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wizard

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,096
California
It is devoid of the suffocating atmosphere of the first film, its an action movie. Not that its bad its just dumb.

On a side note I said fuck the cartel at one point and my father said "no mellow liberal shit is gonna stop them" Facepalm
 

SneerfulOwl

Member
Nov 4, 2017
1,886
Just came back from seeing this movie and couple of questions:
1. Was the gang part of the rival cartel that was in war with the daughter's father's cartel? Hence they decided to kill Alejandro and kidnap the girl after Alejandro told them he was working for her father? It was never made clear.
2. Who was trying to ambush the convoy? The girl's father's cartel or the rival cartel?
3. It comes back to the whole which cartel is which. They kind of dropped this plot and continued with Alejandro and the girl plot. Who did Alejandro kill in the first movie if the cartel boss responsible for his family's death is still alive?
 

Fubar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,730
Just came back from seeing this movie and couple of questions:
1. Was the gang part of the rival cartel that was in war with the daughter's father's cartel? Hence they decided to kill Alejandro and kidnap the girl after Alejandro told them he was working for her father? It was never made clear.
2. Who was trying to ambush the convoy? The girl's father's cartel or the rival cartel?
3. It comes back to the whole which cartel is which. They kind of dropped this plot and continued with Alejandro and the girl plot. Who did Alejandro kill in the first movie if the cartel boss responsible for his family's death is still alive?
1. It wasnt explicitly mentioned, but I imagine it was just a guy and his border crossing gang - relatively small time, not an important group overall - who saw an opportunity to pressure one of the most powerful men in Mexico and hopefully come out with more power/money/influence.

2. The convoy was driving through the rival cartel's territory with local and state police helping. I think what they were going for in that scene was that the cops were dirty and leaked info to the rival cartel. The dirty cops and a small group of cartel members were supposed to kill the Americans and steal Isabelle.

3. The first movie leads you to believe that Alejandro kills the man responsible for his family's deaths. This one, in the scene with Isabelle at the small ranch with the deaf man, Isabelle tells Alejandro that she knows who he is. He is the attorney with the family that "they" were ordered to kill. Alejandro tells her that "they" didnt kill his family, but instead clarifies that her father ordered another man to do it. So the boss from the 1st movie evidently reports to Isabelle's father.
 

NinjaScooter

Member
Oct 25, 2017
54,457
1. It wasnt explicitly mentioned, but I imagine it was just a guy and his border crossing gang - relatively small time, not an important group overall - who saw an opportunity to pressure one of the most powerful men in Mexico and hopefully come out with more power/money/influence.

2. The convoy was driving through the rival cartel's territory with local and state police helping. I think what they were going for in that scene was that the cops were dirty and leaked info to the rival cartel. The dirty cops and a small group of cartel members were supposed to kill the Americans and steal Isabelle.

3. The first movie leads you to believe that Alejandro kills the man responsible for his family's deaths. This one, in the scene with Isabelle at the small ranch with the deaf man, Isabelle tells Alejandro that she knows who he is. He is the attorney with the family that "they" were ordered to kill. Alejandro tells her that "they" didnt kill his family, but instead clarifies that her father ordered another man to do it. So the boss from the 1st movie evidently reports to Isabelle's father.

Regarding point 1, at the beginning when the dude is trying to talk his little cousin into becoming a coyote (when they are sitting by the river smoking/drinking) he mentions something about the Matamoros, like "they pay well" or "they protect" or some shit IIRC, which is the rival cartel, so I think it's implied that he and his coyote crew are somehow affiliated with that gang, if not outright a part of it.
 

SolidNivram

Member
Apr 30, 2018
95
Hawthorne CA
Can someone explain what the hell the point of the Somalia plot point was? Was that guy actually helping terrorists get to Mexico?


He was the leader of that Somali pirate group that controlled that piece of sea. It was assumed that he was letting terrorists cross that part of the sea and into Mexico. But later you find out that those terrorists that blew up the store were homegrown.
 

scitek

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,113
Can someone explain what the hell the point of the Somalia plot point was? Was that guy actually helping terrorists get to Mexico?

They were using their assumption that Mexican cartels were letting foreign terrorists into the US as a cover story for their operation in Mexico. Later, after everything went to shit and they shot up the Mexican police, it was revealed that the terrorists were actually homegrown, and their entire excuse for being down there in the first place was no longer viable.
 

guiloahhhhh

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,773
Just saw this. As a stand alone movie it's forgettable. As a sequel to Sicario it's fucking insulting.

Yep. Bit unfortunate. Not a bad film per se but the first one just had so much vision. Kate really brought so much to the original seeing everything through her eyes.

The original film seeing her nearly killed by Alejandro and her feeling helpless gave you an awesome feeling to see the scope of how brutal these people are. Even though she's a badass woman she could never compete with these people who are killers.

And yet in this movie they don't do things as great. "Hey guys I'll escort with Mexican federal police!" Isn't Josh Brolin the dude to be like "fuck that we'll finance our own shit"? We're not going to trust this? And then he's just like "yeah we have her somewhere I have ONE GUY WITH HER." We don't have back up or anything else? Even the ending pulling up in the helicopters why are we landing? Don't we have door gunners just to fuck people up? The truck full of cartels could have just opened up fire while your coming around.

The whole movie sort of seems like a mediocre real action film. Characters say cliched things WIPE IT CLEAN. SPOTLESS. The secretary of defense just leaves it with his inferior for some reason even though this shit could go way south if it's discovered Americans are operating on the border. The Alejandro surviving part is pretty hardcore and well shot. Overall I just don't know what story or morals they are trying to tell.
 

StrawberryJam

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,702
Yep. Bit unfortunate. Not a bad film per se but the first one just had so much vision. Kate really brought so much to the original seeing everything through her eyes.

The original film seeing her nearly killed by Alejandro and her feeling helpless gave you an awesome feeling to see the scope of how brutal these people are. Even though she's a badass woman she could never compete with these people who are killers.

And yet in this movie they don't do things as great. "Hey guys I'll escort with Mexican federal police!" Isn't Josh Brolin the dude to be like "fuck that we'll finance our own shit"? We're not going to trust this? And then he's just like "yeah we have her somewhere I have ONE GUY WITH HER." We don't have back up or anything else? Even the ending pulling up in the helicopters why are we landing? Don't we have door gunners just to fuck people up? The truck full of cartels could have just opened up fire while your coming around.

The whole movie sort of seems like a mediocre real action film. Characters say cliched things WIPE IT CLEAN. SPOTLESS. The secretary of defense just leaves it with his inferior for some reason even though this shit could go way south if it's discovered Americans are operating on the border. The Alejandro surviving part is pretty hardcore and well shot. Overall I just don't know what story or morals they are trying to tell.
Exactly. Looking at it through Kate's eyes made it almost like a cosmic horror movie, with her seeing things she can't comprehend and being powerless to stop it. Cos of that you didn't really empathise with anyone other than her.

Now I'm supposed to believe that Alejandro won't murder a kid of his enemy when I seen him kill 2 without a second thought in the first one? Nah man. This was like someone read a synopsis of the first movie and made a sequel to that rather than the actual film.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,696
The writing felt so much slacker this time. Playing constant hot potato with the young girl was more irritating than entertaining and it got increasingly convoluted towards the end -
having the boy bump into Benicio in the car park only for it to pay off later
- and just felt nowhere near as tight as the first.

It was a telegraph too far, unfortunately. And how that 'random' encounter sets up the sequel.
 

cj_iwakura

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,195
Coral Springs, FL
Exactly. Looking at it through Kate's eyes made it almost like a cosmic horror movie, with her seeing things she can't comprehend and being powerless to stop it. Cos of that you didn't really empathise with anyone other than her.

Now I'm supposed to believe that Alejandro won't murder a kid of his enemy when I seen him kill 2 without a second thought in the first one? Nah man. This was like someone read a synopsis of the first movie and made a sequel to that rather than the actual film.
The weird thing is, it was the exact same writer.

It's like he had a ton of cool ideas but couldn't decide on which to focus on so he was like 'screw it I'll use them all'.
 

Carn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,961
The Netherlands
The weird thing is, it was the exact same writer.

It's like he had a ton of cool ideas but couldn't decide on which to focus on so he was like 'screw it I'll use them all'.

well, its not just that. I remember reading an article about the first movie, where del Toro and Villeneuve changed a lot in a certain scene to make Alejandro a more mysterious person (I believe it was a scene where he would explain his history to Emily Blunt's character); basically cutting down on most of the lines. That's something that happens during filming, when a director and the actors look at a scene and are open, able and willing to change it up a bit to make it a bit more interesting. This is also dependent on time and budget available, and the amount of 'power' the director has to change things up. It could just very well be that for Soldado, they just filmed the script "as is", which gave us a decent but kinda silly (compared to the first one) end result.
 

cj_iwakura

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,195
Coral Springs, FL
well, its not just that. I remember reading an article about the first movie, where del Toro and Villeneuve changed a lot in a certain scene to make Alejandro a more mysterious person (I believe it was a scene where he would explain his history to Emily Blunt's character); basically cutting down on most of the lines. That's something that happens during filming, when a director and the actors look at a scene and are open, able and willing to change it up a bit to make it a bit more interesting. This is also dependent on time and budget available, and the amount of 'power' the director has to change things up. It could just very well be that for Soldado, they just filmed the script "as is", which gave us a decent but kinda silly (compared to the first one) end result.

Guessing the writer had full creative control without Villeneuve.

I liked the sequel, and it's definitely got more thought behind the plot than I expected, it's just unfocused.
 

Donos

Member
Nov 15, 2017
6,539
Enjoyable but way below the first one. Brolin is hardly the good guy and i didn't root for him but his character has charisma.

Alejandro was punished snake and a mothaF who has seen shit, so it's hard to not root for him although he eats kids for dinner. Feel that they missed to flesh him out more though since Part 2 was supposed to be about him. A few flashbacks to his attorney life maybe.
 
Jul 18, 2018
5,884
Just watched this last night...
The opening with illegal border crossing - meh
The second part of opening in Kansas? At grocery place... now that sent chills like the first movie. I was thinking the movie would have that surreal tone throughout but no. Like other members said they opted for a more action orientated movie this time around, lots of mindless killing throughout which i felt took away any emotional weight you had on anyone.
The cinematography thought is still great, and the acting is good still.

But man that grocery scene, i really want this series to go back to that feeling of helpless, ominous type of scenes.
 

Nappuccino

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
13,064
Guessing the writer had full creative control without Villeneuve.

I liked the sequel, and it's definitely got more thought behind the plot than I expected, it's just unfocused.
From what I remember reading, the new director reworked a lot of the last act. So it's not really his unfiltered vision here, either.
 

TheWraith

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,058
Finally saw this, absolutely loved it. Story went in an unexpected direction and the characters were as interesting as in the first movie. Don't get some of the complaints here.
 

Whompa

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
4,254
was it super dope or lit fam swag or simply epic? The first one was fantastic but I dunno...something tells me the follow up isn't nearly as good