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Kotaku UK: Shut The Hell Up, Deacon

eXistor

eXistor

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,324
I hate it when games are afraid to just let the game be. I don't need incessant chatter. I was so pleasantly surprised when Nintendo dared to let Link go at it alone again in BotW. That game has issues, but I love that about it.

On the flip-side I loathe the reboot Tomb Raider series for a multitude of reasons, but one of my main annoyances is that Lara won't shut the fuck up. I literally had to turn off all sounds to be able to get through it.
 
Ahti

Ahti

Unshakable Resolve
Member
Nov 6, 2017
9,235
I didn`t like it at first and got used to it after some hours.
Still not a fan of this char and his monologues tbh.
 
Iwao

Iwao

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,817
Deacon comes across to me as a little unhinged and the performances sell it.

The only bad/jarring parts of this are when he shouts when he's supposed to be in stealth.
 
Zips

Zips

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,913
In some games, I really cannot stand the character constantly making quips. It kind of takes me out of the experience.

I haven't played Days Gone yet but just from what I've seen, it maybe seems like he should be toned back at least a little bit.
 
Dekuman

Dekuman

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,028
This seems like something they can point out in a review as a possible flag for people who don't like chatty main characters. But I don't see why they need to write an op ed about it when even in this thread, it's clear people can't agree on if its good or bad.
 
Hailinel

Hailinel

Shamed a mod for a tag
Member
Oct 27, 2017
35,527
Dekuman said:
This seems like something they can point out in a review as a possible flag for people who don't like chatty main characters. But I don't see why they need to write an op ed about it when even in this thread, it's clear people can't agree on if its good or bad.
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It's Kotaku "THIS PERSONA SONG IN SMASH HAS A SLUR!!!" UK. So this is perhaps not that surprising.
 
P A Z

P A Z

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,916
Barnsley, UK
He isn't Nathan Drake that's for sure and tbh that's what I like about him, he acts like a real person, constantly battling with who he really is and what the world has turned him into.

I wouldn't compare him to Aloy either, Aloy's "constant" talking was in service to the player, we were discovering the world of Horizon alongside her so her commenting on everything makes sense as a way to teach players.

With Deacon it's different, he's not teaching the player about things in the world, we're seeing how a man functions day to day, moment to moment, on the edge of a mental breakdown.
 
Old School Gamer

Old School Gamer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,273
The audio for the game is way out of wack. You can jump off your motorcycle and he'll still be talking loud like he's still on the bike. You'll be in a stealth mission and he'll just start yelling something all of a sudden. He'll also say something that has nothing to do with your currently doing.
 
Dynamite Cop

Dynamite Cop

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,002
California
Edgar said:
but they can be? And they should try to say something more beyond gameplay loops. Thematic elements tied to gameplay and characters , when done right are fantastic and enrich the whole experience .
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My reply was worded poorly. Sure, games can and have told great stories, they just don't tend to be AAA console titles, which are pushed by publishers to sell as many units as possible.
 

Bundy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,931
Ah, another Days Gone thread. And already 6 pages. Imagine my shock.

And yeah, I disagree. It's good. I like it in various open-world games. Especially in Days Gone. "Fuck you Copeland!"
 
Nanashrew

Nanashrew

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,328
KillstealWolf said:
That moment when Bubsy of all things has the solution to the problem.

P9RJokp.jpg


Just have an option slider that lets you decide how much the character talks.

(I'm all for characters talking more, Silent Characters only really work if it's a custom character or a Pair of Jeans character that you are supposed to put yourself into.)
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Bubsy is often what I think of with many current games these days. And by that, I mean Bubsy secretly influenced games by making characters so talkative to a point you'd wish they'd shut up or at least talk a little less.
 
Lowrys

Lowrys

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,444
London
Nightengale said:
Not really. There's some story segments that show that he's really holding himself back when he's with other people. Boozer calls out on how Deacon closes himself off to other people as he internalises his own grief in a way that he doesn't want to share with other people.

It's not elegant, but the story does have moments to explain why Deacon - when he's alone and Deacon - when he's with other people - act differently.
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I'd be interested to hear more details on this. I've just
burned down the church and weaponized Boozer
and, so far, Deacon is a gruff tough dude in cutscenes but an absolute psychopath when alone (e.g. when approaching an enemy camp, "gotta kill em all yeah yeah gotta kill every one of these assholes yeah all of them").
 
noyram23

noyram23

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
9,372
Nah, I like them crazy Deek, I'm even hoping that it seeps out more on his story missions, it does but I want full blown, hopefully in latter ones since this game is looooooong
 
Nightengale

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,708
Malaysia
Lowrys said:
I'd be interested to hear more details on this. I've just
burned down the church and weaponized Boozer
and, so far, Deacon is a gruff tough dude in cutscenes but an absolute psychopath when alone (e.g. when approaching an enemy camp, "gotta kill em all yeah yeah gotta kill every one of these assholes yeah all of them").
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Personally, I view those moments as exactly it.

The whole 'burning the church' thing as his way of 'moving on' is not rational at all, personally I found it something that his physcopath self would do - except in a sombre tone instead of his usual kill em all. It's worth noting - he doesn't tell Boozer that he burned the church. He just said he went there for closure, and killed squatters that was there.

and the scene before that - where O'brian tells you Sara is dead for real, and then when Boozer tries to egg Deacon out of it, he gets really angry and aggresive? That to me, felt like Boozer pulling out a part of the repressed, angry Deacon that we only see when he's alone, constantly struggling due to his frustration on things.

Like I said, it's not elegant, but I see those moments as moments where Deacon - when he's alone, lets himself be unhinged. ( but is also rational enough to know that other people sees his actions as irrational and crazy, so he holds himself back when dealing with other people. )
 
Hokey

Hokey

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,164
I really like the game but have to admit Deacon talking to himself is my least favourite aspect. The way he does it makes him sound crazy (obviously intentional) but I kinda like him less because of it, he does it way too frequently and lastly the mixing is so bad that you can genuinely miss other important dialogue that you trigger because the sounds will just play over the top of each other like a jumbled mess.
 
Raised in a Barn

Raised in a Barn

Chicken Chaser
Member
Mar 26, 2019
224
Cutscene Deacon and gameplay Deacon are two completle different characters.
They never portray him as crazy or insane in any of the cutscenes or general dialouge.

A little unhinged, yeah, but have you seen what the dude been trough? The apocolypse happened, his wife died, and his only friend and companion got badly hurt.
Not being able to handle tragic events and becoming angry or depressed don't make you insane.

Having finished the game I don't think Bend was going for a insane biker guy motive.

Side note, great fucking ending. Like I really really love the ending, I would say better then Last of Us even.
 
MeBecomingI

MeBecomingI

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,091
His talking to himself is actually refreshing. I enjoy his observations and such about the world and whats happening. I find it odd in a lot of open world games where the protagonist is silent while roaming the world, despite the various shit that's happening. It gives us a neat perspective into his perception of the world and I wish more open world games did that. Brings a lot to his character.

Highly disagree with this article.
 
Thorn

Thorn

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
24,446
I dont mind the talking to himself but he always sounds weird sometimes like his voice cracks in a weird way, often when near a nest.
 

Nerokis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,571
lol @ all the people responding to a perfectly reasonable opinion piece by lashing out at Kotaku UK

good god, we're barely better than /r/Games sometimes
 
AudioEppa

AudioEppa

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
4,650
This better be a thing Sony has for its main characters going forward. I love when they talk to themselves, because it's feels like a real person I'm playing. I don't play single player games to role-play myself into the game. I play them because I want to experience a well developed character. It's cool when a character and I think the same as something happens on screen.

And 😂 @ people getting in their feelings over others pooping on this pointless article.
 
Sean

Sean

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,591
Longview
Just beat and platinum'd it today and I have to completely disagree. I've spent a *lot* of time in the game and loved Deacon, he never got old.

And I sure as fuck would be angry and yell at Copeland and talk to myself a lot when the world is that fucked up. Hell, I talk to myself outloud now a lot. I wonder if it's a PNW thing.

The mixing can be pretty awful though, absolutely. It's by far the thing that stood out the most to me in the game as far as "bad" things go. There's not really anything else I had any issues with.
 
Shini42

Shini42

Member
Jan 7, 2018
419
That is why I didn't listened to reviews and bought the game. It seems like some people just wanted to hate Days Gone no matter what. First I thought it was zombie fatigue, but it turns out even bigger than that. Game isn't perfect by a long shot, but come on... at some point you aren't giving a valuable feedback anymore, you're just knit picking.
 
Antrax

Antrax

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,300
This kinda thing is annoying in every game that does this. Stop making your characters respond to literally every contextual interaction.

I love GR: Wildlands, but if I hear "aw come on, you never let me drive anymore. Because of that one time!" when I get in a fucking vehicle, I'll snap lol

Jeremy said:
I must say that I don't get the need to "like" characters at all.
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It's at least harder to make unlikable protags in games because I'm expected to actually "be" them for the whole duration, which can be hours and hours of content. In a movie with a dick as the main character, you're still just watching and you can root against them. In a game where you play a dick, the game doesn't let you run the MC into a horde of enemies and get wrecked lol.
 
The Praiseworthy

The Praiseworthy

Member
Oct 30, 2017
9,232
lol what.... ?

Deacon's blabbering is one of the best things about Days Gone, the voice actor and the script are good fun and interesting.
 

Joco

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,446
Peter Parker in Spiderman PS4 kind of annoyed me in this way as well. I got that part of his character was being this cocky, smart-alecky guy, but after a while I just wanted him to shut up.
 
TinfoilHatsROn

TinfoilHatsROn

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
3,119
So it's WORSE than the Horizon e3 demo? Well that's a hard pass then. God I hated that shit. I appreciate the dedication to storytelling though but I also want to enjoy environments and stealth and talking ruins any immersion.
 
timedesk

timedesk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,937
TinfoilHatsROn said:
So it's WORSE than the Horizon e3 demo? Well that's a hard pass then. God I hated that shit. I appreciate the dedication to storytelling though but I also want to enjoy environments and stealth and talking ruins any immersion.
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I can understand that. I personally enjoy the characterization that comes from the characters talking. I really hate silent protagonists and just find them boring. Everyone has a thing that can pull that out of the game, like I hated not being able to disagree with the cat in Persona 5 when he told me to go to bed. There are always some elements of how a game wants to structure itself that get in the way of how you want to play. It doesn't mean the game is bad, but I can understand having less interest in it.
 
TinfoilHatsROn

TinfoilHatsROn

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
3,119
timedesk said:
I can understand that. I personally enjoy the characterization that comes from the characters talking. I really hate silent protagonists and just find them boring. Everyone has a thing that can pull that out of the game, like I hated not being able to disagree with the cat in Persona 5 when he told me to go to bed. There are always some elements of how a game wants to structure itself that get in the way of how you want to play. It doesn't mean the game is bad, but I can understand having less interest in it.
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Sure. I mean I think HL 1 and 2 are amazing in both game play and story but it would have been ruined for me (and probably a lot of other folks I imagine) if Gordon talked to himself after every story moment or something. Or hell Doom 2016 for something more modern. You might not enjoy them. Whatever.
Edit: Different strokes for different folks is how it goes. I think.
 
BarryFishFinger

BarryFishFinger

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,508
Hard disagree from me, I love it. The performance is great, some of the ways he says stuff is proper unhinged and it feels right for the character, the setting, the tone. The guy really hates rippers and marauders, ha. In camps and talking with other people he's fairly normal, but out in the wilderness alone he goes a little nuts. I've not found it intrusive or annoying.
 
ToddBonzalez

ToddBonzalez

The Pyramids? That's nothing compared to RDR2
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,530
I like it. Deacon's insane ramblings add a lot to his characterization. Honestly I wish more of that personality came out in cutscenes.
 
timedesk

timedesk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,937
TinfoilHatsROn said:
Sure. I mean I think HL 1 and 2 are amazing in both game play and story but it would have been ruined for me (and probably a lot of other folks I imagine) if Gordon talked to himself after every story moment or something. Or hell Doom 2016 for something more modern. You might not enjoy them. Whatever.
Edit: Different strokes for different folks is how it goes. I think.
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Just want to say I see your point. There are absolutely some games that tell their story well without the main character even saying a word out loud. Some of those games, like HL1, might have a smaller story, but talking absolutely would have impacted it. I'm sorry if I sounded judgemental in my earlier post. It really is more of a preference thing I think. I find that so long as what the character is saying is interesting, or reflects their personality/development, I'm fine even if it might mess with the reality of the story. It is easy to see how others might not though.
 
Mik2121

Mik2121

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,948
Japan
TinfoilHatsROn said:
So it's WORSE than the Horizon e3 demo? Well that's a hard pass then. God I hated that shit. I appreciate the dedication to storytelling though but I also want to enjoy environments and stealth and talking ruins any immersion.
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I've been playing for a while and didn't really think he speaks that much. At least not nearly as much as Alloy during that demo. I remember when I watched that demo I also thought she spoke a bit too much, but in Days Gone, Deacon doesn't really speak that much. He is a bit deranged though, but I thought it kind of matched his personality.
 
SuzanoSho

SuzanoSho

Member
Dec 25, 2017
1,466
I got the impression that Deacon's circumstances were slowly and gradually driving him towards insanity the entire time, and his constant banter felt like it intentionally helped to drive that home; his coping mechanism, if you will. This article, as per usual Kotaku, seems to be another pointlessly nitpicky talking point just for the sake of having something to make an article about, and I'm positive that Days Gone's less than stellar reviews made the decision to write this up pretty easy for them...
 
Joeyro

Joeyro

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,760
Lopez said:
Lol people keep saying this

Does he like actively enjoy murdering or something?
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He is just a somewhat "realistic" portrayal of someone that lives in a world after the zombie apocalypse. He doesn't enjoy murdering others but he is desensitized after everything he lost and how far the world has fallen. Honestly, his personality fits well with the setting, better than a snarky likable character the mows down zombies and human enemies alike while dropping quips on the fly.
 
Protome

Protome

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,724
On top of my other issues with the voice acting I'd also love to know why they made Deacon's voice actor yell every line he has on a bike but not make any other character do that.

Like either the bike is loud enough that you need to yell or it isn't lol
 
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