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[OPEN SPOILERS] GAME OF THRONES S8 |*FULL LEAK DISCUSSION*| IT IS KNOWN

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darkwing

darkwing

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Oct 25, 2017
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TheGamingNewsGuy said:
So this:

Dany is executing everyone in King's Landing. Jon and Tyrion are upset.Dany has Tyrion arrested to be executed for freeing Jaime.Tyrion tries to convince Jon that his family will never be safe because his lineage makes him a threat to Dany's rule.Jon tries to talk to Dany but she justifies her actions then Jon pledges himself to Dany but then stabs her, then surrenders himself.In the epilogue, Jon takes the black again for killing Dany. Arya leaves. Sansa rules the North. Bran oversees his council of Tyrion, Davos, Sam, and Bronn. A council gets formed to decide who the King should be. Tyrion gives a speech and everyone votes on Bran to become King. The end. In the Epilogue, Jon takes the black again for killing Dany. Arya leaves. Sansa rules the North. When they're deciding who to elect as king, Sam suggests holding a democratic election and the other nobles laugh at him. That's before they vote on Bran. Bran oversees his council of Tyrion, Davos, Sam, and Bronn. The Unsullied leave to cross the sea and start liberating slave cities on their own, because that's Dany's plan before Jon kills her -- she has this big speech scene, after sacking King's Landing, where she's talking about wrecking the world, liberating all of the slaves from their masters

Is 95% Confirmed to be happening
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yes
 
PlanetSmasher

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Marcus Brutalius said:
Everybody watching the final episode:
0f4a3ddf9bd24eeba10519167c2a81f7824b45fb60db517e28eea99f82116b80.jpg
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Pretty much. There's nothing left to look forward to. The show is pure narrative diarrhea at this point, all we can really do is wipe it from our minds and realize that we'll never, ever rewatch the show in the future because they shit the bed so spectacularly at the finish line it devalues the entire rest of the series in the process.
 
Jibbajabbawockky

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One thing on the show that really sticks out now to me is how axed book characters like Stoneheart or fAegon would have really helped build up Dany's heel turn, if even just thematically, in the case of Stoneheart.

Assuming Dany going Mad Queen is GRRM's endgame, I can sort of envision a pretty fun and interesting path to that point. It's a shame the showrunners decided to not do that and just sprint to the finish cause they were sick of the show and didn't have GRRM's books to do the heavy lifting.
 
PlanetSmasher

PlanetSmasher

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BDS said:
I think the most insane thing anybody does in this episode is when Cersei has front-row seats to Cleganebowl but decides to just peace out
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It's not like anyone in-universe cares as much about Cleganebowl as much as the fans decided to. It was pointless. If Sandor won and Gregor died, nothing would change: Sandor would've still died in the collapse. The same thing would happen if Gregor crushed Sandor's head like a melon or threw him into the flames: he'd die too.

The whole scene was pointless narratively and existed solely to pay off memes, which is almost as bad as Jaime's entire character arc just reversing itself at the last second because Sansa snarked at him once.
 
fuzzyset

fuzzyset

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PlanetSmasher said:
Pretty much. There's nothing left to look forward to. The show is pure narrative diarrhea at this point, all we can really do is wipe it from our minds and realize that we'll never, ever rewatch the show in the future because they shit the bed so spectacularly at the finish line it devalues the entire rest of the series in the process.
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Yeah that's pretty much how I feel. Wouldn't recommend this show to a friend at this point.
 
Lego Killer Moth

Lego Killer Moth

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Oct 25, 2017
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Everyone is fuming at this but it's pretty clear in my mind that Dany doing this has been the plan from the start. You can get mad at Benioff and Weiss for the sloppy writing these last two seasons, I am too. You can be mad at other plot beats. But this specific plot beat is something that has clearly been in the cards since GRRM was still writing. Not noticing foreshadowing doesn't mean it wasn't there. This isn't out of nowhere, it's where we've been heading from the start.
 
Corky

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Jackson said:
Everyone is fuming at this but it's pretty clear in my mind that Dany doing this has been the plan from the start. You can get mad at Benioff and Weiss for the sloppy writing these last two seasons, I am too. You can be mad at other plot beats. But this specific plot beat is something that has clearly been in the cards since GRRM was still writing. Not noticing foreshadowing doesn't mean it wasn't there. This isn't out of nowhere, it's where we've been heading from the start.
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It was terribly executed that's why people don't like it.
 
Kalel114

Kalel114

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So glad I did my re-watch before this season, because there is no way I can do it again after this. I don't mind Danny's heel turn, just the execution was/is so poor.
 
jett

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How can Show Bran possibly be king. He's barely human.

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What does Jon taking the black even mean. There's no more white walker menace. The freefolk can come and go. There's a goddamn HOLE in the wall.
 
Corky

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Jackson said:
The execution could've been better. But the overwhelming sentiment I'm seeing all over the place is "Dany wouldn't do this" and "they threw away her whole arc", when this has always been what she was supposed to do.
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That's because it wasn't executed well. People may say they just hate the very idea of the plot beat, but if it hadn't been rushed and been properly built up to people wouldn't be having that reaction, they would have already accepted it as a possibility. It was pulled of worse than Anakin in revenge of the sith.
 
TheGamingNewsGuy

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There is a possibility the council ending is fake but everything has lined up with it so it's definitely real (and we know the Tyrion Trial Ending is fake).
 
Whompa

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TheGamingNewsGuy said:
I mean the ending that were pretty much know is happening is bad for sure but not nearly at ME3's orginal level
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I think you're right. My jaw was on the floor the day I beat that game...it was so abruptly bad. The extended shit and dlc softened the blow but god damn...I guess GoT has been a slow burn of shit for 3+ seasons now so maybe I'm just used to it being ass.
 
Kain

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Emerson said:
Has there been any discussion of this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeftoI3c81c

At around 31:00 Barristan's actor claims that GRRM has completed both books and signed a deal to release them after the show completed.

I'm not fool enough to get my hopes up, but that's a hell of a claim for an actor to make up.
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It would make sense, at least for WoW. They could release it by Christmas and then the last one next year. It's possible.

I still think George has lost interest and will never release the last book. I'll happily eat crow if not though.

Btw speaking about George, I'm sure he's dying to shit on the show once it's over. Wait for it.
 
Charamiwa

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... Bronn is on the concil? Bronn is deciding would should be king? This bothers me more than anything else for some reason.
 
Orb

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There are lots of people who watch this show on a really shallow level and their takeaway from Dany's previous "fire and blood" moments was "oh wow she is brutal" but prior to literally like this single episode, her cruelty has largely been reserved for people who arguably deserved it.
 
Charamiwa

Charamiwa

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People really need to let go of this "the Night's Watch is useless now that the White Walkers are dead" mentality. For thousands of years they were thought to be a myth, it doesn't mean they stopped manning the Wall. The Night's Watch serves as a glorified prison too, on top of guarding the realm from the fucked up things from beyond (not just the Walkers). It's useful to the realm.
 

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Charamiwa said:
People really need to let go of this "the Night's Watch is useless now that the White Walkers are dead" mentality. For thousands of years they were thought to be a myth, it doesn't mean they stopped manning the Wall. The Night's Watch serves as a glorified prison too, on top of guarding the realm from the fucked up things from beyond (not just the Walkers). It's useful to the realm.
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Well dany becomes the night queen so the walkers are there for that too
 
Corky

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Charamiwa said:
People really need to let go of this "the Night's Watch is useless now that the White Walkers are dead" mentality. For thousands of years they were thought to be a myth, it doesn't mean they stopped manning the Wall. The Night's Watch serves as a glorified prison too, on top of guarding the realm from the fucked up things from beyond (not just the Walkers). It's useful to the realm.
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Not anymore, the wildings are allies now. It's really dumb however they justify it. ESPECIALLY, if all seeing god king brad ends up being king.
 
jobrro

jobrro

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Orb said:
There are lots of people who watch this show on a really shallow level and their takeaway from Dany's previous "fire and blood" moments was "oh wow she is brutal" but prior to literally like this single episode, her cruelty has largely been reserved for people who arguably deserved it.
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Yes, although I can arguably understand why she 'went mad' it is still disappointing in both the logic of the characters in the events that triggered it and her response to those events.
 

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Honestly, Danys character turn is indefensible.

You have to jump through ridiculous mental hoops to even have it make a lick of sense, and even then you'd fail.

If she wanted to rule by fear and not through love, why not go straight for the Red Keep and become Queen, and then rule precisely as Cersei has been doing? Cersei is ruling through fear. It's not like the last few seasons haven't shown that to be an effective tactic.

Dany killing so many civlians makes no fucking sense.
 
Klyka

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Charamiwa said:
... Bronn is on the concil? Bronn is deciding would should be king? This bothers me more than anything else for some reason.
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I can see the first council meeting:

Tyrion: "Ok everyone, we should vote who will be king."
Bronn: *pulls out a crossbow* "What's double Highgarden?"
Tyrion: :O
*next scene*
Crowd: "All hail King Bronn!"
 
Yuuber

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Bran as king makes no fucking sense when the character himself said he can't be lord of Winterfell. Unless there's a dark plot twist here where Bran was just fucking humanity somehow and will become the next Night King or something.

Jon exiling himself is in line with the character in my opinion, but it's ultimately a shame.
 
Kain

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Charamiwa said:
People really need to let go of this "the Night's Watch is useless now that the White Walkers are dead" mentality. For thousands of years they were thought to be a myth, it doesn't mean they stopped manning the Wall. The Night's Watch serves as a glorified prison too, on top of guarding the realm from the fucked up things from beyond (not just the Walkers). It's useful to the realm.
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It's not like that. The Wall was indeed created for keeping the WW at bay but that purpose was lost to the years. First they started to accept criminals, then lords who renounced their claim, then when the WW threat was lesser and lesser and everyone forgot the original meaning and started to think the Wall was there for keeping the wildlings at bay and to serve as a life sentence for criminals. Now as you say it only would serve as a glorified prison, but the two big menaces to the realm are gone: WW and wildlings. And there's a huge fucking hole that they don't know how to repair because the ancient techniques are lost. Unless they just use brick and mortar.

The NW has no purpose anymore, the Wall neither. Taking the black means nothing after all the show has come and gone. Now Jon going beyond the Wall to live amongst the free folk would make sense. But there's nothing keeping him out of whatever he wants. Jaime killed Aerys and he was a free man ffs
 
Klyka

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Yuuber said:
Bran as king makes no fucking sense when the character himself said he can't be lord or Winterfell. Unless, there's a dark plot twist here where Bran was just fucking humanity somehow and will become the next Night King or something.

Jon exiling himself is in line with the character in my opinion, but it's ultimately a shame.
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Bran "can't be Lord of Winterfell" because he is going to be King of the Realms, duh!
 
jett

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UltraMagnus said:
Bronn being on the fucking endgame council is so D&D it has to be real.
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And it'll be explained away with "A Lannister always pays his debts."

lol

The most unbelievable part of this show is Tyrion surviving the last two seasons despite making one idiotic decision after another.
 

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Spirit of Jazz said:
What would you say the steps towards that were?

Dany's probably the only character in the show that's always done her best to seek a better ending for everybody e.g. She spared literally slavers because she saw the systemic issue of being born into the position, Arya on the other hand butchered the Frey's when they sins were they were born into the family and Rob fucked them all over. If anything Dany's mistakes were that she didn't just murder all of her rivals people. The worst she did was murder turncloaks who did utterly horrible shit to her when she was always loyal to them, which is less terrible than the shit Ned pulled in the first episode where he murdered someone for being terrified and warning them of white walkers because he blindly followed law.

Also I'm not buying anybody trying to say this is a nuanced show with no good and bad sides. The only greyish characters were Melisandri who's blood magic feel failed during her most powerful sacrifice then came back as a level 20 cleric with no need for sacrifice, Stanis because he tried to end battles with the fewest casualties through nefarious means who died to a legit evil person, then the High Sparrow who legitimately fought for the small folk and against the corruption of power/money at the cost of radical religious authoritarian rule who also died to a legit evil person who gave him power in the first place.

There's blatant good and bad in the show. The conclusion then needed to resolve conflicts of interest between good characters so they had the person who's done the most good turn evil because she saw a building. When the writers suggest there's no build up to this and it's just random as fuck maybe don't support their shitty decisions.

Also a reminder that Bran could have saved all the lives at Winterfell given he knew it just required him and Ayra plus all the civilian lives at King's landing. He just seemed to want to go with what got him the throne...
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My point is, regardless of how badly the show or not shown Danys steps to becoming mad, Dany was always gonna become mad in the end. Martin would never allow her to get the throne.

I have posted this before and I still post it because I really like the video.

The video was posted in 2016 and is about the themes of ASOIAF, what's going on inside GRRMs mind and how Dany is the final villain of the show and how Jon will refuse to take the throne. Especially watch from 10:50 if you don't have much time.

 
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