WaPo: Trump announces deal for government to reopen for three weeks, ending longest shutdown; no money for his border wall

KingK · Jan 25, 2019

Sounds good, except this part

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) said earlier Friday that House Democrats were holding off on plans to unveil a border-security proposal expected to match or exceed the $5.7 billion Trump has demanded

still makes no sense to me. Why is almost $6 billion in additional border security funding the Dems' starting point for border negotiations?! Does the party legitimately believe there is a "crisis" at the border requiring that level of additional funding? Or is it simply more of the shitty preemptive negotiating on the part of Democrats?

I'd be fine with some additional border security funds being the end result in a final budget negotiation, but the starting position for Dems should be zero increase to the funding. By saying "see, us Democrats want to spend an additional $6 billion on border security too! Just not for a wall!" you're just validating the GOP's false narrative of a crisis on the border; shifting the debate to haggling over the method of dealing with the "crisis."

This was addressed and argued extensively in the last thread, but it still doesn't sit well with me at all.

Glad to have a clean CR for now though.

Deleted member 176 · Jan 25, 2019

KingK said:
Sounds good, except this part

still makes no sense to me. Why is almost $6 billion in additional border security funding the Dems' starting point for border negotiations?! Does the party legitimately believe there is a "crisis" at the border requiring that level of additional funding? Or is it simply more of the shitty preemptive negotiating on the part of Democrats?

I'd be fine with some additional border security funds being the end result in a final budget negotiation, but the starting position for Dems should be zero increase to the funding. By saying "see, us Democrats want to spend an additional $6 billion on border security too! Just not for a wall!" you're just validating the GOP's false narrative of a crisis on the border; shifting the debate to haggling over the method of dealing with the "crisis."

This was addressed and argued extensively in the last thread, but it still doesn't sit well with me at all.

Glad to have a clean CR for now though.

immigration courts do need funding

Sho_Nuff82 · Jan 25, 2019

CloseTalker said:
Dumb Canadian here! What would him calling a "National Emergency" actually do? What would the effect of that be, both for him and for the country?

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2019/01/presidential-emergency-powers/576418/

This article has a pretty good breakdown. Long story short, it gives the president temporary powers that exceed his authority to respond to an imminent crisis, until the crisis has passed.

Unfortunately, declaring something like the border situation a 'crisis' sets terrible precedent for future presidents, and as has been pointed out by no less than Marco Rubio, there would be nothing to stop the next Dem president from declaring a national crisis to force universal healthcare or gun law restrictions or climate change legislation, based on actual mountains of statistical data that reflect these being actual crises.

Deleted member 22649 · Jan 25, 2019

Brock Reiher said:
immigration courts do need funding

You are correct, but would any of this money go towards that purpose?

Tobor · Jan 25, 2019

Trump has been so completely beaten on this.

He's been whipped by the Democrats and pissed off his base. I can't even remember a time he's lost so badly. It feels fucking great!

Cipherr · Jan 25, 2019

PogChamp said:
Take note folks, THIS is what a cave looks like.

This... All that chicken littling about the Dems yesterday, and for what?

For the Republicans to show you what ACTUAL CAVING looks like.

Deleted member 36543 · Jan 25, 2019

CopperPuppy said:
Lol wtf kind of nonsense is this

No he's not

Mistaken identity.

kukubrew · Jan 25, 2019

I'll laugh if Pelosi invites Trump to deliver STOU on the 16th.

fierrotlepou · Jan 25, 2019

What does CR stand for?

Greg NYC3 · Jan 25, 2019

SlyShinobi said:
I was among those affected. And a coworker next door is telling everyone that the dems lost.

...i

...what?

He's saying he can't wait to see the look on Pelosi's face when Trump doesn't invite her to the SOTU address. That she is getting outplayed. Still blame dems for shutdown. Even though I pointed out the dems got the house in January.

Just a glimpse of what I deal with. So not all feds are on the same page. Ugh.

I won't let this sour today though! Eat it, you orange turd!

My office is also affected but I left early today before the deal got announced. The office is mostly GOP and honestly I don't think that even they're this delusional, they understand that we all just went through this bullshit for nothing.

Trey · Jan 25, 2019

fierrotlepou said:
What does CR stand for?

Continuing resolution.

Tom Nook Says... · Jan 25, 2019

Tobor said:
Trump has been so completely beaten on this.

He's been whipped by the Democrats and pissed off his base. I can't even remember a time he's lost so badly. It feels fucking great!

First of all, they're not pissed off. While it may look that way, that's not what's happening. I guess you just don't understand politics or something because if you had any idea what you're talking about it would be obvious to you that they're just tired of winning.

HamSandwich · Jan 25, 2019

So what happens in 3 weeks? Does Trump go tantrum mode again and shut down the government? If I were Pelosi, I would refuse to invite him for a SOTU until a long term bill is signed.

KingK · Jan 25, 2019

Brock Reiher said:
immigration courts do need funding

$6 billion worth!? They can't use any of their existing budget for it?

Also, net migration is down. Border crossings are down. The main reason there is a need for additional judges is Trump's crusade to arrest everybody. The Dem position should simply be to reallocate existing funding to judges away from other border security aspects, as the numbers dictate there is actually less of a need for funding on the border, not more.

HStallion · Jan 25, 2019

The confusion and anger from Trump supporters I know has been rather enjoyable. They both want to hate on Trump but don't want to do it where any damn libtards can see.

Tobor · Jan 25, 2019

ThomasJames said:
First of all, they're not pissed off. While it may look that way, that's not what's happening. I guess you just don't understand politics or something because if you had any idea what you're talking about it would be obvious to you that they're just tired of winning.

Haha. I thought you were serious in the first half of that post. Thanks for the laugh!

Deleted member 3896 · Jan 25, 2019

HStallion said:
The confusion and anger from Trump supporters I know has been rather enjoyable. They both want to hate on Trump but don't want to do it where any damn libtards can see.

Lol indeed. I've been scanning profiles to stuff myself on schadenfreude all day.

Aaronrules380 · Jan 25, 2019

HamSandwich said:
So what happens in 3 weeks? Does Trump go tantrum mode again and shut down the government? If I were Pelosi, I would refuse to invite him for a SOTU until a long term bill is signed.

Trump tries to force it with a national emergency and then fails because no such emergency exists and so the courts will shoot it down as the blatantly illegal move it is

Grug · Jan 25, 2019

Lol. Haven't seen suggestions of Trump playing "4D Chess" lately.

My 3 year old son would school him at Paw Patrol Memory Match cards.

Greg NYC3 · Jan 25, 2019

KingK said:
$6 billion worth!? They can't use any of their existing budget for it?

Also, net migration is down. Border crossings are down. The main reason there is a need for additional judges is Trump's crusade to arrest everybody. The Dem position should simply be to reallocate existing funding to judges away from other border security aspects, as the numbers dictate there is actually less of a need for funding on the border, not more.

Don't be concerned with the number, the way appropriations work if the departments don't use the money they're budgeted it goes back to the Treasury. Last year Customs and Border didn't spend their entire budget which was much less than what's being proposed now. The Democrats are offering so much to counter Trump's argument that they don't want border security and to highlight when Trump complains about the offer that all this was about was his stupid wall, not security.

Deleted member 2802 · Jan 25, 2019

Tobor said:
Trump has been so completely beaten on this.

He's been whipped by the Democrats and pissed off his base. I can't even remember a time he's lost so badly. It feels fucking great!

Apparently Pence, Kushner and his inner circle could be seen applauding, smiling, and clapping throughout his speech
So Trump could be living in W land for all we know

HStallion · Jan 25, 2019

shira said:
Apparently Pence, Kushner and his inner circle could be seen applauding, smiling, and clapping throughout his speech
So Trump could be living in W land for all we know

This isn't surprising. They have to put on a show.

Luminish · Jan 25, 2019

Cipherr said:
This... All that chicken littling about the Dems yesterday, and for what?

For the Republicans to show you what ACTUAL CAVING looks like.

As far as political naratives go, there's no doubt it's that Trump caved.

But as far as policy goes, the $5.7 billion extra for defense for nothing is still Dem's opening position going into this conference. Either democrats honestly believe there's a crisis at the border, or it's a cave. Maybe we gave them too much credit by thinking it was the latter.

Deleted member 1041 · Jan 25, 2019

what a wild day
roger stone arrested
la guardia halting flights
trump caving

KingK · Jan 25, 2019

Greg NYC3 said:
Don't be concerned with the number, the way appropriations work if the departments don't use the money they're budgeted it goes back to the Treasury. Last year Customs and Border didn't spend their entire budget which was much less than what's being proposed now. The Democrats are offering so much to counter Trump's argument that they don't want border security and to highlight when Trump complains about the offer that all this was about was his stupid wall, not security.

That first sentence I actually did not know, thank you. That does soften the blow a bit.

As for the second part, I understand the strategy they're going for, but I disagree with that strategy. Like I said, I really really do not like how that proposal completely validates GOP messaging about a "border crisis." The Dem position should be that the is no crisis, and no additional funding needed. The party is just so fucking awful at constantly ceding the framing of a debate to the right.

DustyVonErich · Jan 25, 2019

CopperPuppy said:
"Holds all the cards"

"Hands too small to hold cards"

LOL

Haha! This the shit that got me.

Mr. X · Jan 25, 2019

Meanwhile

WedgeX · Jan 25, 2019

Update: Both the House and Senate have passed their respective bills for the Continuing Resolution, and it's headed to Trump.

BREAKING: House approves bill to reopen the government, sends measure to Trump for his signature

The bill would open the government for three weeks but does not provide funds for President Trump's border wall. Trump is expected to sign the bill, clearing the way for federal workers to return to work on Monday.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...9a09ff1e2a1_story.html?utm_term=.a747b838e700

HamSandwich · Jan 25, 2019

Mr. X said:
Meanwhile

Kernel · Jan 25, 2019

Mr. X said:
Meanwhile

The party must be destroyed, if that's even possible.

Devilgunman · Jan 25, 2019

It's such a blessing to see a bunch of assholes at Breitbart despite him and call him names. Trump is in no man land now.

ryutaro's mama · Jan 25, 2019

Surfinn said:
Newsweek cover, soon:

CAVEMAN

Picture of Trump in tattered clothing, holding a club/lonely sitting next to a dying fire

Next to a broken stone.

WaffleTaco · Jan 25, 2019

Watch Trump not sign it

Perturabo · Jan 25, 2019

Mr. X said:
Meanwhile

So they're really all in on the train wreck huh?

I know, I know his base is still mostly there, but we'll see if it still holds up if he keeps looking like a weak moron.

TheXbox · Jan 25, 2019

Backpay for federal workers is in there, right?

Wagram · Jan 25, 2019

Sure feels like Nancy grabbed Trump by the Puss*

Sir Tsunami · Jan 25, 2019

TheXbox said:
Backpay for federal workers is in there, right?

I believe Trump signed something regarding that previously. That's why his administration kept trying to say it was a free vacation

Treestump · Jan 25, 2019

Mr. X said:
Meanwhile

Going down with the ship I see. Spineless, the lot of them.

WedgeX said:
Update: Both the House and Senate have passed their respective bills for the Continuing Resolution, and it's headed to Trump.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...9a09ff1e2a1_story.html?utm_term=.a747b838e700

All of that for literally nothing. What a winning deal maker.

Typhonsentra · Jan 25, 2019

I honestly am a bit worried how outlets seem to be taunting Trump on losing. We only have three weeks until this happens again and if he sees this as hurting his pride he is less likely to accept a no wall deal. People could seriously die if things continue along this cycle of shutdown to interim deal to shutdown over the next two years. Trump is like a dangerous child.

BDS · Jan 25, 2019

Typhonsentra said:
I honestly am a bit worried how outlets seem to be taunting Trump on losing. We only have three weeks until this happens again and if he sees this as hurting his pride he is less likely to accept a no wall deal. People could seriously die if things continue along this cycle of shutdown to interim deal to shutdown over the next two years. Trump is like a dangerous child.

Trump wanted out of the shutdown as soon as he realized how bad it was for him, but he couldn't figure out a way to do it while saving face. He doesn't want another one. He'll just declare an emergency.

Psyborg · Jan 25, 2019

Anyone else think this just a ploy to get his SOTU address... then go right back to the shutdown/wall shit on the 15th?

My apologies if this has already been brought up, I came into this thread late.

Vic_Viper · Jan 25, 2019

Psyborg said:
Anyone else think this just a ploy to get his SOTU address... then go right back to the shutdown/wall shit on the 15th?

My apologies if this has already been brought up, I came into this thread late.

Yes this is my thinking as well. It's atleast part of it. Pelosi should invite him to give the SOTU in a month from now, until a loner funding bill has been signed, just in case.

rokkerkory · Jan 25, 2019

Art of the cave

stew · Jan 25, 2019

I thought we was going to declare national emergency, but he fucking caved lmao! He's fucking clueless. Please keep harming yourself you dipshit.

Psyborg said:
Anyone else think this just a ploy to get his SOTU address... then go right back to the shutdown/wall shit on the 15th?

My apologies if this has already been brought up, I came into this thread late.

I think it's because some airports were shut because too much people called in sick.

raYne_07 · Jan 25, 2019

Psyborg said:
Anyone else think this just a ploy to get his SOTU address... then go right back to the shutdown/wall shit on the 15th?

My apologies if this has already been brought up, I came into this thread late.

I don't know where this idea comes from that he cares about the SOTU speech. He doesn't. It only mattered to him because someone (Pelosi) said he couldn't do it and he wants to look strong.

He caved today because of the falling Republican/Base polling and the optics of the airport issues.

Someone suggested inviting him to do the SOTU on the 16th, right after this 3 week extension runs out, and I support that 100%. If there's no deal and he shuts down the government again, it's gonna be hell.

usagi704 · Jan 25, 2019

Good.

Giving him any amount of money for any amount of border security or wall would be nothing short of caving to him. Glad to see they didn't.

Deleted member 8750 · Jan 25, 2019

Doukou · Jan 26, 2019

Giving a date on when the government is going to shutdown next is a really bad play. People are going to plan for protest instead of the slow drag like this shutdown and Trump already showed he'd cave so I find it hard to believe he can get any win out of this.

Tom Nook Says... · Jan 26, 2019

Vic_Viper said:
Yes this is my thinking as well. It's atleast part of it. Pelosi should invite him to give the SOTU in a month from now, until a loner funding bill has been signed, just in case.

If Pelosi wants to be as brutal as possible about it, she should announce that it's being delayed by 35 days. If the American people were expected to wait that long, so should the president.

Comes with added benefit of being after Feb 15th.

nasirum · Jan 26, 2019

Thank you, Pelosi and crew, for not bowing at all to them.

Let's keep this spine moving forward.

WaPo: Trump announces deal for government to reopen for three weeks, ending longest shutdown; no money for his border wall

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