and because my priority is playability, and better performance means better playability for any game across the board. So Nintendo should give me the option to play games with better performance and we're both happy.
Nah, being in a handheld instead of tying yourself to a huge ass power guzzling box tethered to a TV is easily worth the trade off of the small number of weirdos deeply offended by that notion.
This is reflected in the switch sales, and in titles like BOTW continuing to sell millions of copies everyquarter.
The OP played the game for over 200 hours I'm sure they understand how good the game is. Just because someone has issues with certain parts doesn't mean they don't like it. I would assume the opposite actually, usually the people that are the most passionate also will draw more complaints since they have had a good deal of time with the subject. There is nothing wrong with what the OP is saying that it would be nice if there was a market available better way to play the game without sub 30 dips and potentially an even higher fps and resolution.
This right here is part of why the OP doesn't sustain itself. Either 60fps is lying (because he managed to play 200 h. of a game that is supossedly unplayable) or he just opened a troll/console warring thread. In both cases, it's a bad look for him.
We're speaking of the same person that less than a week ago called Ocarina of Time the quintessence of Zelda while being a 20 fps game with dips that got updated to be a 30 fps game. So excuse me if i'm being exceptical.
There's also a market available better way to play the game without sub 30 fps dips and higher fps and resolution, it's called a PC, emulators are legal and dumping your own game is legal too, doing so on Wii U is so easy it hurts, it has been explained to OP time and time again bue he doesn't yield, he just wants to keep this crusade of him ignoring every reasoning thrown at him. And it's not like anyone is trying to change his mind, this thread would have a different tone if he didn't treat people who tolerates *shudder* 30fps as inferior beings/people with inferior or no standards.
I agree with the OP to a certain extent in the fact that the games should run well, have a decent resolution etc, especially first party titles as they should know the limitations of the system.
This happens on most consoles though. Why do people think Sony ended up limiting the FPS on GoW and Last Guardian?
The Koei-Tecmo argument: 3rd party using first party IP. Koei-Tecmo games are generally very un-optimized.
That said: as others pointed out, OPs post history already kinda shows they are arguing in bad faith. If you are unhappy with the Switch hardware being what it is, accept it and sell it off.
An Nvidia Tegra X1 isn't going to give you the same performance as GPUs in consoles or gaming PCs.
This isn't about "not being allowed to critize a company".
I don't care about form factor or power consumption. I care about playing Nintendo games and I care about money. A Switch costs 300 bucks, a Switch game costs 60 bucks. If I get performance as bad as in Age of Calamity then yes, I demand better.
People have explained the limitations of the hardware to accommodate portability, it really sounds like you're just pulling a "lazy devs" argument at this point.
Oh whoops. Based on my memory those were 30fps, but yeah, you're right. Haunting Ground I'm very certain was 30fps, at least. I can remember trying a mod last year to get that running at 60fps, but parts of the game ended up running too fast.
And Sony should let me spend my money on their games all being at release being on PC.
We can also wake up from fantasy land where we get a new big Zelda every 4-5 years with new fresh ideas and leveldesign that is handcrafted and 4K graphics and not loosing scope and not having a staff that is 3 times as big as before and look at everything in context
If you don't wanna criticism to your demands, maybe don't post them on a public message board
IDK, I'm in the club that due to resolution and draw distance, it didn't look the best at release, either. I wouldn't say it aged poorly. It did make me quickly want a Switch Pro that could clean up image quality and remove some of the system's bottlenecks, however, along with later releases.
As a big Zelda fan I put over 200 hours into Breath of the Wild and thoroughly enjoyed it, including its Add-Ons. The last time I played it was 1-2 years ago.
So I was in the mood for some Zelda again and started BotW - and was seriously shocked by how bad it looks and runs. Both resolution and framerate are a mess. I'm a huge Nintendo fanboy, but there simply is no better way to describe it.
BotW has a nice art style, its world is beautifully designed and realized and the gameplay is fun (I even like the breakable equipment), but unfortunately the low resolution makes this nice art style and beautiful world look completely blurry, and the performance... man, I really don't remember BotW running this badly.
Depending on which part of Hyrule you are exploring, it feels like this game is struggling to even hold 25 frames per second.
It's not like the game's technical aspects are just not impressive or groundbreaking enough - it's like the game doesn't even get the fundamentals right. Shouldn't decent image quality and smooth controls/gameplay be a given for any game at this day and age? It's 2021 and I'm stuck playing BotW in a blurry and stuttering fashion and that's the baseline Nintendo has set for one of their biggest releases ever. It shouldn't be too much to ask this masterpiece of a game - or any game - to have crisp image (and audio) quality and smooth performance first and foremost, and I really don't like that Nintendo or any other game companies tend to get a pass for this.
Another excellent example is Fire Emblem Three Houses - this game is a technical mess and was basically outdated on the day it released. The worst thing is, reviews mostly ignored that and scored it into the 90s. If the new James Bond movie released with blurry image or compressed audio quality, do you think reviews would praise it anyway? No. Movie critics would tear the film apart. Movies have established a baseline for certain technical standards they are expected to meet, which also helps in terms of futureproofing. I wish there was something similar for games. The only thing I can remember is Sony saying no game releasing on PSVR is ever allowed to drop frames below 120fps - or else it won't get released.
I generally believe that performance is one of the, if not THE most important aspect(s) determining how well a game ages, and Breath of the Wild shows that.
My prime positive examples are Metroid Prime and Haunting Ground - these games have aged wonderfully from a technical perspective, despite their low resolution they both look, and even more importantly, play great even today, both running at smooth 60fps (Haunting Ground's meticulously directed fixed camera work also helps a lot).
Compare them to non-60fps games from the same era. The difference in overall look and playability is staggering.
TL;DR:
Technical shortcomings like poor performance make games age badly, and BotW shows that.
Maybe getting spoiled by Playstation 5 games with 4k, 60fps and nonexistant load time is a real thing already.
I completely disagree with everything you said except that Metroid Prime aged well.
Btw almost everywhere the game runs at smooth 30fps and the performance is NOT what determines how a game ages, but the gameplay and BotW's gameplay will hold up in decades.
There's also a market available better way to play the game without sub 30 fps dips and higher fps and resolution, it's called a PC, emulators are legal and dumping your own game is legal too, doing so on Wii U is so easy it hurts, it has been explained to OP time and time again bue he doesn't yield, he just wants to keep this crusade of him ignoring every reasoning thrown at him. And it's not like anyone is trying to change his mind, this thread would have a different tone if he didn't treat people who tolerates *shudder* 30fps as inferior beings/people with inferior or no standards.
Buying a defunct system and game from that system that isn't being made then ripping said game from system to put on PC. That's not a what I was referring as a market available solution, that's a workaround. A market available solution is something that any mom and dad can go into the store and buy and it works as any console does.
I would never not play a game because it doesn't reach a performance metric, but I have not been very motivated to play my Switch in recent months and the big thins is performance for sure.
Just like when the Switch came out my 3DS gathered dust and felt "old", after having a few months with the Series X and PS5 it feels like I don't want to go back. Bought Age of Calamity but haven't really played it and will by Mario 3d Land to hopefully get motivated but I hope performance is good enough to keep me interested.
I would be so hyped for a new Switch in 2021. I don't even want it to be a new console, the same thing but beefier so I can have better games. This is one time I wish Nintendo would go back to being top tier in tech.
If he was a baiter he wouldn't continuously engage in the discussion like he has. I think you guys are placing too much faith on him, or his commitment to this "bait" is just sad.
I think the primary issue is that the drops aren't nearly as prevalent as he claims. You can go dozens of hours without missing a frame.
I just don't understand calling it a stuttering mess, nor calling 900p "blurry". It's not perfect, but it's certainly not blurry unless you have a bad upscaler. Maybe try playing on a 1080p set or with an external upscaler?
Switch pro can't come soon enough. The Switch was my first ever Nintendo console that I bought and it's already one my favourite consoles ever. That said while its power was acceptable on 2017 , it feels really underpowered in 2021. I know it's still selling incredibly well and deservedly so thanks to the incredible library. But still for hardcore gamers we crave more.
First of all, I don't think that approaching a Nintendo title from a performance/technology perspective is very lucrative in general. All Wii/Wii U/Switch titles run on pretty bare specs, so this shouldn't be too surprising and there are obviously more interesting things to look at when analyzing their games.
I generally believe that performance is one of the, if not THE most important aspect(s) determining how well a game ages, and Breath of the Wild shows that.
What you're describing is the exact opposite of aging well. A game can run at 480p 25fps or at 8K with 120, if the substance of the game is outdated and boring (gameplay, art style, story, music), the game won't age well.
I'd even say that this is the only thing that doesn't matter at all for how well a game ages. You can literally boot the game file on a PC in 10 years and play it under the circumstances you prefer: if the substance is well made, the game will still feel modern and timeless.
I'm not a big Zelda fan, but I think that no other title delivered so well in these regards (gameplay, freedom of choice, atmosphere). Also, you're saying that everything under 60 FPS is not playable for you. How did you survive with the PS4? I remember playing Horizon and the smoothness of the art style and presentation clashed with the stuttering 30 FPS all the time.
Also, there are clear generational leaps. I don't know if that will change in a few decades, but currently, technology doesn't evolve in a linear fashion. You'll find amazing titles with great gameplay at the beginning of a console cycle where technology is limited and graphics are mediocre, and things are obviously changing when developers make use of the computing power.
my main point however is that EVERYTHING is important for evaluating how well a game aged, but CLEARLY not the raw technological circumstances. I think they're quite unimportant and arbitrary in the grand scheme of things.
OP I don't know why so many people in here are trying to peg you as a console hater or war-type.
The man simply wants a faster, better Switch people. The new chip inside could be just fast enough to produce 60fps and that's it. He isn't asking for Nintendo to make a PS5. C'mon now...
Do have to say thanks to this thread I've finally gotten round to trying botw on emulator and it is a very nice experience compared to the original. Installed some cool mods as well like the Linkle mod and a Studio Ghibli music pack. That being said I still don't think the game has aged poorly on either Wii U or Switch, it's still fantastic on those systems as well.
OP I don't know why so many people in here are trying to peg you as a console hater or war-type.
The man simply wants a faster, better Switch people. The new chip inside could be just fast enough to produce 60fps and that's it. He isn't asking for Nintendo to make a PS5. C'mon now...
Because his post history says otherwise, insults everyone who is fine and undertands the limitations of the console something he choose to ignore and most of his arguments may as well be "lazy devs"
The OP played the game for over 200 hours I'm sure they understand how good the game is. Just because someone has issues with certain parts doesn't mean they don't like it. I would assume the opposite actually, usually the people that are the most passionate also will draw more complaints since they have had a good deal of time with the subject. There is nothing wrong with what the OP is saying that it would be nice if there was a market available better way to play the game without sub 30 dips and potentially an even higher fps and resolution.
I don't care about FPS or performance really as long as it's not intrusively bad and I had a great time with BOTW. I think the Switch is a marvel.
That said, this thread is incredibly mad. Someone said "get help" at one point! At a guy who...basically wants a Switch Pro? Which is a fairly topical thing, since Nintendo said they weren't releasing an updated model anytime soon.
OP I don't know why so many people in here are trying to peg you as a console hater or war-type.
The man simply wants a faster, better Switch people. The new chip inside could be just fast enough to produce 60fps and that's it. He isn't asking for Nintendo to make a PS5. C'mon now...
I played through the starting area last year and had no desire to play the rest of the game again. It was an amazing experience in 2017, but one that I might never be able to replicate like the magic of leveling and starting to raid in vanilla WoW. The resolution/frame-rate certainly doesn't help after getting used to the Series X and PS5.
60 fps in games isn't always preferable because there's such a thing as games feeling too responsive, if you know what I mean.
The ideal case is that a game targets 30 fps, but has slowdowns during hectic action on screen because that gives the player more time to analyse the situation and react accordingly.
Small observation, but I have noticed Nintendo fans seem to be extremely sensitive (moreso than any other fanbase) regarding any criticism of Nintendo hardware or software.
" Nintendo's website states that ROMs are not authentic games and that "distribution of an emulator developed to play illegally copied Nintendo software hurts Nintendo's goodwill". It also insists that it's illegal to download ROMs even if the person owns the original game – a point that is contested on gaming forums."
Small observation, but I have noticed Nintendo fans seem to be extremely sensitive (moreso than any other fanbase) regarding any criticism of Nintendo hardware or software.
60 fps in games isn't always preferable because there's such a thing as games feeling too responsive, if you know what I mean.
The ideal case is that a game targets 30 fps, but has slowdowns during hectic action on screen because that gives the player more time to analyse the situation and react accordingly.
Gorgeous art and leveldesign held back by subpar hardware. Game runs like ass and looks blurry as hell. It's actually sad how some of Nintendo's games run.
My wife has been playing it next to me on and off while I play Demon Souls and being that DS is arguably one of the best looking games out right now I still glance over and can't believe how beautiful Zelda can look
I don't care about form factor or power consumption. I care about playing Nintendo games and I care about money. A Switch costs 300 bucks, a Switch game costs 60 bucks. If I get performance as bad as in Age of Calamity then yes, I demand better.
I think the primary issue is that the drops aren't nearly as prevalent as he claims. You can go dozens of hours without missing a frame.
I just don't understand calling it a stuttering mess, nor calling 900p "blurry". It's not perfect, but it's certainly not blurry unless you have a bad upscaler. Maybe try playing on a 1080p set or with an external upscaler?
This, saying "Both resolution and framerate are a mess" and "world look completely blurry" are totally lies, expect if he plays on 60" TV or his Switch has some technical problems.
I mean over 90% time game is running at locked 30 FPS, and despite 900p game looks very nice.
OP I don't know why so many people in here are trying to peg you as a console hater or war-type.
The man simply wants a faster, better Switch people. The new chip inside could be just fast enough to produce 60fps and that's it. He isn't asking for Nintendo to make a PS5. C'mon now...
If you read his posts that's kinda exactly what he's saying though? He's demanding Nintendo give him the Switch he deserves, using that exact phrasing on top of that.
Despite the fact that ignores just about all logic on how console development actually works.
OP I don't know why so many people in here are trying to peg you as a console hater or war-type.
The man simply wants a faster, better Switch people. The new chip inside could be just fast enough to produce 60fps and that's it. He isn't asking for Nintendo to make a PS5. C'mon now...
900p can absolutely look blurry as hell when you're used to a lot higher and when on a more modern television lol. 720p used to look crisp, now it's unwatchable for some people.
In general, I enjoy playing videogames and so I appreciate threads like this. It reveals posters who speak in hyperbolic extremes and love bad faith discussions.
Going by Steam's past month hardware survey, a 66,70% of its users are running on a 1080p display, so... Allow me to disagree.
This a time as good as many other to remind people that just because console makers try to push for higher resolutions so they have a shiny new palabro to use in their new machines' marketing, it doesn't mean that those higher resolutions are actually standarised.
In fact, if they aren't on PC, where 4k monitors make for a 2.34% of Steam users when we have been capable of having those resolution for more time than consoles, they aren't going to be stadarised on the console space, no matter how much tiem and saliva console makers spend talking about 4K
Gorgeous art and leveldesign held back by subpar hardware. Game runs like ass and looks blurry as hell. It's actually sad how some of Nintendo's games run. I'm playing Age of Calamity and Origami King at the moment. Age of Calamity might be the worst nintendo game in terms of performance and looks while Origami King runs flawless and looks gorgeous.
I'm playing AoC at the moment and I'm actually impressed at what's happening on screen considering it looks very like BotW with at times 50-100 enemies on screen with all the effects and physics on display. The textures, materials and some of the geometry also look better than BotW.
Some people just can't understand that Switch is a phone like device in size and power consumption terms that operates on around 10 watts of electricity and can at anytime be taken on the go. There will always be limitations to hybrid gaming consoles vs dedicated home consoles that consumer 10-20x the power and are 100x as large physically for cooling.
900p can absolutely look blurry as hell when you're used to a lot higher and when on a more modern television lol. 720p used to look crisp, now it's unwatchable for some people.
I wrote "expect if he plays on 60" TV", but I doubt he does, because he also said that frame rate is mess while fact is that over 90% time frame rate is locked at 30 FPS.
If 60fps is your issue then you must agree then that this is true of 95% of console games from PS3/360/PS4/XB1 then?
And you must also give Nintendo credit for influencing Spencer to focus on 60fps focused Xbox first party titles due in part to 2D Mario, 3D Mario, Mario Kart, Smash, Splatoon, DKC, Mario Tennis and Yoshi all being 60fps on Switch.
Going by Steam's past month hardware survey, a 66,70% of its users are running on a 1080p display, so... Allow me to disagree.
This a time as good as many other to remind people that just because console makers try to push for higher resolutions so they have a shiny new palabro to use in their new machines' marketing, it doesn't mean that those higher resolutions are actually standarised.
In fact, if they aren't on PC, where 4k monitors make for a 2.34% of Steam users when we have been capable of having those resolution for more time than consoles, they aren't going to be stadarised on the console space, no matter how much tiem and saliva console makers spend talking about 4K
That is a false equivalency, for one PC monitors are typically 27"(though are usually 1080p are smaller) so it's not nearly the same. And even at 27" it doesn't look good at 1080p.
Also, 4K is standardized.... the console makers didn't do any pushing for 4K, they just followed what happened to the TV market. Consoles are played on TVs, the standard for TVs is 4K(you can technically still buy 1080p sets, but they are pretty rare)
I really don't understand what Steam players playing on 19" 1080p displays have to do with the fact that 1080p on 55" 4K tv(the most common size and resolution of a new TV) looks like shit.
Are you actually trying to argue that 4K is not the standard when it comes to TVs? Because it is and has been for several years now.
I wrote "expect if he plays on 60" TV", but I doubt he does, because he also said that frame rate is mess while fact is that over 90% time frame rate is locked at 30 FPS.
Nintendo stopped caring about leading in tech but their games are beautiful even at lower res. It does take time to adjust if you keep switching between ps5/PC/series X and switch, so just stick to Switch till you beat the game. That's what i did when i finished Zelda BotW.
If 1080p is bad then why do some PS5 games specifically have modes of graphics targeting that exact resolution? 4k is a thing yes but that doesn't mean 1080p is suddenly equivalent to 480p
The only person that would truly think that mus be entitled as hell
If 1080p is bad then why do some PS5 games specifically have modes of graphics targeting that exact resolution? 4k is a thing yes but that doesn't mean 1080p is suddenly equivalent to 480p
The only person that would truly think that mus be entitled as hell
I just got a brand new 4K tv, wanted to see how Breath of the Wild looked on it, and ended up playing on my completed (everything but the Korok seeds) file for quite some time just because it was fun. I highly disagree
