Spanish-speaking Era: Can ‘negrito’ be used affectionately?

[Jehuty]

The answer the OP questions. Negrito/Negro is a term of endearment, depending on who says it (or really what country you are from). People from Latin American countries with more African/Black blood will probably have no issue with being called it. If someone who is not from one of those countries blurts
it out, then probably yeah, there will be a problem. For reference, us Dominicans use negro(a)/negrito(a) as a term of endearment. I wouldn't call any of my Mexican friends that though. Also, what other posters are saying is true, easiest way to describe you automatically becomes your nickname and sticks with you for life.

 

[Ricky_R]

In Puerto Rico it's widely used as a form of affection or a non-offensive way to call somebody you care about, even if he/she isn't a PoC.

Whether that's an issue for PoC here in PR, I honestly don't know. However, knowing how most Puerto Ricans are, I think I would be hard pressed to find many people who feel uncomfortable or offended by it.

 

[maruchan]

It can be pretty damn racist, here is a children's song by Mexican legendary kids singer cri cri.

 

[DeltaRed]

Manchester United's Edinson Cavani has apologised for a deleted social media post containing a Spanish phrase that is offensive in some contexts.

​

The Uruguayan striker sent the message after scoring the injury-time winner in United's 3-2 win at Southampton.

The Football Association is looking into the post.

"It was intended as an affectionate greeting to a friend, thanking him for his congratulations after the game," said the 33-year-old.

"The last thing I wanted to do was cause offence to anyone.

"I am completely opposed to racism and deleted the message as soon as it was explained that it can be interpreted differently. I would like to sincerely apologise for this."

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[SolidSnakeBoy]

but an old person is old, this is referring to any child as "little black boy" even if they are not black, no? A non black person calling a black person in america "nappy headed" is "factually accurate" but definitely comes with some racist connotations at BEST. Plenty of south american countries have issues with racial relations towards black people so maybe referring to non black children/people as "black" isnt the best or most progressive idea.

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As Austriacus mentioned the person is not usually old, in fact actual old people that you do not know probably would be offended if you used viejo/a towards them, a polite señor/a is usually used. The point is that these terms are rarely aligned with race/age/other face value meaning, and more of an ingrained commonly acknowledged meaning, long dissociated. I think the evolution of these terms is not hard to see, LA countries are an amalgamation of native, black, and white peoples that have lived together for many generations and have intermixed constantly, the original connotation has become murky when "negro" as a social race is not as clearly delineated as it is in other countries. It is also further exasperated by the way the language supports diminutives and can easily add emphasis to things that are meant to be insults. Just something to try and internalize rather than making blanket statements about race in other cultures.

 

[Sqrt]

First I would say that, regardless of context, 'negro or negrito' are no equivalent to the n-word. Negro is the Spanish word for black, and it should be treated as such when judging its use, which indeed can be racist depending on the context.

And given the context, I would say that Cavani wasn't trying to be offensive.

 

[CenaToon]

It's sugarcoated racism. You can always say "Yeah but in the right context it's not THAT bad!", but it's still racism.

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Lol no.

 

[Messofanego]

I remember a viral video of some argentinian debate show, and this native woman was speaking, and when she finished the presenter asked her from which neighboring country she was from. And she and her family were argentinians since the country was born, was a really embarrassing moment for all the white argentinians on set, and the woman went on talking about how the original argentinians all looked like her and the europeans came later.

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Ooph

Can you share that clip?

Found the video, it doesn't go exactly as I remembered it but it pretty much goes as I said

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Thanks

 

[taco543]

In Puerto Rico it's widely used as a form of affection or a non-offensive way to call somebody you care about, even if he/she isn't a PoC.

Whether that's an issue for PoC here in PR, I honestly don't know. However, knowing how most Puerto Ricans are, I think I would be hard pressed to find many people who feel uncomfortable or offended by it.

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So I live in California and just started a new job at a different bank. I don't speak spanish, however here at my new bank one of the managers was hit by a customer committing fraud. So she had to file reports and was afraid of losing her job, she's puerto rican, and the customer was African, just immigrated from Africa, and she was pissed and kept cussing him out, talking about how if she loses her job shes going to kill "El Negrito" I was completely uncomfortable with it and keep getting mixed messages from friends that speak spanish what to do. I didn't even know if I should start a thread or what. But how do you see this. cos it was really disconcerting and really uncomfortable, but also being new here, as in still under a month, I didnt want to ruffle any feathers...

 

[Ricky_R]

So I live in California and just started a new job at a different bank. I don't speak spanish, however here at my new bank one of the managers was hit by a customer committing fraud. So she had to file reports and was afraid of losing her job, she's puerto rican, and the customer was African, just immigrated from Africa, and she was pissed and kept cussing him out, talking about how if she loses her job shes going to kill "El Negrito" I was completely uncomfortable with it and keep getting mixed messages from friends that speak spanish what to do. I didn't even know if I should start a thread or what. But how do you see this. cos it was really disconcerting and really uncomfortable, but also being new here, as in still under a month, I didnt want to ruffle any feathers...

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Well, in that case I don't like the way she's using it. Many people from PR can also be quite ignorant and racist so who knows if she was using it in a disrespectful/racist way. I'm not black, btw.

Normally when people here use the word "negrito" (like "mi negrito" or "mi negrita") it's used in a way to show affection. Like saying "my cute thing" or something similar. It's been that way since I can remember and while I don't hear as much today, it's still widely used with no issues.

 

[squallmx]

Yes, I mean, it was the name of a popular bread for decades:

They change the name to NITO a few years ago... because the company started selling it in the USA...

 

[Tochtli79]

So I live in California and just started a new job at a different bank. I don't speak spanish, however here at my new bank one of the managers was hit by a customer committing fraud. So she had to file reports and was afraid of losing her job, she's puerto rican, and the customer was African, just immigrated from Africa, and she was pissed and kept cussing him out, talking about how if she loses her job shes going to kill "El Negrito" I was completely uncomfortable with it and keep getting mixed messages from friends that speak spanish what to do. I didn't even know if I should start a thread or what. But how do you see this. cos it was really disconcerting and really uncomfortable, but also being new here, as in still under a month, I didnt want to ruffle any feathers...

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In that case I'd say it's definitely leaning racist, she's directly associating her anger with his skin colour. If it were me I would've said "that customer" or "that man", not gone straight for "that black man".

 

[Tochtli79]

Yes, I mean, it was the name of a popular bread for decades:

They change the name to NITO a few years ago... because the company started selling it in the USA...

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This is not helping to illustrate the point as not only is that caricature plainly racist but the phrase in that ad is as well.

 

[Hidant]

So I live in California and just started a new job at a different bank. I don't speak spanish, however here at my new bank one of the managers was hit by a customer committing fraud. So she had to file reports and was afraid of losing her job, she's puerto rican, and the customer was African, just immigrated from Africa, and she was pissed and kept cussing him out, talking about how if she loses her job shes going to kill "El Negrito" I was completely uncomfortable with it and keep getting mixed messages from friends that speak spanish what to do. I didn't even know if I should start a thread or what. But how do you see this. cos it was really disconcerting and really uncomfortable, but also being new here, as in still under a month, I didnt want to ruffle any feathers...

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I'm not Puerto Rican but the key thing is that in this case, it's being used with negative connotations, maybe "negrito" doesn't carry the same weight and connotations than saying N****, but if she's cussing him and mentioning his race while she's at it, it's not a good look.

As some people mentioned before, in Latin America there's a lot of issues with race and maybe there's not the level of vitriol that you see in the US, it's more subdued but not less important, so you will find a lot of diet racism and colorism, even in people that you migght otherwise think of as liberal or open minded.

EDIT: I would like the opportunity to recommend the following book, centered in this very issue: Pigmentocracies: Ethnicity, Race, and Color in Latin America

 

[softie]

As racist as sexist are the words "woman" or "man", I guess, yeah...

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That's a bit of a half-cooked argument, ignoring the burdensome history that the topic's words bring with them. The BLM movement tried very hard to make the society aware of accepted, covert racism, you can't just shrug it off like "yeah these are just attributes and everything else is fluffed up outrage".

 

[taco543]

Well, in that case I don't like the way she's using it. Many people from PR can also be quite ignorant and racist so who knows if she was using it in a disrespectful/racist way. I'm not black, btw.

Normally when people here use the word "negrito" (like "mi negrito" or "mi negrita") it's used in a way to show affection. Like saying "my cute thing" or something similar. It's been that way since I can remember and while I don't hear as much today, it's still widely used with no issues.

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In that case I'd say it's definitely leaning racist, she's directly associating her anger with his skin colour. If it were me I would've said "that customer" or "that man", not gone straight for "that black man".

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I'm not Puerto Rican but the key thing is that in this case, it's being used with negative connotations, maybe "negrito" doesn't carry the same weight and connotations than saying N****, but if she's cussing him and mentioning his race while she's at it, it's not a good look.

As some people mentioned before, in Latin America there's a lot of issues with race and maybe there's not the level of vitriol that you see in the US, it's more subdued but not less important, so you will find a lot of diet racism and colorism, even in people that you migght otherwise think of as liberal or open minded.

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Yeah see thats why I felt really weird about it and didn't know what to do, because friends said it usually is used in a friendly connotation but in the context especially it made seriously uneasy. I have no history of the word and honestly had never heard it prior, the first thing I did on my break was google to see if it was a racist term and kept finding mixed things there too. it's been just under a month now since its happened, and she hasnt said anything like that since, but it was definitely enough to throw me off.

 

[Murr]

Growing up in northern Mexico (Tamaulipas, Nuevo Leon and some time in San Luis), I only ever saw "negrito" used in an immensely condescending way, as a punctuation mark to drive home how they were being treated/ being thought of the way they were because they were black.

Reading debates about use of the r-word in America always gave a whole of of deja-vu. Really wish people were not so steadfast in enshrining language just because of cultural inertia. Mexico quite simply does not take black people seriously, and I get the sense a lot of other Hispanic countries are similarly allergic to self-reflection on race.

 

[Austriacus]

That's a bit of a half-cooked argument, ignoring the burdensome history that the topic's words bring with them. The BLM movement tried very hard to make the society aware of accepted, covert racism, you can't just shrug it off like "yeah these are just attributes and everything else is fluffed up outrage".

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I just love how you talk about "ignoring history" while completely ignoring the one relevant here and to the words being used in the corresponding language (hint: not Anglo history).
But it sure feels nice for us brown countries to keep being educated by americans and europeans, real nice.

 

[Manu]

Yes, I mean, it was the name of a popular bread for decades:

They change the name to NITO a few years ago... because the company started selling it in the USA...

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Man I'm glad we don't have anything as bad over here.

Wait. Oh no.

OH NO.

OH NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

[Tora]

So what's the general consensus then?

Suarez is a shithead, a clear racist. With Cavani though, i'm not sure how it's being perceived; I can understand why he'd get punished but surely surely it makes more sense to just genuinely chalk it down to cultural differences and educate him on it.

 

[Pancracio17]

As a mexican, I have no idea if people find it offensive, but I dont really like saying it anyway.

 

[DBT85]

So what's the general consensus then?

Suarez is a shithead, a clear racist. With Cavani though, i'm not sure how it's being perceived; I can understand why he'd get punished but surely surely it makes more sense to just genuinely chalk it down to cultural differences and educate him on it.

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Cananvi also apologised. Suarez denied it and had a t hirt campaign to support him. The two cases are really quite different.

 

[IggyChooChoo]

This is not helping to illustrate the point as not only is that caricature plainly racist but the phrase in that ad is as well.

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What's racist about the slogan? Does "baratico" have a connotation I'm not picking up on?

 

[Tochtli79]

What's racist about the slogan? Does "baratico" have a connotation I'm not picking up on?

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I mean it is literally fetishizing (lo más rico) and associating lack of economy/value (barato) with black people. The bread is a tasty cheap snack as are black people according to that ad, which yikes.

 

[DongBeetle]

My nana has said it in the past. I think it's an older person thing

 

[Advance.Wars.Sgt.]

I'm black and Hispanic ill be one of the first to say no. You only take it from your family it is super weird to have a random stranger say that even if its possitive.

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Thanks for your input.

Have there been any more black Hispanic people who have posted in this thread? Because no offense, but the opinions of non-blacks on this subject don't hold a measure of value since you're not affected by anti-black racism and are likely unwitting perpetrators of it.

 

[Advance.Wars.Sgt.]

Double post

 

[Tora]

Cananvi also apologised. Suarez denied it and had a t hirt campaign to support him. The two cases are really quite different.

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Good, I do think it's much more clear in this case

 

[martincrimson87]

I just love how you talk about "ignoring history" while completely ignoring the one relevant here and to the words being used in the corresponding language (hint: not Anglo history).
But it sure feels nice for us brown countries to keep being educated by americans and europeans, real nice.

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Don't waste your thumbs. They won't get it. I applaud the OP for making an effort to understand though.

 

[mantidor]

My parents call me negrito all the time. And i have two aunts "negras", and two cousins, we are called that because we happen to be more brown than the rest of the family.

Also this seems relevant: https://fb.watch/252qLQKxAu/

 

[kyo2004]

Yes, in Argentina you can use negro to refer to someone. My father was pale as a ghost and my mother would address him as negro lot of times.

Unless you are called negro de mierda Is not to be taken as an insult.

The anglosphere should stop believing they are the center of the universe and truly learn about other cultures as you are doing instead of wasting time trying to shoehorn words like latinx into our language.

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+1...

As always, every word in Spanish has a context to be used (even the tone how you say it at the moment) as opposed in English speaking countries where almost is a trigger warning. Like many already showed here, in Colombia, "marica" is widely used to friendly chatting.

 

[Doc Holliday]

My entire family calls my uncle El Negrito. It's a term of endearment. We've corrected family when they try to use it for other people outside of the family. Morenito or Morenita is more common, it sounds less offensive but we would never use it in an actual conversation in a professional setting or with strangers.

However, once you hear "eso negros!" "Eso morenos" watch out, that's usually the start of a shitty conversation. It's all in the delivery and context.

BTW that Dominican twitter post in one hundred percent true. My mom calls me a el narisu(big nose), el flaco/el gordo (don't ask), and a few more. Yea it's dumb, but I think people are slowly changing and realizing sometimes this stuff affects people.

 

[Advance.Wars.Sgt.]

Joetachi I really appreciate you speaking out, and would love to hear more from you. If it matters, I hear and see you, because while I may not be culturally Hispanic, I am black, which has a language of oppression that transcends cultural lines.

This invitation goes out to any other black Hispanics who are tired of having non-black Hispanics speak over/for you and who constantly diminish your voices: You can PM me if you want to chat, I'm all ears.

 

[Tiny Chihuahueño]

Important thing to note since Spain/Latin America are very different: That's more of a Latin American thing, here in Spain we don't have that affectionate term for people in your family in general. When they say "negrito" here they basically want to say "poor black people from Africa", so I wouldn't give it a pass in this country at least.

 

[hydrophilic attack]

i have worked with quite a lot of people from spain and south america, but thankfully never heard them use phrases like this. they were all my own generation though and maybe this is more of a boomer thing, or maybe they realized it wouldn't be socially accepted here. or maybe some of them talked like this among themselves but were tone switching when around people outside of the hispanic community

My mom calls my sister and me "gorda" and my dad "gordo", and it always slightly scandalizes my friends who know some Spanish.

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lol i had a coworker from bolivia who would call people this haha. but she was very nice and said it in a friendly way so no one took offence. but probably fatphobia is more socially acceptable here than racist slurs

 

[Javier]

My parents call me negrito all the time. And i have two aunts "negras", and two cousins, we are called that because we happen to be more brown than the rest of the family.

Also this seems relevant:

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That video is so on point.

 

[Chapo]

It's pretty funny, but my dad (Mexican) prefers to be called Negro (pronounced neh-gro and not nee-gro) than by his actual name. He hates his real name lmao

His nickname is literally Negro in Mexico. He has been called that since he was a kid originally by his own mom. Friends and family call him Negro, even by my mom lmao

 

[IggyChooChoo]

I mean it is literally fetishizing (lo más rico) and associating lack of economy/value (barato) with black people. The bread is a tasty cheap snack as are black people according to that ad, which yikes.

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OK, that makes sense, thanks for explaining it.

 

[softie]

I just love how you talk about "ignoring history" while completely ignoring the one relevant here and to the words being used in the corresponding language (hint: not Anglo history).
But it sure feels nice for us brown countries to keep being educated by americans and europeans, real nice.

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I don't think this is solely applicable to Anglo history. Slavian, Hispanic, German, Greek, Arabic or Sino history is loaded with same or similar themes of accepted, cultural racism. Raising awareness for trying to amend those cultural inadequacies isn't attributable to a single ethnicity, origin or culture, it's important for building a sophisticated global society.

My personal background is German-Slav, so I'm completely unsuited to asses the linguistic subtleties or to have cultural insight into the discussed wording. Of course I've got my own burden to carry, so I've wanted to point out a common thread running through all different cultures.

I didn't want to "lecture" anybody, so no offense.

 

[Deleted member 21709]

Yes, I mean, it was the name of a popular bread for decades:

They change the name to NITO a few years ago... because the company started selling it in the USA...

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This thread seems like a potential repeat of the Sinterklaas one.

 

[Joetachi]

Joetachi I really appreciate you speaking out, and would love to hear more from you. If it matters, I hear and see you, because while I may not be culturally Hispanic, I am black, which has a language of oppression that transcends cultural lines.

This invitation goes out to any other black Hispanics who are tired of having non-black Hispanics speak over/for you and who constantly diminish your voices: You can PM me if you want to chat, I'm all ears.

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Na bro ill keep shitting up this thread because from what it seem how real i said some shit bothered some people . The thing is im half Dominican and half Puertorican and i dont take any bullshit from the racism on each of the countries i grew up in . From puertoricans telling me to my face that i am better and smarter that Dominicans because i was raised in the island and hearing the same racist bullshit excuses from Domincans when they talk about Hatians as if ive not been called the sameshit. Then you have the rest of latin america that makes the shit you have to take from them look tame then you have these motherfuckers on this forum saying that they hear that they call the slightly tan uncle "negrito" its all good here nothing wrong in latin america racism is some "gringo shit". The same people that dont let black people progress anywhere in latin america. What i failled to realize is how little voices that are black from this part of the world get heard ill keep fucking up any of the fantasies they have about what they think latin america is.

 

[Eila]

What's racist about the slogan? Does "baratico" have a connotation I'm not picking up on?

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It's a racist caricature of how caribbean blacks supposedly talk. Similar to asians and r's.

 

[Iori Loco]

Oof, this is a really tricky one. I guess it can be considered inherently racist since it specifically makes a distinction of someone's skin's color, on the other hand, people really use the term "negr@/negrit@" towards people they really love or respect in a way the n-word would never be used. For example, the song titled "La negra Tomasa" was written in honor of a slave's daughter who inherited the lands where her family served at, and used her wealth to take care of disenfranchised people, or so says the legend. The lyrics of the song talk about the singer's love for the Negra Tomasa, and how he gets sad everytime she goes out, how beautiful she is and how crazy she drives him.



That's not to say there's not a lot of discrimination based on skin color in Latin American countries, and the word can be used in a hurtful or despective way, usually preceded by another insulting adjective like pinche, or the like.

 

[DeltaRed]

Cavani charged for social media post

​

Manchester United striker Edinson Cavani has been charged with misconduct by the Football Association for a now-deleted social media post containing a Spanish phrase that is offensive in some contexts.
The Uruguayan striker sent the message after scoring the injury-time winner in United's 3-2 win at Southampton.
He later deleted the post and apologised when it was pointed out the meaning that could be attached to it.
The striker has until Monday 4 January 2021 to provide a response to the charge.
As of this season, Football Association rules state that any player found guilty of an offence of discrimination will face a minimum three-match suspension.
United say they will consider the charge but repeated their message that they are committed to the fight against racism and stressed their was no malicious intent behind the forward's post.

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He'll probably be getting a 3 game ban for it. Doesn't seem to be any malicious intent behind it but they need to set an example.

 

[Sphinx]

Is it like... Thanks, Black person!... or does it read differently?

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It reads " thanks, cute nice black person"

That said, using someone's race to call them is weird, no matter the intentions.

 

[IneptEMP]

Yes, I mean, it was the name of a popular bread for decades:

They change the name to NITO a few years ago... because the company started selling it in the USA...

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"Oh yes, of course 'negrito' is affectionate, just look at this adorable ad from my country!"
*literally posts an image of a blackface creature with a fucking bone in its nappy head*

...Jesus fucking Christ.

If that was posted in good faith some of you are really out of your fucking depth when it comes to racism towards black people.

 

[Advance.Wars.Sgt.]

"Oh yes, of course 'negrito' is affectionate, just look at this adorable ad from my country!"
*literally posts an image of a blackface creature with a fucking bone in its nappy head*

...Jesus fucking Christ.

If that was posted in good faith some of you are really out of your fucking depth when it comes to racism towards black people.

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Non-black Latine posters are just like Euro posters in that they speak over black populations affected by anti-blackness because it's out of sight, out of mind for them.

Why is it so hard for people who aren't affected by a particular brand of bigotry to NOT speak on shit they have NO part in?

 

[squallmx]

Non-black Latine posters are just like Euro posters in that they speak over black populations affected by anti-blackness because it's out of sight, out of mind for them.

Why is it so hard for people who aren't affected by a particular brand of bigotry to NOT speak on shit they have NO part in?

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Well OP was kind of asking for our opinion. My post was not made with malice, for better or worse our cultures are different.

 

[Baphomet]

I personally don' use it but I've heard it a bunch growing up in PR in a non offensive way and no one has had a problem with it.

 

[Sendero]

It is racist, specially if said to a foreign person.
But regardless of how you or anyone else feel, the truth is that -- in LA -- it's mostly used in an affectionate way, although it can skirt the condescending line (it depends on context).
If someone actually is purposely trying to be malicious, they would instead say "africano", "indio" (not bad words per se), or straight up "p* negro" (the extra qualification is sort of required).

In the case mentioned, the FA basically had no option but to put a spotlight on it, since Cavani is a public figure, that play under their rules.
And the message was open for the general audience to see.

So, yes.. the vast majority of LA are calling bullshit on this, but it's definitively the right approach, since the point is to reduce Diet racism in the world.
Of course, it almost assuredly will have the absolutely opposite impact, but that's a different discussion.