Marth's popularity and relevance is unquestionable to be honest. He's the only Fire Emblem character to have his own Wikipedia article.
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The number of Fire Emblem characters in Smash is fine: A defense of the large amount of FE characters in the roster
- Thread starter HylianSeven
- Start date
Three Houses was my GotY last year, so I'm pretty cool with it getting representation in Smash, though I do wish it'd been Edelgard as the fighter instead. I haven't gotten upset about it though because I've never been too picky about who gets into Smash anyhow and Byleth looks like they have a cool moveset.
But don't you see in Fire Emblem it's fine because Sakurai likes it and Xenoblade is such a niche franchise /s
I mean that it's more from Smash than anything else, same case as Roy except he had memes (Roy's our boy) and a sword on fire, there's a reason Marth still hasn't won a poll from FEH
Had votes not still been split between games in 2018, he would have won that year. It's the reason why they stopped splitting character votes in 2019.
Super Mario Bros.
lol, I'm just playing, I understand some of the frustration, but honestly whether something is overrepresented or underrepresented in Smash I don't think really matters. I don't think Sakurai or Nintendo are looking at Smash like that, and I honestly don't get why fans do. But again, I've never really been bothered by who gets into Smash, so maybe I'm the outlier here lol.
Who is Wyvern Knight?
So what if we get one off characters?
This is a bait post that seriously shouldn't be cared about.
Not like that is going to work now that not only he has gotten alts but also Three Houses released, every character not in the game will probably will win from now on
You're literally the first person to reply to it, and I've said multiple times that Byleth is the only DLC I'm happy with and the stats don't lie about Goku.
The issue with that is they're all pretty much clones, so the amount of work going into then is far less than most characters.
Honestly, what would be nice is if new FE characters focused on different classes so they can represent newer characters through echoes. Byleth, Robin, and unfortunately don't really fit any other characters and echoes wouldn't fit. If instead we had an fighter, an armored Knight, and a mage user, then most new Fire Emblem games could get representation through clones.
TBH, If I had to choose between Season Pass 2 having 6 more Fire Emblem characters or having Crash Bandicoot/Master Chief/Doomguy/Dante/Monster Hunter/Kratos or whatever, I'd pick the Fire Emblem characters every time because I deadass hate America.
It's pretty amazing when you think about it. And there are still 6 more on the way.
percentage-wise, you're right.
plus, there's only been 1 FE character added for Smash Ultimate. JUST ONE!
plus, there's only been 1 FE character added for Smash Ultimate. JUST ONE!
Not to mention all of the Mii Fighter outfits, Assist trophies, Shovel Knight, FREAKING CUPHEAD! It is truly a celebration and an embarrassment of riches.
That is simply not true, you can see a huge difference between the more graceful style of Marth's combat abilities and the more blunt and heavier hits of Ike's Ragnell. And even in the design these two besides the blue hair are not really that samey. Marth looks almost effeminate with a good looking outfit while Ike (especially in his Radiant Dawn alt) is dressed like a mercenary should be dressed.
Corrin has that weird outfit and half of his moves are just him / her being a dragon. Roy has that good looking armor, fire moves which compliments his red hair and a powerful voice acting. Robin looks like a nerd. Saying that these guys look the same is really pushing it.
But overall I still think that's too many fire emblem characters and that it could be more diverse, the idea of Anna being in this game makes me furious that Byleth got in instead.
Uh, did you forget Chrom? Ultimate had added 2, Chrom and Byleth
Also I really dislike how some people there, admitting by themselves not knowing much about Fire Emblem, still disrepects the series and try to make it look blander than it really is. I feel like for some people, characters that share some similar traits (being human, having swords) make them by default samey while you can still have really different characters with the same traits. I already explained myself on my previous post. I actually agree with you guys, there are too many fire emblem characters. But bashing the series in a disingenous way is not really helpful or constructive because I really think Fire Emblem is more varied than you may think.
in fact, i did forget Chrom. lol
Ok, 2. hmmm.. they might wanna stop there, though I wouldn't mind 1 more FE character if the next FE game is incredible.
I don't agree with the notion that it deserves to have so much representation because it's popular since that excuse would also justify the next 6 characters being FE reps.
It's a franchise that has all the representation it needs. If you are a big fan of light skinned short haired pretty boys then you have so many characters to choose from. You don't need more and additional ones only dilute the uniqueness that Smash supposedly strives for.
It's a franchise that has all the representation it needs. If you are a big fan of light skinned short haired pretty boys then you have so many characters to choose from. You don't need more and additional ones only dilute the uniqueness that Smash supposedly strives for.
Well, if that pass of 6 FE characters had at least one standalone woman in it, then yeah, I'd pick that pass too, cuz that sausage fest on the other end is not to my liking. lol
Sure, but it has nothing to do with the actual thread. You're trying to bait for responses.
The fact that you named two Capcom characters really shows that you don't think much about these things.
I mean, this is genuinely what the fans wanted. Everybody points to 4 Marths as the problem, but the only reason we have 4 is because: Lucina got accidentally upgraded to a full character, people wanted Roy so badly that they literally voted him back in the game, and people couldn't stand Chrom getting BTFO'd, so they voted him in as well. The current Fire Emblem situation is largely a result of fans voting those characters in and happen stance. Even Corrin largely got in on the strength of a moveset in a notoriously dead time for Nintendo as an advertisement rep (and his game was one of the few Nintendo titles in that period to do well that could offer a character to Smash, quality of the game aside lol). Byleth is the first time they've just genuinely added a FE character again mainly out of choice it seems, and let's face it, Three Houses has been one of Nintendo's biggest success stories in recent years too (in addition to Heroes literally pulling in 2/3rd of a $1 Billion).
So, yeah, the Fire Emblem series in Smash is just a weird situation... and when the most expendable and problematic of the FE characters is literally begged for by fans simply because he existed in Melee and their nostalgia dictates he must return... you start to realize Smash and FE is never going to be fixed lol.
Also, why the hell would anyone advocate for cutting Lucina? She's a low effort clone to Marth who will always be in the game that genuinely adds nuance through a different ability from his tipper mechanic and is the only pure female fighter from FE. There's no reason to cut her outside of satisfying some arbitrary "need" to cut down on FE characters given the fact she's based off of the main character who is always going to stick around.
So, yeah, the Fire Emblem series in Smash is just a weird situation... and when the most expendable and problematic of the FE characters is literally begged for by fans simply because he existed in Melee and their nostalgia dictates he must return... you start to realize Smash and FE is never going to be fixed lol.
Also, why the hell would anyone advocate for cutting Lucina? She's a low effort clone to Marth who will always be in the game that genuinely adds nuance through a different ability from his tipper mechanic and is the only pure female fighter from FE. There's no reason to cut her outside of satisfying some arbitrary "need" to cut down on FE characters given the fact she's based off of the main character who is always going to stick around.
But again, you're the only person who seems to have been baited. It's not like it was a post that got a lot of response, you saw it hours later and just had to warn nobody!
Har de har har. (Admittedly my brain lapsed on remembering Minecraft Steve for that, otherwise he would be in Monster Hunter's place.)
Dante being on there still stands, since he resonates on the western bro-meter in TYOOL 2020 as "acceptable non-political/non-anime Japanese representation of an American (who is also from hell), and well, a white dude".
BTW this implies that Crash Bandicoot is a white American male.
nearly 15 million sales, dozens of game of the year and game of the DECADE awards, one of the highest rated and beloved gaming series of all time, and we didn't get a newcomer from breath of the wild. insanity. ultimate should have had all 4 champions added to the game. it's what zelda deserves.
I know I'm getting b8ed but I just can't resist.
Really, "Dante," "Virgil," and "Nero" and you went with American? Those are all clearly Italian names and the 4th game takes place in what is effectrively the Vatican.
Plus Dante is anime as hell, I'm not sure what you're talking about.
Italian-American, Italian-British and Italian-Canadian. But all from hell. I don't write the rules, sorry.
"inb4" the haters get to you, but you're right.
However, can we please consider Midna a champion? I would like to exchange 1 Champion for 1 Midna.
Sorry, Revali fans. We are eating bird person tonight.
I can't believe Edelgard fanboys thought she had a chance of getting in over Byleth. It's obvious Nintendo was going to go for the main character over any other character regardless of this "plot importance" excuse people like to come up with.
The champions had, what, 15 minutes of combined screen time?
If the new crew is important in BotW2 though I'm all for it.
Eva is from like Switzerland or Lichtenstein or something, at least if you consider Bayonetta canon.
It's a very European family.
midna riding wolf link should have got in too. and impa or girahim from skyward sword. basically, zelda needs way more representation than a captain falcon clone, 3 links, shiek and zelda.
While Edelgard would have been a better choice I'm cool with this because Byleth at least can use the other 3's weapons.
Game sold 2.9m copies in 2 months while is insane for a Fire Emblem title so I'm not surprised. While I agree, it's a lot of characters, due to Three House's greatness I'm sliding it through.
Game sold 2.9m copies in 2 months while is insane for a Fire Emblem title so I'm not surprised. While I agree, it's a lot of characters, due to Three House's greatness I'm sliding it through.
There's really no need for a defense. Byleth is a first party character, from a franchise that is growing in popularity, and Samurai really loves Fire Emblem. So it's just logical and I don't know why online people are just so toxic about it. Plus, to some people that say he plays the same way as other FE characters, ehhhh.
three houses didn't sell 3 million in 2 months because of byleth, it was due to edelgard and claude. 2 characters who represent something smash desperately needs more of and who aren't blue haired swordsmen. we're getting a lot of the "these are the smash bros rules" type posts to defend the inclusion of byleth.
It wasn't due to Edelgard and Claude. It was due to the entire package.
I'm still dying here because a third of the complaining posts presume that the echoes/Roy aren't liked/played by fans, the other third is hand-wangling over the promoted skins being "samey and too similar to each other" and the rest just forget that a game with a 30 year history with changing protagonists is more likely to accumulate characters in a 21-year old game.
I wonder, if Final Fantasy/DQ were to be in FE's shoes, what would be the new complaint? Too many spikey haired boys? Still too many swords? Too many emo/cartoony-looking characters in my smash? Why do we have so many Cloud echoes?
I wonder, if Final Fantasy/DQ were to be in FE's shoes, what would be the new complaint? Too many spikey haired boys? Still too many swords? Too many emo/cartoony-looking characters in my smash? Why do we have so many Cloud echoes?
You would still get those complaints but both of these series you mentioned are more popular than FE (FF especially) and are much more important for JRPG and ultimately video game history.
I like Byleth inclusion and moveset but this is colored because of the 4 Marth characters.
- Marth itself that is fine.
- Roy, that has changed on little things and some moves that behave a little different but is basically the same kit. At least is not blue haired, is from a different game and has done legacy so he could be somewhat saber.
- Lucina is just a straight Marth clone without the tipper mechanic, blue haired girl and the second Awakening rep. She would be a Marth alt like Corrin, Robin or Byleth.
- Chrom is just another blue haired Roy clone with Ike Up hair and the damn third Awakening rep. I dont care you have the model already, he should be stuck in Robin final Smash.
So 4 characters that play basically the same, very similar visually, and perception is very important, when you ser 4 of them in the Maine characters selection screen occuping space that in your mine could be occupied by other characters. But Ultimate everyone is here makes this more difficult as you cant make some of this changes without losing that slogan.
But seriously just Lucina alt color of Marth in smash4 and no Chrom and instead another echo like Dixie Kong with DK up-B with her hair would have color this discussion solo differently.
And I will take advantage of this threads to show my eternal disdain of Dark Pit. Just go die in the alt color section.
- Marth itself that is fine.
- Roy, that has changed on little things and some moves that behave a little different but is basically the same kit. At least is not blue haired, is from a different game and has done legacy so he could be somewhat saber.
- Lucina is just a straight Marth clone without the tipper mechanic, blue haired girl and the second Awakening rep. She would be a Marth alt like Corrin, Robin or Byleth.
- Chrom is just another blue haired Roy clone with Ike Up hair and the damn third Awakening rep. I dont care you have the model already, he should be stuck in Robin final Smash.
So 4 characters that play basically the same, very similar visually, and perception is very important, when you ser 4 of them in the Maine characters selection screen occuping space that in your mine could be occupied by other characters. But Ultimate everyone is here makes this more difficult as you cant make some of this changes without losing that slogan.
But seriously just Lucina alt color of Marth in smash4 and no Chrom and instead another echo like Dixie Kong with DK up-B with her hair would have color this discussion solo differently.
And I will take advantage of this threads to show my eternal disdain of Dark Pit. Just go die in the alt color section.
So maybe it's a matter of "imagined right" where the complaints are coming from? then maybe the goalposts will shift somewhere else
I sure as heck wish we had cloud, girl cloud, brown-haired cloud with a gunblade and Disney cloud
Or maybe you can just press the merge echoes with characters button if you're so disdainful of glorified skins getting a "equivalent of main character slot"
I didn't know free desserts got so much complaints, what a world we live in
You would reject the pack with Monster Hunter because you hate America.
Uh, okay.
I just don't see what tonally this adds to Smash that several previous FE characters didn't. Visually, musically. Yeah, he doesn't just use a sword. It doesn't help when the highlights of Smash characters being added to the roster is seeing the wild ways they've incorporated characters who wouldn't seem like characters in a fighting game are translated, or who bring a unique flair. And there's just none of that.
I'm not bothered, I wasn't invested in continually playing Smash anyway. But it is absolutely a boring choice. I like when they add something both nostalgic and yet riduculously reverent. Megaman is well done, but I'm here to see them add shit like Wii Fit Trainer. Like what a fucking wild choice that felt like. Fuck, add the car from Daytona while they're at it.
If I do pop in Smash again, what am I gonna say when showing the game to someone else? "You thought that anime character sword guy was crazy, check this one out!"
I'm not bothered, I wasn't invested in continually playing Smash anyway. But it is absolutely a boring choice. I like when they add something both nostalgic and yet riduculously reverent. Megaman is well done, but I'm here to see them add shit like Wii Fit Trainer. Like what a fucking wild choice that felt like. Fuck, add the car from Daytona while they're at it.
If I do pop in Smash again, what am I gonna say when showing the game to someone else? "You thought that anime character sword guy was crazy, check this one out!"
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I'm pretty sure the complaint would be "Why the hell does Square Enix have 8 characters in a Nintendo crossover fighter?"
I'm totally taking the piss in this entire conversation but Steven Minecraft should have gone in that spot, something I mentioned later. I just don't give enough of a care to edit this.