SuperPac

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,371
Seattle, WA
I've no idea what you're talking about with the alliance stuff. The flags are coloured the same and the allied ships appear on the map. And why would I settle for taking 50% of the rewards when I can turn traitor and take 100%?

Yep. In fact I was in a brigantine crew on Friday night where we did just that - after the last skellie ship went down and the galleon crew we were allied with had hopped into the sea we fired on their ship. Yada yada yada we ended up sinking them and taking all but 2 of the captain skulls and getting that 100% value. The incentive to break is that you want 100% and it just depends if you're that player or not or how confident you are in your PVP. It's a loose framework on top of the sort of unofficial alliances that were happening before. I think if you had too much information - like allied players' names were a different color - that would remove the possibility you could turn traitor in a larger group of allied sailors and really start some crazy fighting (who's shooting? are they on our team? what's happening? etc).
 

X1 Two

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
3,023
Had loads of fun for the first two days. But now it's just the same toxic community again. Either I don't find other crews fighting because they have the commendations done (I do, too, but I'd like to fight them anyway) or they straight up shoot at my ship or they betray alliances the moment they have the loot. There's not even a downside to staying in an alliance, they don't lose out on anything, instead they earn everything I cash in as well. But nope, gotta be an ass because that's what being a pirate apparently means. Next week on Tuesday and Wednesday everybody will play together again to get the new commendations before they start being selfish again.
 

X1 Two

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
3,023
The only thing I agree with what you posted is that it's still difficult to find a group of players and get into a game together.

I've no idea what you're talking about with the alliance stuff. The flags are coloured the same and the allied ships appear on the map. And why would I settle for taking 50% of the rewards when I can turn traitor and take 100%?

But that's the thing, you do get 100 % if you have it on your boat. The other crew gets another 50 % for free, it's not taken out of your pocket.
 

Johnohno

Hero of Bowerstone
Member
Nov 6, 2017
207
But that's the thing, you do get 100 % if you have it on your boat. The other crew gets another 50 % for free, it's not taken out of your pocket.

Yeah if it's on my boat then fair enough, they can have the 50%. If it's on their boat though then I'll look at how many planks / cannonballs both ships have and judge whether or not to break the alliance from there.

For example I was playing with a sloop yesterday who didn't really do much in the fight but just collected the treasure constantly leaving my ship to do all the work. At the end of the fight I swam over to their ship to check the loot, noticed they had no planks left and told my crew to open fire. 100% for us :D

Edit: I should say we did let them keep the 50% though. We didn't break the alliance when cashing in.
 

SuperPac

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,371
Seattle, WA
Had loads of fun for the first two days. But now it's just the same toxic community again. Either I don't find other crews fighting because they have the commendations done (I do, too, but I'd like to fight them anyway) or they straight up shoot at my ship or they betray alliances the moment they have the loot. There's not even a downside to staying in an alliance, they don't lose out on anything, instead they earn everything I cash in as well. But nope, gotta be an ass because that's what being a pirate apparently means. Next week on Tuesday and Wednesday everybody will play together again to get the new commendations before they start being selfish again.

They only get 50% of what you turn in. The crew that turns in gets 100%, everyone else in the alliance gets 50% of the value/xp. And yeah, you still have to be ready for anything to happen, just as before. I allied with crews to do forts before this alliance system was in place and it was similarly uneasy and there was no official loot sharing in those instances. Sometimes you meet pirates who will honor the alliance and share fairly and sometimes you meet others that don't want to. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

X1 Two

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
3,023
Yeah if it's on my boat then fair enough, they can have the 50%. If it's on their boat though then I'll look at how many planks / cannonballs both ships have and judge whether or not to break the alliance from there.

For example I was playing with a sloop yesterday who didn't really do much in the fight but just collected the treasure constantly leaving my ship to do all the work. At the end of the fight I swam over to their ship to check the loot, noticed they had no planks left and told my crew to open fire. 100% for us :D

I just settle for 75 %. Let them go to an outpost, then go on their ship and take skeleton skulls. Have never had a comment besides "fair enough, they deserve it".
 

Rodelero

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,068
Sure

https://www.resetera.com/search/1912608

There you are, in every thread that have the words SEA and THIEVES, bickering with anyone daring to enjoy anything about the game
And it goes waaaaay back. Way back.

That link doesn't work for me, but whatever. I stand by the things I have said about Sea of Thieves. I was one of the very few people on this forum who accurately statedwhat the full game would comprise and how it would be received, while the majority allowed themselves to be overhyped and mislead. You can go back and read through the arguments if you want, and while you can perhaps criticise me for going round in circles arguing with people, I was proven right pretty much every time. When people were getting excited about a data mine, I was one of the first to point out the dangers of interpreting files found in a data-mine as things that would actually be in the game.

The following details were widely shared on this forum as things that were going to be included at launch (only after my interjections did some stop being so bullish):
  • More enemy types / more variations for skeletons and possibly evil mermaids as enemies
  • More islands
  • Harpoon guns (on ships?)
  • Complete ship customization
  • More types of food: Coconuts, pineapples and pomegranates
  • New game mechanic - Potions: probably curing, poisoning and resurrecting etc.
  • More Weapons: boarding axes, heavy sword, rapier etc.
  • More music instruments (Banjo etc.)
  • Skeleton parrots
  • Possible wieldable bread, fishmeat, sharkmeat, scrubbrush, mango and dic
I can't help but resent the fact that I am singled out for combating nonsense with facts and for combating hype with reason in the months leading up to launch.

I will admit, I do have a contrarian streak. In topics that are generally more positive than I feel they ought to be, I have a tendency to be more critical (and the reverse is true too). In the case of Sea of Thieves, I do spend far more time talking about the things I dislike than the things I like and I can how people might get the impression that I hate the game, but I really, truly don't. I always criticise the games I care most about most heavily. I spent huge amounts of time criticising Call of Duty 4, my favourite shooter and most played game ever. I've written hundreds of thousands of words critiquing FIFA, a franchise I loved from when I was a kid. Nowadays I apply the same lens to the games I develop.

As I said, I don't hate Sea of Thieves by any means, but I do think there is a lot wrong with it and I do think it's a shame. If I hated Sea of Thieves I wouldn't spend any time talking about it. Here's what I wrote just after launch:

I think most people can see that Sea of Thieves, in certain respects, is a truly exceptional game. Its approach to vocal co-operation, to soft skills, to proximity chat and to simple, accessible, supremely non-gamey mechanics feels once in a generation. Had it all come together I'm fairly confident this game would be talked about in the same breath as Breath of the Wild... but it hasn't. It's not just that the game feels unfinished, it's that so many core features feel half-baked or desperately ill-conceived. It's a game of fantastic highs and depressing lows. As good as the sailing is, as on point as the theme is, as beautiful as the sea and skies can be, they aren't good enough for me to overlook the tedium of the progression system, the repetitiveness of the quest structure, or the crumminess of the combat.

[...]

I'm enjoying the game for now as are my crewmates, but I'm not sure how long it's going to last. If I was to review the game I'd probably give it a 6 or 7, by no means because everything in the game is mediocre, but because it mixes design and mechanics worthy of 9s and 10s with design and mechanics worthy of 2s and 3s.

My views on Sea of Thieves aren't outliers. They are just outliers within the subset of people that still care about the game.

I remember trying to argue with you before Sea of Thieves released and you already were complaining about how underwhelming it looked. Thankfully i realized it would be futile and it didnt last long.

The search system doesn't pick up any instances of either of us using eachother's name. Maybe you dreamed about arguing with me?

That's all i have to say on the subject before you use this as bait to ban me, though.

I am neither capable of banning of you nor do I want you to be banned.
 
OP
OP
Klobrille

Klobrille

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,361
Germany
The Cursed Sails update boosted the game to #19 of the Most Played Games on Xbox One.

Keep in mind PC players are not included in this.
 

Rodelero

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,068
The Cursed Sails update boosted the game to #19 of the Most Played Games on Xbox One.

Keep in mind PC players are not included in this.

Good result, up from 30th I believe. Even better in the UK, up to 15th. Key question going forward is whether it can stay above its previous low (30th in the US) in the lead up to Forsaken Shores.
 

Tappin Brews

#TeamThierry
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,064
I was talking to a friend about this. It'd be cool if you had a carrier pigeon or something on the ship you could send off with a message to everyone on the server. Risky as you can give away your position to people who want to steal your stuff, but useful as it notifies everyone that you're looking to do a group event.
i was thinking a flare gun. fired straight up it could be visible across the map. good for signaling for attention
 

MisterMangu

Banned
Feb 12, 2018
724
That link doesn't work for me, but whatever. I stand by the things I have said about Sea of Thieves. I was one of the very few people on this forum who accurately statedwhat the full game would comprise and how it would be received, while the majority allowed themselves to be overhyped and mislead. You can go back and read through the arguments if you want, and while you can perhaps criticise me for going round in circles arguing with people, I was proven right pretty much every time. When people were getting excited about a data mine, I was one of the first to point out the dangers of interpreting files found in a data-mine as things that would actually be in the game.

The following details were widely shared on this forum as things that were going to be included at launch (only after my interjections did some stop being so bullish):
  • More enemy types / more variations for skeletons and possibly evil mermaids as enemies
  • More islands
  • Harpoon guns (on ships?)
  • Complete ship customization
  • More types of food: Coconuts, pineapples and pomegranates
  • New game mechanic - Potions: probably curing, poisoning and resurrecting etc.
  • More Weapons: boarding axes, heavy sword, rapier etc.
  • More music instruments (Banjo etc.)
  • Skeleton parrots
  • Possible wieldable bread, fishmeat, sharkmeat, scrubbrush, mango and dic
I can't help but resent the fact that I am singled out for combating nonsense with facts and for combating hype with reason in the months leading up to launch.

I will admit, I do have a contrarian streak. In topics that are generally more positive than I feel they ought to be, I have a tendency to be more critical (and the reverse is true too). In the case of Sea of Thieves, I do spend far more time talking about the things I dislike than the things I like and I can how people might get the impression that I hate the game, but I really, truly don't. I always criticise the games I care most about most heavily. I spent huge amounts of time criticising Call of Duty 4, my favourite shooter and most played game ever. I've written hundreds of thousands of words critiquing FIFA, a franchise I loved from when I was a kid. Nowadays I apply the same lens to the games I develop.

As I said, I don't hate Sea of Thieves by any means, but I do think there is a lot wrong with it and I do think it's a shame. If I hated Sea of Thieves I wouldn't spend any time talking about it. Here's what I wrote just after launch:



My views on Sea of Thieves aren't outliers. They are just outliers within the subset of people that still care about the game.



The search system doesn't pick up any instances of either of us using eachother's name. Maybe you dreamed about arguing with me?



I am neither capable of banning of you nor do I want you to be banned.
I have to agree with everything said here.

The game had potential to be goty or gotg. Instead, it poorly implemented features and it's world is barren af. I've never seen such a barebones game before.
 

SuikerBrood

Member
Jan 21, 2018
15,523
The alliance system seems like a massive fucking cop out. I hadn't really read into the details until now but it's a change which clearly flies in the face of the game Rare were making just a few months ago. It's another move towards Sea of Farmers and away from Sea of Thieves. It's an extension of the already stupid way that gold is shared between crew members:

Solo player collect one chest, gets 100 gold (100)
Four players collect one chest, gets 100 gold each (400)
Eight players collect one chest, crew gets 100 gold each, members of allied crew gets 50 gold each (600)
Twenty four players collect one chest, crew gets 100 gold each, members of allied crew get 50 gold each (1400)

As someone that kinds of like playing solo... fuck all of this.



Or perhaps Edge is being reasonable and the other impressions are coming from those that 'just like to praise ;)'.

I'm glad they do it like this. Why the hell would you team op/play in teams if you wouldn't get any loot from it? Good call by Rare.
 

Rodelero

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,068
I'm glad they do it like this. Why the hell would you team op/play in teams if you wouldn't get any loot from it? Good call by Rare.

This is kind of a two part issue...

I have a major issue with the way gold is shared out on an intra-crew basis. It leads to a situation where smaller crews and solo players in particular gain gold/rep far, far slower than those playing in crews do. Now to be clear, I don't mind that the game is harder because I am playing on my own. I don't mind that I'm hugely vulnerable to crews out in the wild or that I have to take a ton of care doing all the things a major crew will do without much consideration. I mind that when I cash in a chest, my crew (i.e. me) receives a quarter of what a four person crew would. Ultimately, I play the game a lot less now because I feel like solo play doesn't respect my time at all.

As for the alliance system, I don't think the design is right at all. All I really wanted to see were the following things: To have an easy way to tell who was in the alliance and who wasn't (name colouring) and to have no damage between alliance members (accidental damage at skull forts is a massive pain in the ass).

Neither of these things have actually been implemented and instead Rare have just put in place an artificial incentive to being in an alliance, something which flies in the face of the design principles they stated in regards to cultivating natural interaction between players and crews. The thing I can't understand is why. Crews were already forming unofficial uneasy alliances in precisely the way Rare intended. It was those uneasy alliances which so often lead to the best stories of unlikely friendships or traumatising betrayals. Those kinds of things can still happen, of course, but the betrayals will be rarer because the incentive has been reduced and the friendships less special because it's being coerced.

Sea of Thieves most interesting moments were and are based on game theory. This kind of artificial manipulation makes the game theory less interesting and the game less interesting in turn.
 

Johnohno

Hero of Bowerstone
Member
Nov 6, 2017
207
I mind that when I cash in a chest, my crew (i.e. me) receives a quarter of what a four person crew would.

This makes absolutely no sense to me.

You receive exactly the same as that crew and gain experience at the exact same rate they do. Just because there's four of them doesn't mean they earn 4x as much, they each earn 1x exactly like you do. They have an easier ride of it, sure, but it's your choice to ride solo. You shouldn't be given special treatment to do so, otherwise let's just make everyone go solo and screw teamwork or the bigger ships.

I also think you're overplaying how difficult solo play is. Sure there's a bigger risk from other ships and order of souls voyages can be a pain but the rest is pretty much the same. You even have the added benefit of not having to rely on some mute randoms who constantly play instruments, turn the ship lights on and off or drop the anchor every 2 seconds ;)
 

SuikerBrood

Member
Jan 21, 2018
15,523
1. I think it's a good thing Rare pushes people towards 2,3 or 4 player ships (and alliances).
2. It would make no sense to me if I'd earn only 1/4th of the gold when I hand in a chest. That would make galleons very unattractive. And galleons make this game the nice experience it is in my opinion.

I think your post about experiences being created without alliances and with is interesting. Don't disagree that putting in more systems that push towards one kind of playing style destroys the core of the game where you make your own stories. But the way they've implemented alliances makes people choose between betraying or not.
 

Rodelero

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,068
This makes absolutely no sense to me.

You receive exactly the same as that crew and gain experience at the exact same rate they do.

No, I gain exactly the same as each member of that crew.

Just because there's four of them doesn't mean they earn 4x as much, they each earn 1x exactly like you do. They have an easier ride of it, sure, but it's your choice to ride solo.

Anyone that has played a significant amount alone and with a crew will attest that you gain gold/rep at a much higher rate (i.e. double, triple, maybe more).

You shouldn't be given special treatment to do so, otherwise let's just make everyone go solo and screw teamwork or the bigger ships.

That's the point though... the way gold is shared right now is special treatment which favours large crews. The way gold is now shared in alliances is further special treatment which favours large alliances. I don't really mind that it isn't logical (such that a solo player gets the full share and a crew of four would receive a quarter share each), but it should be at least relatively fair/balanced which, right now, it is not.

I also think you're overplaying how difficult solo play is. Sure there's a bigger risk from other ships and order of souls voyages can be a pain but the rest is pretty much the same. You even have the added benefit of not having to rely on some mute randoms who constantly play instruments, turn the ship lights on and off or drop the anchor every 2 seconds ;)

It's not entirely about difficulty, it's about efficiency.
 

Johnohno

Hero of Bowerstone
Member
Nov 6, 2017
207
It's not entirely about difficulty, it's about efficiency.

Which again is entirely by choice. You have the tools to be more efficient if you so wish.

If Rare did what I feel you're proposing, I.e. give solo players 4x the gold / rep, then I can 100% guarantee it'd be the death of the game.

Everybody would play as sloops. Everybody would be even bigger arseholes as the loot is theoretically worth more. Hell if I even played a Galleon I'd purposefully hunt down sloops to steal their treasure to stop them getting that 4x bonus.
 

Rodelero

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,068
1. I think it's a good thing Rare pushes people towards 2,3 or 4 player ships (and alliances).

I think the game pushes people towards co-operation anyway. I most enjoy Sea of Thieves when playing with friends and I had some great experiences, particularly pre-launch, playing with randomers. I can see why Rare wouldn't want to cultivate a situation where playing solo/in small groups was more efficient, but we're a million miles from that situation right now.

2. It would make no sense to me if I'd earn only 1/4th of the gold when I hand in a chest. That would make galleons very unattractive. And galleons make this game the nice experience it is in my opinion.

You're right, and I wouldn't actually suggest them making a change in that fashion. I would suggest that they give a bonus to gold/rep for smaller crews (something like 100% bonus for 1 player, 50% for 2, 25% for 3, 0% for 4).

I think your post about experiences being created without alliances and with is interesting. Don't disagree that putting in more systems that push towards one kind of playing style destroys the core of the game where you make your own stories. But the way they've implemented alliances makes people choose between betraying or not.

Imagine a situation where an alliance of two crews is going to split loot worth 10,000G. The natural way to do so is for one crew to take 5,000G worth and the other crew to take 5,000G worth. If they both cash in, each crew receives 7,500G. In the old scheme, the betrayer has 5,000G to gain and 5,000 to lose. In the new scheme, the betrayer has 2,500G to gain and 7,500 to lose. A 50% boost is extremely heavy handed.

If Rare did what I feel you're proposing, I.e. give solo players 4x the gold / rep, then I can 100% guarantee it'd be the death of the game.

I haven't proposed that at any time and, yes, such a heavy handed change would harm the game. At the same time, the status quo is a significant disincentive to me playing the game. I don't really feel like it's worth playing unless I'm playing in a crew, and a lot of the time, if my friends aren't around to play with, I'm just not in the mood for it.
 

xyla

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,561
Germany
As a casual player I really don't like that the new items are guarded behind 50 sunken ships. Who thought about that?!
I'm not able to buy much of the set either way, because I play the game for one or two hours every other week - and if I got it right, when you've done 50 ships, you can buy the whole set either way.

And why set up a new currency if you don't use it for that stuff this event? I just want my skeleton mug :(
 

Gestault

Member
Oct 26, 2017
13,766
Has anyone else noticed new color-banding artifacts in darker areas like clouds and water? I have some screens I can pull up later if people don't know what I mean, but I wasn't sure if it was something on my display or the game until I checked the DVR on another device. Oddly enough, I noticed the same thing on the Turn10 logo video when starting up Forza 7, which also showed up in the capture. Output settings haven't been changed on my end, and otherwise things look like they should in HDR. Possibly a system-level change in a dash update?
 

Edge

A King's Landing
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
21,012
Celle, Germany
As a casual player I really don't like that the new items are guarded behind 50 sunken ships. Who thought about that?!
I'm not able to buy much of the set either way, because I play the game for one or two hours every other week - and if I got it right, when you've done 50 ships, you can buy the whole set either way.

And why set up a new currency if you don't use it for that stuff this event? I just want my skeleton mug :(


1. They use the currency for this event. For the ship skin, sails, the skull on the front and something else I think.

2. 50 ships just sounds much, it isn't, I literally just did the 3 different crews, one of them twice and another one was a failed attempt and I had the 50 completed. To beat one "raid" you already have to fight against 8 ships.
 

Finaj

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,440
They just need to keep the updates coming.

I hope they introduce:

1. Bounties for pvp.

2. Daily reputation quests with cache rewards (I doubt this one will happen though becuase Rare seems to want a more open-ended structure).
 
Oct 29, 2017
691
This game will be completely different after a year, and to me that speaks incredibly well of Rare's capabilities going forward.

People said the same thing in late 2016 at the start of the Alpha. Here we are in 2018, and outside of a few minor changes the game is basically the same. I still think the title was chalk full of innovative ideas, but I'm definitely disappointed with the direction that things have gone.
 
OP
OP
Klobrille

Klobrille

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,361
Germany
The skeleton ship fights are so much fun (and fucking intense!). We just had a three ship alliance vs them. Felt so awesome.

Nearly got all event commendations.