• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
  • We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.

Bob White

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,934
This is pretty standard lefty stuff... Not really MRA shit. I would recommend really watching the entirety of what they are trying to say.

I'll summarize:
- They are critical of people attaching social justice concerns to a massive corporate film. Both those on Youtube who make dozens of videos shitting on the film or Larson and those who feel like the movie is important.
- Mention the charity thing that gave tickets to underprivileged kids to go see the movie as an example of faux wokeness.
- They center most of the criticism of Larson specifically due to a speech she made at a conference that they think came from her realizing she's not a black woman and thus not the lowest on the totem pole of having to struggle so she decides to shit on white male film critics and how they give negative reviews to films like A Wrinkle in Time. "These movies aren't for them" is what she says. This is the main focus of this part of the video. The main thing they take issue with here is someone using lack of representation as an excuse for a movie doing poorly (they show images of white men giving Larson's films positive reviews).
- They say that having more voices in film criticism is good and that their is probably a kernel of what she was trying to say. They sight the documentary about the history of African Americans in horror and how it presented ideas that Jay would never have thought of. Basically they think she framed it all wrong.
- Film criticism is the least important thing in the whole world on the scale of social justice. They namedrop films like Tangerine as movies that would be worthy of this level of discourse. Films that got great reviews from white men.

I don't think the RLM guys are perfect, but there has been this weird conflating them with alt-right people.

Nah, man. They're alt-right and they totally SUCK now. I don't actually need to watch the video or anything to hear Jay say to actual incel alt-right derps how they are making the world an embarrassing nightmare. Or how they both seem actually to lean left. Fuck all that, man! Burn them to the ground!
 

Kin5290

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,390
Considering they seem supportive of PoC and Woman in movies that don't use corporate shillism to push a blonde white lady as the face of feminism, I think they are fine with the push for more woman in lead roles.
Considering that the "controversial statements" Larson made were advocating for more Women of Color in entertainment media, and that she actually went out of her way to give women of color exposure like when she sought out a local female photographer during a press trip, maybe cutting her down is a little misplaced.
 

The Watcher

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,349
This is pretty standard lefty stuff... Not really MRA shit. I would recommend really watching the entirety of what they are trying to say.

I'll summarize:
- They are critical of people attaching social justice concerns to a massive corporate film. Both those on Youtube who make dozens of videos shitting on the film or Larson and those who feel like the movie is important.
- Mention the charity thing that gave tickets to underprivileged kids to go see the movie as an example of faux wokeness.

- They center most of the criticism of Larson specifically due to a speech she made at a conference that they think came from her realizing she's not a black woman and thus not the lowest on the totem pole of having to struggle so she decides to shit on white male film critics and how they give negative reviews to films like A Wrinkle in Time. "These movies aren't for them" is what she says. This is the main focus of this part of the video. The main thing they take issue with here is someone using lack of representation as an excuse for a movie doing poorly (they show images of white men giving Larson's films positive reviews).
- They say that having more voices in film criticism is good and that their is probably a kernel of what she was trying to say. They sight the documentary about the history of African Americans in horror and how it presented ideas that Jay would never have thought of. Basically they think she framed it all wrong.
- Film criticism is the least important thing in the whole world on the scale of social justice. They namedrop films like Tangerine as movies that would be worthy of this level of discourse. Films that got great reviews from white men.

I don't think the RLM guys are perfect, but there has been this weird conflating them with alt-right people.

Well...duh. It really shows what they think of the general movie goers if they believe that we believe massive corporations give a fuck about marginalized groups in media. They only do if it adds to their bottom line and even then. It's all about representation of all kinds and of course no female led Marvel movie is going to end sexism so what's the problem?
 

Wigdogger

Member
Oct 27, 2017
513
I've generally been a fan of their content, as they've had some pretty funny blasts, but they've definitely been waffling in this direction for a while.

Ultimately, their critiques have usually been savaging the homogenized nature of blockbuster filmmaking in the modern era or stuff like carving out space in the Ghostbusters remake debate so they could savage the movie as separate from the controversy surrounding it.

This feels similar. Once I watched their whole rant, it sort of made sense, but they sure took a snarky, roundabout way of going about it. Their overreaction is sort of on par with the optics of Brie's statements. The irony isn't lost on me that guys who have made a living savaging things are getting their nose out of joint when their vague demographic is targeted. Turnabout, it seems, is not fair play.

That said, it doesn't mean Larson or anyone else is above some level of feedback based on their tone (even though cherry-picked in a disingenuous way) or the causes they choose to champion. It's not a gender thing, I'd say. Some neckbeards are certainly going to take the conversation that way, but for me, a lot of famous people say stupid shit or champion causes they have no background in. That's equally dangerous, especially if they aren't equipped with the tools to do so.

Then again, RLM's "tone" has been this way before on the Wonder Woman review... so I suspect some of this is just moderate white dudes navigating the cultural changes that are -- and have been -- taking place.

I would give them enough credit to not associate them with MRAs and that ilk; they aren't that. They're clearly moderates, with some left-leaning bent through their art. But taking the time to have this kind of expanded debate which borders on character assassination (over some pretty flimsy evidence) just tells me they've kind of been drinking their own Kool-Aid a little too long.

I'll continue watching them, but I think I have a better context for who these guys are now -- such as that is.
 

Toxi

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
17,550
Nah, man. They're alt-right and they totally SUCK now. I don't actually need to watch the video or anything to hear Jay say to actual incel alt-right derps how they are making the world an embarrassing nightmare. Or how they both seem actually to lean left. Fuck all that, man! Burn them to the ground!
Reminder that this is how most RLM fans respond to criticism.
 

Violence Jack

Drive-in Mutant
Member
Oct 25, 2017
41,937
I saw the review. I wasn't too bothered by it. But I think the biggest problem they had was Brie talking about white male critics when in the larger scope of wanting more diversity and representation in cinema that movie critics are pretty low on the totem pole in the way of importance. And watching that clip of her speaking about A Wrinkle In Time, I kinda see what they were getting at. Many films featuring PoC and/or women in leading roles have received lots of critical praise from the same while male critics that she's talking about.

I've never had a problem with the RLM guys, as they seem to talk about controversies surrounding whatever films they review. But I really wish RLM (and quite a few other critics) would start ignoring the shitty internet trolls who got all heated over what was ultimately a harmless comment. They aren't worth the effort, and all they want is attention anyway. But they really didn't need to harp on it as long as they did.
 

Deleted member 8561

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
11,284
This was the first 15 mins of the review. (i know it says racial oppression. But the gif is about White Fragility. So just roll with it. LOL)
htGrFYZ.gif

----------------
Don't let RLM see this tweet.
54215001_427661407983955_4510299922381144064_n.jpg

Us is a clearly a movie that focuses on race/identity and being socially and culturally relevant to those issues that we face today. The directer is very clearly defining the film for what it is and is promoting it as such.

Conflating that with Marvel (and other companies) co-opt social movements, even though their movie has nothing to do with social movements and is motivated out of increasing publicity and their bottom line, is the main criticism levied by RLM.

I don't inherently disagree with RLM's assessment, even though I think there are portions that are blatant tone policing.
 

TheMango55

Banned
Nov 1, 2017
5,788
snarky and condescending youtube channel criticizes actress for sounding snarky and condescending while discussing something they seem to agree with.

I mean I'd expect some tone policing from various places, but has RLM ever even watched their own content?
 

Contramann

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,405
RedLetterMedia is good when it comes to actually talking about movies and analyzing what makes them work or not work. But they're fucking trash when it comes to addressing controversies surrounding movies.
Nah. RLM is good at analyzing movies from a schlock-indie perspective. But that's about it.The fact that Mike refuses to engages with movies on anything other than a literal perspective by itself almost makes them no better than any other pop film critic by default. The lack of discussion of film shot, composition, themes, etc. is what really gets me though. Basically their movie reviews are just plot summaries where they make fun of how the plot unfolds and maybe some discussion about acting and a bit of cinematography.

It's frustrating too because you know they could talk about interesting film shit like that, but it's almost like they're so aware of their audience that they expect them to not know or care about that shit so they skip over it. Instead you get little hints of that in BotW, Re:View or their Bandcamp Commentaries. It's almost like they don't trust their audience to be smart enough to care about any of that so instead it becomes to guys just complaining usually or making MAD-quality name jokes or puns.
 

LosDaddie

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,622
Longwood, FL
Comments section for the video is predictably trash.

I might put on the video while I'm cooking dinner in a few.


Funny because he got needlessly combative plenty of times and would try to bully his way into "winning" arguments at the old place. It's like when people complain about "hating drama" but are almost always the first to perpetuate it.

I've mentioned a few times on here that most of the OT "celebrities" on GAF had mod-immunity, and Bobby was one of them. That's why he (and others) acted the way he did.

All those screenshots from the old GAF mod-forum dumped online when GAF imploded must've opened some eyes.
 

Platy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
27,719
Brazil
This is pretty standard lefty stuff... Not really MRA shit. I would recommend really watching the entirety of what they are trying to say.

I'll summarize:
- They are critical of people attaching social justice concerns to a massive corporate film. Both those on Youtube who make dozens of videos shitting on the film or Larson and those who feel like the movie is important.
- Mention the charity thing that gave tickets to underprivileged kids to go see the movie as an example of faux wokeness.
- They center most of the criticism of Larson specifically due to a speech she made at a conference that they think came from her realizing she's not a black woman and thus not the lowest on the totem pole of having to struggle so she decides to shit on white male film critics and how they give negative reviews to films like A Wrinkle in Time. "These movies aren't for them" is what she says. This is the main focus of this part of the video. The main thing they take issue with here is someone using lack of representation as an excuse for a movie doing poorly (they show images of white men giving Larson's films positive reviews).
- They say that having more voices in film criticism is good and that their is probably a kernel of what she was trying to say. They sight the documentary about the history of African Americans in horror and how it presented ideas that Jay would never have thought of. Basically they think she framed it all wrong.
- Film criticism is the least important thing in the whole world on the scale of social justice. They namedrop films like Tangerine as movies that would be worthy of this level of discourse. Films that got great reviews from white men.

I don't think the RLM guys are perfect, but there has been this weird conflating them with alt-right people.

The movie IS important. I have friends whose lunch have more budget than Tangerine. Big budget movies that acess large scale audiences NEED to have "social justice" (aka basic decency) because they are sending a message. Captain Marvel being the biggest women focused super hero movie EVER is pretty important.

They complain about giving tickets to kids? Do these people have a stone in place of their heart?

It iare a little too interested in focused they are in protecting the quality of white men reviews

Art criticism IS important because life imitate art and art imitate life. Yeah, taking some fascists to guillotines would be more important but they have to believe more in their work
 

Lebron

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,582
They been doing this shit since the new SW films hit the deck and think they being slick. They pandering to a particular group. Not saying they feel the same way, but they been click hunting for a while now.

They trash. I wouldn't be bothered as much if I didn't have constantly see people who can't form their own opinion quote their SW prequel arguments over and over again.
 
Oct 29, 2017
4,065
Yeah, my main takeaway is that they're tired of these movies becoming some culture war. They're also not alone with that

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outl...eminist/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.587def1bb053
Most people don't know what the fuck either the strawman feminists or those weird people online complaining about a culture war are even talking about.

It's an internet thing for internet people and it's also clear that people aren't hesitating about seeing the film.
 

Deepwater

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,349
Us is a clearly a movie that focuses on race/identity and being socially and culturally relevant to those issues that we face today. The directer is very clearly defining the film for what it is and is promoting it as such.

Conflating that with Marvel (and other companies) co-opt social movements, even though their movie has nothing to do with social movements and is motivated out of increasing publicity and their bottom line, is the main criticism levied by RLM.

I don't inherently disagree with RLM's assessment, even though I think there are portions that are blatant tone policing.

Jordan Peele has said repeatedly that Us isn't a "movie about race". Your premise is a bit off.
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
20,747
I stopped regularly watching them when they immediately began their Wonder Woman review with "There's no reason for girls to look up to her," as if they have any reason to insert themselves in that conversation.
 

Fat4all

Woke up, got a money tag, swears a lot
Member
Oct 25, 2017
93,120
here
Are you implying that they do this sort of deep dive into an actor's statements on diversity for every marvel film?
what? no, I said they've been making fun of corporate shilling for years

that was basically the premise of the Nerd Crew videos, which were parodying nerd youtube shows directly
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,330
I already responded to that part of the criticism up above.
And they agree with her that more women and people of color should be reviewing movies. They take issue with her dismissing white dudes solely to prop up women and POC instead of just propping up women and POC without attacking white dudes.

I hope you don't think anyone should have any respect for that argument.
 

Quad Lasers

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,542
Their Wonder Woman review(a movie so boring I couldn't even get half-way through it!) was so god damn terrible that it was the point that I just stopped bothering with any more of their content.

The beginning of it was like 10 straight minutes of them bloviating about how dumb the concept of little girls looking up to super heroes is and completely missing the point of why people need to see themselves reflected in media.
 

SugarNoodles

Member
Nov 3, 2017
8,625
Portland, OR
Us is a clearly a movie that focuses on race/identity and being socially and culturally relevant to those issues that we face today. The directer is very clearly defining the film for what it is and is promoting it as such.

Conflating that with Marvel (and other companies) co-opt social movements, even though their movie has nothing to do with social movements and is motivated out of increasing publicity and their bottom line, is the main criticism levied by RLM.

I don't inherently disagree with RLM's assessment, even though I think there are portions that are blatant tone policing.
Comic book IPs have long served as metaphors for social movements and social issues, so the premise of your argument is a bit fucked.

Marvel may be operating like any corporation, but that doesn't make the movies void of relevant content.
 

Lunaray

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,731
This is pretty standard lefty stuff... Not really MRA shit. I would recommend really watching the entirety of what they are trying to say.

I'll summarize:
- They are critical of people attaching social justice concerns to a massive corporate film. Both those on Youtube who make dozens of videos shitting on the film or Larson and those who feel like the movie is important.
- Mention the charity thing that gave tickets to underprivileged kids to go see the movie as an example of faux wokeness.
- They center most of the criticism of Larson specifically due to a speech she made at a conference that they think came from her realizing she's not a black woman and thus not the lowest on the totem pole of having to struggle so she decides to shit on white male film critics and how they give negative reviews to films like A Wrinkle in Time. "These movies aren't for them" is what she says. This is the main focus of this part of the video. The main thing they take issue with here is someone using lack of representation as an excuse for a movie doing poorly (they show images of white men giving Larson's films positive reviews).
- They say that having more voices in film criticism is good and that their is probably a kernel of what she was trying to say. They sight the documentary about the history of African Americans in horror and how it presented ideas that Jay would never have thought of. Basically they think she framed it all wrong.
- Film criticism is the least important thing in the whole world on the scale of social justice. They namedrop films like Tangerine as movies that would be worthy of this level of discourse. Films that got great reviews from white men.

I don't think the RLM guys are perfect, but there has been this weird conflating them with alt-right people.

Signal-boosting this because I think people don't seem to have actually watched the video.
 

DarthSpider

The Fallen
Nov 15, 2017
2,959
Hiroshima, Japan
You're right, and responded shortly before I submitted an edit to revise after I read your previous post. I said propagated and pushed, and instead I should have said that they are the most readily available sources documenting the issue, which are a mess, and not implied they are the cause for the controversy and his departure. I was a few days late and only saw the aftermath. I appreciate your experience and insight.

Ah, sorry, I didn't see your edit in time. You're definitely correct in that those toxic sites have unfortunately documented the issue better than anyone else. If anyone does seek them out, I'd warn them not to read any of the commentary about the tweets, but rather just let the tweets speak for themselves.
 

skillzilla81

Self-requested temporary ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,043
Their Wonder Woman review(a movie so boring I couldn't even get half-way through it!) was so god damn terrible that it was the point that I just stopped bothering with any more of their content.

The beginning of it was like 10 straight minutes of them bloviating about how dumb the concept of little girls looking up to super heroes is and completely missing the point of why people need to see themselves reflected in media.

Straight white men don't ever have to think about that.
 
Nov 23, 2017
4,302
And they agree with her that more women and people of color should be reviewing movies. They take issue with her dismissing white dudes solely to prop up women and POC instead of just propping up women and POC without attacking white dudes.

I said it in the RLM thread it's a silly argument that they get into and there's no reason it needs to be 10 minutes long when they actually agree with her and it just makes them look like they belong with all the #comicsgate people in the end.
Oh my god the horror!
 

Skyebaron

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,416
They spend too much time on it but I agree with their points. It attacks both sides so everyone will have something to defend themselves. Meh video, meh movie.
 

mael

Avenger
Nov 3, 2017
16,841
Their Wonder Woman review(a movie so boring I couldn't even get half-way through it!) was so god damn terrible that it was the point that I just stopped bothering with any more of their content.

The beginning of it was like 10 straight minutes of them bloviating about how dumb the concept of little girls looking up to super heroes is and completely missing the point of why people need to see themselves reflected in media.
I do hope they spent more than half the review having a problem with how Superman being a role model or Batman or whatever because that's more transparent than a clear blue sky otherwise.
 

Cort

Member
Nov 4, 2017
4,359
Reminder that this is how most RLM fans respond to criticism.

I remember when Josh from RLM expressed extreme disappointment towards Trump winning the elections on his Twitter account.
I also remember fans tweeting him awful things because of that opinion

I definitely subscribe to the idea that their fanbase is awful.
 

El Bombastico

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
36,067
No, it wasn't about that. He was accused by someone on Twitter of sexual assault. His podcast co-host on Full of Sith, Bryan Young, stood up for Bobby saying it wasn't true, which caused a shitstorm in the left-leaning Star Wars podcast circles. Bryan quickly apologized and banned Bobby from the podcast. It's been a real shitshow and has caused yet another rift between former friends in the Star Wars community. Whether or not he's guilty, I cannot say. But after the first accusation, a few more women came forward with their unpleasant encounters with old Bob. It's all been deleted, but I was there to see it all go down.

I've known about this for months but didn't want to post anything. Glad to see someone else can verify it.

This was his final post. For anyone that wants to see why he was permabanned.

And then came the abuse allegations that Spider mentioned.

In short, fuck Bobby. The little midget was always a prick, and now it turns out he was also a hypocrite.
 

Deepwater

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,349
Their Wonder Woman review(a movie so boring I couldn't even get half-way through it!) was so god damn terrible that it was the point that I just stopped bothering with any more of their content.

The beginning of it was like 10 straight minutes of them bloviating about how dumb the concept of little girls looking up to super heroes is and completely missing the point of why people need to see themselves reflected in media.


This is where my hang up is, their arguments fall apart where this is basically all that they're doing because Disney is bankrolling popular movies therefore it's bad.

Again, a blind spot not uncommon amongst white men who can't see the value of non white boys being able to identify with fictional characters in popular media. But rah rah corporatism.
 

RedMercury

Blue Venus
Member
Dec 24, 2017
17,677
Nah, man. They're alt-right and they totally SUCK now. I don't actually need to watch the video or anything to hear Jay say to actual incel alt-right derps how they are making the world an embarrassing nightmare. Or how they both seem actually to lean left. Fuck all that, man! Burn them to the ground!
Well this is certainly disingenuous
 

Kinthey

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
22,360
Most people don't know what the fuck either the strawman feminists or those weird people online complaining about a culture war are even talking about.

It's an internet thing for internet people and it's also clear that people aren't hesitating about seeing the film.
The article is mostly taking the perspective of the reviewers who really can't avoid this whole thing
 

Deleted member 25600

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
5,701
This is pretty standard lefty stuff... Not really MRA shit. I would recommend really watching the entirety of what they are trying to say.

I'll summarize:
- They are critical of people attaching social justice concerns to a massive corporate film. Both those on Youtube who make dozens of videos shitting on the film or Larson and those who feel like the movie is important.
- Mention the charity thing that gave tickets to underprivileged kids to go see the movie as an example of faux wokeness.
- They center most of the criticism of Larson specifically due to a speech she made at a conference that they think came from her realizing she's not a black woman and thus not the lowest on the totem pole of having to struggle so she decides to shit on white male film critics and how they give negative reviews to films like A Wrinkle in Time. "These movies aren't for them" is what she says. This is the main focus of this part of the video. The main thing they take issue with here is someone using lack of representation as an excuse for a movie doing poorly (they show images of white men giving Larson's films positive reviews).
- They say that having more voices in film criticism is good and that their is probably a kernel of what she was trying to say. They sight the documentary about the history of African Americans in horror and how it presented ideas that Jay would never have thought of. Basically they think she framed it all wrong.
- Film criticism is the least important thing in the whole world on the scale of social justice. They namedrop films like Tangerine as movies that would be worthy of this level of discourse. Films that got great reviews from white men.

I don't think the RLM guys are perfect, but there has been this weird conflating them with alt-right people.
I agree with most of this and found that their point about Disney's marketting strategy for this movie to be very reminiscent of H.Bomberguys recent Woke Brands video. Watching all of this unfold over the last month, there's no doubt in my mind that Disney was stoking the flames of controversy in order to get free advertising from right wing nutters....and it clearly worked.
 

Vas

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,016
I found the points contained within the video to be fair and reasonable, as far as I could see. They weren't dismissive of the issues raised, but rather were critical of how the studios lean into controversy in order to manufacture publicity for the shallow reason of generating profits. It's essentially the same points raised by H Bomberguy in his 'Woke Brands" video, which was well received on this forum, IIRC.
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,330
Signal-boosting this because I think people don't seem to have actually watched the video.

You realize this
- They center most of the criticism of Larson specifically due to a speech she made at a conference that they think came from her realizing she's not a black woman and thus not the lowest on the totem pole of having to struggle so she decides to shit on white male film critics and how they give negative reviews to films like A Wrinkle in Time. "These movies aren't for them" is what she says. This is the main focus of this part of the video. The main thing they take issue with here is someone using lack of representation as an excuse for a movie doing poorly (they show images of white men giving Larson's films positive reviews).

Is awful right?

Like that's so cynical it spins around to malicious

"Brie Larson realized she's not a black woman so in order to feel better about not being the most oppressed she attacked white film critics"

That's supposed to be the context that makes people have a better POV of RLM?
 

Bob White

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,934
Reminder that this is how most RLM fans respond to criticism.

The first few pages is filled with people who didn't actually see the vid and just popped in the thread to say how much RLM has fallen off. I'm just irritated at the blind "oh, we hate them now? ok, glad to know!" Like, watch the fucking video and form you own opinions.

These dudes are aloof on POC issues, I'll admit that. But the make up of this thread is like they're some Joe Rogan ass cesspool channel now. Really?
 

Deleted member 29939

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 2, 2017
1,572
Uhhhhh, I dont know if this bold push to paint them as MRA, white biggot, anti diversity racist nutjobs is hilarious or cause for concern considering the link to the supposedly "damning" video is right there for anyone to see... and they are none of these things (in said video or any I've seen so far).

Godamn. So many asshole manbabies online to pile on, no need to make shit up where it doesnt exist.