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Marvel Cinematic Universe |OT3| Is This Canon? (LGBTQIA+ Lives Matter)
- Thread starter Neoxon
- Start date
- Entertainment Comics OT
It's the reason the OT says what it says. It will be a shitshow and the fucking South Park episode reinvigorating chuds is not helping
I read the Variety article, very interesting. It seems that Disney plus was the straw that broke the camel's back, in the sense that it increases the load on an already strained film production process. That said, I will repeat what I said in the thread in the Etc subforum: none of the issues seem unsolvable or especially serious. marvel Studios can easily refocus, trim the quantity of projects, recast any troublesome actors and/or move in any direction it wants story arc-wise. It might take a bit of time but that's not necessarily a bad thing as it will give audiences a bit of distance from the stuff it didn't enjoy.
I'm just afraid that Marvel's gonna "course-correct" and drop Kang as a character, and instead replace him with someone else like Doom. I'm really enjoying the overall Kang story and want to see it followed through to the end. Apparently Ant-Man's BO performance gave them pause about Kang, and I hope it's nothing more than that; I'm fine if they course-correct steps on the way to the end and still have Kang as the big bad.
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This was my takeaway, as well.
That being said, I don't think sustaining the Phase 3 popularity was ever realistic. It was lightning in a bottle. However, refocusing the story and maybe trimming the budgets can help make this a more sustainable/profitable endeavor for Marvel Studios going forward.
I don't think a Phase 3-like climax is completely out of the question but yeah, it will be hard to replicate.
Well discourse is absolutely shit.
So I might as well take a break from these threads too. Specially since it got weirdly personal.
Good thing the OT was done early, I'll stick around to post my impressions on the film
So I might as well take a break from these threads too. Specially since it got weirdly personal.
Good thing the OT was done early, I'll stick around to post my impressions on the film
tbh I think there is way, way too much discourse on here about "the chuds." Like really, who cares? Either the movies are good or they aren't. Spending so much time proactively worrying about what chuds will think, how they'll react, etc. is just weird to me. These are the same people who make videos on a daily basis about how Kathleen Kennedy and Brie Larson will be executed for crimes against men any day now. They live in their own delusional world, and tbh it's getting pretty annoying that every discussion here about The Marvels in particular and Marvel in general isn't being derailed by actual chuds, but people talking about chuds. It's vaguely giving "Six for the Six" lol
idk, in hindsight one of the reasons Phase 3 worked so well is because it was the biggest stretch of time where Feige's attention was 100% on the movies and unencumbered by other execs. I do think anything Marvel does is unlikely to ever top 2018-19 in terms of commercial and zeitgeist success, but I also don't think it's hard to imagine a better received and executed phase 4 and 5 that was just a couple movies a year if D+ had never been a factor. I don't even dislike the D+ shows -- a couple of them have been good/great, most have been fine, only one has really been terrible -- but their existence has clearly been a net negative on Marvel's quality control and the downstream effects on writers and vfx workers.
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Oh, I still expect a big climax at the end of whatever this saga ends up becoming. I just don't think it can achieve the highs of what Infinity War/Endgame did.
I agree. It's pretty easy to envision a better Phase 4-5, and this is coming from someone had has mostly enjoyed everything since 2019 (including Secret Invasion, to an extent). I mean, Marvel Studios is one of only - what - 3 companies to successfully launch a cinematic universe? And theirs is by the far the biggest and they're the only one to move into the streaming space in a significant way. I'm not surprised they fumbled a bit (or a lot, depending on your opinion). Too much too quickly (with minimal story progress).
Yeah I ignored that thread. mean I get some legit criticism with the franchise is warranted, but man is the thread so toxic from reading the first page alone.
Wait what episode was that about?
Wait what episode was that about?
I agree. The far-right narratives are good to be aware of and it's good when certain critiques may be louder than they normally would be and why that may be but I also do agree that the impact is being overstated, especially now with Marvel and Disney being in a discernable rut and with the overall chaos of the box office of the last year. I keep going back to Sarah Z's "sacrificial trash" video and one of its important points: these narratives are only able to stick when there's legitimate issues for them to latch on to.
A whole ass episode on how Disney's Kathleen Kennedy obsessively forces women of color into Disney films and makes them lose money.
Naturally it's been spammed everywhere now and I'm sick of people spamming "Put a chick in it and make her gay"
I've read every single page in today's thread and while it's been close to dreadful, it haven't been as bad as I expected. There's many legitimate critiques in there. Although it's eye opening to me to see what feels like the majority wanting Marvel to completely drop Kang and his overarching story (I wonder if that's the case with the GA as well). Instead of just recasting him and powering through, which there's also many who's advocated for. If we are at the MCU's crisis point then I'm plenty satisfied, cause there's only been four or so movies that I've found less than satisfying out of the 32. If we are at the low point of the franchise, then I'm one happy fan.
[edit] Although, thinking more on it, I can't be happy with current MCU not latching onto the general audience. Cause that may make Marvel backtrack or change stuff for better or for worse. So it would be ideal if we weren't in the current situation of over-saturation and quality drops.
[edit] Although, thinking more on it, I can't be happy with current MCU not latching onto the general audience. Cause that may make Marvel backtrack or change stuff for better or for worse. So it would be ideal if we weren't in the current situation of over-saturation and quality drops.
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Ooof! I mean I usually enjoy South Park, but I'm pretty eh on the modern episodes. And this ain't it.
Edit: Looking it up, it's Joining the Panderverse I take it?
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I hate this idea that if a villain loses once then they're immediately nonthreatening.
You saw ERA's enlightened post about how Kylo ren being beaten meant he could never be threatening as Supreme Leader, and LFL listened and gave us "Somehow Palpatine returns"
Meanwhile some of the coolest villains are those that are thwarted easily at first but grow stronger until they become monsters.
Hell Across the Spiderverse is a whole movie about a villain like that
The kickback actually has to happen to sell though. It never happened to kylo and I wouldn't be surprised if it never happened with Kang at this rate.
We'll have to wait and see but until then people are allowed to judge what's there and what's there is a lil bitch
It's definitely nowhere near as bad as what some people here are insinuating(without even actually reading the thread, it seems like). The discussions have been fairly civil and backed with good reasoning. It's nowhere as bad as the Marvels pre-sales/forecast thread where people were just absolutely shitting on people for being excited for the movie.
weirdest thing will be all the people in those threads who can't shut up about how much they hate cape shit and it's ruining cinema, calling the clips of Marvels mid, somehow watching Marvels in theatres on the thursday preview day and posting how much they hated it in the official Marvels resetera thread
It still was pretty toxic, dogpiling on someone who can't even respond.
Probably, but it still wasn't anywhere close to what you said about people being more preoccupied with it.
In fact, Zeo was only brought up originally because some posters wanted more pushback against the criticism for the MCU(which is the topic in the first place) that he usually provides, which was also silly IMO.
Looking back, yeah I only read the last page and the discussion was all about Zeo, I probably should've read more than that, my bad.
I never thought Blade would be one of my most anticipated MCU projects alongside Deadpool 3, but I realize it is. I'm a sucker for vampires, werewolves and witches in media (honestly I've only watched Vampire Diaries universe and Twilight). I've never seen the original Blade movies from the 90/00s but what I gather from it is that Blade is a daywalking vampire who's hunting other vampires with a sweetass sword, shotgun and other tools. That sounds cool to me. Alongside it supposedly partly filming in my favorite US city New Orleans (talking aesthetics and atmosphere, I've no idea how the place is in real life). Cap it off with great castings in Mahershala Ali and Mia Goth. That it'll have a limited budget of $100m also seems like a nice restriction to reel them in. The draft they reported on today sounded trash but I'm hopeful the Logan scribe can turn it around. I kinda hope it's gonna be set in the 1920s to make it a period piece like some rumors suggested, but nonetheless I'm on board. Just… make Blade the actual lead, lol.
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You're a sucker for this stuff and that's all you've watched? Then from one person with a soft spot for vampires to another, you need to watch What We Do In The Shadows. Both the movie and the TV show, which have entirely different casts and stories.
Oh, I've watched the movie. It was awesome, really loved it. Only got one episode in with the show but it's definitely on my radar still. I just looked it up and it's on HBO Max, I'm definitely watching one of these days. Only heard great things about it. I also watched Buffy during my childhood but remember none of it. It's on Disney Plus so I could do a complete watch. Thanks for the rec!
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I feel like Namor in Wakanda Forever just came and went. Of course, the allegations against Tenoch played a part in that, but it also felt like despite getting praise and considered one of the highlight of WF, no one was really talking about Namor or seeing more of him. I know the movie's not even a year old, but based on the announced projects, it doesn't seem like Namor was scheduled/meant to have more appearances(barring cameos) in any movies before Fantastic Four or Kang Dynasty. It's another case of a major character introduced but not getting any follow up for a while.
On the one hand, it feels like they announced too many projects at once for Phase 5 and 6, but on the other hand, other than the Avengers movies and FF, it also feels like the announced projects were... poorly considered, if that makes sense.
On the one hand, it feels like they announced too many projects at once for Phase 5 and 6, but on the other hand, other than the Avengers movies and FF, it also feels like the announced projects were... poorly considered, if that makes sense.
a lot of characters feel like they came and went because they didn't do a very good job of following up on characters in this saga. remember shang-chi? we ain't seeing that dude again for like another 3 years give or take.
they set up a lot of great characters recently, but failed on capitalizing on them. the fact we don't have a young avengers project at this point is a pretty big oversight.
they set up a lot of great characters recently, but failed on capitalizing on them. the fact we don't have a young avengers project at this point is a pretty big oversight.
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I definitely straight-up forgot that they introduced Namor, which is wild because he's one of my favorite Marvel characters and was a real highlight of that movie. I enjoyed Wakanda Forever at the time, but I guess it really didn't stick with me.
Of course, but I mean people bring up Shang-Chi from time to time, especially in conversations about characters not being seen again. But Namor? Not a peep. Which is kind of astounding given the major role the character has in comics and is poised to have in the MCU.
I really didn't care for Wakanda Forever. It felt like there was just too much crammed into one movie and nothing felt cohesive. I can't remember much else of what I didn't like about it offhand other than how silly a lot of it was. Kind of broke my willing suspension of disbelief in a few places. E.g. it's a personal nitpick, but I can't ever take Namor's ankle wings seriously. Every time I saw them I wished they were a magical artifact instead of literal biological wings lol.
The arguments themselves aren't bad but the way so many people openly attacked a single user that can't even reply is nothing short of bullying.
It can certainly be viewed that way. What I've seen though was just some people saying "we need him to shut down these haters", then someone asking "what happened, he's usually amicable", and people pointing out that that's not their experience with him. I think it's simply what happens when someone is, to say the least, often the center of heated debates--even the note on their ban says as much.
But I do agree it's only fair if some people feel like they want to stand up for him. In any case, the talks have ceased, I was just disagreeing with the framing that it overtook the discussion in that thread.
I acknowledge your point, however I believe we should also acknowledge that a thread being less antagonistic doesn't necessarily mean that the discussion is better. You can have a very peaceful thread if you let one side troll and mock openly and no one is there to raise a voice against it. Zeo may have gone in a bit too hard in some cases but most of the time he antagonized people that were present in Marvel threads with the goal of delivering drive-bys, misinformation and trolling.
I have expressed my personal opinion many times. I want to have good-faith discussions with everyone, it doesn't matter if they agree with me or not. I find disagreement fun and stimulating, i really like reading different arguments and other points of view. At some point though MCU-related threads became practically unreadable and that certainly wasn't Zeo's fault.
It could be because Universal still partially owns the film rights to Namor, though that didn't prevent Marvel from pushing Hulk hard in the MCU.
I'm not going to wade through the thread in OT, so I don't know if it's posted there, but it seems some parts of the Variety article might be a tad.. unreliably sourced. Like Blade being the 4th lead:
View: https://twitter.com/StarrburyMike/status/1720107202793349261?s=20
And I guess the author has some odd tendencies:
View: https://twitter.com/MsLizzieHill/status/1720053912009326830?t=3mRuksZccMUP2hzmvNOCJA&s=19
Doesn't mean the article is complete bullshit, of course. Not at all. But some details might be quite a bit off the mark, it seems.
View: https://twitter.com/StarrburyMike/status/1720107202793349261?s=20
And I guess the author has some odd tendencies:
View: https://twitter.com/MsLizzieHill/status/1720053912009326830?t=3mRuksZccMUP2hzmvNOCJA&s=19
Doesn't mean the article is complete bullshit, of course. Not at all. But some details might be quite a bit off the mark, it seems.
The OT thread was buzzing with activity. I posted the Lizzie Hill tweet and there hasn't been a response there in over 20 minutes LOL
Also...
They are. Tatiana Siegel is not.
She's not only the one who made the Ray Fisher hit piece, she also wrote the whole thing about Momoa "Dressing up as Johnny Depp" to torture Amber Heard when in reality...he was just dressed as Jason Momoa on a workday
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Yikes. Who knows how much of what she wrote on Marvel were tales from her ass.
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There were a lot of reheated things that we know are real issues at Marvel. Those are true.
Yeah some elements of that article felt highly suspect. The fact that the article claims that Mahershala Ali was at one point demoted to 4th lead in his own movie makes little to no sense. I mean that would be a stark contrast to Kevin Feige having fought tooth and nail for diversity before, especially during the time when Ike Perlmutter was in charge.
There are some things that need work in the MCU that's for certain (i.e. better treatment for VFX artists), won't deny that.
There are some things that need work in the MCU that's for certain (i.e. better treatment for VFX artists), won't deny that.
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Marvel threads are too often a shitshow in the Etcetera forum. Its a waste of time to engage in the back and forth.
I largely ignored the more salacious stuff focused on the real problem: Feige's obsession with fixing stuff in reshoots and post. That's the real problem Marvel Studios has right now aside from Majors and the dumb decision to not feature characters together quickly after the introductions of new ones. I hope that they *are* taking the right steps to right the ship.
I largely ignored the more salacious stuff focused on the real problem: Feige's obsession with fixing stuff in reshoots and post. That's the real problem Marvel Studios has right now aside from Majors and the dumb decision to not feature characters together quickly after the introductions of new ones. I hope that they *are* taking the right steps to right the ship.