Is Persona killing Shin Megami Tensei series? [yes]
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Interesting to hear people wanted more Digital Devil Saga.
Don't get me wrong, both games are great and I honestly prefer them over Persona in terms of atmosphere and story, but to me they feel complete as a duology. I never felt the need to have any more.
Don't get me wrong, both games are great and I honestly prefer them over Persona in terms of atmosphere and story, but to me they feel complete as a duology. I never felt the need to have any more.
Yeah I'm a little concerned after Radiant Historia RM. For Nocturne its visual presentation is a big part of its identity. It's supposed to be off-putting. You mess with the art and you tank the mood. Which is to say nothing of the general direction, shot composition, editing, sound design. Atlus is full of allot of talented people but I am afraid that they made not be able to recapture the magic of the original Nocturne.
I'll give Nocturne another go in honor of this thread. IV wasn't very good imo, haven't finished that one.
I always forget that DDS on the PS2 existed.
Do you consider an "offshoot" of the SMT series to not be "part" of that series?
Do you consider an "offshoot" of the SMT series to not be "part" of that series?
They liked the hybrid concept, SMT IV is the best selling SMT, and the mainline games have been historically on Nintendo platforms.
Trying to understand why Atlus is still making platform exclusives is another debate.
Unless the game is impossible to play without mandatory handheld gameplay, I don't know why it isn't multiplatform. It would benefit the SMT series greatly
it was announced very early on so probably some kind of deal with Nintendo I would guess, although it's not like Atlus are exactly know for being rational with their platform choices
While the recent SMT games being on 3DS/('not modern platforms') has limited awareness amongst those players on HD systems compared to Persona, they were also on the most popular Nintendo platform at the time, and therefore received plenty of promotion in the same format (directs) that went on to promote SMTV on Switch when it was announced.
I don't think the series so much fight for attention as cross-promote either: I only played Persona 4G on Vita because I loved SMT Strange Journey and Devil Survivor on DS, and then went back to SMTIV on 3DS after. Although I think that was down to the delayed EU digital-only release, which probably doesn't help my case :D
All in all, I think having Devil Survivor, Devil Survivor 2, SMTIV, Devil Summoner, SMTIV:A, Strange Journey Redux, Persona Q and Persona Q2 all on 3DS is a pretty good lead-in to SMTV. Not only that, but I think JRPGs as a whole kinda cross-promote, and there's a valid criticism that the Switch was perhaps even a little too JRPG-heavy (depending on your genre preferences) in some directs. While Persona might have a lot of Atlus resources dedicated to it, I suspect SMTV will gain a lot of visibility from Nintendo pushing it too.
I'm quite looking forward to playing PQ2 while I wait, probably my last 3DS game.
I don't think the series so much fight for attention as cross-promote either: I only played Persona 4G on Vita because I loved SMT Strange Journey and Devil Survivor on DS, and then went back to SMTIV on 3DS after. Although I think that was down to the delayed EU digital-only release, which probably doesn't help my case :D
All in all, I think having Devil Survivor, Devil Survivor 2, SMTIV, Devil Summoner, SMTIV:A, Strange Journey Redux, Persona Q and Persona Q2 all on 3DS is a pretty good lead-in to SMTV. Not only that, but I think JRPGs as a whole kinda cross-promote, and there's a valid criticism that the Switch was perhaps even a little too JRPG-heavy (depending on your genre preferences) in some directs. While Persona might have a lot of Atlus resources dedicated to it, I suspect SMTV will gain a lot of visibility from Nintendo pushing it too.
I'm quite looking forward to playing PQ2 while I wait, probably my last 3DS game.
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Yamai said it's because of the hybrid nature of the Switch: it will be the best looking SMT game so great to play on the TV, but the demon raising mechanics fits well with an handheld as it was with SMTIV (I'd add JRPG in general are a good fit on a handheld). Also 5 out of 6 mainline entries are on Nintendo systems.
https://kotaku.com/atlus-on-why-shin-megami-tensei-v-is-a-nintendo-switch-1819868716
As for why it is exclusive I still think Nintendo and Sony pay Atlus for the SMT and Persona exclusivities.
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So supposedly we are hearing atlas stuff tomorrow?
Maybe will will hear more about SMTV there, god I've been craving it so bad.
Edit: and yes, there are easy modes.
Maybe will will hear more about SMTV there, god I've been craving it so bad.
They really aren't that hard, they just punish you if you don't put some thought into your team, and not anything like min-matching, just rock paper scissor stuff and buffs. It's nothing like say, Sekiro, in which you can slam your head on a boss for hours.
Edit: and yes, there are easy modes.
I wouldn't say they're exactly harder games than Persona.
e.g. Nocturne have 2 or 3 really hard bosses but Nyx Avatar or Shadow Mitsuo are several times harder than the other ones.
Strange Journey is probably the hardest one, while SMTIV is laughable easy.
I'd blame Atlus going for the quick and easy cash instead of blaming Persona fans, but that's just me :P
It's not so much that they are hard, but as demons make up 3/4 of your party, and you are constantly evolving/fusing them, you need to pay a bit more attention to your shifting party makeup than in an RPG like Persona where you are constantly upgrading the same handful of units where you are very familiar with their strengths and weaknesses. As such, you have a far larger selection of options for party recruitment/makeup, and that makeup is constantly expanding/changing, with all the advantages of choice and disadvantages of lack of familiarity/choice paralysis.
I really like SMT, by the time you've got a sizeable demon stock it's like managing a small army. That they join at a suitable level, and powerful ones can only be fused by fusing high-level demons, means less focus on grinding units up (which is often why I rarely use units from the subs bench in JRPGs) and more focus on experimentation.
I like SMT for the focus it has on judo-christian mythology, Most of the Law/Chaos/Neutral endings stuff just came across as 2 bad endings and a good one to me, as both law and chaos are presented as so extreme it's insane.
I liked that Apoc went in a different direction, although I do suppose I don't care too greatly for "THE POWER OF FREINDSHIP". But hey, Kill your friends boyo.
The thing I liked the most in Apocalypse was actually focusing on Celtic myth with Dagda/Danu at the front rather than Lucifer etc again. I found the 'power of friendship/go it alone' choice less interesting than law/neutral/chaos though, considering that the cast largely pushes you towards the former with it's barrage of generic JRPG cliches. All in all I found the happy-go-lucky teen anime pasted onto the demonic apocalypse a really odd choice, but hey, Dagda/Krishna made for some interesting dialogue. The improved maps and tweaked battle system was fun too, although the final dungeon really outstayed it's welcome.
I hope we see a little more of SMTV soon though, my enthusiasm for it remains undimmed.
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The fact that Apocalypse (i haven't played so i can't really talk about it) kinda ignored the whole allignment system i think is one of the things that hurted SMT fans the most, i hope they don't go that route again and i think they already said they won't.
Not gonna lie, I think the allignment system in how it was used up until apoc is nothing more than a 2deep4u farce. I mean, law is always genocide or permanent mind control for everyone, and chaos is permanent weirdmageddon, and fan's of SMT like to parade these choices about as if they are anything more than a shit ending. Anyone with half a brain can see that neutral is pretty much your standard "Good Ending".
Although...
SJR (Although I never actually finished it), I think it basically added what is a good law and good chaos ending, plus an even gooder neutral. It's an improvement on what was there originally.
SEGA fucked up badly with SMT in Europe.
I waited two years for the EU release for SMT4, not after the JP release but after the US one.
When it came out I was so tired I bought it and never bothered to learn how to play.
Meanwhile, they had good reviews for Golden and pushed on Persona just enough to not piss off fans.
I waited two years for the EU release for SMT4, not after the JP release but after the US one.
When it came out I was so tired I bought it and never bothered to learn how to play.
Meanwhile, they had good reviews for Golden and pushed on Persona just enough to not piss off fans.
And it sold what, a third of what P5 did if these numbers are right? 600k vs 2 mil roughly? I think the next game on switch will do a good share better honestly but yeah that shit didn't exactly set the charts on fire
I think SMT5 is gonna sell really well on Switch. It's going to give Persona a run for it's money. SMT4 was solid but 3DS to me, was the wrong platform.
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It sold as much as Persona 3 which is the game that convinced Atlus to invest more in Persona.
Persona is just an easier spinoff series to market, compared to the flagship Shin Megami Tensei. SMT have a darker and more serious tone to them in terms of presentation. Not saying Persona lacks this, but in terms of marketing, you need to admit that Persona is easier, and less costly, to market.
And this wouldn't be the first instance of a spinoff surpassing its father franchise.
And this wouldn't be the first instance of a spinoff surpassing its father franchise.
SMT fans who don't like Persona overreact to Persona even existing as a series
We got SMT4:A in the same year as Persona 5, and that's been the only mainline game in either series so far. We know SMT5 is coming, and we're fairly sure that the new P5R is going to be an SMT4A style mainline pseudo-sequel, so the two franchises are in a pretty good balance to each other.
Spinoffs we've had Persona Q2, the dance games which were really one release split in two versions ala Pokémon, a mobile gacha for SMT, and that side scroller thing for SMT.
There was a period where Persona was getting a LOT more spinoffs under Index but that seems to be over. Furthermore SMT used to get a lot of other spinoffs, the major change here is that THOSE have disappeared in favor of Persona spinoffs. SMT proper is releasing at about the same clip it always has.
To put it bluntly, I strongly disagree with the premise that SMT is dying by Persona's hand, or that it's dying at all.
We got SMT4:A in the same year as Persona 5, and that's been the only mainline game in either series so far. We know SMT5 is coming, and we're fairly sure that the new P5R is going to be an SMT4A style mainline pseudo-sequel, so the two franchises are in a pretty good balance to each other.
Spinoffs we've had Persona Q2, the dance games which were really one release split in two versions ala Pokémon, a mobile gacha for SMT, and that side scroller thing for SMT.
There was a period where Persona was getting a LOT more spinoffs under Index but that seems to be over. Furthermore SMT used to get a lot of other spinoffs, the major change here is that THOSE have disappeared in favor of Persona spinoffs. SMT proper is releasing at about the same clip it always has.
To put it bluntly, I strongly disagree with the premise that SMT is dying by Persona's hand, or that it's dying at all.
It's honestly still pretty early. IV and IVA both took like 3.5 years to develop. It's been just over 2 years since V was announced and barely a year since it started full production. Unless UE4 dramatically streamlined their Dev process, it's probably helped but not cutting an entire years worth of time, so I would be surprised to see it again before 2020 closer to its actual release.
This is Team Maniax's first HD title and first console SMT in over 15 years so there's likely a lot going into this and a lot of learning and trial on their part.
Maybe we'll get yet another tease, but personally I'd rather not see anything until the game is actually close to coming out. Like no more than 6 months out. Last thing I want is another P5 situation.
afaik Strange Journey Redux was the only one to have easy mode.
It still has an alignment system, just a different one. Considering what the game is and its place in the story just repeating the Law/Chaos thing wouldn't have made any sense for it.
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Apocalypse's eschewing of the traditional LNC alignment system is part of what made it so good. It was a step away from the harmful devotion to its own tropes that SMT regularly indulges.