for the EVIL actions were sitting in their suburban home playing video games. Just because you are married to your politics, ideals, new vocabulary, and so forth, doesn't mean you know better than the actual victimized civilians. It's disgusting.
 

Deleted member 19813

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
3,928
Yes. There's definitely a bunch of liberals in this thread, and most all of them are the ones handwringing trying to distract from the long record of what US intervention looks like and who it benefits and thinking that screaming "COMMUNISM" constitutes an argument.

The people you're upset about are very clearly not liberals.

They must be right-wing Nazis? Right?
 

lemonade

Member
May 8, 2018
3,044
Weird that you seem to think intervention only means military intervention which is something I have said I am against.

I'll keep saying it, the Cuban people can't overcome it's government through will alone. They will be killed - are being killed - if they do so. It's asymmetric, so encouraging them to do so is not honest if you aren't willing to follow up to help in some form. The US isn't so morally bankrupt it can't do good - and any nation that's within 90 miles of one's borders is in any nation's interest. To deny the US any interest, particularly since there are historical and other interests at play.

I don't need to rattle off what good or bad the US has done historically (which is off topic) when I am trying to keep this focused on the Cubans first and foremost. So it's not a dodge, it's just a recognition that there is no outcome here that won't involve the US in some form.

What you seem to advocate for is drop the embargo (which I agree with), but then not only do nothing but let the regime behave as is without any engagement. Which is fine, I just disagree.

I have seen you in multiple threads, repeatedly denying US imperialism by making "both sides" arguments, trying to white-wash the atrocious history of US imperialism while advocating US intervention.

GTFO with your LARP of "focused on Cubans first and foremost" and just admit you want US to be the "world police" and keep on meddling with other countries in the name of "democracy and freedom".
 

lemonade

Member
May 8, 2018
3,044
What blows my mind is how much discussion is about the US. This is about Cubans fighting a communist dictatorship. The white liberal doesn't always have to be the victim and make everything about their hatred of their own country.

This is what this thread has become.

While many Cubans were fleeing communism on styrofoam cooler lids in shark infested waters to get here, those blaming the USA for the EVIL actions were sitting in their suburban home playing video games. Just because you are married to your politics, ideals, new vocabulary, and so forth, doesn't mean you know better than the actual victimized civilians. It's disgusting.

You sound like a Republican Florida state politician. Recognizing US imperialism and intervention as a direct precursor to Cuba's current struggle is as relevant as ever in this current event.
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
Here is an video from some people in Cuba discussing the protests and what the government is doing about it. It's in Spanish obviously, I can't translate it all, it's very long but the gist of it is that he is saying the people are not afraid anymore, not afraid of their oppressors, they will march to protest this dictatorship.

He mentions that army is beating, arresting and even killing protestors. He mentions some protestors get beat up and taken away to different parts of the island and they basically make you disappear. He says they heard of plans of the government to shut down the internet and power. Other cities have the army out in force imposing a lockdown. He says they have government officials hiding in street clothes to spot dissenters.

He mentions how they have no medicine, one small pack of aspirin costs a thousand pesos. They plan to march at 4, guess this was before then. Says they don't throw one stone, says they will be peaceful and just exclaim the will of the people. He said he would share the experience live if they don't shut down the internet. I assume they shut down the internet.

This is just one group of people in Cuba, there are plenty of stories of people here in Miami getting in touch with family members in Cuba sharing the same stories of people being beaten and jailed. This is what is happening on the ground in Cuba.
To add to my previous response to this, I've seen now that the government's alleged plan for suppressing the protests is circulating and seems to be what this guy is reading from in the video. Apparently a cop who disagrees with the actions leaked it. It's not crazy to think some cops aren't into what's going on, since some form of service (military, police, fire fighters) is compulsory for young men. So there should certainly be Cubans who were conscripted into the police force who support the protestors, and I've heard scattered reports of some police joining the protests.
 

sacrament

Banned
Dec 16, 2019
2,119
I have seen you in multiple threads, repeatedly denying US imperialism by making "both sides" arguments, trying to white-wash the atrocious history of US imperialism while advocating US intervention.

GTFO with your LARP of "focused on Cubans first and foremost" and just admit you want US to be the "world police" and keep on meddling with other countries in the name of "democracy and freedom".

No...? Hardly would say my numerous comments in this very thread about dropping the embargo, and speaking against military intervention as the corner stone of US imperial advocacy.

There is no both sides on this... I can be against the US policies historically, and against the regime in Cuba while thinking there can be another way to solve the problem.

Since you're full of answers, how would you see through this?
 

Feign

Member
Aug 11, 2020
2,515
<-- Coast
There have been many good-faith posts in this thread about the consequences of American foreign policy with respect to Cuba. I advise anyone who encounters a bad-faith poster trying to derail the thread to report and ignore. This should be first and foremost a thread about current events in Cuba; if the discussion gets too far off-track it may be locked.

This should probably get a threadmark.
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
People are sharing a list of names of over 110 people it claims are missing or detained. Personally I can verify that two of the people named were indeed arrested, plus there's a well-known activist (Luis Manuel Otero Alcantara) among the names. That seems to be the scope of the arrests that we know of so far.

This should probably get a threadmark.
I hope that's not necessary. I don't think it would accomplish much.
 
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sacrament

Banned
Dec 16, 2019
2,119
People are sharing a list of names of over 110 people it claims are missing or detained. Personally I can verify that two of the people named were indeed arrested, plus there's a well-known activist (Luis Manuel Otero Alcantara) among the names. That seems to be the scope of the arrests that we know of so far.

Where are you tracking these things? Trying to keep abreast of things, but can't find much outside the original videos.

Incidentally, Mexico's President did call for the removal of the embargo and Biden made a statement in solidarity with the people.

Guess cutting the internet tends to slow down the news...
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
Where are you tracking these things? Trying to keep abreast of things, but can't find much outside the original videos.

Incidentally, Mexico's President did call for the removal of the embargo and Biden made a statement in solidarity with the people.

Guess cutting the internet tends to slow down the news...
I see a lot in my Facebook feed because I have FB friends living in Cuba. My partner gets way more because she's Cuban and has dozens of connections. Her family has been plugged into this nonstop since it started. So basically I'm getting some stuff from primary sources.

I wasn't sure if I should share the missing persons poster itself since I doubt it would be of use to anyone here, but I guess it's good for people to see it if they want to, so here it is.

The networks were apparently taken down in Havana today. It seems people are still out there even now, playing protest music and such. I wish I had more solid reporting to share, but it's been scarce tonight. There's a lot of hearsay that I've been keeping to myself for now, as I think it would be irresponsible for me to amplify information if I'm not confident it's true.
 
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Beer Monkey

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
9,308
How hard is it to say what you mean? Here, I'll do it so people can stop jerking this guy around for no good reason: "liberals" and "leftists" are different things.

God…

By that I'm assuming that you mean the 'leftists' are people trying to get Republicans elected to prove a point and own the libs and "accelerate" the situation.

Signed, somebody way left of the DNC who has finally disavowed the 'leftist' label. I no longer trust 'leftists'. And I identified as "leftist" for decades. I'm in my 50s and have seen enough of the disingenuous bullshit.
 

Deleted member 2834

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,620

Metallix87

User Requested Self-Ban
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
10,533
Please ban me from this website forever.
FWIW, I understand how you feel reading all the shit in here. It's crazy and sickening how much people on Era have to turn everything into an opportunity to shit on the United States and avoid putting blame on a leftist dictatorship.
 

Keasar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,724
Umeå, Sweden
By that I'm assuming that you mean the 'leftists' are people trying to get Republicans elected to prove a point and own the libs and "accelerate" the situation.

Signed, somebody way left of the DNC who has finally disavowed the 'leftist' label. I no longer trust 'leftists'. And I identified as "leftist" for decades. I'm in my 50s and have seen enough of the disingenuous bullshit.
When an American says they are "way left".

unknown.png
 

Ramsay

Member
Jul 2, 2019
3,625
Australia
Please ban me from this website forever.
I definitely understand where you're coming from.

If this was about a protest in Chile against Pinochet, everyone here would be rightfully up in arms, and for good reason - yet when it comes to an equally corrupt regime that killed far more people (possibly as much as all the Operation Condor countries combined, depending on how you count Castro's death toll), we get people here defending this tyranny because the regime is "on their side".

Like outside of maybe Communist China (which people simply say isn't communist), I've seen ridiculous excuses for repression in communist regimes (the Red Terror, anyone?) simply because a socialist regime was the one doing it, as if this makes any difference to the tens of thousands tortured or murdered.
 

Metallix87

User Requested Self-Ban
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
10,533
I definitely understand where you're coming from.

If this was about a protest in Chile against Pinochet, everyone here would be rightfully up in arms, and for good reason - yet when it comes to an equally corrupt regime that killed far more people (possibly as much as all the Operation Condor countries combined, depending on how you count Castro's death toll), we get people here defending this tyranny because the regime is "on their side".

Like outside of maybe Communist China (which people simply say isn't communist), I've seen ridiculous excuses for repression in communist regimes (the Red Terror, anyone?) simply because a socialist regime was the one doing it, as if this makes any difference to the tens of thousands tortured or murdered.
I see this on Twitter, as well. I had an exchange with someone who was praising Castro, and I explained what my own family endured under his reign. He said my family must've been wealthy, when I explained that they weren't, rather than blame the communist dictatorship, he replied "well, that's just war and revolution, not communists".
 

Zandareth

Member
Oct 25, 2017
66
I definitely understand where you're coming from.

If this was about a protest in Chile against Pinochet, everyone here would be rightfully up in arms, and for good reason - yet when it comes to an equally corrupt regime that killed far more people (possibly as much as all the Operation Condor countries combined, depending on how you count Castro's death toll), we get people here defending this tyranny because the regime is "on their side".

Like outside of maybe Communist China (which people simply say isn't communist), I've seen ridiculous excuses for repression in communist regimes (the Red Terror, anyone?) simply because a socialist regime was the one doing it, as if this makes any difference to the tens of thousands tortured or murdered.

Yeah. It's extremely infuriating to see people in their cozy developed country defending regimes that are quite frankly just evil, just because they claim to be left wing. You can be against Trump and against Maduro, Ortega and Diaz-Canel, there is no contradiction there, you just care about basic human rights and the lives of the oppressed people, how hard can this be to understand?
 

PeskyToaster

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,318
Were those articles lauding their Covid response and vaccine just puff pieces? It seemed like Cuba's health system and other metrics were ranked quite highly but maybe the reality on the ground for the common folk is different. Hard to determine what most people really want though without free and fair elections.
 

Serpens007

Well, Tosca isn't for everyone
Moderator
Oct 31, 2017
8,135
Chile
I definitely understand where you're coming from.

If this was about a protest in Chile against Pinochet, everyone here would be rightfully up in arms, and for good reason - yet when it comes to an equally corrupt regime that killed far more people (possibly as much as all the Operation Condor countries combined, depending on how you count Castro's death toll), we get people here defending this tyranny because the regime is "on their side".

Like outside of maybe Communist China (which people simply say isn't communist), I've seen ridiculous excuses for repression in communist regimes (the Red Terror, anyone?) simply because a socialist regime was the one doing it, as if this makes any difference to the tens of thousands tortured or murdered.

Considering one of the excuses Pinochet used to kill thousands, and torture tens of thousands, including kidnapping babies and sending them to different countries (or even military taking them to their own families, making them hate their previous family without knowing they were adopted), was precisely to "not turn us into another Castro's Cuba", I find this comparison rather insensitive.

Were those articles lauding their Covid response and vaccine just puff pieces? It seemed like Cuba's health system and other metrics were ranked quite highly but maybe the reality on the ground for the common folk is different. Hard to determine what most people really want though without free and fair elections.

AFAIK, they were actually doing well and those articles weren't puff pieces. The crisis just got to them eventually and they don't have many ways of getting out of it sadly.
 

Metallix87

User Requested Self-Ban
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
10,533
Were those articles lauding their Covid response and vaccine just puff pieces? It seemed like Cuba's health system and other metrics were ranked quite highly but maybe the reality on the ground for the common folk is different. Hard to determine what most people really want though without free and fair elections.
From my understanding of the situation, based on what my immediate family has told me, their healthcare system is great "in theory", but in practice suffers because most Cuban doctors overwhelmingly opt to leave the country for work, as despite having to give the Cuban government a chunk of their pay, they still make significantly more money working in other countries than they would working in Cuba. Basically, there is no real incentive for Cuban doctors to practice in Cuba, and thus wait times at hospitals and clinics can be extreme at best and disastrous at worst.

Considering one of the excuses Pinochet used to kill thousands, and torture tens of thousands, including kidnapping babies and sending them to different countries (or even military taking them to their own families, making them hate their previous family without knowing they were adopted), was precisely to "not turn us into another Castro's Cuba", I find this comparison rather insensitive.
Not for nothing, but the way a lot of people are going to bat for the communist regime that has robbed, killed, and tortured the Cuban people for decades on here is not just insensitive, but disgusting, so I'm not sure why this is what you're taking offense to. Both regimes are monstrous, but one wouldn't have people actively covering for their actions so aggressively.
 
Aug 8, 2019
230
Were those articles lauding their Covid response and vaccine just puff pieces? It seemed like Cuba's health system and other metrics were ranked quite highly but maybe the reality on the ground for the common folk is different. Hard to determine what most people really want though without free and fair elections.
Numbers as of today:

Population: 11 million
Cases: 244,914
Deaths: 1,579

Even at their worst moment during the pandemic, the country's numbers are far better than the regional average. Those articles were not puff pieces, but this last month has been the worst by far.

Edit: Link to see the number of Coronavirus deaths across Latin America
 
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Dennis8K

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,161
The Cuban regime is awful. I wish the protesters the best.

The embargo on Cuba is evil though. All it does, and have done for decades, is hurt regular people in Cuba.

The embargo has been ongoing for decades but the regime stays. At what point is sanity going to prevail and the embargo lifted?
 

Serpens007

Well, Tosca isn't for everyone
Moderator
Oct 31, 2017
8,135
Chile
Not for nothing, but the way a lot of people are going to bat for the communist regime that has robbed, killed, and tortured the Cuban people for decades on here is not just insensitive, but disgusting, so I'm not sure why this is what you're taking offense to. Both regimes are monstrous, but one wouldn't have people actively covering for their actions so aggressively.

Because it hits close to home and it's specially insensitive when you have several Chileans in the thread supporting the Cuban people. Political exiles that flee Chile were given asylum in Cuba too, so there's that also. Sadly, the cuban regime was (and still is) used to justify anti-marxist sentiment that has lead to attrocities in the other side of the "political fence" in completely different historical and geopolitical contexts. There are much better examples for the point you're trying to make.
 

Metallix87

User Requested Self-Ban
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
10,533
Because it hits close to home and it's specially insensitive when you have several Chileans in the thread supporting the Cuban people. Political exiles that flee Chile were given asylum in Cuba too, so there's that also. Sadly, the cuban regime was (and still is) used to justify anti-marxist sentiment that has lead to attrocities in the other side of the "political fence" in completely different historical and geopolitical contexts. There are much better examples for the point you're trying to make.
The Cuban regime is used to justify anti-Marxist sentiment because they actively identify as a Marxist state and continue to commit atrocities on their populace, but get defended consistently by people on here. The comparison that person was making wasn't saying that Pinochet is somehow less bad than the Cuban Communist Party, nor that the Chilean people weren't suffering under Pinochet, it was pointing out that people will defend a Marxist dictatorship aggressively in a way they won't defend other brutal dictatorships. You're essentially proving their point correct by taking offense, too.
 

sphagnum

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,058
Were those articles lauding their Covid response and vaccine just puff pieces? It seemed like Cuba's health system and other metrics were ranked quite highly but maybe the reality on the ground for the common folk is different. Hard to determine what most people really want though without free and fair elections.

No, they were doing very well previously.
 

Serpens007

Well, Tosca isn't for everyone
Moderator
Oct 31, 2017
8,135
Chile
The Cuban regime is used to justify anti-Marxist sentiment because they actively identify as a Marxist state and continue to commit atrocities on their populace, but get defended consistently by people on here. The comparison that person was making wasn't saying that Pinochet is somehow less bad than the Cuban Communist Party, nor that the Chilean people weren't suffering under Pinochet, it was pointing out that people will defend a Marxist dictatorship aggressively in a way they won't defend other brutal dictatorships. You're essentially proving their point correct by taking offense, too.

They quite literally implied that Castro was worse than the whole Operation Condor combined. I am entitled to feel offense if it's that we're being used as an example to try to persuade white folks. I'm sure not every chilean on this board or even in this same thread feel the same, but I would please ask to find better examples to lecture those people that want to bat for the regime. You are using a dictator that toppled one of the few examples of an actual democratic, socialist government and people to lecture others.
 

Deleted member 4346

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,976
By that I'm assuming that you mean the 'leftists' are people trying to get Republicans elected to prove a point and own the libs and "accelerate" the situation.

Signed, somebody way left of the DNC who has finally disavowed the 'leftist' label. I no longer trust 'leftists'. And I identified as "leftist" for decades. I'm in my 50s and have seen enough of the disingenuous bullshit.

This is really something, I've read it several times and I can't figure out of it's genuine or someone doing a bit. It's like the left meme "I'm a lefty from way back" personified. Who do you trust now, the Democratic establishment that are in power? The same ones who are continuing the sanctions on Cuba, the same ones who could easily provide enough vaccines and food for a country just off of our coast?

Jesus Christ. I swear politics breaks people down into the most absurd and laughable positions.
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
[Internet outages] made it difficult to corroborate reports that scores of activists had been taken into custody. Videos posted on social media on Monday appeared to show the authorities parading through the streets and violently detaining people, beating them with batons and kicking them once they had fallen to the ground.

Cuban dissidents compiled the names of scores of people they said were missing, prompting fears that the government had begun a fresh crackdown on anti-government activists.
This seems to be referring to the list I posted of over 110 people:
I wasn't sure if I should share the missing persons poster itself since I doubt it would be of use to anyone here, but I guess it's good for people to see it if they want to, so here it is.

As protests spread on Sunday, Mariam Rosa, a 28-year old with a toddler, said she wrestled with an everyday dilemma: Should she spend hours in line waiting to buy milk for her baby at a store, or pay triple for a bottle on the black market?

"I'm in a lucky position that I can afford this, but most people are not," she said. She added that she had not joined the protests, out of fear for her family's safety.
I'm sure some are thinking that the protestors don't speak for all Cubans, and they're right -- including when they say "we are not afraid." When the government catches young people dissenting, it calls their grandparents and tells them to make sure their grandkids are being good citizens. I hope the doubters in the first couple pages who saw a crowd of people and said, 'it looks like a free country to me!' are still paying attention. Cubans are not free to speak against their government. Even after leaving to another country, they often restrain themselves for fear the regime will retaliate against their family.
 

Metallix87

User Requested Self-Ban
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
10,533
They quite literally implied that Castro was worse than the whole Operation Condor combined. I am entitled to feel offense if it's that we're being used as an example to try to persuade white folks. I'm sure not every chilean on this board or even in this same thread feel the same, but I would please ask to find better examples to lecture those people that want to bat for the regime. You are using a dictator that toppled one of the few examples of an actual democratic, socialist government and people to lecture others.
Fair enough. Can this philosophy then be applied more broadly on this forum moving forward?
 

Serpens007

Well, Tosca isn't for everyone
Moderator
Oct 31, 2017
8,135
Chile
Fair enough. Can this philosophy then be applied more broadly on this forum moving forward?

Well, I'd say just use the report function. Even if the result is not what one always may want, it's always helpful.

I personally just hope we can keep this thread healthy to stay informed about the situation in Cuba and the struggle they are going through, while yeah also being able to discuss stuff like the embargo without turning this into a thread about "white marxists opinions on the internet". It's hard enough to know what happens on the island right now without that
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
Continued protests this morning and yesterday:




Thanks for sharing! I think I saw the first video on Facebook last night. Not sure what's going on the second one there, haha.

From my understanding of the situation, based on what my immediate family has told me, their healthcare system is great "in theory", but in practice suffers because most Cuban doctors overwhelmingly opt to leave the country for work, as despite having to give the Cuban government a chunk of their pay, they still make significantly more money working in other countries than they would working in Cuba. Basically, there is no real incentive for Cuban doctors to practice in Cuba, and thus wait times at hospitals and clinics can be extreme at best and disastrous at worst.
This is consistent with what I've heard. Cuba sells its healthcare workers like mercenaries to other countries and doesn't pass on the benefits to its workforce. Some doctors also go in hopes of escaping into the host country; I've heard at least one story of a doctor just slipping away without a word to anyone, even their family.

Were those articles lauding their Covid response and vaccine just puff pieces? It seemed like Cuba's health system and other metrics were ranked quite highly but maybe the reality on the ground for the common folk is different. Hard to determine what most people really want though without free and fair elections.
You've gotten some good responses already, and I'll add my own understanding. The country is able to control its citizens in a way that some countries (like the U.S.) can't, including an enforced national mask mandate and forced quarantine for everyone who tests positive for COVID and everyone who has contact with them. It strictly limited foreign travel and tested all incoming travelers, with forced quarantine for any travelers who test positive. It worked very well for the first year of the pandemic. I wouldn't say that articles praising Cuba's handling of the pandemic are puff pieces at all, but if any claim that it did well just because of its healthcare system, I'd say they were omitting some relevant information. After a while, the lack of medicine, soap, masks, and other supplies simply took their toll. The country's transportation is also reliant on a lot of public transit... lots of people on buses together.

As for the vaccine, the Cuban government says it's very effective. There isn't external confirmation of that yet. I will say that they would be pretty stupid to waste their limited resources manufacturing and administering vaccines they know aren't effective, so I'm personally leaning towards the vaccines being at least somewhat effective. I hope so because some people close to me have gotten it. However they know people who got the vaccine but still died of COVID. In those cases, not enough time had passed for the vaccine to take full effect, but the mRNA vaccines have at least some effectiveness a couple of weeks after the first dose, so at least in that regard the Cuban vaccine may not be comparable to them. It is supposed to require three doses spaced out over more than two months.
 

Metallix87

User Requested Self-Ban
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
10,533
This is consistent with what I've heard. Cuba sells its healthcare workers like mercenaries to other countries and doesn't pass on the benefits to its workforce. Some doctors also go in hopes of escaping into the host country; I've heard at least one story of a doctor just slipping away without a word to anyone, even their family.
Yep, the latter checks out with what I've heard. Being a doctor in Cuba is one of the best ways to get the hell out of there.
 

janusff

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
18,198
Austin, TX
This forum and its predecessor has always had some weird opinions about Cuba.

I'm a Cuban American born on the island. I came to the U.S. when I was 6 and have lived in Miami ever since. Much of my family stayed behind in Cuba. My father, sister and stepmother finally made it to the U.S. in 2005. I still have an aunt and cousins who live there.

Most Cuban Americans in Miami are traditionally Republican and support the embargo. This is slowly changing and younger generations are beginning to think differently. Now, I'm not a Rebublican and don't support the embargo. But I'm not about to go around and act like the Cuban government is the victim here. They are an oppressive regime. Anyone here that acts like the Cuban government isn't that bad and that they are actually a democracy has no fucking idea what they are talking about.

I still remember the thread in the old place that popped up when Fidel Castro died. Many were acting like he was some sort of hero. I was so confused but I think I understand why. This place is very critical of the United States, very often justifiably so. Castro was a guy who was often seen as outsmarting the U.S. and persevering despite many efforts to get rid of him. Many consider only this and had nothing but kind words. It was upsetting to me at the time but I didn't really engage because I just wasn't in the mood.
Thanks for sharing. Great post
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
Yep, the latter checks out with what I've heard. Being a doctor in Cuba is one of the best ways to get the hell out of there.
Well, sort of! The government doesn't allow doctors to emigrate. During particularly rough periods, it extends that restriction to nurses as well. Healthcare workers are trapped in the country.
 

Metallix87

User Requested Self-Ban
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
10,533
Well, sort of! The government doesn't allow doctors to emigrate. During particularly rough periods, it extends that restriction to nurses as well. Healthcare workers are trapped in the country.
They can't emigrate with the purpose of leaving, but they're able to find work outside of the country, which in many instances in past has allowed them to essentially leave without officially saying they've left.
 
OP
OP
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
They can't emigrate with the purpose of leaving, but they're able to find work outside of the country, which in many instances in past has allowed them to essentially leave without officially saying they've left.
Oh, can they do this on their own, without being part of a government-led group? I didn't know about that, if so.