• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
  • We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.

Hailinel

Shamed a mod for a tag
Member
Oct 27, 2017
35,527
I would readily accept "they were in over their heads, resulting in disaster" (I mean, there's probably nothing more human than that) if not for the whole "gamers can't appreciate art" thing. At some point you have to stop giving people the benefit of the doubt and concede they really are that clueless and lacking in self-awareness.

The game is truly fascinating in its awfulness, on so many levels; the multiple fonts used are downright offensive. It's the videogame equivalent of an Ed Wood movie.
Oh, they can be both in over their heads while their heads are firmly planted in their asses. One does not absolve the other here. The thing is, even if the writing wasn't so painful and Alex was actually a sympathetic character, it would still be a story playing out against a game with an agonizingly slow, mechanically bloated combat system and a needlessly obtuse leveling mechanic, among its other gameplay follies.
 

Weltall Zero

Game Developer
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
19,343
Madrid
Oh, they can be both in over their heads while their heads are firmly planted in their asses. One does not absolve the other here. The thing is, even if the writing wasn't so painful and Alex was actually a sympathetic character, it would still be a story playing out against a game with an agonizingly slow, mechanically bloated combat system and a needlessly obtuse leveling mechanic, among its other gameplay follies.

"Going in over their heads" implies failing to fulfill their own ambitions, which doesn't seem to be what's happening here, given that they consider the resulting work to be art, and people disliking it to be uncultured.
 
Oct 27, 2017
11,532
Bandung Indonesia
Mindblown seeing some in here is still using the word "tribute" to describe what happened here.

Copy pasting verbatim with no acknowledgment to authorship is not tribute, people, it's plagiarism.
 

Hailinel

Shamed a mod for a tag
Member
Oct 27, 2017
35,527
"Going in over their heads" implies failing to fulfill their own ambitions, which doesn't seem to be what's happening here, given that they consider the resulting work to be art, and people disliking it to be uncultured.
A person that's in over their head doesn't always realize it, or want to admit it. Why admit failure when they can just say that no one understands their genius? It's delusion born from incompetence.
 

xir

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,632
Los Angeles, CA

toythatkills

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,826
London, UK
Before hanging this guy out to dry, does every other game that pays tribute to other works of art (for lack of a better term?) cite their source materials in the credits?

He's not paying tribute, he's plagiarising, so your question really is "does every other game that plagiarises other works of art cite their source materials in the credits?" to which the answer is obviously no, but doesn't really count as a defence.

It's not an homage, or a tribute, because there was no artistic reason for the text to be there in that form, no attempt to make it even remotely clear that the text was stolen, no attempt to credit the author, and etc. Believing that the guy who made this game is just naive about homage is incredibly naive about on the part of anyone who believes it. It makes no sense at all.
 
May 21, 2019
1
PDX
I don't think some people here understand sampling in music.

You can't just grab any sound and put it in a commercial track without attribution anymore. Sure, the Amen Break from "Amen, Brother" by the Winstons became a monster outside of its own context, and birthed entire genres, but the fact that the creators died penniless had more to do with the lack of structure around sample attribution at the time.

There's a system. If you're not submitting your shit to ASCAP and citing your sample sources, and possibly paying licensing fees, and your commercial tracks get out in the world uncited, you'd better have a good lawyer on your side. And since the plagiarism trial involving the melody from "Blurred Lines," that legal precedent is even more in favor of the original content creator, not the sampler. Look up the case surrounding The Verve Pipe's "Bittersweet Symphony" for further reading.

tl;dr, No, even if this was a case of AACK releasing a song with an uncleared sample, they still did it wrong.

Source: I'm a published drum n bass producer and record label co-owner.
 
More alleged plagiarism

Sera

Member
Oct 27, 2017
698
Melbourne
More stuff found

D7pRWlQXsAASlxv.jpg
 

sredgrin

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,276
Hopefully this will be taken a bit more seriously now that it's a non-fictional source that they're plagiarising!

Why would it be taken more seriously? Fiction requires creativity, copying that is much more potentially harmful, as it could be argued he is attempting to pass the creativity off as his own. With like dictionary definitions, it more screams just being fucking lazy.
 

Plum

Member
May 31, 2018
17,317
Why would it be taken more seriously? Fiction requires creativity, copying that is much more potentially harmful, as it could be argued he is attempting to pass the creativity off as his own. With like dictionary definitions, it more screams just being fucking lazy.

Because it's much harder to pull the "it's just a homage!" or "it's just fair use!" excuses when you're copying something that doesn't require creativity. Both are equally as harmful in my eyes as, even though non-fiction stuff doesn't require creativity, it's still legitimate content that was created through effort and skill (albeit probably not that much).
 

Eumi

Member
Nov 3, 2017
3,518
Again, I haven't played the game, so maybe every single other line of dialogue is fantastic, but when I see multiple characters citing internet definitions as if that's their own words, it just makes me think that very little care was put into what the characters are actually saying.

Good writing would have characters explain concepts in a way that is in line with the character, using words and phrases that help build that character. This is just taking an actual, real person's words and puppeteering your characters to say them.

Either way the author's stance of "no one appreciates my game because they don't get it" gets funnier by the day.
 

Adamska

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,042
Honestly, it's very naive to describe what's happening as plagiarism. The game appears to contains hundreds of lines of dialogue, and yet only a handful of those pertain to the Murakami book and it's actual plot line is not lifted from the work that's allegedly being plagiarized. It'd be like claiming a movie plagiarized The Terminator for having a character saying "I'll be back" while not being about time traveling cyborgs.
 

toythatkills

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,826
London, UK
Honestly, it's very naive to describe what's happening as plagiarism. The game appears to contains hundreds of lines of dialogue, and yet only a handful of those pertain to the Murakami book and it's actual plot line is not lifted from the work that's allegedly being plagiarized. It'd be like claiming a movie plagiarized The Terminator for having a character saying "I'll be back" while not being about time traveling cyborgs.

So you'd equate the quotes in the OP, a good paragraph or so of text directly copied from a book, to the common everyday phrase "I'll be back."
 

Adamska

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,042
So you'd equate the quotes in the OP, a good paragraph or so of text directly copied from a book, to the common everyday phrase "I'll be back."
I'm not sure how you came to your conclusion, but no, I'm saying creative works can contain callbacks to other works and doing so is not considered plagiarism.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,114
I buy it was a homage to be honest. It was a tiny piece of text and the author has always said the game was heavily inspired by the author.

Plenty of other reasons to criticize this game too.
 

Zubz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,565
no
The Murakami bit is plagiarism since it's quoting a whole passage of a recent work without attributing it, but the Urban Dictionary stuff isn't anything major; the lines aren't even verbatim. I have a strict "don't make me interested & then disappoint because I will dive deep into Schadenfreude" policy, & there's plenty of that to be held with Yiik. But the UD stuff just seems like bog standard laziness.
 

makonero

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,693
Plagiarism is either direct words or paraphrasing another's thoughts directly. If you plagiarize Wikipedia for a creative work, it's still plagiarism even if you change a few words around!

As others have said, you can take the concept and filter it through a character and it be fine. But copying words and paraphrasing whole segments of urban dictionary is plagiarism.
 

ILikeFeet

DF Deet Master
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
61,987
this is plagiarism through and through. maybe he could have gotten away with the first instance, but here is some "you fail the class" shit. it's basic shit the teachers tell you from day one and this dude failed it
 

demondance

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,808
Either way the author's stance of "no one appreciates my game because they don't get it" gets funnier by the day.

Considering he didn't feel confident enough to have his characters describe things like "metaphysics" in their own voices and had to copy definitions word-for-word, I'm confident he doesn't understand the content of his own game.

He had no problem finding the confidence and will to write Dick Masterson in Dick's own voice, though!

This is no more egregious than Earthbound ripping off a bunch of music cues.

Are you guys serious with this stuff
 
May 13, 2019
1,589
When it comes to this game, there is always more and it is always worse.

This is no more egregious than Earthbound ripping off a bunch of music cues.
For the longest I thought that was the reason of why it took so long for the game to be released for the Virtual Console.

Apparently, the real reason had something to do with that "Dali's Clock" enemy in Moonside that resembled the melting clocks from Salvador DalĂ­'s "The Persistence of Memory".
 

Fat4all

Woke up, got a money tag, swears a lot
Member
Oct 25, 2017
93,710
here
i didnt know to write a video game all you had to do was google sommit and then Ctrl+C, Ctrl+V
 

jett

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,673
It's like with that one games journalist. Plagiarists don't just do this shit once.
 

Kapryov

"This guy are sick"
Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,155
Australia
Semi-unrelated but I just encountered the weird tribute to YIIK section of VA-11 HALL-A.
Very odd in retrospect. That alternate universe when the game is so beloved it's remade several times.
 

Zubz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,565
no
Man, how did this game get such high review scores?

There was a hype train going into this game, & many reviewers need to put games down early on. I'm assuming those reviews that gave it good scores just trusted the game got better while the ones that got further were the 3's & 4's (Out of 10).
 

DNAbro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,972
There was a hype train going into this game, & many reviewers need to put games down early on. I'm assuming those reviews that gave it good scores just trusted the game got better while the ones that got further were the 3's & 4's (Out of 10).

I would have given the game a 7 based on the first 15 hours but the last 10-13 or so made me hate it and not forgiving of any of its flaws. 4 out of 10.
 
Oct 29, 2017
458
Yeah, there's a lot of problems with just straight copying the text of something that you like. Presenting it as a citation is different.

I didn't know about the gravestone stating Iwata's name, though. Just going through that thread, I'm also one of those people that didn't think it was insulting so much as it wasn't much of a "tribute" (if that was the intent).
 
May 21, 2019
5
I would have given the game a 7 based on the first 15 hours but the last 10-13 or so made me hate it and not forgiving of any of its flaws. 4 out of 10.

Yeah I thought the first half was very grating, but at least I could see someone with a high tolerance for janky design enjoying it; but once I got to the point where the devs rewrote the ending (the point where you enter the Essentia Mind dungeon and onward) I was like, "Who the heck would like doing this crap?"
 
Last edited: