Are we still not over these Ep XIII "criticisms"? This thread is turning in circles.
She learned that from Chewie.I love how Rey's first reaction to the Force Skype is "Oh shit Kylo Ren, fucking kill that guy!"
So I found a Reylo gifs tumblr, and I think it might be time to say goodbye to the real world and live there forever.
The whole casino mission should have been scrapped as it was a complete waste of time. Extended scenes of Luke and Snoke training their apprentices would have been great instead. Snoke mentions training Ren a couple of times in TFA iirc and I was really hoping that they would follow that up in TLJ.I finally saw Last Jedi for the first time. Overall I liked it more than Force Awakens. There were some writing issues and some of the dialogues were amateurish.
I just don't understand Finn, Poe and Rose's mission to find the thief and disable the destroyer's trackers. It was all worthless in the end. It sort of felt like the director did not like the final cut of how the subplot was going, so he decided to can it. I guess we're just used to seeing the good guys always succeeding so seeing them fail and amount to nothing is a new direction. And they did fail. Also after the rebel ship cuts the destroyer with hyperjump speed, I feel that there was something missing. How did Rey get back to the rebels after the ship gets sliced and Luke's lightsaber explodes? The biggest wtf however, was Leia floating back to the ship after the bridge gets taken out. Come on.
*snip*
The whole casino mission should have been scrapped as it was a complete waste of time. Extended scenes of Luke and Snoke training their apprentices would have been great instead. Snoke mentions training Ren a couple of times in TFA iirc and I was really hoping that they would follow that up in TLJ.
Let me guess you think that the reason Poe had a problem is because she's a woman and nothing to do with her own handling of the situation as a leader responsible for the success of a mission and those under her.
Hmmm, what do you think about the forest fight in TFA? If you have to pick one as the better one than the other, which one would you choose?
Well at least we can agree on that! Loved that scene.I like the forest fight, but it has two clear advantages: one, it's a more emotionally significant scene. Two, at least one of the fighters (Rey) is absolutely inexperienced in the use of her weapon, and that justifies a lot of what would otherwise would be awkward shots.
It's one of the great fights in the saga for sure.
I like the forest fight, but it has two clear advantages: one, it's a more emotionally significant scene. Two, at least one of the fighters (Rey) is absolutely inexperienced in the use of her weapon, and that justifies a lot of what would otherwise would be awkward shots.
It's one of the great fights in the saga for sure.
I don't get the hurry to get over old characters and nostalgia so fast.
There's going to be at least one of these movies every year for the next few decades, possibly every year of your life. They'll get to the completely different, way out there stories eventually. Maybe even with Rian Johnson's trilogy. Yeah, my favourite thing about The Last Jedi is the OT characters as the new characters except for Kylo Ren haven't won me over and I would have liked to have seen more of the old actors in their roles while they're still alive. I'm happy to spend some time in the OT era in these anthology films. And I'm definitely looking forward to seeing young Han and Lando.
Don't worry though guys, despite Holdo clearly thinking that Poe doesn't need to know about her plans and doesn't deserve to know since he's demoted and clearly should have been angry about him questioning her authority in front of so many people and also engineering a mutiny that could kill everyone in the Resistance, in the end she still tells Leia point blank that she likes him, d'awwwwwwwwwwwwwwww.
The idea that an admiral should be responsible for telling a captain the grand d plan is an idiotic assessment.I did. Everyone on the Resistance side is idiotic. They deserve to lose.
So you think forest fight is better?
If so, yeah, I concur. At first it seems like the throne room is fight is "cooler" but now since I have time to reflect on it yeah, the fight in TFA is superior to me in so many ways.
See, I'm not a fan of calling characters idiots because we've seen the movie and we know things will go badly for them. At that point Poe had a completely valid reason not to tell Holdo, and at that moment we assume he's right and Holdo is wrong. Later on we find out Holdo was right to not tell him and Poe was wrong for not listening when he should've. If they both have valid reasons for doing what they did and both plans could've ended up working, I don't feel like this makes them idiots. Poe's planned could've worked if BB-H8 didn't find them out and Holdo's plan would've worked if Poe hadn't disobeyed her.I did. Everyone on the Resistance side is idiotic. They deserve to lose.
The idea that an admiral should be responsible for telling a captain the grand d plan is an idiotic assessment.
There's a reason why that doesn't happen in real life. They tell you what your going to do, and your going to do it. At best you'll get an answer as to why you're doing the thing but that reason can just as easily be bs from the brass.
Because they've already had multiple desertion attempts, and if someone with knowledge of the plan decided to desert and get caught, they're all fucked.Question is: why isn't Holdo sharing that information with Poe?
Don't tell me "he just got demoted and she can't trust him". She LIKES HIM, even after he leads a MUTINY against her. Hours later he's elected new leader of the Resistance, so doubts about his reliability are out of the questions (I guess? None of this makes any sense anyways).
Everything in this plotline is terrible.
See, I'm not a fan of calling characters idiots because we've seen the movie and we know things will go badly for them. At that point Poe had a completely valid reason not to tell Holdo, and at that moment we assume he's right and Holdo is wrong. Later on we find out Holdo was right to not tell him and Poe was wrong for not listening when he should've. If they both have valid reasons for doing what they did and both plans could've ended up working, I don't feel like this makes them idiots. Poe's planned could've worked if BB-H8 didn't find them out and Holdo's plan would've worked if Poe hadn't disobeyed her.
And not that this really applies but I also don't think characters making "dumb" mistakes is really an issue. I'm not sure if you've seen Game of Thrones but Rob Stark gets criticized for being dumb and causing some major fuck ups but him making mistakes was the interesting part of this story. I think characters should be allowed to make mistakes.
You can like someone and decide that it would be fore the best that they don't know something. Hell Poe effectively told part of the plant to a bunch of people.Holdo LIKES Poe, but she won't tell him why he ain't gonna die like a fool after they run out of gas. Why? It's so damn shallow.
But we are discussing a good part of the movie ;)Guys, I think we're devoting way too much time to a teeeeeerrible storyline. I take pride in never devoting too much time discussing Yoda's "this thing about creating clones is horrible, but also pretty damn convenient" flip flopping in the PT and I won't drag down the thread with a discussion about what I consider a tremendously boring and illogical subplot between poorly written characters. I'd rather keep seeing pretty gifs posted or discuss about the good parts of the movie, like porgs.
Everyone loves porgs, right?
Tell me people love porgs, at least. My daughter does - BB8 is still her favourite thing tho, and she won't sleep without its plushie.
Dumb.They explain this when Kylo goes out to spin around in his TIE Fighter; the First Order's weaponry can't cover their fighters when they're too far out, so Hux orders them to fall back.
But this is OT and not TLJ, and this may not even be canon, so considering they only sent in 3 TIE Fighters... i bet they only carry 3, if they really worry about them that much that they can't afford to lose another fighter after knocking out the biggest ship in their caravan.Within its vast belly hangar bays, an Imperial-class Star Destroyer typically carried an impressive complement of troops, consisting of seventy-two TIE/ln space superiority starfighters, eight Lambda-class T-4a shuttles , twenty AT-AT walkers, thirty AT-ST or AT-DP walkers, and fifteen Imperial Troop Transports.
People acting like Holdo's plan wouldn't have worked if the Hacker hadn't taken a heel turn.
It was a good plan.
It would have worked.
Poe didn't deserve to know.
He done goofed up and got demoted. He probably should have been in the brig. His mutiny didn't achieve anything, again his hot-headedness would have got them all killed were it to have worked.
Why are we still debating this?
^ Yeah I think the reasoning behind "return at once, we can't protect you!" callback is just nonsense, ehh, but I guess contrivances like that are needed in order for the main gimmick of the movie to function.
You sure about that? It sure looked to me in the end he got promoted to become the leader of Resistance after all :P
A lot of that Holdo shit doesn't make sense either.You sure about that? It sure looked to me in the end he got promoted to become the leader of Resistance after all :P
Sure, I don't disagree with any of this. It's a bit of a clumsy thread that deserved to be explored better even within the constraints its set within. Either way, Poe is the real MVP!I guess I am just kinda miffed about how half-hearted the movie seem to be in teaching Poe a "lesson". First that I like him, I like him too comment which seems to be made to bang on the head of audiences that despite all the fuck up he has done, we shouldn't be too mad at Poe because he's just oh so god darn likable. And then in the end he got basically promoted by Leia to lead the Resistance anyways; it just feels like the movie tried too hard to make the audience go 'd'awwww' with him despite his fuck ups causing a vast majority of deaths in the movie.
So I found a Reylo gifs tumblr, and I think it might be time to say goodbye to the real world and live there forever.
Guys, I think we're devoting way too much time to a teeeeeerrible storyline. I take pride in never devoting too much time discussing Yoda's "this thing about creating clones is horrible, but also pretty damn convenient" flip flopping in the PT and I won't drag down the thread with a discussion about what I consider a tremendously boring and illogical subplot between poorly written characters. I'd rather keep seeing pretty gifs posted or discuss about the good parts of the movie, like porgs.
Everyone loves porgs, right?
Tell me people love porgs, at least. My daughter does - BB8 is still her favourite thing tho, and she won't sleep without its plushie.
That's the plan, man. That's what the movie explains to us. They pull the fighters back because they can't cover them at range. Hux is content to simply follow the Resistance ships, knowing they'll run out of fuel in a matter of hours and he can follow them if they jump. We see that Hux has drawn Snoke's ire earlier in the movie, so we understand that he's going to settle for what he sees as a guaranteed win. Hux is not characterised as smart, daring or even competent, but in his mind he has the Resistance "tied to the end of a string" and that's the plan he's going with.
Could they have sent all their TIE pilots out on a suicide mission to shoot at the Resistance ships? Sure, I guess. We don't really have any indication that the First Order's fighters can do much to permanently disable a ship of that size by just hammering away at its armour, but let's say for the sake of argument that it was possible. Maybe they could have called in another couple of Star Destroyers from somewhere else in the galaxy to cut the Rebels off. Maybe they could have slung their their battering ram cannon underneath a couple of TIE Fighters and flown it over to punch a hole in the Resistance cruiser. Maybe Snoke could have Force Projected over to the Resistance ship's bridge and stood in front of all the important control panels so that when the Rebels shoot at him they accidentally hit the lever that throws the ship into reverse and before they know it they fall back into range of the First Order and get blowed up real good, whoopsiedoodle.
The movie isn't bad because the omniscient viewer can come up with a better plan than the characters did. Every movie ever made, including every Star Wars movie before this one, falls to pieces when you start "Well actually..." and "Why didn't they just..."ing. Watching a movie isn't supposed to be a competition to see whether every aspect of the script holds up under harsh scrutiny. If Rian Johnson hired a military advisor to come in and make certain that the depiction of a space battle in his script was 100% airtight, do you really think it'd make a material difference to this entry in a family-friendly saga about space wizards?
Man, I wish more characters in movies were complete robots. Movies would finally reach the level of writing videogames have!
Some of the people arguing how "idiotic" the Resistance characters are clearly were never in the military or any high stress job during high stress situations.
If they could barely shoot down one TIE Fighter when there's only three of them to concentrate all their fire on, how would they manage to shoot down a sprawling mess of them?Could they have sent all their TIE pilots out on a suicide mission to shoot at the Resistance ships?
They blew up the main bridge and their main hanger with only three TIE Fighters.
Yeah I'm pretty sure that "sure he did just commit mutiny, but isn't he kinda cute while he sleeps?" is something people with a background in the military will find definitely relatable.
Let it go, you can't win this one.
"You can't win this one", he says, while proving how hard he misunderstood what Holdo said. Keep shooting, even a blind man will sometimes hit a target.
They blew up the main bridge and their main hanger with only three TIE Fighters.
That's pretty damn permanent.
Nevermind the permanent damage to killing off the entire upper echelon of the rebellion.
THIS is what the movie explains to us.
You know what's been bugging me
There are a few voices during the cave scene with Rey. And definitely someone saying "Rey" in the very beginning
I wonder if it's just the dark side fucking with her