Deleted member 11413

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Saying that hispanics are more diverse ideologically than black Americans isn't saying that black Americans are a hive mind.

Its also measurable on most axes, e.g. the political stats that have already been posted are a partial validation. It also just logically follows because hispanics literally have more cultural diversity in their recent ancestry than black Americans.

It feels like nuance is dead on this forum.
This is such a weird thing to say anyway though, black Americans are just as ideologically diverse as any other group. Just because the majority of this group votes Democrat doesn't negate that at all. Hell, the Democratic Party itself is fairly ideologically diverse.

Also "more cultural diversity in their recent ancestry"? What does that mean exactly?
 

Epiphyte

Member
Nov 4, 2017
132
what does cultural diversity in their recent ancestry mean
They weren't slaves

The cultural erasure+blending as a result of slavery really did forge American Blacks into a fairly unique culture vs. other immigrant diaspora. I mean, the whole existence of Kwanzaa is a result of America erasing peoples culture to the extent that pan-africanism is the best we could offer
 

Deleted member 11413

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They weren't slaves

The cultural erasure+blending as a result of slavery really did forge American Blacks into a fairly unique culture vs. other immigrant diaspora. I mean, the whole existence of Kwanzaa is a result of America erasing peoples culture to the extent that pan-africanism is the best we could offer
There were black slaves in places other than the US...
 

Mudo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,132
Tennessee
STOP TALKING JOE!!!!
He's been doing great for months, under the radar, cruising along to election, but now I keep seeing quotes with BS like this in the last week, and debates coming up, and it all worries me. He just does the gaffe thing constantly in life. Also, I really hope how that quote sounds is not what his intent is. So now all African Americans are basically the same, everywhere? really?????????
 

Deepwater

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,349
They weren't slaves

The cultural erasure+blending as a result of slavery really did forge American Blacks into a fairly unique culture vs. other immigrant diaspora. I mean, the whole existence of Kwanzaa is a result of America erasing peoples culture to the extent that pan-africanism is the best we could offer

latinos were actually slaves, but I can imagine you wouldn't consider that if you dont count the black ones, which is why this is not a good answer. Not to mention, not every black person in america were descendants of the slave trade.
 

collige

Member
Oct 31, 2017
12,772
OK so what I'm getting from the last few pages is that apparently the "notable exceptions" he was talking about are "literally every black person that immigrated in the last 60+ years and their families"
 

Neece

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,514
latinos were actually slaves, but I can imagine you wouldn't consider that if you dont count the black ones, which is why this is not a good answer. Not to mention, not every black person in america were descendants of the slave trade.
Which is why there is debate right now among black people about reparations, and which black people should or should not get them.

Diversity....
 

Epiphyte

Member
Nov 4, 2017
132
latinos were actually slaves, but I can imagine you wouldn't consider that if you dont count the black ones, which is why this is not a good answer. Not to mention, not every black person in america were descendants of the slave trade.
You're right

Latino identity in and of itself is complicated as shit
 

Deleted member 2699

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JetmanJay

Member
Nov 1, 2017
3,695
Absolutely. I've talked to a lot of people this year who would've voted for Trump over Bernie and Warren because communism or whatever, but are voting for Biden in November.

it doesn't make sense to me really, but he's our best shot.

I mean, I hope you're right. I really do. But we all know there's a strong, strong chance this guy is gonna to say some dummy shit or completely lose his train of thought and give us a thousand yard stare on live TV during the debate.
All of us here will vote for him no matter what at this point, but what about those fringe middle ground voters?
 

ebs

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
443
This is such a weird thing to say anyway though, black Americans are just as ideologically diverse as any other group. Just because the majority of this group votes Democrat doesn't negate that at all. Hell, the Democratic Party itself is fairly ideologically diverse.

Also "more cultural diversity in their recent ancestry"? What does that mean exactly?

I don't think it's weird to state points with strong evidence backing it up, which greatly influence the political landscape of the US.

I just mean if you trace back an equal amount of time for all black Americans and hispanic Americans, and make that a meaningfully recent amount of time (you're more likely to be influenced by the beliefs of your grandparents than great-great-great grandparents), and you then count the unique ethnocultural groupings (geography, religion, language etc) of those ancestors, then hispanic Americans will have more groups.

And then logically the descendants of more groupings will have more diversity in their ideologies.

Note: you really have to use the word diversity here in its pure sense, not as the politically charged version.
 

Deleted member 6230

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I don't think it's weird to state points with strong evidence backing it up, which greatly influence the political landscape of the US.

I just mean if you trace back an equal amount of time for all black Americans and hispanic Americans, and make that a meaningfully recent amount of time (you're more likely to be influenced by the beliefs of your grandparents than great-great-great grandparents), and you then count the unique ethnocultural groupings (geography, religion, language etc) of those ancestors, then hispanic Americans will have more groups.

And then logically the descendants of more groupings will have more diversity in their ideologies.

Note: you really have to use the word diversity here in its pure sense, not as the politically charged version.
This makes no fucking sense dawg lol
 

Deepwater

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,349
I don't think it's weird to state points with strong evidence backing it up, which greatly influence the political landscape of the US.

I just mean if you trace back an equal amount of time for all black Americans and hispanic Americans, and make that a meaningfully recent amount of time (you're more likely to be influenced by the beliefs of your grandparents than great-great-great grandparents), and you then count the unique ethnocultural groupings (geography, religion, language etc) of those ancestors, then hispanic Americans will have more groups.

How do you make this determination when black people can also be hispanic or latino.
 

Orb

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,465
USA
It's just so fucking sad that his biggest asset is he's not Trump and the strategy most people are advocating is "don't talk, Joe."
 

cloudy

Member
Nov 10, 2017
3,256
Man, people really hate Biden here. He was obviously talking about ideological diversity. It's crazy how every gaffe he makes is dissected for malicious intent
 

Royalan

Because you are my sister in the craft.
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
14,963
Man, people really hate Biden here. He was obviously talking about ideological diversity. It's crazy how every gaffe he makes is dissected for malicious intent

It's not just here.

Black media's been talking about this since he made the comments.

He will no doubt be asked to clarify his remarks next time he does interviews.
 

Deleted member 11046

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I haven't conflated once in this thread. In fact I made it a point to say black american and not african american.
Yeah that's fair. The error was made by the person you were replying to then. The point stands.

Not even close. As much as I despise Bloomberg, I'd feel way less worried going into the next election with him running over Biden. And that says a LOT.
I don't see how that is possible.

I expect that the idea behind his very strange words was simply that black people vote Democrat more reliably than Latino people. Totally not the same thing as diversity, but he's a politician running for office. That's exactly how he sees his information, day in and day out.
His words weren't strange. Just ignorant and casually racist. But I'd like to point out that many people in this thread are following his lead in at least one aspect. Biden was wrong to speak of African Americans as a monolith, regardless of his intent, but he was equally mistaken to speak of Latinos as a separate racial group when "Latino" isn't a race. One quarter of all Latinos in the US identify as black, the majority of humans of African descent outside of Africa are Latino, and Latin America has the largest population of black people in the Americas. Referring to "Latino" as a race that specifically excludes black people contributes to the erasure of afro-latinos and is insensitive.
 

Deepwater

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,349
its reallllllly telling when yall think black people in the states are no more than fucking slaves and our culture and ideology are homogenized because of it.
 

Deleted member 6230

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Man, people really hate Biden here. He was obviously talking about ideological diversity. It's crazy how every gaffe he makes is dissected for malicious intent
I don't know how any one can say Black people aren't ideological diverse. Even among Democratic voters there's ideological diversity so I don't really get how people can assume that doesn't extend to Black folk. But y'all say anything to absolve this white man of his nonsense so have it
 
Jul 13, 2020
211
User Banned (2 weeks): Trolling over multiple posts, account in junior phase
Oh nooooo...a verbal gaffe! Let's all blow it out of proportion and pretend it's making us question whether he'd be a better President than the demon currently in office. Aaaaaaah! Or something...
 

Jibberhack

Member
Oct 30, 2017
853
I don't know how any one can say Black people aren't ideological diverse. Even among Democratic voters there's ideological diversity so I don't really get how people can assume that doesn't extend to Black folk. But y'all say anything to absolve this white man of his nonsense so have it

There's been ideological diversity since Booker T. Washington and W. E. B. Du Bois. Smh.
 

Jer

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,349
It's just so fucking sad that his biggest asset is he's not Trump and the strategy most people are advocating is "don't talk, Joe."

His biggest assets are that Trump can't define him negatively, he seems to be Teflon, and he appeals to swing state voters. He's a much stronger candidate than he gets credit for here.
 

Orb

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,465
USA
It's gonna be wild watching someone get banned from this forum for defending statements made by the Democratic nominee for President of the United States.

Oh nooooo...a verbal gaffe! Let's all blow it out of proportion and pretend it's making us question whether he'd be a better President than the demon currently in office. Aaaaaaah! Or something...
It wasn't a verbal gaffe. He didn't misspeak. He said the same thing twice in two different interviews. He believes it and for some reason thinks it's a good idea to say it out loud.
 

Maxim726x

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
13,958
The problem we have, of course, is that Biden's past gaffe's have been countered by absolutely catastrophic news cycles for Trump.

That's a luck buffer. We can run out of luck to mitigate Biden's problems and we might have this cycle.

No one is going to give a fuck about anything but Covid. Both it's direct threat and economic threat.

Gaffes from either are going to be forgotten almost immediately... After we see a new death toll, or that schools that are open are forced to close because staff/students are sick with Covid.

Then, you have the second wave that is likely to coincide with the flu in October. He's probably already fucked beyond redemption, the rest of this is noise.
 

Rewind

Member
Oct 27, 2017
588
Yeah, this is pretty fucked. Can't believe some people are actually trying to defend that all black people have the same political ideology so it's okay. Reminds me when people were arguing that black voters are uninformed. You can vote for Biden and still call out some of the horrible shit he spews sometimes. He needs to apologize, if nothing else, to not normalize shit like this more than it already is.
 
Jul 13, 2020
211
It's gonna be wild watching someone get banned from this forum for defending statements made by the Democratic nominee for President of the United States.


It wasn't a verbal gaffe. He didn't misspeak. He said the same thing twice in two different interviews. He believes it and for some reason thinks it's a good idea to say it out loud.

Ok, as a Black Man, it didn't for a nanosecond make me even consider not voting for him and voting out Orange Satan.

Because I'm an adult and a pragmatist. But go off, I guess...
 

Deleted member 11413

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22,961
I don't think it's weird to state points with strong evidence backing it up, which greatly influence the political landscape of the US.

I just mean if you trace back an equal amount of time for all black Americans and hispanic Americans, and make that a meaningfully recent amount of time (you're more likely to be influenced by the beliefs of your grandparents than great-great-great grandparents), and you then count the unique ethnocultural groupings (geography, religion, language etc) of those ancestors, then hispanic Americans will have more groups.

And then logically the descendants of more groupings will have more diversity in their ideologies.

Note: you really have to use the word diversity here in its pure sense, not as the politically charged version.
Except this is all bullshit. There are black Latinos, there are tons of black people who have immigrated here from a wide variety of countries with vastly different cultures and ideologies, there are black people who immigrated here who DO have a slave history, but were slaves in entirely different countries and under entirely different European colonial projects and thus, while having a shared generational trauma of 'slavery', have different languages, cultures, and customs. There are people here who's ancestors never experienced slavery but experienced Apartheid, the Holocaust, and other forms of genocide

I mean just in terms of religious identity black Americans are incredibly ideologically diverse, encompassing all three Abrahamic religions (Islam, Christianity, Judaism) plus a wide variety of other cultural belief systems.

In light of that your response just seems really ignorant
 

TheHunter

Bold Bur3n Wrangler
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
25,774
Oh nooooo...a verbal gaffe! Let's all blow it out of proportion and pretend it's making us question whether he'd be a better President than the demon currently in office. Aaaaaaah! Or something...
We can demand better out of our candidates without walking all over already vulnerable minorities.
 

Sixfortyfive

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,615
Atlanta
You know defending the racist shit that just can't stop coming out of Bidens mouth makes you look racist too, right? You don't have to do this.
I don't know how they always jump to "so all the black people who voted for him in the primary were wrong, huh?" like it's some kind of gotcha.

Man, people really hate Biden here. He was obviously talking about ideological diversity. It's crazy how every gaffe he makes is dissected for malicious intent
I really don't think this argument has the weight that you think it does.

The fact that the Republican party is so hostile to African American needs to the point where they vote Democratic by default does not mean that the black electorate is not ideologically diverse. It simply means that the entire political spectrum of the black electorate basically exists within the boundaries of the Democratic party as a result.
 

lowmelody

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,101
The interference running and excuses are mind numbing at this point. It's not a 'gaffe', unless you consider letting the mask drop a 'gaffe'. Biden has always been racist. That shock and/or denial is on you.

Just because you're determined to vote for him doesn't mean he isn't a racist shit head. Just because he's 'not as bad as Trump' doesn't mean every racist thing that falls from his mouth has to be white splained away. People in here brow beating black people to fall in line with a smile just like Biden does.

Oh nooooo...a verbal gaffe! Let's all blow it out of proportion and pretend it's making us question whether he'd be a better President than the demon currently in office. Aaaaaaah! Or something...

Embarrassing.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,880
I'm not even gonna waste my time getting angry at this shit. Biden is an old white-ass white dude, and I've already come to terms with his cordially racist shit. Time for him to run it back and "clarify" as always.
 

Korranator

Banned
Nov 5, 2017
43
Biden has always been a complete liar and a disgrace. I still can't believe this is the best the DNC could do. It should have been Bernie.
 

Deleted member 11413

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Ok, as a Black Man, it didn't for a nanosecond make me even consider not voting for him and voting out Orange Satan.

Because I'm an adult and a pragmatist. But go off, I guess...
What does this have to do with voting for Biden instead of Trump though? People can dislike this statement and call it out as wrong and still vote for Biden...they aren't mutually exclusive.