CloseTalker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
34,301
I'd like to think she's been trying to redefine the role of a popstar with her actions lately, just not sure if the fans are ready for it.
I think based on everything going on right now and how tense everyone is, some people (not necessarily anyone here) might say maybe wait a month and a half until after the election to redefine the role of a pop star. Once Trump is defeated, go to town.
 

jman1954goat

Linked the Fire
Member
May 9, 2020
13,335
Fair enough, I can see your point and you're right. It doesn't mean 100% agreement; I went too far. But it is something that very strongly associates you with somebody and what they do. Roan expressed something similar herself: "revealing that she would vote for Harris but wouldn't "put my entire name and my entire project behind one" candidate." With something as serious as genocide, it's easy to see how that's a bridge too far.
Yep agreed that Roan's stance is completely understandable. I too am disgusting by The Israel army's actions and American Support for that regime so I understand.


I meant what I said about really liking both of your earlier posts in this thread. It was just that one point about the definition of a Endorsement I wanted to push back a little on.

I Would Even go as far as to Say I Endorse your Posts 😂
 

M.Bluth

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,671
Yeah, this is probably true. She's not saying anything inherently unreasonable (quite the opposite), but her phrasing and word choices are clearly leaving room for misinterpretation. Which for subjects like this, can really matter.
What people must understand is that if people want to misinterpret and misrepresent your views, it doesn't matter how clear you are.

Here and on social media, countless people have argued very clearly, very elequently, why Biden (and now Harris) would still be preferable to Trump despite the fact that they're inadequate on so many domestic issues, and their foreign policy not only amoral, but also catastrophic for everyone involved.

And rather than take in the point made, the respons is invariably one of the following: "OH SO YOU'LL VOTE FOR TRUMP?!!" "OH SO YOU WONT VOTE?!!" "OH BUT TRUMP IS GONNA BE WORSE!!" "OH YOU'RE A SINGLE ISSUE VOTER GET FUCKED"
 

yogurt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,548
The solution here is for everyone involved to spend less time online.

Chappell should spend less time online.

People in obsessive parasocial relationships with her should spend less time online.

People scrutinizing her every utterance about politics and cross-examining how "both sidezzz" it is should spend less time online.

People who think dem party loyalists are organizing targeted attacks (lol) should spend less time online.

Take some space.
 

Royalan

Not actually the youngest mod — AP Fact Check
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
14,641
I want to be absolutely clear: I'm a huge fan of Chappell, I've said so on this board a few times. I love her music, I love her vibe. I love what she stands for. I'm also not on Twitter, and I'm barely on TikTok, so I didn't hear about this controversy until it hit my Threads feed, which means it's being talked about by a lot of older, mostly queer, mostly Black and PoC folks. So I got a general gist of what she was being dragged for before I actually listened to what she said…

And I can see why she's being criticized.

Because I have to tell you: "actually…have you all considered that maybe both sides are bad actually?" Is not a nuanced take. It's not a brave take. It's certainly not a radical take. It's not a leftist take, and it's not an interesting take. It's literally the political "noncommittal" lacking specifics comment MOST people default to. Y'all know "centrists"? That pocket of middle-of-the-road voters who flummox both the right and the left and are practically hated here? Speaking to those voters you would hear, almost word for word, what Chappell has said. To the degree that, if you took Chappell Roan''s name out of it, and had me read a transcript of her comments and tell you what I thought, I would just shrug and say, "This just sounds like someone who doesn't really want to talk about politics."

And that's valid! Chappell's position is common because by definition she's not alone in feeling this way. And that is ok. But that's also why people defending her by saying she's just being attacked because she didn't fall in line and endorse Kamala aren't making a whole lot of sense. Let me be clear again: I don't doubt that's happening. But she's also getting criticized by a lot of a) queer people, b) PoC, and c) people who honestly don't care if she endorses Kamala or not because they thought "Chappell Roan" was a landmark in Italy until a week ago. And it's because she's so branded herself (or allowed her fans to brand her) as such a radical, a leftist, and someone who thinks about these things…and she's so branded herself in the aesthetic of "drag" (you know, that famously apolitical artform)…that from where I sit, I think an environment was created where people were expecting more than the political equivalent of cold oatmeal. Fair or not.

Because it is absolutely possible, really easy even, to shit on Democrats, withhold your endorsement, hold them to task, talk about the actual nuances of how they've come up short and/or outright failed, without sanding down the very really and very present danger of the right. People do it every day. It's very easy to flame the shit out of Democrats without feeling the need to say, "pfft! OF COURSE we know Trump is bad!" Because, looking at how white women as a group have voted in the last TWO elections….jury is still out on that, just how much people "know."

So I'm not on board flaming this girl, but I'm not going to pretend like what she said was some perfectly logical take and any criticism of her is disingenuous. And you know what? I can say everything I just said about Chappell Roan, and still enjoy her music, still root for her as an artist, and still like HER. I can give her grace, because at the end of the day it reads to me like she just doesn't talk about this stuff much or really wants to (or maybe she does and just needs to get better at it, who knows).

And I think maybe some of the people who are rushing to defend her and position her as the next great radical queen need to also consider the pressure they're putting on her.
 

Zimmiwood

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,331
Chappell Roan is a real one. I hope she's able to get herself back into shape and wish her the absolute best.

People clearly didnt know who she was and what she has consistently stood for, it was legit weird seeing takes about her being a straight cis white woman profitting off queer culture as if she isn't a whole lesbian herself. Someone also brought up how she's been raising money for Palestine and been very vocally supportive. I get how her first statements read clumsy to those not familiar with her but a lot of the online reaction was also completely ridiculous.

I have to wonder if the republican nominee was someone like Mitt Romney if she'd be seeing as much backlash as she has now. I don't doubt a lot of this fervent reaction stems from the real fear of a second Trump term but man we gotta be better than this.
 
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krazen

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,100
Gentrified Brooklyn
Also, tbh the political discourse in the post kind of showcases the point; we give each other some grace for political takes and look at the arguing in the post, imagine you have thousands of people arguing for and against your points for good and bad reasons, and effectively have to a small company that is now Chappell Roan show (dancers, music techs etc) where fucking up a statement might take food out of their plates too
 

Book One

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,991
The solution here is for everyone involved to spend less time online.

Chappell should spend less time online.

People in obsessive parasocial relationships with her should spend less time online.

People scrutinizing her every utterance about politics and cross-examining how "both sidezzz" it is should spend less time online.

People who think dem party loyalists are organizing targeted attacks (lol) should spend less time online.

Take some space.

Yup yup.
 

baby meowsers

Member
Feb 27, 2024
121
Oh wow so she managed to "both sides" trans rights (!?!?!) in this galaxy brain take but then goes on to mispronounce Kamala's name? Almost feels like a dog whistle to me. Extreme side eye intensifies.

Chappell Roan Is 'Voting for F---ing Kamala,' but Not Happy About It (variety.com)
"So yeah, I'm voting for fucking Kamala" — mispronouncing Harris' first name in the same way that Trump does

As a trans woman who is squarely in the crosshairs in a potential future Trump administration, Roan can fuck right off with this. I am with her on Palestine but babe you have all the nuance of a fucking boomer with both sides mess. Have fun centering your career around drag queens and drag culture while not actually putting your ass on the line for them when it matters the most.
 

Fart Master

Prophet of Truth
The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
10,409
A dumpster
She cares about LGBTQ rights which the Democrats vow to support, so why did she try to paint Kamala as bad as Trump? Yes, we shouldn't deny that her silence on Palestine is maddening, but to both sides the Dems is crazy, no?
I think it's fair to not want to support a candidate complicit with genocide.

It's admirable how's she sticking to her guns but she needs to chill out with social media.
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
74,105
Fuck if I ever became famous I'd stay until I had enough money to fuck off and relax forever

Many of y'all are fucking mad

If she endorsed she'd get brutalized for supporting genocide

But since she only said she's voting for her she gets brutalized for not endorsing

Kinda hope she's got enough banked to just go home and chill forever if she so desired

Not worth it

Too much misery rage addicts in this world
 

Axe

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,057
United Kingdom
I've been concerned about Chappell, so I'm glad she's taking a break to look after herself. She clearly has not been adjusting to fame very well at all.

For the sake of her image and her sanity, she should stay offline for awhile. She seems to throw herself into everything, and has not been doing herself any favours there.
 

Nerokis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,948
I think the "she's not being nuanced, she's just being equivocal"-esque criticisms in this thread are missing the point a little bit. I don't think anyone believes that Roan has been articulating deep, complex, multilayered political takes. I don't think she's even tried to do that. But in the same token, part of what makes the backlash to her so goofy is that some folks seem allergic to any amount of nuance if it isn't coupled with an explicit endorsement of Kamala.

In this case, Roan's apprehension to using her platform to endorse a candidate (or party) is coming from an eminently understandable place. It's pretty funny to me seeing people call her out as spouting basic both sides sentiment when they themselves aren't doing any work to reconcile the concepts of knowing one party is better than another and yet not believing the best use of your platform is to glorify that lesser evil that's still involved in terrible things.

The idea of blue no matter who comes from an understandable place, too, but there's absolutely no need for that sentiment to crowd out all political rhetoric that doesn't ultimately collapse to an endorsement of the blue candidate. We absolutely need space to bemoan the options we have and to just be deeply angry at the people in power who are actively accommodating horrific acts.
 

M.Bluth

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,671
Fuck if I ever became famous I'd stay until I had enough money to fuck off and relax forever

Many of y'all are fucking mad

If she endorsed she'd get brutalized for supporting genocide

But since she only said she's voting for her she gets brutalized for not endorsing
There are many online who think they're doing something worthwhile when they do that... But in truth, they're preemptively bullying the people they decided will blame for a Harris loss.
 

Fiction

Fanthropologist
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,249
Elf Tower, New Mexico
Really really weird that this popular female singer is getting so much shit for having a nuanced take on things that matter to her personally and other mega stars are not.
 

Lilly-Anne

Member
Feb 14, 2024
940
Oh wow so she managed to "both sides" trans rights (!?!?!) in this galaxy brain take but then goes on to mispronounce Kamala's name? Almost feels like a dog whistle to me. Extreme side eye intensifies.

Chappell Roan Is 'Voting for F---ing Kamala,' but Not Happy About It (variety.com)


As a trans woman who is squarely in the crosshairs in a potential future Trump administration, Roan can fuck right off with this. I am with her on Palestine but babe you have all the nuance of a fucking boomer with both sides mess. Have fun centering your career around drag queens and drag culture while not actually putting your ass on the line for them when it matters the most.
She is the most vocal artist in the entire world about trans rights and consistently donates proceeds of her shows to several charities including For The Gworls. This purity testing is absolutely ridiculous. Especially considering the absolute pathetic showing at the DNC convention, where transgender people were completely ignored.
 

baby meowsers

Member
Feb 27, 2024
121
idk why it's so hard to say "Biden and Trump are both bad on Palestine. I hope Kamala (while not mispronouncing her name) does better than Biden on this." I think most people don't have an issue with her being critical around I/P. It's this boneheaded boomer-style both sidesing around trans policy that has me personally disgusted. I also think it's silly to demand an endorsement from anyone.
 

Flame Lord

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,085
There are a lot of people who take their vote way to seriously, and most of them ironically don't vote. All she had to say was vote for Kamala, but instead she had to say "you know they're both pretty bad, but vote for Kamala, even though she's not much better either, but still." It's just muddling the whole message for no reason.
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
22,569
Oh wow so she managed to "both sides" trans rights (!?!?!) in this galaxy brain take but then goes on to mispronounce Kamala's name? Almost feels like a dog whistle to me. Extreme side eye intensifies.
People trying to make out like accidentally mispronouncing Kamala's name is some egregious right-wing dogwhistle is the type of liberal nonsense that makes folks not take y'all seriously.
 

Bluelote

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,061
the policy of Kamala on Palestine is not a minor thing for her, so she is right not endorse the candidate behind it,
and she didn't fail to recognize that Trump is not a better option and even declared her vote for Kamala
people are really overreacting,

people saying the way she said Kamala is a dog whistle, come on, stop it, that's how you get 4 more years of Trump.
some here are the champions of taking shots at potential allies because they are not 100% the same as you at some point huh?
 

nonoriri

Member
Apr 30, 2020
4,618
Were those same people criticizing Chappell Roan?
It doesn't matter. It is not about those people being uniquely hypocritical but about how society tends be to more critical of young women than men. Her statements, while imperfect, aren't really that egregious but it's a great outrage machine for the media even though people like Carrey have much more harmful views over all.
Come on.

A dog whistle for what, exactly?
Half the people I know who are excited to vote for Kamala constantly mispronounce her name. Hell, I've seen people mispronounce 'Walz' and he's been our governor for six years... This is just really transparent outrage engineering by Variety. Weren't they the ones pushing a lot of the negative narratives around Jonathan Glazer after the Oscars?

Edit: Yeah it was Variety. lol. LMAO even.
 

Schw7abe

Member
Oct 28, 2017
56
And rather than take in the point made, the respons is invariably one of the following: "OH SO YOU'LL VOTE FOR TRUMP?!!" "OH SO YOU WONT VOTE?!!" "OH BUT TRUMP IS GONNA BE WORSE!!" "OH YOU'RE A SINGLE ISSUE VOTER GET FUCKED"

I always find this so odd when it comes up when discussing Kamela with someone (not you). Because yes, genocide is at the top of the list but there's also no longer supporting Medicare for all, and no longer supporting environmental issues, not advocating for basic human rights... Ya know things I really care about.
 

ElephantShell

10,000,000
Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,787
This whole freaking out about not endorsing Harris is so dumb. It's not the responsibility of every celebrity to tell you who to vote for. I can't blame anybody for having misgivings about the current Democratic Party. It's easy to begrudgingly cast a vote for a party you don't believe in to avoid the alternative, lots of people do that. Chappell Roan is going to do that. But you can't expect somebody to half heartedly publicly endorse a candidate and party they don't even really like.

Besides Harris already got the ultimate pop star endorsement in Taylor and the population of uninformed teenagers and young adults affected by a Taylor endorsement is probably pretty close to the same as the population affected by a Chappell Roan endorsement so what does it even matter.
 

baby meowsers

Member
Feb 27, 2024
121
People trying to make out like accidentally mispronouncing Kamala's name is some egregious right-wing dogwhistle is the type of liberal nonsense that makes folks not take y'all seriously.
I'm going to defer to the experts on this one.

Singling out Harris' first name is a way to "other" her, said Myles Durkee, a professor of psychology at the University of Michigan.

"When you intentionally mispronounce someone's name who's less traditional in the American context, it's almost a dog whistle to othering that person, trying to suggest they're less American, that they're less worthy of you saying their name correctly in the first place," he said.

Durkee said probably a lot of people in the U.S. who hadn't heard the name Kamala before might inadvertently pronounce it "ka-MALA" instead of "COMMA-la."

But Trump repeatedly saying Kamala wrong is a different story. Durkee called it a microaggression and noted it's something conservatives did with former President Barack Obama's name too.
How to pronounce 'Kamala' — and why it matters : NPR
 
This whole freaking out about not endorsing Harris is so dumb. It's not the responsibility of every celebrity to tell you who to vote for. I can't blame anybody for having misgivings about the current Democratic Party. It's easy to begrudgingly cast a vote for a party you don't believe in to avoid the alternative, lots of people do that. Chappell Roan is going to do that. But you can't expect somebody to half heartedly publicly endorse a candidate and party they don't even really like.

Besides Harris already got the ultimate pop star endorsement in Taylor and the population of uninformed teenagers and young adults affected by a Taylor endorsement is probably pretty close to the same as the population affected by a Chappell Roan endorsement so what does it even matter.
That's what's also getting me. Kamala just got endorsed by one of the biggest musicians on the planet... why even bother getting this upset about Chapell's non-endorsement. Kamala doesn't need anybody to be her attack dog. Especially over an opinion that isn't even wrong. The Biden admin has been factually horrendous regarding the genocide of the Palestinians. And now it's looking like things about to escalate into a war in that region because America refuses to actually hold Israel accountable for anything it has done.
 

LumberPanda

Member
Feb 3, 2019
7,003
Democrats active in commiting genocide? I sleep

Accidentally use the wrong, yet common, pronunciation of a name? Real shit
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
22,569
Even in the experts that you quoted, they say that deliberately mispronouncing someone's name is a dogwhistle, and that a lot of Americans who hadn't heard the name before or often might default to the wrong mispronunciation "inadvertantly."

This is the very reason that I specified "accidentally." Even her own fucking stans get it wrong sometimes.

So I repeat, trying to make out like this is a surefire alt-right dogwhistle is clown behavior, the kind of thing that makes it obvious when liberals are not actually serious about the consequences of racial profiling and othering. Like, I wish some of y'all had this level of scrutiny for the criminal justice system. Focus on that.
 

baby meowsers

Member
Feb 27, 2024
121
Even in the experts that you quoted, they say that deliberately mispronouncing someone's name is a dogwhistle, and that a lot of Americans who hadn't heard the name before or often might default to the wrong mispronunciation "inadvertantly."

This is the very reason that I specified "accidentally." Even her own fucking stans get it wrong sometimes.

So I repeat, trying to make out like this is a surefire alt-right dogwhistle is clown behavior, the kind of thing that makes it obvious when liberals are not actually serious about the consequences of racial profiling and othering. Like, I wish some of y'all had this level of scrutiny for the criminal justice system. Focus on that.
Babe, Harris is not some obscure, unknown figure who's name has never been said. Like there's been a whole public conversation around the minimal effort required to not get her name wrong. "accidentally" sure.

Talk about clown behavior.
 

LumberPanda

Member
Feb 3, 2019
7,003
There are a lot of people who take their vote way to seriously, and most of them ironically don't vote. All she had to say was vote for Kamala, but instead she had to say "you know they're both pretty bad, but vote for Kamala, even though she's not much better either, but still." It's just muddling the whole message for no reason.
fr all she had to do was not mention the ongoing genocide smh
 

Lilly-Anne

Member
Feb 14, 2024
940
Babe, Harris is not some obscure, unknown figure who's name has never been said. Like there's been a whole public conversation around the minimal effort required to not get her name wrong. "accidentally" sure.

Talk about clown behavior.
I'm sorry to be one telling you this, but there will millions upon millions of people in election day that will happily vote for Kamala with enthusiasm that won't know how to pronounce her name correctly.
 

Funkelpop

Member
Sep 2, 2022
6,142
People should stop clamoring for celebs to endorse politicians. She was more than right to not want to endorse anyone.
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
22,569
Babe, Harris is not some obscure, unknown figure who's name has never been said. Like there's been a whole public conversation around the minimal effort required to not get her name wrong. "accidentally" sure.

Talk about clown behavior.
First of all, don't call me Babe. I don't know you like that.

Second, being a public figure is not some scientific barrier from people mispronouncing your name on accident. Same with having "public conversations" (where in the public did these conversations take place, exactly? Was every American present?)

Again, her own stans- people who are extremely excited for her and will do the same browbeating towards depressed Arabs-Americans as the next Democrat right now- will sometimes mispronounce her name on accident online and on television still. It happens.

What is important is to engage with the context around that mispronunciation to determine if you're dealing with ignorance or maliciousness, especially if you're dealing with a minority where the name "Kamala" truly is pronounced differently within their culture (because we believe in intersectionality, do we not?) But trying to weaponize this as a wholesale dog whistle in every instance, especially to reroute criticism away from Kamala's electoral history and platform, is pure deflective liberalism. It's a pure outrage tactic and, at the very least, it's not going to work on me.

So yes, what you're engaging in is clown behavior. This is the equivalent of wearing a dashiki and kneeling in the wake of George Floyd's murder. Utterly useless posturing.
 

GuessMyUserName

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
5,338
Toronto
Nothing makes my blood boil like all the liberals playing shocked-ass Pikachu face at her accurately calling out the transphobia among liberals.

These people love to take credit from actual activists speaking up on us to label themselves allies without doing a god damn thing, and use that credit to attack people out here actually voicing our concerns.

I'm someone who always advocates voting for harm reduction, which yes, means voting Kamala Harris - but Democrats are fucking running away from trans people and they absolutely do not get to lord their phony support over us.
 

nonoriri

Member
Apr 30, 2020
4,618
Babe, Harris is not some obscure, unknown figure who's name has never been said. Like there's been a whole public conversation around the minimal effort required to not get her name wrong. "accidentally" sure.

Talk about clown behavior.
I'd be interested in hearing your explanation for how many people say they're so excited to vote for "Tim Waltz".

Anyway, once again, Variety is a magazine that misrepresented Jonathan Glazer's statement on Palestine and never bothered to correct doing so and continued to peddle outrage against him. They're not a neutral party when it comes to people criticizing the genocide in Gaza.
 

Like the hat?

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,892
watching her tiktok comments she makes her viewpoint abundantly clear. she doesn't owe anyone her endorsement and she has real qualms with Kamala's positions and the positions of democrats as a whole, yet she still says very clearly that Kamala is getting her vote because it's the better choice between the two. I think a ton of people on the left are on the same page as her honestly.
 

baby meowsers

Member
Feb 27, 2024
121
First of all, don't call me Babe. I don't know you like that.

Second, being a public figure is not some scientific barrier from people mispronouncing your name on accident. Same with having "public conversations" (where in the public did these conversations take place, exactly? Was every American present?)

Again, her own stans- people who are extremely excited for her and will do the same browbeating towards depressed Arabs-Americans as the next Democrat right now- will sometimes mispronounce her name on accident online and on television still. It happens.

What is important is to engage with the context around that mispronunciation to determine if you're dealing with ignorance or maliciousness, especially if you're dealing with a minority where the name "Kamala" truly is pronounced differently within their culture (because we believe in intersectionality, do we not?) But trying to weaponize this as a wholesale dog whistle in every instance, especially to reroute criticism away from Kamala's electoral history and platform, is pure deflective liberalism. It's a pure outrage tactic and, at the very least, it's not going to work on me.

So yes, what you're engaging in is clown behavior. This is the equivalent of wearing a dashiki and kneeling in the wake of George Floyd's murder. Utterly useless posturing.
I call everyone babe. You have also generalized me and you don't know me like that.

Roan did not slip up in some out of context talking that some fan captured in passing. She recorded and released a video HERSELF knowing full well the level of eyeballs on her and on this moment in particular. Wild the way some trip over themselves to defend what's truly some sus behavior.

As I said before, I have no issues with her not being that into Harris and being very critical of the Dems around I/P. I don't need her to endorse her or care if she does. As a trans woman I take very serious issue with her both sidesing trans issues and side eye her statement in her TikTok.

I could really do without the personal insults btw and the insane comparison to that gross, performative Floyd moment. And the feeling couldn't be more mutual about "clown behavior."
 

RMChoodie

Member
Dec 27, 2021
1,982
American in Costa Rica
I really enjoy her music and her stance on no I'm not an overnight sensation.
She was 17 when she first signed to a major label
She got dropped in 2020 I didn't make them money her words they didn't care
Moved back home worked at a drive thru then did what do few can understand I'm going to give it a year I'm moving back to LA if nothing happens cool but she wrote and worked her ass off.
She deserves tremendous respect for doing that.
I appreciate she is upfront about wanting to be an actress first so she's playing an character
Madonna/Gaga/Halsey all have shown you take the time to separate from your character especially if you are bipolar she has great mentors in her corner like Elton John who adores her.
She's under pressure to have another album of songs and still grow with live shows throw in social commentary and you can see why she needs a break to focus on being her best self.
 

ZeoVGM

Member
Oct 25, 2017
79,774
Providence, RI
Babe, Harris is not some obscure, unknown figure who's name has never been said. Like there's been a whole public conversation around the minimal effort required to not get her name wrong. "accidentally" sure.

Talk about clown behavior.

LIterally millions of people are going to vote for Harris on Election Day who also mispronounce her name. The majority of Americans have no idea about the "public conversation" you're referring to.

You also never answered my question: what was her mispronunciation a "dog whistle" for exactly? Is Chappell secretly a Republican? A racist? What were you implying, because "dog whistle" means something very specific.
 

GuessMyUserName

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
5,338
Toronto
As a trans woman I take very serious issue with her both sidesing trans issues and side eye her statement in her TikTok.
As a trans woman I *strongly* disagree with this statement. She did not both sides trans issues, she merely pointed out the very accurate fact that Democrats are courting transphobes intentionally by hiding away from us and we absolutely not just deserve but NEED better than this.

I will forever be holding Dems feet to the fire over this because I do not want them to become the Labour party - who the Kamala team is reportedly taking cues from, which have made a running start now that they're in power rolling back on trans rights and legislating against our rights.

I am fully grateful for Chappell Roan addressing this because right now liberals are abandoning us.
 
Dec 9, 2018
25,362
New Jersey
Nothing makes my blood boil like all the liberals playing shocked-ass Pikachu face at her accurately calling out the transphobia among liberals.

These people love to take credit from actual activists speaking up on us to label themselves allies without doing a god damn thing, and use that credit to attack people out here actually voicing our concerns.

I'm someone who always advocates voting for harm reduction, which yes, means voting Kamala Harris - but Democrats are fucking running away from trans people and they absolutely do not get to lord their phony support over us.
There was not even a trans speaker at this year's DNC, which hasn't happened since 2012, if I'm recalling that correctly. There has also been a noticeable de-emphasis on trans rights within the latest DNC platform as well (among other things like not saying anything about the death penalty and withdrawing from the anti-interventionist foreign policy). That's not to say they're the same as Republicans, of course, who've embraced the genocidal platform of expunging trans people entirely. However, there is legitimate concern within some trans rights activists that the Democratic party is starting to distance themselves from the community, and I think that's a conversation worth having.

Now, having said all that, I don't think Chappell was very articulate in her frustrations with the democratic party, and I think she just doesn't want to be engulfed in politics anyway, so it's probably for the best tbh. She's not the most informed, but her emotions are valid. That's pretty much my take on it. A lot of young people are feeling the same way and feel somewhat politically isolated with both parties not serving their interests, hence why their turnout in elections have been much lower than older generations.
 

Lordfifth

Member
Jul 31, 2022
1,440
wait a month and a half until after the election to redefine the role of a pop star
As a trans woman I *strongly* disagree with this statement. She did not both sides trans issues, she merely pointed out the very accurate fact that Democrats are courting transphobes intentionally by hiding away from us and we absolutely not just deserve but NEED better than this.

I will forever be holding Dems feet to the fire over this because I do not want them to become the Labour party - who the Kamala team is reportedly taking cues from, which have made a running start now that they're in power rolling back on trans rights and legislating against our rights.

I am fully grateful for Chappell Roan addressing this because right now liberals are abandoning us.
What people don't understand or rather pretend to not understand, is that once you vote someone in, you lose control over thier actions ,especially when they didn't make any public promises to do what you want them to do, and liberals try thier hardest to stop anybody from extracting somewhat progressive promises like: please don't support a genocide.

what will happen is this, if kamala wins she won't do anything she wasn't pressured to do or didn't say she will do, liberal will dissappear to their holes and pretend they didn't gaslight everyone to wait untill after the election, the next election comes around, the liberals start repeating the same old song and dance, using the same lesser of two evils rhetoric and every issue you bring up to try to pressure the nominee will be brushed aside, as "helping the enemy".

liberals don't have any beliefs over any morals so they will take up any stances the democrat part has, and they will keep playing the lesser of two evil card.


What these dumb as rock liberals don't get, you need obama to be the nominee to get away with this more than once.
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
22,569
I call everyone babe.
I am not everyone.

Roan did not slip up in some out of context talking that some fan captured in passing. She recorded and released a video HERSELF knowing full well the level of eyeballs on her and on this moment in particular.
Why do you think filming a prepared statement is also an objective barrier from mispronouncing something? This level of analysis is lacking.

As a trans woman I take very serious issue with her both sidesing trans issues and side eye her statement in her TikTok.
As a Black person I take very serious issue with non-Black people trying to weaponize the idea of racial othering as a way to deflect from the main arguments at hand while also likely doing absolutely nothing towards furthering the complete autonomy of Africans and their diasporas from Western colonialism in a display of gross, performative liberalism.

I could really do without the personal insults btw and the insane comparison to that gross, performative Floyd moment.
I could do without you trying to be offended on behalf of a Black woman over an argument that even the experts you quoted at me said you're wrong about.