Spider-Man: Far From Home |Spoiler OT| Even dead, I'm the hero
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At this point Marvel movie spoilers have felt like known certainties for six or seven years now. Winter Soldier, every single side plot in the other Cap American films, The Snap, what went down with Captain Marvel, the entire Spider-Man x Iron Man arc, etc. So the spoilers don't bother me. It must suck for non-comics readers but thems the breaks.
Like of course they are doing the Sinister Six. It is written all over the wall. Non-comics readers might not have understood why they'd leave The Vulture alive with that prison scene and make a Venom movie, but to comics readers it's basically connecting the dots
It was clearly shown that he had access to a lot of spy resources and money. Facial recognition software would have been a given with some of the other stuff they were doing.
My biggest question is where does this all go now? The obvious answer is a setup for Captain Marvel 2 but I'm certain Furys involvement with the Kree is going to lead to a character(s) that we've yet to see. Maybe this leads to a Nova cameo which the leads to a United Front storyline, maybe the Super-Skrull? So many possibilities.
Part of me thinks they liked the reception to the Fury/Carol dynamic in CM and want a way to use it again in the sequel
Yeah, he could be more comparable to Keemstar or some shit. Some guy who is a piece of shit and spreading tabloid-esque gossip, maybe even with an agenda to make someone look bad, but not because they are alt-right or have political aspirations behind their bullshit, but because they are opportunistic and shitty people who want to use their platform in shovel muck.
He has tech because he's paranoid and has squirreled away tech for himself. But that doesn't mean he has access to databases that could ID random scientists that work for Stark Enterprises. SHIELD *might* have had that information at one point and a BIG maybe on the US Gov't having it, but Fury no longer has access to either of those things.
Thinking on it further, I still think Mysterio did something to EDITH, or something was up with the glasses.
At the time when Spider-Man was telling EDITH to call off the drones, I thought to myself "this dialog is really awkward". I forget the exact phrasing, but EDITH was asking if Peter wanted to terminate something, or something like that. Whatever the specific dialog was, it was requesting he enact something, rather than call something off.
So, with the mid-credits scene in mind, it was either clunky writing, or intentionally done to get the footage Beck needed.
I really think it's a long game, and it's going to hurt Peter more. Heroic father figure Tony Stank dies, and that's it for him. Duplicitous father figure Quentin Beck "dies", but he gets to cheat death. It's not fair, and Pete's life being unfair is status quo.
Also I'm selfish and I want to see MCU Vulture and MCU Mysterio hanging out.
Wonder who's going to lead the Sinister Six. I don't see Vulture being in charge, Mysterio is too large scale to be his lackey. Perhaps Scorpion?
Just got home. Man, what a film. Need to see it a couple more times, but I think it passed Spider-Man 2 for me.
Narrative
I felt like the film's plot was very consistent and interesting all the way through. You have Peter dealing with the death of Tony Stark and the need to step into his shoes. You also have Peter wanting to be a normal teen with a normal life. In true Spider-Man fashion, Peter is constantly juggling between his two lives this film, and I loved it. It's similar to Raimi's Spider-Man 2 that way, but has a richer variety imo. The first half of the movie is very light and breezy and while it keeps a more optimistic tone throughout it raises the stakes considerably once Mysterio has his turn. The second half is where the film really shines, and I really enjoyed Peter having to struggle against Mysterio after he learned the truth. The JJJ reveal was perfection. I freaked out soooo hard. Already have a good theory on where 3, will go, but more on that later. Also loved that the MCU Spidey now has his swinging through Manhattan moment.
Characters
All of the characters were fantastic, Tom Holland as Peter especially. He has such range and really sold Peter's struggles on this film. He does it so effortlessly but we really need to appreciate how good he is as Spider-Man and Peter. MJ was next level in this film, easily the best love interest of any MCU film and I love how they are developing their relationship, Mysterio was everything I wanted and more. It was so obvious he was gonna be a bad guy, but I still fell bad for all the suckers who took the trailers at face value. His turn was perfect, and while making him a former Stark Employee is new, his over the top nature and movie like show man ship was very much keeping in line with the comics. Ned and Betty were great in this, loved their summer romance and them dating is comic accurate too. Happy was the best he's ever been in this film. The advice he gave to Peter was Uncle Ben tier. I do hope him and Aunt May stick around.
Action
I think this is the best action in a Spider-Man movie yet. I saw someone complain the action was bad and that's a hard disagree from me. From the moment Peter and Mysterio fought Hydro Man I was impressed. Peter web slinging through the rubble during that fight was awesome, particularly that backwards maneuver he did through the window.
The molten man fight was just as good, but the illusion scene was on a whole nother level. The zombie Iron Man, the multiple Spider-Men, tossing MJ off the bridge, the Nick Fury fake out, magnificent.
My only complaint is that I wish they had spent a little more time on the blip and Pete/Aunt May's relationship after she find out, but those are small squabbles. Highly recommend
What's next?
With Mysterio setting Peter up, I definetly think we get the Sinister Six next movie. I'm not exactly sure what the complete line up will look like, but enough of his enemies are in the mix now. I don't think Peter will stay exposed, by the end of the 3rd movie they'll prove Mysterio doctored the video and Peter will be cleared. The comics have played with the idea of Peter's identity being exposed before too. They'll have fun with it but I don't expect it to be permanent. I thought Fury and Hill being Skrulls were a nice touch, looks like the real Fury is making the S.W.O.R.D. Base.
I'm so excited for the future of the MCU. Hope that JJJ cameo was a sign of more to come
Narrative
I felt like the film's plot was very consistent and interesting all the way through. You have Peter dealing with the death of Tony Stark and the need to step into his shoes. You also have Peter wanting to be a normal teen with a normal life. In true Spider-Man fashion, Peter is constantly juggling between his two lives this film, and I loved it. It's similar to Raimi's Spider-Man 2 that way, but has a richer variety imo. The first half of the movie is very light and breezy and while it keeps a more optimistic tone throughout it raises the stakes considerably once Mysterio has his turn. The second half is where the film really shines, and I really enjoyed Peter having to struggle against Mysterio after he learned the truth. The JJJ reveal was perfection. I freaked out soooo hard. Already have a good theory on where 3, will go, but more on that later. Also loved that the MCU Spidey now has his swinging through Manhattan moment.
Characters
All of the characters were fantastic, Tom Holland as Peter especially. He has such range and really sold Peter's struggles on this film. He does it so effortlessly but we really need to appreciate how good he is as Spider-Man and Peter. MJ was next level in this film, easily the best love interest of any MCU film and I love how they are developing their relationship, Mysterio was everything I wanted and more. It was so obvious he was gonna be a bad guy, but I still fell bad for all the suckers who took the trailers at face value. His turn was perfect, and while making him a former Stark Employee is new, his over the top nature and movie like show man ship was very much keeping in line with the comics. Ned and Betty were great in this, loved their summer romance and them dating is comic accurate too. Happy was the best he's ever been in this film. The advice he gave to Peter was Uncle Ben tier. I do hope him and Aunt May stick around.
Action
I think this is the best action in a Spider-Man movie yet. I saw someone complain the action was bad and that's a hard disagree from me. From the moment Peter and Mysterio fought Hydro Man I was impressed. Peter web slinging through the rubble during that fight was awesome, particularly that backwards maneuver he did through the window.
The molten man fight was just as good, but the illusion scene was on a whole nother level. The zombie Iron Man, the multiple Spider-Men, tossing MJ off the bridge, the Nick Fury fake out, magnificent.
My only complaint is that I wish they had spent a little more time on the blip and Pete/Aunt May's relationship after she find out, but those are small squabbles. Highly recommend
What's next?
With Mysterio setting Peter up, I definetly think we get the Sinister Six next movie. I'm not exactly sure what the complete line up will look like, but enough of his enemies are in the mix now. I don't think Peter will stay exposed, by the end of the 3rd movie they'll prove Mysterio doctored the video and Peter will be cleared. The comics have played with the idea of Peter's identity being exposed before too. They'll have fun with it but I don't expect it to be permanent. I thought Fury and Hill being Skrulls were a nice touch, looks like the real Fury is making the S.W.O.R.D. Base.
I'm so excited for the future of the MCU. Hope that JJJ cameo was a sign of more to come
Just got out. That was gooooood. They nailed the Far From Home theme imo, when he was swinging in New York again at the end it felt like being home again. Superb. Also JJ was fantastic after playing the game. The fun house Mysterio kick off the first time on screen was everything I wanted it to be. Can't stop thinking how good the second half was pulled off, because it's a mellow first half.
I'd say probably Dr. Octopus or Chameleon. Scorpion and Electro aren't really leader types.
Doc Ock is a natural choice, they'll probably set him up in the sequel. True, I did like how they made Scorpion smarter in this universe. He's not a bumbling moron like he is in the comics.
Concerning Chameleon, perhaps they'll retcon him being a Skrul who lies about how he got his powers.
THIS. THIS IS JJ. THIS IS THE CORE OF WHO HE IS. (and will always be, in any incarnation)Not some fucking bigoted piece of shit.
Though i wouldn't call JJ a true shitty person.
My personal reading of the MCU Vulture is (even setting a side Peter saving his life) he respect and likes him. It never was personal for toomes.
So i don't think he would like Beck setting up Peter to be some fucking murdering piece of shit. Because Toomes knows better.
And thinking about this while i'm typing it out. Would possibly see as, yet another instance of privileged fucks stepping on the little guy. And maaaaaaybe, even try to help him clear his name. (if he's out of jail, that is)
I don't know who that Keemstar person is. But sounds about right.
Though i wouldn't call JJ a true shitty person.
Nah. I don't think they would.
My personal reading of the MCU Vulture is (even setting a side Peter saving his life) he respect and likes him. It never was personal for toomes.
So i don't think he would like Beck setting up Peter to be some fucking murdering piece of shit. Because Toomes knows better.
And thinking about this while i'm typing it out. Would possibly see as, yet another instance of privileged fucks stepping on the little guy. And maaaaaaybe, even try to help him clear his name. (if he's out of jail, that is)
Just came back from seeing the movie. Was really fun! I loved the crazy stuff Mysterio was doing. An awesome visual showcase once he really started messing with Spidey. I legit was super shocked at how far Mysterio was willing to go til the very end. Obviously there was a lot of actual attempts made at the lives of many people in the film, but there's still something so strong about a point blank gun to the head. That is some scary stuff.
Anyway! Took some pics with my local spidey-fam after the show!
Anyway! Took some pics with my local spidey-fam after the show!
I have to say I'm very disappointed with this movie, which is surprising since I usually have the majority opinion when it comes to movies.
The entire first chunk of the movie felt so weird. Knowing that Mysterio is a villain leadsto this part feeling hollow and it dragging. Fury also felt really out of character here though I guess that has an explanation behind it in the end.
Mysterio's motive is revealed to be that he wants to be the next Tony Stark. Its kind of lame and a big step down from the grounded motive of the Vulture. I get that he's a theatrical character but its hard to take him seriously when he just sounds like a butthurt spurned tech bro. Like, his origin was Tony deciding to name his tech BARF? At the end they tried to give him some heady lines about "people needing to believe" which was just laughable.
Then we have Peter getting tricked into giving up his friends, man this sucked. Peter is a smart guy and I really feel like he should have been able to pick up on it all being a ruse, especially right on the heels of being tricked into giving up the glasses.
The final fight, while exciting to watch, just didn't make a whole lot of sense. Beck had already dropped the mirage so he had no reason not to just sic every drone he had on Spider-Man. Instead he sends maybe a hundred or so drones after him while hundreds more of them are on standby doing nothing. (He was rebooting the mirage yes, but that's entirely pointless to do) And he only sent one initial drone to kill the people that can make his entire plan fall apart? If the drones can shoot out unblockable sonic attacks, then why does he waste so much time shooting bullets that Spidey dodges by the thousands? When Parker says "execute them all" to Edith I immediately knew what that was leading to, because its such a completely unnatural line in that situation. "Stop them all" or "cancel them all" makes sense, but "execute them all" almost has the opposite meaning.
Overall, I guess I'm most disappointed by them just playing it straight. Mysterio pretended to be a good guy but surprise, actually a bad guy. That's it. No multiverse shenanigans, no real sympathetic qualities for the villain, no real losses for the hero. (Peter's identity being leaked isn't as bad as he thinks it is, basically everyone important already knows about it) I think the parts I actually liked were Peter's relationships with MJ and Happy growing, the very creative Mysterio mirage fights, and the JJJ cameo.
The entire first chunk of the movie felt so weird. Knowing that Mysterio is a villain leadsto this part feeling hollow and it dragging. Fury also felt really out of character here though I guess that has an explanation behind it in the end.
Mysterio's motive is revealed to be that he wants to be the next Tony Stark. Its kind of lame and a big step down from the grounded motive of the Vulture. I get that he's a theatrical character but its hard to take him seriously when he just sounds like a butthurt spurned tech bro. Like, his origin was Tony deciding to name his tech BARF? At the end they tried to give him some heady lines about "people needing to believe" which was just laughable.
Then we have Peter getting tricked into giving up his friends, man this sucked. Peter is a smart guy and I really feel like he should have been able to pick up on it all being a ruse, especially right on the heels of being tricked into giving up the glasses.
The final fight, while exciting to watch, just didn't make a whole lot of sense. Beck had already dropped the mirage so he had no reason not to just sic every drone he had on Spider-Man. Instead he sends maybe a hundred or so drones after him while hundreds more of them are on standby doing nothing. (He was rebooting the mirage yes, but that's entirely pointless to do) And he only sent one initial drone to kill the people that can make his entire plan fall apart? If the drones can shoot out unblockable sonic attacks, then why does he waste so much time shooting bullets that Spidey dodges by the thousands? When Parker says "execute them all" to Edith I immediately knew what that was leading to, because its such a completely unnatural line in that situation. "Stop them all" or "cancel them all" makes sense, but "execute them all" almost has the opposite meaning.
Overall, I guess I'm most disappointed by them just playing it straight. Mysterio pretended to be a good guy but surprise, actually a bad guy. That's it. No multiverse shenanigans, no real sympathetic qualities for the villain, no real losses for the hero. (Peter's identity being leaked isn't as bad as he thinks it is, basically everyone important already knows about it) I think the parts I actually liked were Peter's relationships with MJ and Happy growing, the very creative Mysterio mirage fights, and the JJJ cameo.
I still can't get past how stupid Mysterio's plan was.
He needed ridiculous amounts of luck/coincidence for the plan to not immediately fall apart. All of the Avengers needed to conveniently be absent. He needed Tony to have implemented basically zero safeguards in the Edith system. If Peter wasn't having trouble with his Spider-Sense then it's all over straight away. And he needed Peter to be dumb enough to hand over essentially a dangerous WMD to someone he'd known for like 24 hours. It's very contrived, even for a comic-book movie.
And all that is just for the initial phase of the plan! It gets even harder for him to keep up the charade going forward. What does he do when the other Avengers want to meet him? He'd have to know that beings like Thor are going to be much harder to fool. And what does he do when a genuine threat shows up? Hell, what even was his end goal with any of this?
Anyway, I'm getting dragged to see the movie again with another group of friends, so hopefully it works better for me on a rewatch.
He needed ridiculous amounts of luck/coincidence for the plan to not immediately fall apart. All of the Avengers needed to conveniently be absent. He needed Tony to have implemented basically zero safeguards in the Edith system. If Peter wasn't having trouble with his Spider-Sense then it's all over straight away. And he needed Peter to be dumb enough to hand over essentially a dangerous WMD to someone he'd known for like 24 hours. It's very contrived, even for a comic-book movie.
And all that is just for the initial phase of the plan! It gets even harder for him to keep up the charade going forward. What does he do when the other Avengers want to meet him? He'd have to know that beings like Thor are going to be much harder to fool. And what does he do when a genuine threat shows up? Hell, what even was his end goal with any of this?
He could only avoid the other Avengers for so long, though. I mean Doctor Strange in particular would probably be very interested in speaking to a Wizard from another dimension who managed to defeat elemental monsters he'd never heard of before, and that's assuming he doesn't smell bullshit from the getgo. And he can literally teleport around the world at will. There's no tracking some of these heroes.
Anyway, I'm getting dragged to see the movie again with another group of friends, so hopefully it works better for me on a rewatch.
Also Mysterio says he has to kill Spiderman, because he knows his real identity and he might tell people. He then uses his illusions, in a really cool way, to get Spiderman to tell him everyone he's told and get him hit by a train.
What just makes no sense is that he then doesn't follow up at all on whether he actually died. He has this incredible satellite technology that can track people (as shown earlier in the film), and instead of following up and tracking his body he just...doesn't care? I mean the whole point was that he had to kill him so he wouldn't tell people he's a fraud. So wouldn't it be imperative that he make sure he's ya know, actually dead? When all he has to to is literally say "EDITH track that train and look for signs that he's still alive." I mean, Peter literally passes out in the train for hours. All he would have had to do is send a drone to put one in his dome.
That just made no sense, like Austin Powers Dr. Evil levels of incompetence. Kinda took me out of any feeling of suspense.
What just makes no sense is that he then doesn't follow up at all on whether he actually died. He has this incredible satellite technology that can track people (as shown earlier in the film), and instead of following up and tracking his body he just...doesn't care? I mean the whole point was that he had to kill him so he wouldn't tell people he's a fraud. So wouldn't it be imperative that he make sure he's ya know, actually dead? When all he has to to is literally say "EDITH track that train and look for signs that he's still alive." I mean, Peter literally passes out in the train for hours. All he would have had to do is send a drone to put one in his dome.
That just made no sense, like Austin Powers Dr. Evil levels of incompetence. Kinda took me out of any feeling of suspense.
This was one of those special movies for me that made me forget continuity errors, plot contrivances, and the like. I had so much fun I really didn't mind how silly it all was.
Like, zombie Iron Man coming to get Peter was the best thing I've seen in a long time.
I doubt he thought the kid was strong enough to survive getting hit by a train.
Yeah. His goal is dumb, his reason behind his goal is dumb... he's a shitty villain, to be honest. Mysterio and his "powers" are cool, but Beck is godawful.
I think this is a combination of Mysterio being too hands off for his own good and him actually liking Peter. While he was playing him, I got the impression Beck really did like Peter, at least for a time. Probably didn't want to confirm and see his dead body
Spider-man does have a weakness against trains. It's how Ock knocked him out. :)
Tace , I did love the awkward teenage stuff in this. ALL of it. But as for the personal stakes, I feel like Spider-Man 2 still did a better job of putting Peter through the wringer and thus making his victory that much more cathartic. There is still tons of love in this, and as much of a Mysterio fanboy as I am, it wasn't enough to send it over the top for me.
But I do find it fun that both the Raimi series and this one have extremely strong first outings but somehow effortlessly top themselves in the second outings by leaning into the character drama but also having extremely strong villains to back it up and keep the stakes personal.
But I do find it fun that both the Raimi series and this one have extremely strong first outings but somehow effortlessly top themselves in the second outings by leaning into the character drama but also having extremely strong villains to back it up and keep the stakes personal.
See, I think it would have been so much better if after he got the glasses, he was more up front about how much he actually hated Peter. It would have made his dad talks earlier in the movie so much more manipulative, cunning and sociopathic. The movie just wasn''t willing to go the full distance to the detriment of the character.
If Spider-Man is caught and sent to jail, he would be in there with scorpion and Vulture probably, right?
I completely disagree. The character was much better for not being an "evil for evil's sake" caricature.
Movie was fucking GOAT live action Spider-Man. Firing on every fucking cilindar god damn.
Also LOL at some of y'all in here
Trailer Drops: Omg Mysterio is a good guy and he's from the multiverse!!
Comics nerds: Never trust Mysterio
Movie releases: Omg Mysterio is dead I hate the MCU killing off bad guys
Comic nerds: What did we just say??
NEVER
TRUST
MYSTERIO
That boi ain't dead. I mean aside from NEVER TRUST MYSTERIO we also have the rumored Thunderbolts movie, which Mysterio is supposed to be a part of.
NEVER
TRUST
MYSTERIO
That's something that actually bummed me out about the movie, I really liked the idea of Peter having an actual supportive superhero listening and talking to him. But it's not meant to last because NEVER TRUST MYSTERIO
Also LOL at some of y'all in here
Trailer Drops: Omg Mysterio is a good guy and he's from the multiverse!!
Comics nerds: Never trust Mysterio
Movie releases: Omg Mysterio is dead I hate the MCU killing off bad guys
Comic nerds: What did we just say??
NEVER
TRUST
MYSTERIO
That boi ain't dead. I mean aside from NEVER TRUST MYSTERIO we also have the rumored Thunderbolts movie, which Mysterio is supposed to be a part of.
NEVER
TRUST
MYSTERIO
But he didn't hate Peter. He actually liked Peter. Because Beck is a narcissist, and saw himself in Peter. Saying "Never apologize for being the smartest person in the room" was the tell, and even though he is obviously batshit fucking crazy he was genuinely pissed off that he was going to have to kill him over the drone operator's fuckup.
That's something that actually bummed me out about the movie, I really liked the idea of Peter having an actual supportive superhero listening and talking to him. But it's not meant to last because NEVER TRUST MYSTERIO
That's not a caricature, he had a really good reason to not like Peter. He had no reason to like him except thinking "he's good kid" which honestly is super lame.
Accords jail, don't know why Vulture didn't get sent there.
No, he really didn't have a good reason. His anger was against Stark. Peter was just caught in the cross-fire and he acknowledged that until he realized Peter wasn't going to leave it alone.
MCU Mysterio turning into Arkham Asylum Scarecrow was incredible.
Knowing that the entire op was a con to manipulate Peter makes what could feel bullshit actually work.
How long has Peter been without his spidey-sense? Has this been a thing carried out from other films? I can't remember.
The bridge scene was fantastic when Pete closed his eyes, dude was a monster.
The bridge scene was fantastic when Pete closed his eyes, dude was a monster.
Peter not leaving it alone, squealing on him to Fury and stopping his London scheme is what made Mysterio take off the gloves. He took that personal.
He seemed to not have it at any moment during Homecoming. The first evidence we saw of it was the bus scene in IW.
I don't think so because even if Beck likes Peter he ends up acting as an "evil of evil's sake" villain anyways. He outs his identity and tries to kill him and his friends. Outing his identity is a wholly vindictive move meant to drag Peter down with him, if killing Peter was really just a matter of his hand being forced then he wouldn't have done that. As it stands he acts like a totally different character in the beginning and the end of the movie - keeping him consistent as a sociopath or a narcissist would only have elevated the character.
Ahh I see, it seems like a power he's slowly been developing.
Pretty awesome way to showcase an op power!
I don't agree with that interpretation. He only was killing Peter because he was getting in his way, and he wanted to kill his friends because he suspected they knew his plan and didn't want them to tell anyone.
All of that was him feeling his hand was forced.
Outing his identity was his way to "be the hero" even in death, which was his ultimate goal.
That's the beauty of Spider-Man. I found in every medium the character drama is always the best part of the character. Lol I'm fan boying so hard right now
I do get what you mean about his personal life. While this Peter has gone through some stuff Raimi Peter could only dream of, I do admit that the level of shit he got in 2 was on another level and did make his bounce back the most cathartic yet. But I would say this is right behind it, largely based on how good Holland is at selling Peter as a character.
Well, that's the thing. I don't think he ever truly hated Peter til the third act. His beef was with Tony more than anyone. He was willing to kill children and Peter by the end of it and completely exposed my boy while framing him for murder. I definitely think they went a full lap with the character. Him liking Peter, even if only for a time, adds complexity to Mysterio imo
But what do I know lol