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Chikor

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
14,239
Well, every international organization is a playground of international politics, and WHO is no exception; that I do agree with.

However, in the case of Taiwan/Republic of China, as you have mentioned, WHO is a specialized agency of UN and has to abide by the international law, including UN resolutions; according to UN resolution 2758, People's Republic of China is the only legitimate representation of China in the UN and the government of Taiwan/Republic of China is not a UN recognized entity. This is not a politic matter per se, but rather a matter of regulatory compliance.

I am not the expert of the One China topic and this is way out of topic for this thread, so I will stop now. What I am trying to say is, WHO is a reputable organization and as an entity with no actual authority over countries around the globe it is doing the best it can. The medical community seems to largely agree with and follow its judgment and decisions at this moment as well.

Anyway, apologies for the digression. I know this is a sensitive topic and I am sorry if anyone feels that the course of discussion is unpleasant.
So I don't know, maybe there are experts here, but I got to imagine I follow this shit more than the average bear, but I only know about this issue because Marco fucking Rubio decided at the peak of the outbreak in China, when shit looked like legit bleak, instead of offering support or maybe start having some sort of coordination between government agencies, he decided that now is the time to pick a fight about Taiwan with China.

It's great we spent energy on that instead of asking them how to make test kits that work.
 

Sampson

Banned
Nov 17, 2017
1,196
My cousin, who is a nurse, is on Facebook every day telling people they should be more worried about the flu. It blows my mind.

Today we had Peter Diamandis, who literally calls himself an "exponential" entrepreneur and believes in the singularity, trivlize this by comparing it suicide deaths and diabetes.

Honestly, it's a great life lesson. The amount of denial people can exhibit in the face of tail events is amazing.
 

Vex

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,213
It's interesting how the virus is not effecting kids that badly, I wonder why that is.
Short answer? "We simply do not know why".

'We simply do not understand why': Coronavirus is sparing children, puzzling experts'

A bit more of that answer here:

"Kids are really good at making good, fast immune responses."
"Children's immune systems are used to being assaulted constantly, so it's to their benefit to coordinate and regulate their response," he said. "At the end of the day, if they freaked out about every single virus every time, they would be in the ICU. Instead, kids are really good at making good, fast immune responses."

There has yet to be any definitive sign that the theories pan out, though, Creech added.

But we still don't actually know why. Maybe it is Earth's way of... Naaaah.
 

kess

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,020
I'm in Seattle and anecdotally, I would say people don't act like you're crazy if you talk about it, but at the same time, no one is doing anything about this.
There is still no fever screening in public places and still no plan to designate fever clinics or wards that I'm aware of. Just hope people's primary care physician make a good cool.

I feel like I'm in a pretty low risk group both in term of avoidance and health risk, some I'm not terribly worried about myself, but I'm starting to get kinda concerned about the lack of response around this. This is not some crazy end of the world measures we're talking about here, just really basic stuff.
There is really no down side of taking this shit more seriously.

This is an example of the kind of deep-seated nihilism and cynicism that has broken the American political system. It stands to reason that if the body politic is wilfully misinformed, the institutions are going to reflect that.

I think we are about to get an object lesson on how corruption has damaged the efficacy of the system to respond to health emergencies.
 
Last edited:

AlanOC91

Owner of YGOPRODeck.com
Verified
Nov 5, 2017
961
Are you in an at-risk demographic? Does IT even go into patient rooms? You'll probably be fine. Just wash hands often and don't touch your face.

No not at risk although I've light asthma.
Our IT department is small and extremely hands on. Always on the move around the hospital through the A&E and Wards. We have to go in and troubleshoot patient TVs in their room when there is an issue.

I'm probably being paranoid though. Gonna wash my hands as often as I can.
 

Sampson

Banned
Nov 17, 2017
1,196
This is the kind of deep-seated nihilism and cynicism that has broken the American political system. It stands to reason that if the body politic is wilfully misinformed, the institutions are going to reflect that.

I think we are about to get an object lesson on how corruption has damaged the efficacy of the system to respond to health emergencies.

The US government is very incompetent.

We're about to end a war in Afghanistan that lasted almost 20 years and produced literally nothing of value.

The only thing that will stop this is people taking matters into their own hands and self isolating. There is no government cavalry that is coming to save you.
 

Joni

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,508
we swab for the flu way more liberally than COVID-19. At least at the moment in the US. For example, in the health system I work for you can just call in and say 'I think I have the flu' and the nurse will order a flu swab for you. You just drive to a lab and get it done. South Korea is really on the ball with testing so their numbers are going to be interesting to see play out.
That is really a country by country thing though I think. I have never been tested for the flu. Each time the doctor just went, 'you have the symptoms of the flu so you probably have the flu, get these prescriptions, stay home 3 days and rest.'
 

TheLastYoshi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
878
I think social media and being circled by news 24/7 has hurt and helped. There wasn't this level of fear and panic over H1N1, that pandemic seemed much worse, but the additional coverage for COVID-19 has brought more awareness, and in the US at least, I can see people already being much more cautious than they were 11 years ago and I think this will ultimately help reduce the death toll.
 

Chikor

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
14,239
The US government is very incompetent.

We're about to end a war in Afghanistan that lasted almost 20 years and produced literally nothing of value.

The only thing that will stop this is people taking matters into their own hands and self isolating. There is no government cavalry that is coming to save you.
I have heard from a bunch of people I respect and who should know something about it that the CDC is in a class of its own when it comes to these things, and everything I read supported this too.
I donno, I don't want to start pointing fingers in the middle of this shit, and I really wouldn't know which is the part that is failing here, but I ain't gonna lie, I kinda thought we would be doing better.
Like, no thermal screening in international airports?
Laos has been doing this for a decade.
 

ReactionShot

Member
Oct 25, 2017
505
So I don't know, maybe there are experts here, but I got to imagine I follow this shit more than the average bear, but I only know about this issue because Marco fucking Rubio decided at the peak of the outbreak in China, when shit looked like legit bleak, instead of offering support or maybe start having some sort of coordination between government agencies, he decided that now is the time to pick a fight about Taiwan with China.

It's great we spent energy on that instead of asking them how to make test kits that work.

Yeah, it is really regretable that the outbreak went out of control despite of governments having ample amount of time to prepare :(
 

TheUnseenTheUnheard

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
May 25, 2018
9,647
Two more people have died from coronavirus at Kirkland's EvergreenHealth Medical Center, according to the hospital's CEO. That brings Washington's death toll to 13. Another 59 people have tested positive for coronavirus in Washington state, according to the Washington State Department of Health.
www.king5.com

Coronavirus in Washington state: Updates from March 2-8, 2020

Facts not fear: Find updates on the coronavirus outbreak in Washington state from March 2-8, 2020.
 

bakedpony

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,264
One of the new case here in the Philippines is a stall vendor on a shopping market. While it is inside a mall, the shopping area where the stall is a dense, tightly packed area with multiple stalls and vendors. She is probably not the only one affected...
 

everyer

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
1,242
I'm so sad to see how the cumminity react these days.
People ask for banning certain outbreak areas while others sending their medical supplies and people to the outbreak areas.

Our common enemy is the virus, not human beings. You help us and we help you. That's what we should do.

Since the outbreak I donated 90 protection glasses to the hospitals in Wuhan and a lot of Chinese people donated to Iran embassy bank account to pay back their help on January and early February.

Don't be selfish.
 

RedBaron17

Member
Oct 27, 2017
279
The airline I work for is reducing the flight schedule for April/May. Looking at a reduction of about 8-10% of our total flights. Word is we're just following the trend of what some of the major airlines will also be doing in the coming weeks. Bookings have been down but weirdly enough they picked up a bit for Easter.
 

Chikor

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
14,239
I'm so sad to see how the cumminity react these days.
People ask for banning certain outbreak areas while others sending their medical supplies and people to the outbreak areas.

Our common enemy is the virus, not human beings. You help us and we help you. That's what we should do.

Since the outbreak I donated 90 protection glasses to the hospitals in Wuhan and a lot of Chinese people donated to Iran embassy bank account to pay back their help on January and early February.

Don't be selfish.
Preach.
There is only one side here.
I sent masks to my friends in China in January and now they are offering to send some back to Seattle (I said I'm fine and that they should give it to old people around them. I hope I won't regret this lol).

I'm going to make some more hand sanitzers and give it to people.
 

iamaustrian

Member
Nov 27, 2017
1,291
The older the worse it gets but regardless of age the vast majority recovers, it's not like if someone who's a bit older gets it that they're basically already dead. The 60-69 years old bracket is at about 3.6% fatality rate from what I can find, and these numbers might be inflated a bit due to the high fatality rate in China's Hubei province as a result of hospitals being overwhelmed.

Afaik there is not a single under 60 years death in italy.
 
Nov 6, 2017
87
Flying back home to Hawaii today from South Korea. Incheon Airport is a ghost town. For all US direct flights, they are doing temp checks, no boarding for anyone above 38c.
 

dryz

Member
Oct 30, 2017
247
So one of the cases in the Czech Republic is a doctor who returned from Italy and even though he had symptoms, he just continued to work with patients for two days. How can we contain it when even doctors are so stupid?
 

texhnolyze

Shinra Employee
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,209
Indonesia
www.ynetnews.com

21 Greek pilgrims who visited Israel infected with coronavirus

Health Ministry say the travelers stayed in the country between February 19 and 27; Israel and PA see thousands of visitors every year who come to see holy sites; earlier, Palestinians closed the Church of the Nativity amid coronavirus fears

Some friends just got back from the Holy Land :/
Huh, how many confirmed cases are there in Israel? I feel like I barely heard the news from there.

So one of the cases in the Czech Republic is a doctor who returned from Italy and even though he had symptoms, he just continued to work with patients for two days. How can we contain it when even doctors are so stupid?
Oh great.
 

Dark Cloud

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
61,087
Flying back home to Hawaii today from South Korea. Incheon Airport is a ghost town. For all US direct flights, they are doing temp checks, no boarding for anyone above 38c.
It might be good to be a little safe still when you get back to Hawaii and keep monitoring yourself. I've been doing that since I got back from vacation (which funny enough was Hawaii)
 
Mar 29, 2018
7,078
I think I'm going to take a break from the subway for a bit. I don't know it cities can just shut them down without a real alternative but I'm going to be biking to work again...

Some of the Massachusetts cases are from a company in the area both my GF and I work in
Now might be a good time to buy a facemask... To protect yourself from all the pollution while in your bike 😷
 
Oct 27, 2017
45,390
Seattle
This is devastating the restaurant industry in the region, many reservations cancelled. Hopefully they can apply for some short term loans or we're going to have a lot of businesses go belly up
 

ChippyTurtle

Banned
Oct 13, 2018
4,773
I have heard from a bunch of people I respect and who should know something about it that the CDC is in a class of its own when it comes to these things, and everything I read supported this too.
I donno, I don't want to start pointing fingers in the middle of this shit, and I really wouldn't know which is the part that is failing here, but I ain't gonna lie, I kinda thought we would be doing better.
Like, no thermal screening in international airports?
Laos has been doing this for a decade.

It's Trump or to be more specific, it's the attitude of the Trump Adminstration towards science, as well as the government agencies that comprise the executive that is causing this. If you want to respond we should probably find the u.s specific coronavirus thread tho.
 

Theorry

Member
Oct 27, 2017
61,141

WinniethePimp

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,399
EU
It's kinda sobering how these last years i was already slowly but surely coming to the realization that life as we knew it was about to end (due to climate change and the resulting socio-economic factors) and it was depressing me on a pretty constant basis, but then this thing comes in and just absolutely one ups that earlier realization and gives you something a lot more imminent to worry about. Well, i guess the world just has to handle one crisis at a time. The only advice i can give is to try and enjoy the moment as best you can.
 

Pankratous

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,290
Good job
blogs.microsoft.com

As we work to protect public health, we also need to protect the income of hourly workers who support our campus - Microsoft On the Issues

Microsoft has asked its employees who can work from home to do so due to the impact of COVID-19. Despite this meaning a reduced need for many of the hourly workers vital to our daily operations, we’ve decided that Microsoft will continue to pay their regular pay during this period. We hope other...

Yesses, if MS is doing this it might only be a better of time before my company does.

Edit: It's not just about WFH but also continuing to pay hourly workers. That's great.
 

texhnolyze

Shinra Employee
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,209
Indonesia
This is devastating the restaurant industry in the region, many reservations cancelled. Hopefully they can apply for some short term loans or we're going to have a lot of businesses go belly up
The travel and holiday industry around the world are going to be impacted the most, I presume. Travel bans and restrictions on public events are going to greatly punish them.
 

RedSparrows

Prophet of Regret
Member
Feb 22, 2019
6,515
It's kinda sobering how these last years i was already slowly but surely coming to the realization that life as we knew it was about to end (due to climate change and the resulting socio-economic factors) and it was depressing me on a pretty constant basis, but then this thing comes in and just absolutely one ups that earlier realization and gives you something a lot more imminent to worry about. Well, i guess the world just has to handle one crisis at a time. The only advice i can give is to try and enjoy the moment as best you can.

I find it helps to not recourse to abject fatalism.
 

iamaustrian

Member
Nov 27, 2017
1,291
So italy has almost 4000 cases now and over 400 recoveries while south korea has over 6000 cases and only 135 recoveries so far.
wouldn't that suggest that the virus is indeed much longer present in italy as first expected?
that would also (partially) explain the much higher death rate in italy


I think social media and being circled by news 24/7 has hurt and helped. There wasn't this level of fear and panic over H1N1, that pandemic seemed much worse, but the additional coverage for COVID-19 has brought more awareness, and in the US at least, I can see people already being much more cautious than they were 11 years ago and I think this will ultimately help reduce the death toll.

I agree
When you ask someone today how he remember the swine flu pandemic 2009, most don't even realize that it was a global pandemic with over 150.000 fatalities. it also hit pretty much the entire planet. death rate was pretty low however afair
 

DukeBlueBall

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,059
Seattle, WA
It's kinda sobering how these last years i was already slowly but surely coming to the realization that life as we knew it was about to end (due to climate change and the resulting socio-economic factors) and it was depressing me on a pretty constant basis, but then this thing comes in and just absolutely one ups that earlier realization and gives you something a lot more imminent to worry about. Well, i guess the world just has to handle one crisis at a time. The only advice i can give is to try and enjoy the moment as best you can.

Well if the coronavirus tanks global economy, emissions will inevitably reverse worldwide. Out of crises comes opportunities. In the US, the most immediate opportunity is a push for better healthcare.
 

Kyougar

Cute Animal Whisperer
Member
Nov 3, 2017
9,370
Then explain why the virus has been circulating in the US for 6 weeks and we only started noticing now. There are mild cases, there has to be.

mild cases don't kill people and the virus needs time to show symptoms.
There could be millions of undetected cases yet and it doesn't impact the death rate at all. Because the death rate is from discovered cases. If you show symptoms, thats your chance of death.

The death rate in Italy? People which are showing no symptoms are already not counted since a week or so ago.

And for there to be a significant number of undetected cases is impossible. because it would mean that only young people without health problems are currently carrying the virus, while only 0.001% of the elderly and people with health problems had caught the virus.
 

Anarion07

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
2,229
I said you were acting like trump because you are. Literally making up information to downplay the situation and downplay the CFR. While it will vary from country to country and adjust over time we know for an undisputed fact that it is significantly worse than the flu. Downplaying the situation is just as bad as people panicking and literally leads to mass panic because they have been misinformed previously
No, he is not acting like Trump. He is acting like a scientist, actually. He never said COVID-19 is more benign than the flu or even the same. He just said the numbers are not comparable right now. Which is true.
People are tested for the flu far more frequently than COVID (for now), so the percentages are off by a lot. COVID will still be worse than the flu, but not as bad as the numbers suggest right now.
That is not downplaying it, that is the truth. Numbers matter.
Source? I'm an immunologist working for the LMU Munich and pretty much all of my colleagues agree on this. Because those are the facts.
 

Bebpo

Member
Feb 4, 2018
4,670
I just wanna complain about how in the West you still have to sign for so many things with plastic pens attached to a touch screen which has always seemed like a huge sanitation breach to me. Even when picking up meds at the pharmacy with a chip card, you still have to sign for your medications.

Whoever thought that up was a serious idiot.

I mean people going to get their medications...are sick people.
And making everyone share the same pen to sign for the medications.

Even with hand sanitizer available that's just so dumb. And that's just a small example of how the west is badly prepared for stopping the spreading of viruses/bacteria.
 

Froli

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,692
Philippines
One of the new case here in the Philippines is a stall vendor on a shopping market. While it is inside a mall, the shopping area where the stall is a dense, tightly packed area with multiple stalls and vendors. She is probably not the only one affected...

Can you give me a link to this info?

One of the 2 patients.
The second patient is a regular visitor of a Muslim prayer hall in Barangay Greenhills in San Juan City, experienced cough and severe pneumonia on Feb 25 which led him to consult a hospital in National Capital Region on March 1, the DOH said.

A test sample was collected from the patient on March 4 and a day later, the specimen was found positive for the deadly disease, the DOH said.

Duque said the patient "has no known history of travel outside of the country."
newsinfo.inquirer.net

Philippines records 2 new confirmed coronavirus cases

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcgz-qVRrSg MANILA, Philippines — The Department of Health (DOH) on Friday reported two new confirmed cases of the 2019 coronavirus disease (COVID-19) that
 

Xun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,326
London
A woman on the bus was coughing a lot this morning and I can't stop thinking about it. Hopefully just a cold...

Also I can't confirm for sure, but I'm pretty sure myselt and my mum had swine flu back in 2009. I've never felt like that before, and the timing was too coincidental in my opinion.
 

WinniethePimp

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,399
EU
No, he is not acting like Trump. He is acting like a scientist, actually. He never said COVID-19 is more benign than the flu or even the same. He just said the numbers are not comparable right now. Which is true.
People are tested for the flu far more frequently than COVID (for now), so the percentages are off by a lot. COVID will still be worse than the flu, but not as bad as the numbers suggest right now.
That is not downplaying it, that is the truth. Numbers matter.
Source? I'm an immunologist working for the LMU Munich and pretty much all of my colleagues agree on this. Because those are the facts.


I feel like in these discussions there are often misunderstandings because different people actually MEAN different things because they often do not specify in enough detail what they are trying to convey.

I think it is import to clarify that when we are talking about the situation right NOW in this instant, then yes, of course the flu is more dangerous than this because the flu is still a LOT more prevalent around the world (more people infected).

What a lot of people actually MEAN though when they say this is more dangerous than the flu is the potential this has in comparison to the flu!
We already know the more or less "maximum extent" of the flu since it pretty much HAS already spread worldwide (albeit with different strains, mutations, and varying degrees of spread each year etc. but you get the basic idea)

Now, if Covid-19 is allowed so achieve that SAME prevalence in the world than the flu, then it will absolutely be more dangerous to the world as a whole since it causes a higher percentage of fatalities.

This is all assuming that health care systems CAN handle the influx of patients all of a sudden, in case they cannot, the sky is the limit in terms of damage this thing can cause, which is mainly why it is extremely important to contain and delay this from happening as good as we possibly can. This is also now where the main challenge lies and why everyone must work together to achieve this common goal.
 

McEwan

Member
Jan 30, 2020
97
Well if the coronavirus tanks global economy, emissions will inevitably reverse worldwide. Out of crises comes opportunities. In the US, the most immediate opportunity is a push for better healthcare.

Indeed. It is one of the worst ironies that it takes a major humanitarian disaster to get cultures and people to change. A good example for me is things like the formation of the UN after WW2 or the changes to football stadia following Hillsborough.

People just seem to react to horror more than they do to positivity.