Millenial Job Hopping

MrMephistoX · Oct 17, 2018

Found this article to be pretty much spot on particularly for me: Millenials Aren't job hopping or disloyal they're adapting to the new normal. Corporations that don't give two flying shits about tenure.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/larrya...ng-young-people-are-5-things-to-keep-in-mind/

So what do you think it is about us millennials? For me it's all about growth and seeing what happened to my dad: brilliant at doing complex finance by hand pushed out by younger workers and lack of aptitude with excel and losing his house in the 2008 downturn.

To me if you're in the same job regardless of how good the company it's not a good thing. Employers are not loyal to you so why stick around if you're not getting growth opportunities after 2-3 years?

Thoughts?

Amory · Oct 17, 2018

When I switch companies I tend to get more money than I would if I stuck at one.

It just makes sense financially.

null_ · Oct 17, 2018

Gen Xer here, and the longest I've been in a job is maybe 4 years? Typically 2 years and I've been ready to jump... I also work in Tech so it's not uncommon.

Edit: I thought I should add is that it's for the same, obvious reasons... there's no loyalty on either side, so why pretend?

WeAreStarStuff · Oct 17, 2018

35. Longest I've been at a job since college is about 3 years.

SageShinigami · Oct 17, 2018

Job hopping generally gets you a higher salary than sticking around at the same place.

MrMephistoX · Oct 17, 2018

Amory said:
When I switch companies I tend to get more money than I would if I stuck at one.

It just makes sense financially.

Yep! I'm leaving on Friday and starting a new job on Monday because of just that. Once the pixie dust wears off even a dream job begins to lose its luster if you're underpaid.

Septimus Prime · Oct 17, 2018

Breadth of experience is valuable, but yeah, I also think the real reason is stagnant growth and salary.

Sunster · Oct 17, 2018

Yea we don't want to work at the very first job we get straight out of college for 2 decades then get fired and lose everything while having a very limited experience set on our resumes.

metalfearsolid · Oct 17, 2018

I don't blame millennials.. especially with the lack of job security and low wages out there. Always look for the best opportunities for yourself.

Kevers · Oct 17, 2018

I worked for Target and while they always treated us well when it came to snacks,parties,or catering the break room during the holidays but they switched the overnight position from 11pm-6am to 4am-8am and lost 70% of the team and treated the people who stayed like shit. The people who stayed after the change were expected to make up for all the people who decided to leave, we had 15-20 people doing the work of 40-50 people in 4 hours less than we were used to. After 3 years of being there I came down with a stomach illness that had me in and out of the doctor, even with notes from the doctor I still eventually lost my job because I called in one too many times.

I'm still pissed off at how that place changed, I was there for 2 years at 11pm-6am and absolutely loved the place. I had a lot of friends and our managers were cool as hell. Everything changed as soon as they decided to start shifts at 4am. That's the incident that it eventually clicked in my head that I need to worry about myself and my health instead of worrying if they'd be upset if I called in because I was puking and shitting my brains out.

Deleted member 532 · Oct 17, 2018

Easiest way to get a raise, get a new job.

Deleted member 6949 · Oct 17, 2018

If a millenial had true upward mobility it wouldn't bump its ass a hoppin.

MrMephistoX · Oct 17, 2018

Sunster said:
Yea we don't want to work at the very first job we get straight out of college for 2 decades then get fired and lose everything while having a very limited experience set on our resumes.

It's the exact opposite of how I was brought up and also taught in business school. There are literally people at my job who have been in my same rank for 25 years. My parents would say that's great! I say ick! One of my colleagues got unceremoniously dumped last week 2 years before retirement.

Mass One · Oct 17, 2018

I literal only work for money. So if someplace else is offering more, I find it stupid to stay.

I even hopped with my internships aswell. My friends did it with their internships too.

null_ · Oct 17, 2018

Sunster said:
Yea we don't want to work at the very first job we get straight out of college for 2 decades then get fired and lose everything while having a very limited experience set on our resumes.

The point of the article is that it is NOT a millennial thing but a young person thing... like I said in my first post, I've been doing the same thing and I'm in my ... uhhh <cough>... upper 40s

EraldoCoil · Oct 17, 2018

I've usually stuck to a job around 2-3 years. Each new job I've takrn has been for more money.

I've learned from my dad what loyalty to one place gets you, and hes worked for the same place for 30 years.

Edit: I'm 31

Deleted member 11626 · Oct 17, 2018

At 28. I was a shift manager at one job for about 2.5 years. No growth beyond that and I had my son on the way, so I left. Spent 2.5 more years at a much higher paying job, then they laid me off after Trump's tax cuts. So I say go where you want. Companies don't give two shits about you. Pensions are virtually nonexistent and you can roll over your 401k. If you can't move up then move out.

SlickShoesRUCRazy · Oct 17, 2018

I need to start doing this.

flyingorion · Oct 17, 2018

I've had about 20 jobs in the last 2 years. That does include temporary, seasonal, and gig jobs. I'm honestly used to having a constant feeling of instability. All of the best ones turned bad. One company lost a contract and so we all lost our job. Another shut down its business in my territory. One place basically used me for my piano playing skills for a week and then dropped me even though patrons liked my music. I've had several merchandiser jobs, but the hours can be very unstable. Had the retail seasonal jobs at either minimum wage or a little above.

Yeah, there are a million jobs out there if you're in the right area. Job hunting is a constant for me. I'm not going to break my back on some faulty ladder stocking some heavy box with a job that pays $9 an hour and offers no insurance. I'm not going to put up with a manager threatening me with violence after I refuse to drive across town to just work another 30 minutes on a 4-hour shift to help out. I'm not going to be yelled at by an angry and entitled baby boomer customer because they can't get a refund on an item they bought a half year ago.

cdyhybrid · Oct 17, 2018

Give people better pay/benefits and give them regular raises and people might stay.

You get what you pay for.

DigitalDevil · Oct 17, 2018

We look for people to stay. It costs a lot to recruit, hire and train new employees. We don't want you to leave. We have growth opportunity if you are passionate, driven and hard working. I am an executive without a college degree... the opportunity is there. That being said, there are way more job hopping millennials than those that are willing to commit. People that do that are extremely unattractive to many recruiters. If I see more two jobs in five years I am not going to call you. Have you ever considered that the companies that don't care if you are disloyal are some of the same companies that are disloyal to their employees?

hurlex · Oct 17, 2018

Maybe companies need to start offering pensions again.

MrMephistoX · Oct 17, 2018

SlickShoesRUCRazy said:
I need to start doing this.

I'll admit I got freaked out after my first job out of school lost a big client and my director and I both got canned so I spent about 6 years with one company (promotions every two years) and then left for a huge increase after I finished my masters. People that stuck around all got laid off with a few exceptions when the company merged. I've been in my current role for 3.5 years so hardly disloyal but there's something to be said for a boss that believes in you being laid off due to restructuring and then stifling your growth. So off I go on Monday to my new higher paying job that builds on my experience and profession!

Amory · Oct 17, 2018

DigitalDevil said:
We look for people to stay. It costs a lot to recruit, hire and train new employees. We don't want you to leave. We have growth opportunity if you are passionate, driven and hard working. I am an executive without a college degree... the opportunity is there. That being said, there are way more job hopping millennials than those that are willing to commit. People that do that are extremely unattractive to many recruiters. If I see more two jobs in five years I am not going to call you. Have you ever considered that the companies that don't care if you are disloyal are some of the same companies that are disloyal to their employees?

I suppose it depends on the industry but I've heard hiring managers say the opposite too, that young people who stay in one place too long start to look like there's something wrong with them so they can't get another job

And I'm not an advocate for changing jobs every couple of years "just cuz". If you're happy and fulfilled and moving up, obviously stay. But it's a good thing for workers that that isn't the expectation anymore and you can get away with shopping around

MrMephistoX · Oct 17, 2018

hurlex said:
Maybe companies need to start offering pensions again.

I think they should start offering early retirement with full federally enforced benefits personally. It would be a great way to get new workers and fresh ideas in continuously instead of coldly laying 55 year olds off.

Allforce · Oct 17, 2018

cdyhybrid said:
Give people better pay/benefits and give them regular raises and people might stay.

You get what you pay for.

Pretty much. 17 years at my job, don't plan on leaving. Guess I'm doing it wrong but I get good pay and amazing benefits and I'm good at it.

Alwayscrazybacon · Oct 17, 2018

null_ said:
Gen Xer here, and the longest I've been in a job is maybe 4 years? Typically 2 years and I've been ready to jump... I also work in Tech so it's not uncommon.

Edit: I thought I should add is that it's for the same, obvious reasons... there's no loyalty on either side, so why pretend?

Same here, I don't think you can pin this on on millenials. My first two jobs I stayed at way too long as I was still believing the loyalty gets rewarded crap. The best run I ever had was a boss job hopping and then hiring his old team for the new company's he moved too twice.

BDS · Oct 17, 2018

Companies don't care about their workers anymore, so workers don't care either. Loyalty is a two-way street.

Griselbrand · Oct 17, 2018

Longest I stayed at one place was 5 years but it was a place where I actually did have some great mobility having started from an entry level position. I've been at my current place for about three years and I'm considering a move in a few months.

MrMephistoX · Oct 17, 2018

DigitalDevil said:
We look for people to stay. It costs a lot to recruit, hire and train new employees. We don't want you to leave. We have growth opportunity if you are passionate, driven and hard working. I am an executive without a college degree... the opportunity is there. That being said, there are way more job hopping millennials than those that are willing to commit. People that do that are extremely unattractive to many recruiters. If I see more two jobs in five years I am not going to call you. Have you ever considered that the companies that don't care if you are disloyal are some of the same companies that are disloyal to their employees?

Don't get me wrong I'd stay if there were a path to growth and I hadn't seen some weird political stuff happening with even execs getting laid off recently under the radar but people love this company so much that manager and director slots hardly ever open up and when they do it's usually someone from the outside. Just in my experience.

3.5 years is a long time but I'd actually be happy to come back once I level up with my new title and experience so I can make decisions instead of following orders.

Deleted member 4034 · Oct 17, 2018

I wish I did this, been at the same job 4 years and I make much less than my friends who hop around for the best offer. And hopping around still entails like a at least a year at a place. Boldest things I saw was a girl who left right after taking a promotion and another dude who left after three months. Good for them.

My current job brought me and a friend on for $10 an hour 4 years ago. She peaced out for $15 and healthcare at another place 6 months later. I got a raise to $10.50 and was bought on full-time. End of the year, she's at an even better place with a salary, whereas I worked my way up to $12.50. Few years later she's at an even better place and I was offered a raise to $15 just last year, I asked for and got $16. And now I just feel stupid.

Looking to be out of my job by the start of next year. I got bills yo.

And what sucks is, my cost of living is pretty low so I never thought what I made was very little, but then you see the other moves people make and it's like, wow ... I'm really behind.

A Grizzly Bear · Oct 17, 2018

I had an interview for a job where they brought up the fact that I usually don't stay at a job for more than 3 years. I gave the honest answer that it's been better for my career and growth. His reaction was the most snide, patronising "sure" I've ever heard. Didn't bother following up on that one. Companies need to realize they need to have solid career ladders and compensation to keep talent.

RestEerie · Oct 17, 2018

I'm Gen X and i do job hopping as well.

Miletius · Oct 17, 2018

DigitalDevil said:
We look for people to stay. It costs a lot to recruit, hire and train new employees. We don't want you to leave. We have growth opportunity if you are passionate, driven and hard working. I am an executive without a college degree... the opportunity is there. That being said, there are way more job hopping millennials than those that are willing to commit. People that do that are extremely unattractive to many recruiters. If I see more two jobs in five years I am not going to call you. Have you ever considered that the companies that don't care if you are disloyal are some of the same companies that are disloyal to their employees?

Seems like an attitude of the past, honestly. We've been living with 20+ years of stagnant wage growth. People know that they only way they can get ahead in life is either to be in a very lucrative industry or to switch jobs on the regular. Companies should be asking what they can do to retain trained talent rather than the other way around -- and the answer is actually quite simple. Treat them better and make compensation generous and they'll never be disloyal.

CreepingFear · Oct 17, 2018

It's hard, but you have to realize that there is no loyalty. I have a great boss and decent benefits, but I'm no longer growing and I want to get something for having a CCNA. I will not be my mother, working for a company for 39 years to just get dumped and lose her pension.

SlickShoesRUCRazy · Oct 17, 2018

MrMephistoX said:
I'll admit I got freaked out after my first job out of school lost a big client and my director and I both got canned so I spent about 6 years with one company (promotions every two years) and then left for a huge increase after I finished my masters. People that stuck around all got laid off with a few exceptions when the company merged. I've been in my current role for 3.5 years so hardly disloyal but there's something to be said for a boss that believes in you being laid off due to restructuring and then stifling your growth. So off I go on Monday to my new higher paying job that builds on my experience and profession!

Ya, I've been at the same place for a while and after checking out places like zip recruiter, I am def underpaid.

Couple that with the announcement by the boss that all OT is being eliminated(boss is a huge trump supporter who def made a killing with tax cuts, figures he would fuck us), I have more incentive than ever to leave this place.

I've been loyal to this dude, but loyalty means shit if you got bills to pay and are underpaid compared to your peers at other places in similar positions.

MrMephistoX · Oct 17, 2018

Miletius said:
Seems like an attitude of the past, honestly. We've been living with 20+ years of stagnant wage growth. People know that they only way they can get ahead in life is either to be in a very lucrative industry or to switch jobs on the regular. Companies should be asking what they can do to retain trained talent rather than the other way around -- and the answer is actually quite simple. Treat them better and make compensation generous and they'll never be disloyal.

Last straw for me was when they took away our snacks and sparkly water! ;)

You can't survive on 2-3% annual increases in some markets like LA and expect to have a retirement cushion.

deimosmasque · Oct 17, 2018

Truth is comapnies don't reward hard work or loyality anymore. So why should we?

Shokunin · Oct 17, 2018

My mom taught me this when I first entered the job market. Longest I've stayed at a job is 3 1/2 years (I only stayed that long because they let me work the last 2 year remote).

Go get yours, people.

MrMephistoX · Oct 17, 2018

CreepingFear said:
It's hard, but you have to realize that there is no loyalty. I have a great boss and decent benefits, but I'm no longer growing and I want to get something for having a CCNA. I will not be my mother, working for a company for 39 years to just get dumped and lose her pension.

I honestly think you hit the nail on the head; a big part of my desire to jump when growth slows is what happened to my parents. Dad got laid off, mom had to get a real estate license while dad applied like crazy for 2 years only to have to drive a fucking school bus until he got into selling supplemental insurance to Medicare patients.

Are european and Canadian corporations this bad too?

Daitokuji · Oct 17, 2018

I'm in my mid-30s and have never worked at the same company for more than about a year and a half.

Shinku_King · Oct 17, 2018

First job was there for 4 years after that been at the next few for about 6 months or less.

SugarNoodles · Oct 17, 2018

It's pretty special for people to tout "you're paid what you're worth" nonsense and then turn around and blame someone for taking a new job to make more money.

Psittacus · Oct 17, 2018

Companies brought this on themselves. I have no sympathy for them.

HyGogg · Oct 17, 2018

Yeah, until there's a market correction, and companies return to paying for employee retention (which they should because their failure to do so is costing them a lot of money), this is the only thing that makes sense to do.

When a vacant position needs to be filled, companies have to pay market value for available talent. But they don't really give raises beyond inflation rate anymore so particularly early on in your career if you work a job for a couple years you're considerably more valuable than when you started and your only way to cash in on that is to quit.

With unemployment as low as it is, it's ridiculously easy to game this. I know people that have changed jobs three times in a year and doubled their income.

Emmz · Oct 17, 2018

I find job hopping in the software industry to be interesting and frustrating. I've worked at the same place for almost 5 years and I have become very, very good at my job. I've had a lot of people join my team many years older and with more experienced than me who have hopped in and out after a year or two, likely making more money than me when they started, and likely making even more after they left. All the while being completely fucking useless at their jobs for a significant portion of their tenure compared to me, a much younger and "more inexperienced" developer.

My company has treated me well and I genuinely haven't seen better prospects for myself (though that may soon change). In spite of this, it's laughable to me how the "meritocracy" of the industry works. I have a few friends in a similar boat, though they wizened up and finally started playing the game a bit more. I simply haven't seen someone really achieving mastery in a complex and difficult job like working on software in less than a year on a given project regardless of their starting level of experience. The idea of paying them more because they have the balls to jump around being bad at their jobs blows my mind.

Alwayscrazybacon · Oct 17, 2018

MrMephistoX said:
Are european and Canadian corporations this bad too?

Yes, and it extends to privately owned businesses too.

Ryaaan14 · Oct 17, 2018

Get paid

Pooh · Oct 18, 2018

It's the only way to get a "raise" nowadays

If companies didn't want people to hop they'd pay them better

Charcoal · Oct 18, 2018

Do your companies not offer yearly raises? I get a 5% increase every January.

Millenial Job Hopping

EA

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