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I am worried about the development of next gen titles.
- Thread starter DanteLinkX
- Start date
I'm fine with this. There are more than enough games already, so I'd rather have fewer games that are of higher quality.
Bit of an exaggeration there buddy
Bit of an exaggeration there buddy
There should be more studios in the middle ground that make games their way. Without much of a care about the budgets and technology of AAA games. Audience expectations are a problem as well, but if you show them a good idea and game, then they'll take interest in it.
There's a ton of games out and being made currently, that there isn't really a shortage of new stuff if you're willing to check out games from lesser known devs. It'll be fine, especially considering the next gen will dodge the learning curve when it comes to architecture.
An exaggeration!!!!!!!??????? Lol are you kidding? Kids are swatting and threatening devs over like a two dollar poop emoji or something. That's how fickle and awful everyone is when it comes to gaming. It's lame. That's exaggeration
There are a few things I'll like to comment.
First, developers are spending a lot of time on dlc. This is something that I somewhat like and somewhat dislike. If we want to stay positive in this thread then let's hope that we'll se more uncharted legacy stuff.
In the case of Rockstar I think there kind of occupied with the online mode.
Second: I really think that , because of the architecture of next gen, we will se developers using the same engine with similar access and just put on some extra lightning and stuff. I mean God of war already looks amazing, they dont have to build a new game from the ground up for the sequal. I could imagine a game like horizon zero dawn 2 or spider-man beeing in a similar situation (or zelda 2 for that matter, that game obviously is quite fast developed).
So I think we will have an amazing start of next gen with games like horizon zero dawn 2, God of war 2, Spider-man 2 etc and in the best of worlds story dlc on games like Ghost of Tsushima.
That would give developers a head start if they wanted to reach the same level on quantity like ps3/360 gen.
Third: please take this with a grain of salt because I'm not that knowable but here are my thoughts:
Death Stranding didn't take long to develop. I think 3 years? Perhaps new technology, like 3d scanning is speeding things up. Sure didn't look to complicated to put Conan O'Brien in the game.
When it comes to large open world game studios like Ubisoft seems to have stremlined the production processes (well, thats probably not always a good thing but still). New improvements in unreal engine and unity also makes for faster development.
The Outer Worlds is an other example of a great game, also a new franchise, using unreal engine and "only" seems to have needed about 3 years of development time?
Furthermore: it also sort of depends on how long the generation is.
Conclusion: o boy there are going to be an explosion of great squeals and probably some new ip:s next gen. It's going to be awesome.
First, developers are spending a lot of time on dlc. This is something that I somewhat like and somewhat dislike. If we want to stay positive in this thread then let's hope that we'll se more uncharted legacy stuff.
In the case of Rockstar I think there kind of occupied with the online mode.
Second: I really think that , because of the architecture of next gen, we will se developers using the same engine with similar access and just put on some extra lightning and stuff. I mean God of war already looks amazing, they dont have to build a new game from the ground up for the sequal. I could imagine a game like horizon zero dawn 2 or spider-man beeing in a similar situation (or zelda 2 for that matter, that game obviously is quite fast developed).
So I think we will have an amazing start of next gen with games like horizon zero dawn 2, God of war 2, Spider-man 2 etc and in the best of worlds story dlc on games like Ghost of Tsushima.
That would give developers a head start if they wanted to reach the same level on quantity like ps3/360 gen.
Third: please take this with a grain of salt because I'm not that knowable but here are my thoughts:
Death Stranding didn't take long to develop. I think 3 years? Perhaps new technology, like 3d scanning is speeding things up. Sure didn't look to complicated to put Conan O'Brien in the game.
When it comes to large open world game studios like Ubisoft seems to have stremlined the production processes (well, thats probably not always a good thing but still). New improvements in unreal engine and unity also makes for faster development.
The Outer Worlds is an other example of a great game, also a new franchise, using unreal engine and "only" seems to have needed about 3 years of development time?
Furthermore: it also sort of depends on how long the generation is.
Conclusion: o boy there are going to be an explosion of great squeals and probably some new ip:s next gen. It's going to be awesome.
Living hell is people scraping a life in warzones. Living hell is people struggling to earn enough food to keep their children alive.
Hell even if we look at the first world living hell is people working 4 jobs to pay the rent.
Get some damn perspective. A relatively cushy job in software engineering is not flippin "living hell" no matter which way you look at it. Bloody hell.
Theoretically, a move completely over to Ray traced lighting could drastically reduce development time if used correctly.
Calling Uncharted= 1.5 games, that sounds disrespectful to the crazy amount of blood sweat and tears that ND put into making Lost Legacy. I am going to correct you here and say Naughty Dog delivered '2' Uncharted games on PS4 and would be releasing Last of Us Part II for PS4 in May 2020.
Also you've forgotten to mention R*, In PS3 they delivered some of the greatest games like GTAIV, GTAV, RDR, Max Payne 3, LA Noire, Midnight Club LA, couple of DLCS for GTAIV. On PS4 it's just RDR2 and GTA:V remaster. Wonder if we'd get more games from R* for next gen
Also you've forgotten to mention R*, In PS3 they delivered some of the greatest games like GTAIV, GTAV, RDR, Max Payne 3, LA Noire, Midnight Club LA, couple of DLCS for GTAIV. On PS4 it's just RDR2 and GTA:V remaster. Wonder if we'd get more games from R* for next gen
I've been complaining about this before the PS3 era started, lol. And it has only been getting worse.
Better tools could help, but so far the scale of the games has always exceeded the time reducing effect of said tools.
Fortunately indies have filled the gaps. I predict in next gen, people will play even more indie games between AAA games.
Better tools could help, but so far the scale of the games has always exceeded the time reducing effect of said tools.
Fortunately indies have filled the gaps. I predict in next gen, people will play even more indie games between AAA games.
Less AAA games and more indie titles are fine with me. I think the only real bummer is the lack of solid, varied JRPG titles similar to the SNES/PS1 eras, tho that's probably for the best as I don't have the time to play several 40+ hour JRPGs over the course of a year along with everything else coming out. I do miss the variety tho.
This worries me as well, maybe Sony and MS need to buy or create a bunch of new studios (more than what they've been purschasing or creating as of late) in order to up their output.
I would argue the quality of a lot of the games this generation has slipped considerably compared to previous generations. Money and time doesn't equal quality for sure.
As an older, time poor gamer, I really don't mind the slower out put. I only buy maybe 4-5 games a year.
Uncharted 4 is probably bigger than the first 3 combined. The Last of Us 2 is bigger than Uncharted 4. Lost Legacy is bigger or comparable than each of the first 3 Uncharteds and yet you count it as half a game. Same goes for God of War. Rocksteady also made Arkham VR.
You're not putting everything in the right perspective OP, unless you want to go back to ultra linear 10-15 hour corridor/fixed camera games.
You're not putting everything in the right perspective OP, unless you want to go back to ultra linear 10-15 hour corridor/fixed camera games.
It's ashame most of these AAA titles won't be ready 3-4 years tops it's ridiculous at this point but at the same time understandable
You talk like linear corridor games are a bad thing, while I don't. Hell, it's because Outer Worlds is more contained, people seem to like it more. When you have a tighter gameplay loop, things like atmosphere, storytelling and graphics can really shine. The more open games are, the more things need to be scaled back, like visuals.
I'll take another Max Payne over another GTA.
I don't see the problem, unless you plan to only play on the Ps5 (the OP post only lists PS games so maybe it's the case) and only AAA games.
Right now I have tons of incredible games to play: 2019 has been a killer year for Nintendo exclusives, narrative-focused games and some really good AA efforts. And tbh I don't even enjoy all those big AAA games anymore, so I don't care if I play less of them.
Right now I have tons of incredible games to play: 2019 has been a killer year for Nintendo exclusives, narrative-focused games and some really good AA efforts. And tbh I don't even enjoy all those big AAA games anymore, so I don't care if I play less of them.
Games take longer and longer, they require bigger and bigger teams, and their budgets are skyrocketing. Not all games, mind, but the ones competing for a triple-A space compete in insane graphics, immersive open worlds, crazy attention to details which all cost more and more resources. There's more than enough studios out there to deliver enough games, but if studios don't start dialing down the amount of effort needed, it'll get worse and worse. As is, we're already getting too many games that still come out broken, with minimal content at launch or unbalanced despite 4-6 years of active development, which is really telling.
Call Of Duty is probably the easiest example given it's a yearly game: once upon a time, one studio could do one game per year. Then that timeframe was no longer enough, so they split in two teams and worked on alternate years. This timeframe was starting to not be enough to build ambitious sequels, so by the middle of this generation they started giving 3 years to each team, who could finally focus on bigger projects. Except now the 3-years timeframe resulted in a messy development for Black Ops 4 which was missing tons of content and had multiple issues at launch, and now Modern Warfare that has a short (if good) campaign, a terrible Spec Ops mode and a rushed multiplayer. Even 3 years seem to be insufficient now, and I wouldn't be surprised if one of the next CODs received a 4-years frame.
And those are usually iterative sequels with a lot of reused assets and content, and they can barely suffice as is! Building a triple-A IP from the ground up (maybe with a new engine, even) and have it compete with the bests both in terms of quantity and quality is something that requires more and more time and money, and I can definitely see a lot of studios not being able to keep up with that race.
Call Of Duty is probably the easiest example given it's a yearly game: once upon a time, one studio could do one game per year. Then that timeframe was no longer enough, so they split in two teams and worked on alternate years. This timeframe was starting to not be enough to build ambitious sequels, so by the middle of this generation they started giving 3 years to each team, who could finally focus on bigger projects. Except now the 3-years timeframe resulted in a messy development for Black Ops 4 which was missing tons of content and had multiple issues at launch, and now Modern Warfare that has a short (if good) campaign, a terrible Spec Ops mode and a rushed multiplayer. Even 3 years seem to be insufficient now, and I wouldn't be surprised if one of the next CODs received a 4-years frame.
And those are usually iterative sequels with a lot of reused assets and content, and they can barely suffice as is! Building a triple-A IP from the ground up (maybe with a new engine, even) and have it compete with the bests both in terms of quantity and quality is something that requires more and more time and money, and I can definitely see a lot of studios not being able to keep up with that race.
Don't be concerned about the frequency, be concerned about them all having long tailed earnings models attached.
But arbitrary numbers that specify "x amount of titles per generation" signals the end of the videogame industry! It is unsustainable and the next generation will be the last!
(that's sarcasm for those unaware)
People keep saying this, and yet here we are in the sixth year of this gen, and next gen won't even start for another year. On top of that, last gen introduced so many great new IPs. This gen? If it's not an indie game, it's a sequel more often than not.
Sure, counting all of the huge amounts of filler and other aspects that take control away from the player for long periods of time.
That's not a problem at all,if more companies go at it. We'll get the same amount of AAA games in the end
Then you're reading it wrong. I am pointing out the differences between U4/LL and U1-3 + GoW1-3 and GoW 2018. Both U4 and GoW are way better and bigger games due to the more open character of them.
I even prefer a Max Payne 3 remake over another GTA.
The Last of Us launched in June 2013. PS4 launched in November 2013.
So no...
From is a great example of a company that reuses a lot of their existing content and mechanics well. Tons of DS1 era animations in DS3, some BB assets etc. No need to remake everything so they can focus on creating the new stuff.
In similar fashion Ubisoft can pump out a new AC game faster because the engine is done, they know how to work with any development tools they have etc so it's a question of creating assets and animating them which usually is what takes a lot of development time.
The drawback is that games tend to have very similar mechanics and few games do anything new on the gameplay portion. Few games offer as much control as MGS V and I expect Death Stranding will do well in this regard too. Gameplay depth is something I want to see from next gen more than anything.
I was playing Vanishing of Ethan Carter Redux a few days ago and for a game made in 2014 its environments still look as good as anything out there today thanks to photogrammetry. I don't feel there is a ton we can do to improve visuals beyond better lighting without making it a huge ordeal for content creators. Character animation still has a way to go. No, DMC V or any other game's cutscenes don't count, I'm talking about dynamic animation like you would need in any game with tons of conversations.
I think major expansions (albeit likely in standalone format) for single player games like we've seen with Old Blood, Lost Legacy, Frozen Wilds and Iceborne will become more prominent, to bridge the gap between major franchise releases.
Bethesda has been doing quite a bit of this, perhaps not to the greatest of success though. But I think that's more to do with their execution - and making Youngblood totally co-op focused was mind-boggling and somewhat alienating to the Wolfy fans.
Bethesda has been doing quite a bit of this, perhaps not to the greatest of success though. But I think that's more to do with their execution - and making Youngblood totally co-op focused was mind-boggling and somewhat alienating to the Wolfy fans.
It's a living hell for sure, be overworked it's the norm and they glorify crunch time
I'm ok with a output of 1-2 games per great developer
Why you need to worry about something you cannot control. Here lemme give you a life tip even though im still a teen: if you are worried about something and you can do something about it, then do what you can. But if there is nothing you can do, then you dont have to worry too much about it
Practise the life hack, your life will slightly be better. The good thing is my advice here is free because sometimes i put some charges on money
Practise the life hack, your life will slightly be better. The good thing is my advice here is free because sometimes i put some charges on money
I share your fears. I really hope there will be a market for "AA" titles with 1-2 years of development cycle.
Outer Worlds is a good sign.
Outer Worlds is a good sign.
Is it a developer? :)
Okay so I was slightly off.
Although it's fair to say that the PS4 had been announced (Feb 13) for imminent release when TLoU, GT6 and Puppeteer released on PS3.
All three of those games should have been PS4 launch games, and i think should be counted somewhat as current gen missed opportunities
Uncharted 1-3 are, like, 5-8 hour games (if you don't die a lot) and that's with some repetition (go through area once without combat -> combat when you backtrack/return). TLOU2 seems like it might be meatier than all PS3 Uncharteds combined, at much higher quality.
And with FF you are forgetting FFXIV which has had three large expansions during this generation and we'll still be getting FFVII remake's first part (that is supposedly as volumous in content as a mainline FF, even though it's just the first part of the remake). Square Enix has also had better output overall this gen than last (though unfortunately not all of it good, but they've still pushed out more content)
And with FF you are forgetting FFXIV which has had three large expansions during this generation and we'll still be getting FFVII remake's first part (that is supposedly as volumous in content as a mainline FF, even though it's just the first part of the remake). Square Enix has also had better output overall this gen than last (though unfortunately not all of it good, but they've still pushed out more content)
Outer worlds was in development for ~3,5 years. Very few games are made in 2 let alone 1 year nowadays.