Kojima is so far ahead in terms of Cinematography in Games (Warning: GIF Heavy)
- Thread starter BossAttack
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OP
OP
Nah.
It was an intentional stylistic approach for MGSV. It's used far less often and less dramatically in DS.
And it's shot like a music video.
Like, we're talking about cinematography but we really could nail down what we're looking for when we say that. Stylish cuts is also cinematography but I think the subject is just as much about the motivation in a camera shot and the story it's contextualized for.
i just think you're not really paying attention or playing a lot of stuff if that's what you currently believe
try more different stuff!
I think MGSV, MGS-Stranding, Beyond Two Souls/Detroit, God of War, Mass Effect 3 - those games all suddenly adapted to this style of "Woah look we can make the camera move all the time" to the point where the camera-work draws more attention to itself than it should.
I also still don't understand what was good about God of War's "one-take" camera besides the fact that it's a feat and they managed to never break their rule. Cinematically and storytelling wise I don't understand what makes it good, and I have similar issues with the other games. And small aside, developers please stop doing this:
(Pretend: Zoom-back-to-gameplay, "It's like you didn't even notice the gameplay was taken out from the cutscene! /s")
I will say Death Stranding has some good key emotional cues despite the fact that they play so much around with the constant dolly and perry camera techniques.
And Sutherland did a great Venom Snake.
People were bitching about no Hayter but once people gave Sutherland a chance they all but forgot him.
AH yes, loved that scene!!
The ending of that game is very good in my opinion.
OP
OP
I agree with God of War. The one take was a mistake. I'm not sure what it added to the storytelling. If anything, it hurt certain narrative elements by limiting what the camera could do.
I feel like Yoshinori Kitase belongs in this conversation - and had he stayed in the Director position going into the last couple generations he'd hands-down be considered right there with Kojima.
FFVII, VIII, and X (hell, even VI in the 16-bit era) all have some creative, powerful cinematography. In VII, VIII, and X's case, that's not just in the CG, but also in the in-game cutscenes. The guy's primary passion was filmmaking, which is what endeared him to Sakaguchi back in the early '90s.
Silent Hill has also had some brilliant game cinematography between Toyama (SH1) and Sato (SH2; even though he wasn't the main director, he handled all the CG scenes).
FFVII, VIII, and X (hell, even VI in the 16-bit era) all have some creative, powerful cinematography. In VII, VIII, and X's case, that's not just in the CG, but also in the in-game cutscenes. The guy's primary passion was filmmaking, which is what endeared him to Sakaguchi back in the early '90s.
Silent Hill has also had some brilliant game cinematography between Toyama (SH1) and Sato (SH2; even though he wasn't the main director, he handled all the CG scenes).
I still don't get the praise for it either. What do people think it added? I want to know. I feel like the whole collective review-process for GoW consisted of people looking at what it does and just saying "Wow X thing is so good, this is better than all other video games!" for no reason.
Form the tip of my head:
Neil Druckmann
Cory Barlog
Tetsuya Nomura
Ken Levine
David Cage
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It gave the game a sense of presence. You didn't momentarily lose where to focus on the scene after a camera cut.
i dont particularly remember a lot of the framing in god of war but I thought the effort to do the one-take style made sense thematically tho it was slightly contradicted by the style of the game (beat ppl up, explore a bit, maybe some story, beat ppl up). it helped carry across the weariness of both main characters and the constant shifts from peacefulness to these survival-ish vibes. it also, for me, really helped that scene where you leave atreus to fend for himself, I think that was the best usage of it, a time skip w/o a time skip
I think the most western example we have of him is Casey Hudson, in terms of having the willingness to create outlandish concepts and having a big enough ego that they're personally monitoring significant parts of the game to the point of sprinkling them with self-indulgent favorites.
Mass Effect 1's intro and endings are all recreations of Casey Hudson's favorite scenes from some of his favorite movies, like The Right Stuff. Mass Effect 2's suicide mission was also a multi-disciplinary task strung together because Casey from the outset said "I want this to resolve in a high-stakes suicide mission where all your friends can live or die" and he sat down before anything in the game was made with Jack Wall, their Lead Composer, and went through ideas for the music. He did similar things for Mass Effect 3, and I like it less, but you know, it drew from independence day a lot and I think Casey was at a loss about how to pin down the ending and went with the original Deus Ex's ending as his motif.
LOL. Kojima's such a perve.
Oh yeah Detroit has a fantastic 5 minute uninterrupted one take that is also interactive while being highly directed in one of the branches. Probably the best gamey scene too in a choice based game. Would like to see more of these one takes that can branch off seamlessly while incorporating their QTEs and dialogue choices inside without ever breaking the cut.
Big spoiler warning though (the very end):
Big spoiler warning though (the very end):
Terra untying her bow and being free despite a destroyed world is imo the most powerful game scene ever made despite being made with 16 bit blockheads.
Prime Squaresoft shits all over these scenes he posted imo.
The high five from heaven in X. Never forget.
Sorry, but Kojima is stuck on some 80s-action movie level of cinematography. This doesn't even include the wacky stories he tries to make look deep with overlong cutscenes.
As mentioned earlier, Bioshock and Bioshock Infinite are far superior in cinematography. Also Cory Balrog's God of War was amazing. The presentation of Baldur was just impressive.
As mentioned earlier, Bioshock and Bioshock Infinite are far superior in cinematography. Also Cory Balrog's God of War was amazing. The presentation of Baldur was just impressive.
As impressive as the visuals are of Uncharted 4 there is still a feeling of actors on a stage by the way the actual shots look. Kojima is about the only one where it looks like a movie, doesn't make his games the best or even his cinematics the most enjoyable but he has a great eye for film like quality.
Kojima, and his staff, does a really excellent job of mixing shaky camera with actual good camera angles and effect. It doesn't just shake, it specifically shows you what you need to see.
For example,; The camera will pan around before returning to its characters. It will show reactions before a character sharply steps into view, readjusting to hilight the change in tone in the scene. It will increase the franticness of and jerkiness of its movement to match what emotion the scene is trying to convey (like the sharp jerking the camera does whenever a BT appears).
For example,; The camera will pan around before returning to its characters. It will show reactions before a character sharply steps into view, readjusting to hilight the change in tone in the scene. It will increase the franticness of and jerkiness of its movement to match what emotion the scene is trying to convey (like the sharp jerking the camera does whenever a BT appears).
Lol, oh boy. This website feels really sheltered sometimes.
I think the reason why it seems that Kojima has a great eye for cinematography is because he emulates movie shooting for his cut scenes. You can imagine his camera on a dolly or a handheld for certain shots and as a result his scenes/shots "flow" together well.
I agree his scenes have a distinct visual style, but if we compare it to actual well-regarded cinematography from movies it comes off as a pale imitation.
I agree his scenes have a distinct visual style, but if we compare it to actual well-regarded cinematography from movies it comes off as a pale imitation.
To all the naysayers, once you play Death Stranding, you will feel ashamed your words and deeds.
I didn't. I thought and still think he was a shit snake.
Also Setzer telling the story about Daryl- walking down the long stairway as you control your character with the flashbacks playing in the background? Incredibly creative and well done considering the tech limitations.
The overall direction of FFVIII's ending, even taken as 'silent movie' quality, is stronger cinematic work than anything I've seen from Kojima (I have not beaten DS yet).
Have something to contribute?
We're not saying DS stands next to actual well-shot movies. But it stands very tall in a field where the competition is Fallen Order and Sekiro. :P
God of War, Read Dead Redemption 2, Last of Us, GTAV, Wolfenstein: The New Colossus are just a few examples of games with cutscenes better acted, directed and with better cinematography that anything Kojima has ever even dreamed of.
I like the cutscenes in Kojima games but c'mon guys, they are not that good.
I like the cutscenes in Kojima games but c'mon guys, they are not that good.
The amount of folks in here trying to downplay Kojima cinematography, in terms of gaming it's above the rest. Characters feel like part of the action and frame they aren't awkwardly placed and the camera accentuates their action with its placement.
Of those 5 games, choose a scene from each that surpasses the cinematography in a kojima game?
"c'mon guys, accept my extremely minority opinion"
You'll find areas where ERA will gladly harp on Kojima, this is not one of them
I was just thinking, 20 years ago the intro to MGS 1 blew my mind as a young kid and now 20 years later the cutscenes in Death Stranding were the only ones in a long time that managed to really impress me. Other games don't come close as far as I am concerned.
People like to simultaneously make fun of Kojima for knowing more about cinema more than games at the same time as making fun of him for not knowing anything about cinema.
Can't stop people from hating, but you gotta choose one.
You obviously haven't played Death Stranding, and if you have then you definitely haven't seen all of its content. Better is subjective, but it's easily on the same level as the games listed there.
Vagrant story and mgs 1 is the most cinematic games on ps1 imo