Was Lusamine a good villain in Pokemon Sun and Moon?

[Uzumaki Goku]

I'm wondering what the general consensus is on her. I actually like her a lot, too many times we see the whole "dad is an abusive asshole." so it was actually refreshing to see the mother be the evil piece of shit for once. She is so CRUEL to her two kids. It made Lillie calling her out all the more awesome... I haven't played Ultra Sun and Moon and I hear she redeems herself, is that true? Maybe she's more complex than completely evil after all?

 

[lvl 99 Pixel]

She might as well have been twirling an evil mustache in the cutscenes

 

[Brazil]

Better than Lysandre, for sure.

Her design is pretty good (as are Lillie's and Gladion's).

 

[Deleted member 2791]

The Aether part of the plot definitely wasn't the best there was in SunMoon.

 

[CopperPuppy]

Honestly, for Pokemon yeah, not bad.

 

[Deleted member 23212]

Not having played the games enough to know myself, from what I heard she was better in Sun/Moon than UltraSun/UltraMoon.

 

[Horohorohoro]

One of the better villains of the franchise. Not as good as Ghetsis or Cyrus, for example, but way better than Archie and Maxie.

 

[Prophet Five]

Not having played the games enough to know myself, from what I heard she was better in Sun/Moon than UltraSun/UltraMoon.

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I have played them and I was gonna say the opposite, haha. I'm not the biggest fan of Gen7 but I liked Ultra better than the base versions.

I'm not sure she was a good villain, though. She was just kinda there for me.

 

[Berordn]

US/UM are better games in spite of what they did to Lusamine, not because of it.

 

[DNAbro]

I'm wondering what the general consensus is on her. I actually like her a lot, too many times we see the whole "dad is an abusive asshole." so it was actually refreshing to see the mother be the evil piece of shit for once. She is so CRUEL to her two kids. It made Lillie calling her out all the more awesome... I haven't played Ultra Sun and Moon and I hear she redeems herself, is that true? Maybe she's more complex than completely evil after all?

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She doesn't redeem herself in Ultra Sun/Moon, she just doesn't get the chance to be shitty in the same way. Ruined her and Lillie.

 

[Weiss]

Lusamine was an amazing villain in the best written Pokemon game to date. She wasn't some world destroying nutcase, she was an addicted, abusive mother.

 

[Crushed]

watching her turn into an eldritch godlike monster and then fight you by tossing out a pokeball with a clefairy in it is maybe one of the funniest moments in any pokemon game ever

 

[Weiss]

watching her turn into an eldritch godlike monster and then fight you by tossing out a pokeball with a clefairy in it is maybe one of the funniest moments in any pokemon game ever

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A frowning Clefairy.

 

[Glio]

Yes, one of the best in the franchise.

 

[Hucast]

The Aether part of the plot definitely wasn't the best there was in SunMoon.

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Any music involving them was however.



So many pso vibes

 

[Nightbird]

I like that her original motivation was to find her lost husband, that made her very interesting to me. I just wish that the game elaborated a bit more on that part.

 

[BasilZero]

She was okay

No one has topped ghestis though

 

[Deleted member 2791]

Any music involving them was however.



So many pso vibes

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The entire soundtrack was ace tbh

 

[Deleted member 873]

Her character is deluded among two games and the anime series. It's weird to think about her only considering the original game because so much has been done to expand her later on, especially in the anime. You get to know how Lillie was completely mentally abused, and how Gladio loves his sister and all that.

So yeah, she is good, but N didn't need more than the text in the original game to be good.

 

[NSESN]

She is very good. Her relationship with Lillie and Gladion is the best plotline in any Pokemon game imo

 

[Woozies]

Lusamine was an amazing villain in the best written Pokemon game to date. She wasn't some world destroying nutcase, she was an addicted, abusive mother.

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But... she was a nutcase, not a world destroying one, sure, but the combination of pokedrugs and grief in the original game totally sends her off the deep end.

 

[808s & Villainy]

One of the better villains of the franchise. Not as good as Ghetsis or Cyrus, for example, but way better than Archie and Maxie.

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That's a low bar. Even as a kid I thought Archie and Maxie were idiots, but they had cool battle themes at least

 

[AppleKid]

Nope. Even for "by Pokémon standards" arguments (which shouldn't be a thing after the Unova games lol) she was almost as obvious as Lysandre. At least the people close to her weren't completely oblivious this time

 

[Professor Beef]

I haven't played Ultra Sun and Moon and I hear she redeems herself, is that true? Maybe she's more complex than completely evil after all?

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She does, and IMO she's a better character for it.

 

[MP!]

no

 

[abellwillring]

I'll be 100% honest in saying I can't remember a single villain in any Pokemon game and I've played every single mainline title except Ultra Sun and Moon.

 

[riq]

I've found it pretty brave of GF to tackle such a heavy issue like abusive parents. But I'm not a fan of the writing itself, feels like all characters are a little one note, Lusamine included.

 

[Aleh]

She is the best villain, anyone saying otherwise is blinded by nostalgia for other games. Don't @ me

 

[lvl 99 Pixel]

Literally the first time meeting her she makes expressions like

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Almost breaking the 4th wall to tell the player "im gonna be the last boss!"

Honestly shes everything wrong with Pokemons current state of writing along with Lysandre.

Fortunately they made up for it with Team Skull.

 

[Symphony]

Lusamine was the highlight of Sun and Moon, god knows why someone thought it'd be a good idea to gut her story arc in US/UM instead of expanding on it.

 

[NSESN]

Lusamine was the highlight of Sun and Moon, god knows why someone thought it'd be a good idea to gut her story arc in US/UM instead of expanding on it.

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To have gen 1 nostalgia with Team RR

 

[Geg]

Yeah her and Lillie's story was one of my favorite aspects of Sun/Moon. Even though it was obvious at the point of her introduction she'd be a villain.

Did not like US/UM

 

[MayorSquirtle]

Nope. Even for "by Pokémon standards" arguments (which shouldn't be a thing after the Unova games lol) she was almost as obvious as Lysandre. At least the people close to her weren't completely oblivious this time

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Why does a villain being obvious make them bad? It's not like Sun and Moon were trying to hide the fact she was a villain considering the game literally opens with Lillie running away from Aether grunts.

Anyway, I thought she was pretty good, although I like her mostly because of Lillie and Gladion, who would be very different characters without Lusamine being the way she is (which is why USUM's plot changes when it comes to Lusamine were awful). I wish they had gone all the way with her UB transformation and had you actually fight her in addition to her Pokemon, though.

 

[riq]

Literally the first time meeting her she makes expressions like

Almost breaking the 4th wall to tell the player "im gonna be the last boss!"

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Idk but my standards are really low for video game characters, even lower for Pokemon. Usually all you need to know about a character is pretty clear the first time you meet them.

So I'm never expecting to be surprised. Most memorable humans from Pokemon are either because they're attached to a mechanic (Oak, Mohn) or because their theming (like Lusamine, N) is intriguing, not so much their dialogue. Being a kid with abusive/absent parents and experiencing the plot for the first time must have been painful or even eye-opening, even if the only textual element revealing that she was abusive was a textbox saying "Lusamine is abusive!"

 

[ArchedThunder]

I really enjoyed her in SM, though the fact that the final battle with her is a normal battle is super lame.
USUM totally ruined her in my eyes.

 

[Cronogear]

The best thing about her is her contribution to Lillie's character development, which was the best part of S/M's story.

On her own? She's a pretty standard Pokemon villain. So in broad terms, not great.

 

[Professor Beef]

I dunno, I think her (eventually) realizing she's toying with shit out of her control is better than her merging with a Pokemon.

 

[Leo]

She's the best villain in the franchise... Which doesn't mean much.

 

[Deleted member 29682]

She's got a good theme at the very least.

 

[Phellps]

For pokémon standards, yeah. She's probably the most developed villain in the series.

They threw that all out in USUM, though.

 

[Deleted member 32726]

Considering we're talking about Pokemon- not known for it's villains, she was average. All the villains are small notches above and below each other. Lusamine really benefits from being in a 3D game that's colorful and with models that have actual animation and expressions. I'd consider N to be a better "villain", or Cyrus as being cooler and more memorable.

 

[lvl 99 Pixel]

Considering we're talking about Pokemon- not known for it's villains, she was average. All the villains are small notches above and below each other. Lusamine really benefits from being in a 3D game with colorful and models with actual animation and expressions.

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I disagree. The simpler models/sprites let you fill in the blanks with your imagination, while watching Lusamine have maybe 2 other static expressions was kind of just awkward (especially with the protagonists vacant expression).

 

[Xaszatm]

Literally the first time meeting her she makes expressions like

Almost breaking the 4th wall to tell the player "im gonna be the last boss!"

Honestly shes everything wrong with Pokemons current state of writing along with Lysandre.

Fortunately they made up for it with Team Skull.

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And compared to the others who announce themselves as the villains? Why is "well its obvious she's the villain ergo she is bad" a reason at all? The game doesn't care that you know she's evil and isn't trying to hide it, the real surprise is how far gone she is. Everyone that actually matters to her arc (Lilly, Gladion, etc.) is already aware of her state at the beginning. This isn't the exact same of Lysandere were you go "how the hell do you not know he's the villain".

Lusamine is a good villain because she is a personal villain. Sure, her plans threaten the entire world but that's not her goal. Her main conflict is with her daughter and its that interaction that makes it good. It's why the Evil Stepmother of Cinderella is considered the most disgusting villain compared to the Queen of Evil Maleficent, the petty controlling nature is more real than some "take over the world" narrative.

 

[Zen Hero]

Wow spoilers in the title. But I guess no one is interested in playing Sun/Moon anymore with Sword/Shield on the horizon so I guess it's okay.

But yeah she was good. I think she is my favorite villain in the series, because her villainy is so personal rather than a generic attempt to take over the world. Like she does really personally messed up stuff like dressing up her daughter to look like a Pokemon she is obsessed with.

 

[Woozies]

For pokémon standards, yeah. She's probably the most developed villain in the series.

They threw that all out in USUM, though.

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I wouldn't exactly call SM Lusamine developed.

Distinct, certainly, but not developed.

 

[Baphomet]

I wish you had the chance to fight her though, merging her with a pokemon was a waste.

 

[Jessie]

I found her malignant narcissism a breath of fresh air for the Pokémon series, especially after "I'm going to accidentally kill myself to make the world beautiful" Lysandre.

 

[Deleted member 32726]

I disagree. The simpler models/sprites let you fill in the blanks with your imagination, while watching Lusamine have maybe 2 other static expressions was kind of just awkward (especially with the protagonists vacant expression).

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I agree, to an extent. The animation can always be better, but I don't think i'd let the simplicity of it detract from anything.

 

[Keyouta]

Not fighting her when she fuses with an ultra beast was very disappointing.

 

[Lusamine]

She's the best, crazy lucky husband she has.